AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Plasma Flat Panel Displays › Official Pioneer Kuro Pictures Thread.......
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Official Pioneer Kuro Pictures Thread....... - Page 11

post #301 of 5951
10/22/07 at 1:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffrey r View Post

... Maybe this is why I never posted pics before...

Jeffrey, your pics are fine and your TV set is fine

I only commented because I've been reading all the Pio gushing and Panny bashing, so when I saw the pics, I thought I'd point out the flaws.

Again, regardless of saturation and red push, here are the two most obvious flaws I see:

1. there is some weird color processing in the lower right. I really doubt it's the camera CCD and it has nothing to do with saturation.

2. the black hill shadow is lighter than the TV frame (so it's not crushed by the camera) and yet I don't see any detail in most of it, just flat black. That's black crush (which is what I also remember registering when I saw the set.)

Keep in mind, this looks like a difficult scene and I am not saying any other TV would do a better job with it. It may not even be that noticeable when watching it in motion, but it is in a still.

(Before I am accused of PIO bashing, I am actually seriously considering Jeffrey's set. Whatever I get now will be a stopgap for the next couple of years, so I am not thrilled to spend $6.5+k on a 65" commercial Panny. So I am looking at the 60" Kuro Pio for $2+k less, which sounds much better, or the 58" 10UK Panny, which I haven't seen, but which at a total of $2+k looks pretty good as a stopgap, even if 720p)

D-Nice (or anyone else), have you used the the SM and how tough is it to access/use on the Pios?
Reply
Reply

AVS Top Picks

post #302 of 5951
10/22/07 at 1:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ssabripo View Post

victoria silvstedt

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Victoria_Silvstedt

Wow! Just WOW!
Reply
Reply
post #303 of 5951
10/22/07 at 1:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post

Jeffrey, your pics are fine and your TV set is fine

I only commented because I've been reading all the Pio gushing and Panny bashing, so when I saw the pics, I thought I'd point out the flaws.

Again, regardless of saturation and red push, here are the two most obvious flaws I see:

1. there is some weird color processing in the lower right. I really doubt it's the camera CCD and it has nothing to do with saturation.

2. the black hill shadow is lighter than the TV frame (so it's not crushed by the camera) and yet I don't see any detail in most of it, just flat black. That's black crush (which is what I also remember registering when I saw the set.)

Keep in mind, this looks like a difficult scene and I am not saying any other TV would do a better job with it. It may not even be that noticeable when watching it in motion, but it is in a still.

(Before I am accused of PIO bashing, I am actually seriously considering Jeffrey's set. Whatever I get now will be a stopgap for the next couple of years, so I am not thrilled to spend $6.5+k on a 65" commercial Panny. So I am looking at the 60" Kuro Pio for $2+k less, which sounds much better, or the 58" 10UK Panny, which I haven't seen, but which at a total of $2+k looks pretty good as a stopgap, even if 720p)

D-Nice (or anyone else), have you used the the SM and how tough is it to access/use on the Pios?

What is your reference point for your observations?
Reply
Reply
post #304 of 5951
10/22/07 at 1:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

What is your reference point for your observations?

My eyes, which are pretty good, still

Opened it in PS (most of Jeffrey's exif info is still there and nothing looks weird, normal program, sRGB.) It's shrunk, so I had to look at 200%, but you can see all of it clearly at 100. BTW, I have the feeling it's even a little more reddish at his white balance, also changing gamma or exposure values did not bring any more detail in the shadow.)
Reply
Reply
post #305 of 5951
10/22/07 at 2:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post

My eyes, which are pretty good, still

Opened it in PS (most of Jeffrey's exif info is still there and nothing looks weird, normal program, sRGB.) It's shrunk, so I had to look at 200%, but you can see all of it clearly at 100. BTW, I have the feeling it's even a little more reddish at his white balance, also changing gamma or exposure values did not bring any more detail in the shadow.)

So you are using his picture as a subjective and objective reference point? I think you need another reference point (accurate display) to use as a reference point.

Also I wonder what the dynamic range (number of gray graduations) is on his camera
Reply
Reply
post #306 of 5951
10/22/07 at 3:10pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

So you are using his picture as a subjective and objective reference point? I think you need another reference point (accurate display) to use as a reference point.

Also I wonder what the dynamic range (number of gray graduations) is on his camera

At ISO of 200, which is what Jeffrey used, most DSLRs nowadays have a dynamic range which is more than sufficient to make the observations I made.

Dynamic range might account for the black crush, although if so, I shouldn't be able to tell any difference between the black bezel and the shadow, which I do.

But dynamic range has nothing to do with the splotchy coloring in the lower right, which is most likely due to the TV's processing, IMO.

Come on, D-Nice, if I showed this same image as a vacation photo taken at the physical location, wouldn't you just say "Hey, what's with the splotching?" or would you still insist that we go to the actual location as point of reference? We all live on the same Earth, don't we?

P.S. How does the set look with the bottom speaker taken out? Is it a pretty clean look at the bottom, or does it look like a part has fallen off?
Reply
Reply
post #307 of 5951
10/22/07 at 3:45pm
man people chill out this guy post a picture for the first time and you guys are attacking lol, then again they are just saying something so yeah man deal with it. to me as well the tv does look a slight red er but if it looks perfect to the owener then great!.

man i did a post and no one replied regarding it....

how hard is it to post one of the new pioneer with the HALO 3 number screen while the blacks showing and white letters as well.... is this scene so hard ???

here is what it is

Quote:
Originally Posted by gus738 View Post

x2 thanks for info just like him based on what you mentioned theirs slightly if almost not noticeable between the both to justify the price jump of thousands.... maybe hundres then sure in a heartbeat.

basicly this is my approch i was temping to buy the PDP 5080 then the 1080p version 5010FD? couldnt find a price i was looking for and halo 3 showed up.... what i do? seattle for less i ended up getting the panasonic PX 75u series .... its a TH-42px75u now im trying to find a owener that owns any of the 8th gen pio to compare side by side on factory settings (no isf! or adjusting...) both the 75u series to a 8th gen.... to see if its worth paying the extra $$$ for.

that being said i mostly watch crappy cable signal sd and some OTA hd (prison break etc) mostly 360 and not anytime soon bd/hd

i would also like a requeset to cyber?

can you put your halo 3 disc and take a picture at the begainning of the of the disc where it shows the blacks and the 3 in blue, this would so show the true blacks and colors... all lights off

and on factory settings perferably vivid mode well torch mode lol.
Reply
Reply
post #308 of 5951
10/22/07 at 4:16pm
the black levels are my favorite

Reply
Reply
post #309 of 5951
10/22/07 at 4:44pm
That black level pic is ridiculous

Edit: In a good way I mean. That's absolutely crazy.
Reply
Reply
post #310 of 5951
10/22/07 at 4:53pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by gus738 View Post

man people chill out this guy post a picture for the first time and you guys are attacking lol, then again they are just saying something so yeah man deal with it. to me as well the tv does look a slight red er but if it looks perfect to the owener then great!.

man i did a post and no one replied regarding it....

how hard is it to post one of the new pioneer with the HALO 3 number screen while the blacks showing and white letters as well.... is this scene so hard ???

here is what it is

I haven't gotten any feedback on my shots either...I'm thinking of posting intentionally messed up pics and seeing who can figure out what the problem is...hehe
Reply
Reply
post #311 of 5951
10/22/07 at 5:25pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DAYTA View Post

My contribution to the thread...

A pic of my 6010FD + audio setup:


very very nice, I see you are enjoying your new KURO, just one thing, what's with that monster center channel on top of the PDP, if thatthing falls, say goodbuy to that beatiful PDP.
Reply
Reply
post #312 of 5951
10/22/07 at 5:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post

At ISO of 200, which is what Jeffrey used, most DSLRs nowadays have a dynamic range which is more than sufficient to make the observations I made.

Dynamic range might account for the black crush, although if so, I shouldn't be able to tell any difference between the black bezel and the shadow, which I do.

But dynamic range has nothing to do with the splotchy coloring in the lower right, which is most likely due to the TV's processing, IMO.

Come on, D-Nice, if I showed this same image as a vacation photo taken at the physical location, wouldn't you just say "Hey, what's with the splotching?" or would you still insist that we go to the actual location as point of reference? We all live on the same Earth, don't we?

P.S. How does the set look with the bottom speaker taken out? Is it a pretty clean look at the bottom, or does it look like a part has fallen off?

First and foremost, the actual PDP glass is NOT the same color as the bezel. so getting bezel blacks in physically impossible. You will get the illusion of bezel blacks in certain lighting conditions/screen content, but that it.

Now back to the Planet Earth screenshot.....

How do you know what that particular shot is suppose to look like? It could have been captured per the PE film cameras for all we know. That is why I asked what was your reference point. If you would have said that the same scene on xyz display shows more details in the shot....taken by the same person, display location, and camers/camera settings...your "interpretation" of the scene would be much more valid. However, using the provided screenshot as a reference point and saying that there are details missing per what you "think/want" to be there has no basis on actually being taken seriously.

I personally do not have PE to look at that particular shot with my multiple other reference displays, so I cannot point the finger at the camera, panel, or source.
Reply
Reply
post #313 of 5951
10/22/07 at 5:30pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Manchild View Post

I haven't gotten any feedback on my shots either...I'm thinking of posting intentionally messed up pics and seeing who can figure out what the problem is...hehe

I can confirm that your shots look they way they are suppose to.....not to say that there is anything wrong with jeffery r's shots.
Reply
Reply
post #314 of 5951
10/22/07 at 5:41pm
Eh....

Anyway, how does the 6010 look with the bottom speaker removed? Is it fairly clean?

(nothing to do with this thread, but already asked here and don't want to pollute another thread.)
Reply
Reply
post #315 of 5951
10/22/07 at 5:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

I can confirm that your shots look they way they are suppose to.....not to say that there is anything wrong with jeffery r's shots.

Woohoo! That's awesome! The D-Nice seal of approval is one that many seek! If anyone has any HD-DVD pic requests I have a pretty healthy collection. Just let me know.
Reply
Reply
post #316 of 5951
10/22/07 at 6:38pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post

Eh....

Anyway, how does the 6010 look with the bottom speaker removed? Is it fairly clean?

(nothing to do with this thread, but already asked here and don't want to pollute another thread.)

It looks like a pig with chicken legs.
Reply
Reply
post #317 of 5951
10/22/07 at 6:47pm
In all honesty, I find this all a bit baffling. I took these pics in a few minutes of free time, without checking my camera settings, without checking my TV settings, all handheld w/ no tripod, with my 2.5 year old son running around...Just too much stock being placed in the accuracy of these pics (or lack thereof). I'm being told there is distortion in the bottom corner of my panel which I know does not exist. I'm using D-Nice's settings and people are telling me that hey, if I like an oversaturated picture, more power to me (when the camera mode is designed to show just that). But anyway, I'll delete the pics, and hopefully other people will post more pics that were done with more planning. Later.
Reply
Reply
post #318 of 5951
10/22/07 at 7:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice View Post

It looks like a pig with chicken legs.

Oi! Do you mean that it has rails on the side which stay on after the speaker is removed, like this |------|? Or are you pulling my leg

If I decide to go with the 6010, I'd want to remove the bottom speaker (I like flat and have a built in center in the wall) Chicken legs on the Pio would make me go Panny

Jeffrey, nothing to do with your pic taking abilities. They are fine, the camera is fine, I am sure the settings are fine and so is the TV. The color streaking at the bottom right would likely be there on probably most sets: it's a tough scene, as I noted earlier and I am not sure ANY current TV would pass it with flying colors. I doubt, however, that it's on the original footage, since it does look more like a digital artifact.

Anyway, last thing I want is to put this on you, and I mean it.

Cheers, mate and no offense meant.
Reply
Reply
post #319 of 5951
10/22/07 at 7:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post

Oi! Do you mean that it has rails on the side which stay on after the speaker is removed, like this |------|? Or are you pulling my leg

Nope.

Quote:


If I decide to go with the 6010, I'd want to remove the bottom speaker (I like flat and have a built in center in the wall) Chicken legs on the Pio would make me go Panny

You will need to go the Panny route, get an Elite, or scour ebay to find an Elite stand.
Reply
Reply
post #320 of 5951
10/22/07 at 7:24pm
Bummer.... No stand, it has to replace my current one on the wall..., all cables hidden behind, just flat on a clean wall.... But the Elite pushes me back to the $6+ range where the 65" Panny is.... Thanks for the info.
Reply
Reply
post #321 of 5951
10/22/07 at 7:30pm
hi

requesting pics of a PC connected to the 110FD please...1080p resolution showing maybe a website, not full screen, partially showing the desktop and icons... looking for quality of text etc.

thanks.
Reply
Reply
post #322 of 5951
10/22/07 at 7:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post

Bummer.... No stand, it has to replace my current one on the wall..., all cables hidden behind, just flat on a clean wall.... But the Elite pushes me back to the $6+ range where the 65" Panny is.... Thanks for the info.

The 60" Elites are less than that....delivered.
Reply
Reply
post #323 of 5951
10/22/07 at 7:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffrey r View Post

With all due respect, it is well documented that Pentax gives you the option to produce highly saturated, sharp, bright images in the camera if you so choose by using the "bright" mode. This is from Pentax's website, but run a google check and you'll see plenty of discussions about it.

"May I change the color tone of a picture?
Yes, you may change the color tone of picture by selecting Bright or Natural.
Bright: Images are finished brightly with contrast and sharpness
Natural: Images are finished naturally and suitable for retouching"

But in any case, whether I used the bright mode or natural mode, one can process any picture to their liking using software just as someone de-saturated one of my pictures above. So saturation can be a function of the camera processing itself, or software. In bright mode, my camera will oversaturate. It simply is what it is.

Maybe this is why I never posted pics before...


I can buy the camera adding contrast, brightness, sharpness, but the camera adding a red cast, or make regular pictures make people look tanned, i dont think they have that capability, just because every picture i have ever seen, even polaroids, skin tones are usally spot on. All i'm really saying is drop color levels down say 4 notches and take the same shots and compare, might be a improvment, maybe not. It's not your tv either many peoples screenshots seem to have the colors to hot. Nobody ever seems to want to admit there colors might not look accurate, which is why i shouldnt of even posted, really just want to try to help others improve there picture, thats all.. No offense intended. As dnice said the pios come with a reddish push, but droping color down, maybe adjust the hues a few notches, should look great imho.
Reply
Reply
post #324 of 5951
10/22/07 at 9:47pm
Cybertec, those images you had for the planet earth DVD were amazing.

I just bought my 110FD the other day, any tips ? , did you change your settings out of the box ?

what av selection mode are you using on those planet earth images, i tend to use optimum, i like the movie mode for PQ but find it a little dull color wise.

Any tips you could provide on optimzing my set would be greatly appreaciated, this is my first home theatre and i am totally clueless.
Reply
Reply
post #325 of 5951
10/23/07 at 5:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Audio Atmosphere View Post

the black levels are my favorite

[im]http://audioatmosphere.net/images/kuro5.JPG[/img]

wait a minute....I've seen this picture before!!!! LOUDSYSTEM, is that you?!
Reply
Reply
post #326 of 5951
10/23/07 at 6:18am
Quote:
Originally Posted by cybertec View Post

very very nice, I see you are enjoying your new KURO, just one thing, what's with that monster center channel on top of the PDP, if thatthing falls, say goodbuy to that beatiful PDP.

Haha, I love how everyone seems to think that I'm somehow balancing a 50 lbs, 18" deep center channel on a 4" deep PDP.

As I posted yesterday, I actually installed a TV wall mount made for a 20-27" CRT TV behind my 6010FD. The center channel is essentially sitting on a metallic shelf completely level with the Pio's top bezel and not a single part of the speaker or the shelf is touching my beloved TV. I just took that picture to give people a 1st-person view of my setup.

Not sure if you can see it, but I'm also running a 2nd center channel below the TV, and if you can pull this off, I highly recommend it. It makes dialogue sound so much crisper and uniform.
Reply
Reply
post #327 of 5951
10/23/07 at 6:22am
Great thread and great pics you guys.
Was doubting between the Panny and the Pio, and this thread sealed the deal.
Soon be ordering the 508xd (5080 Elite) allthough I really wanted the 5010, but 1600 euro more is a little high for my budget.

Much better prices over there in the BIG US of A.

Keep the pics coming
Reply
Reply
post #328 of 5951
10/23/07 at 8:41am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post

Bummer.... No stand, it has to replace my current one on the wall..., all cables hidden behind, just flat on a clean wall.... But the Elite pushes me back to the $6+ range where the 65" Panny is.... Thanks for the info.

Are you saying that you're going to mount it on the wall? If so, then there won't be any chicken legs because the stand won't be attached.

D-Nice, Do the elite stands work with their corresponding non-elite counterparts? Do 7G stands work with the 8G displays? Also, I thought that ABT-Electronics was the only online store that's authorized to sell elites since you actually have to call them to place the order. If this is not correct, please educate me. Also, will an ISF calibration completely get rid of the red push in the non-elite displays?

Thanks to everyone for posting the pictures. It looks like it will be at least a few more months before I get my Kuro When I do, I'll post some pics.
Reply
Reply
post #329 of 5951
10/23/07 at 8:56am
Quote:
Originally Posted by kalrith View Post

D-Nice, Do the elite stands work with their corresponding non-elite counterparts?

Yes
Quote:


Do 7G stands work with the 8G displays?

I don't know. So I'm going with a default no.
Reply
Reply
post #330 of 5951
10/23/07 at 10:10am
Quote:
Originally Posted by kalrith View Post

Are you saying that you're going to mount it on the wall? If so, then there won't be any chicken legs because the stand won't be attached....

Oh, so if I am mounting it on wall, and take the bottom speakers off, I'll have a clean, uniform bezel line where the speakers were and it will not look like a part fell off (or a pig on chicken legs?) In other words, it will look like a commercial plasma?
Reply
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Plasma Flat Panel Displays

AVS Top Picks

AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Plasma Flat Panel Displays › Official Pioneer Kuro Pictures Thread.......