Triad Owner's Thread - Page 100

Sportsfan14, thanks for replying to my very open-ended question. After looking at the InCeiling Silver satellites, those might work for all three front channels also.

On a different note (and probably outside my budget for this project), I saw Paul mention the FlexSubs a couple times last year. Anyone have any experience with these? I didn't see anything about them on Triad's website (maybe they haven't been released yet?), but maybe I just missed them.

I'm behind in answering posts here, but the FlexSubs are now shipping; Mini and Silver.

The speakers are similar in that they use the same tweeter, and the Silver uses a larger version of the woofer. The cost difference is from more MDF, more foam, more bracing, more packaging, a higher shipping cost, etc. What you get with the Silver is around 2 dB more sensitivity and more power handling; both of which translate into around 4 dB more output. That's not insignificant. If you don't listen at or above reference level, you won't know the difference. If you listen at a robust level once in a while, get the Silver.

A little before and after pics with the Micro Sat 3.0 below the tv.

Before:


After:

Here are pictures of the two new FlexSubs, which are designed to be hidden in an adjacent room, in a cabinet, in a ceiling, or under the floor. The Silver FlexSub (top) is $2,500 to $2,650, depending upon which grill, and the Mini FlexSub is $1,800 to $1,950, depending upon which grill.

Performance similar to the regular subs?

The Mini is the same as our InRoom Mini DSP Sub, and includes a 350-watt RackAmp. The performance is nearly the same, except for the possibility of a frequency response anomaly due to the tube. Audyssey will take that right out. The Silver is basically a Silver DSP Sub modified for remote installation, and it includes the new 600-watt RackAmp 600 DSP.

The big advantage of using either of these subs is to get prodigious bass into a room with no sub actually in the room, and with a very small grill or kick plate, making them virtually invisible. We're shipping them now.

Paul, thanks for the info on the FlexSubs.

Hi Paul,

These look interesting and very innovative, and I'm sure Triad engineering has worked out all the wrinkles. Nonetheless, I have a few questions:

1. Are there any losses through the conduit? Quite honestly, it doesn't look heavy duty enough to contain the energy of "prodigious bass." However, as we know, looks can be deceiving.

2. Do these act like "ported" subs? IOW, does the air in the conduit "resonate" like the air in a tuned port? If so, but the length of the conduit can be variable, how do you control the tune point and the roll off below tune? If they do not act like ported subs, how do you retain the "sealed" aspect of the subs through such a long conduit?

3. Finally, what are the "Group Delay" characteristics of a design that routes the bass through a conduit? Is the delay linear across all (subwoofer) frequencies? Can the subwoofer "Distance" setting account for all the delay?

Thanks.

Craig

The tube is actually very rigid, but there is a bit of loss through it. I'll have some figures, but I don't have them yet. Because the tube is cylindrical, it doesn't resonate like a flat surface. There is a resonant frequency, but it's mostly above the typical 80 Hz crossover, and Audyssey will take care of any remaining peak. You'll have peaks and nulls with any inroom or inwall sub, as well.

The FlexSubs don't act like ported subs because we're not using the back waves of the driver. The natural rolloff (which is compensated for in the amp) is still 12 dB/octave; not 24 dB. They're still acoustic suspension systems, and the tube doesn't change that. I don't have an answer on group delay characteristics yet, but I suspect all frequencies would be the same in that respect. And I don't think a 2' distance would be of any consequence in any system; even one that's calibrated to the nines.

I'll post more when I know more.

I recently bought some demo InWall Silver/4 LCRs for an upcoming theater room. Since the room won't be built for a few months, I thought I might build some brackets for the LCRs so I could set them on the floor and use them for the front speakers in my current setup. My current speakers are 15 yr. old Boston Acoustics, so these Triads should be a step up.

Anyone see any issues with this? Or should I just be patient and not use the Silver LCRs until my new room is complete?

I wouldn't put them on the floor because the on-axis response will be right at your knees. If you can put them on something (a shelf would be best) and lean them against the wall, that'll work. Don't pull them out into the room; they're designed to be use with a boundary, preferably in it, and not on it. If you don't care about the walls in the current room, you can place the speakers on a shallow stand and use heavy-duty velcro to keep them from falling on their faces...which would not be good.

Hi, first post here. I am building a game room for my kids with two 59" Samsung Plasmas. Our installer is recommending the Triad On-Wall Micro LCR 3.0 for each. Given the bar is 6" high, I am thinking of either paint matching them to our wall color. Few questions:
1) What is the turnaround time for getting paint-matched speakers?
2) Is there a way to change the color if we ever decide to change our wall color to something else in x number of years?
3) Are the grills matched too? Or just the body?
4) Does anybody have any pictures of what their paint-matched speaker bars look like? Was wondering if painting the wall color really makes them "disappear".

Thanks to all.

Paul, please correct me if I'm wrong.

1. Takes an extra 3-5 days for custom paint matching. So roughly 7-9 business days from the date of order.

2. Triad can re-paint the LCR later I'm sure. Don't know the price though.

3. The grill is paint matched as well.

4. I haven't seen any LCRs painted to match the walls as they march the tv in black. In fact, I have never sold a LCR that wasn't black.

Paul, btw I love the template for the Micro Sat 3.0. Mounting it was sooooo easy.

Assuming all parts are in stock, custom paint might add one day. We have the computer paint mixing gear and paint in the factory.


Repainting a speaker is generally not worth it. The grill has to be replaced (can't paint it more than once), the baffle has to be masked off, the speaker has to be sanded down, etc. I'm not sure if the drivers are removed, but I would think so. We don't do an "Earl Scheib" repaint.


When you place the order, specify grill color. It can be painted the same color as the speaker, at no additional charge. Or, it can be stock black.


InWalls and InCeilings are regularly custom painted, but InRooms are painted less frequently. Veneer is more popular for InRooms, but I've seen Gold LCRs in a terra cotta earth-tone, grill and all, to blend into the room, and they looked great.

Thanks, and thanks for all the great suggestions you've made!

Are you willing to adopt any more "kids"?

Seriously, that sounds sweet!

Paul, thanks for the suggestions. I don't really have the wall space, so I think I will just wait until my new room is complete.

I currently have my Platinum LCR's and CC sitting on the floor. (They are awaiting the completion of the stands I linked to in a previous post: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...1#post20334601)

While this is definitely a *temporary* situation, I have tilted them back so the tweeters are aimed at seated ear height. I must say that I am astonished at the sound quality, and the soundstage and imaging, even with this very poor positioning of the speakers. Voices image above the CC, not from the floor. Cymbals sound "higher" in space than the drums they are connected to. The entire sonic image is well above the height of the speakers. It's actually quite uncanny how good it is.

Obviously, I'm expecting an improvement when my stands are finished, but for now, I am amazed at the quality of these excellent speakers. I would encourage CatFan to try his speakers, even if he can't optimally place them.

An update on the stands: We received the paint from Triad and have applied 2 coats of the white primer. Tonight we sanded them. Tomorrow night the first coat of black paint goes on!

Here are a few pics of the stands before and after priming:
https://cid-1431503869476bed.photos....pub=SDX.Photos

In addition, I have also recently received 2 pair of Silver Monitors for use as surrounds. They are setup (temporarily) in the Wides and Sides positions. This system is absolutely jaw dropping. The Silver Monitors use the same mid-woofers as the Platinums and a "very similar" tweeter, but without the dispersion lens. The timbre-match between the Silver Monitors and the Plat's is superb, (Thanks Paul!) The addition of Wides to the surround mix is fantastic, with a huge increase in immersion and seamlessness.

I will be posting a full review of the system once it's complete. Trust me, I'm far more anxious for that to happen than *anyone* else.

Craig

In other news, I just received 2 pair of Bentley's for use in commuting to work.

In all seriousness, please post as many pics as you can. Although, I have to admit, part of me doesn't want to see it...yours just shts all over the system i'm installing.

The different lines of BMW's used to be described as "same sausage; different length," meaning that they (the 3-Series up through the 7-Series), all looked and drove the same; they just got bigger as you went up the line. (Chris Bangle changed all that, and I don't own BMW's anymore, but that's beside my point.) I get the sense that, in many ways, Triad speakers are similar. They all have the same great sound quality; they just have more output the further you go up the line.

IOW, I would expect your system to perform VERY well and sound just as good as mine, the only difference being the maximum output potential. If you're putting together a Triad system, you've got nothing to worry about.

I will post pics as I finish off the system.

Craig

Craig, you sound like another "satisficated customer." I can't wait to see the whole setup when you're done.

I know what you mean about Bimmers "scaling." A 3-series is a large 1-series, and a small 5-series, but they scale. They try to maintain a similar feel from the 1 to the 7, and with great success.

Years ago, I did a demo at a distributer's facility, playing five or six Triad speakers, one after another, on the same piece of music and on the same big Denon receiver. What really stood out was the family sound among all the models, with all of them having an honest, uncolored, natural personality. As we went from the Bronze LCR to the Silver LCR, the sound didn't change much, but everyone noticed a bit more extension, better dynamics, and more output. It was a quantitative difference, not a qualitative one. The Gold LCRs were tighter and played louder still, but with the same uncolored personality. The Platinums sounded a lot like the Gold LCRs, until we pushed them, even with the receiver. One dealer told me he had never heard a Denon receiver play so loud! This uniformity is no accident, and engineer David Nelson is responsible. None of our speakers are "voiced" to sound "good." We choose drivers carefully and the result is always sonic neutrality.

And a worthy result it is! What is the goal of listening to music if not wanting to hear what it would sound like if you were there in person listening to the musicians and singers create the music....or be enveloped in the experience of the sound design of a film?

Many people, even audio enthusiasts, prefer their speakers to be voiced to sound a certain way...more ethereal, warmer, more "air," whatever. They forget what the term "high fidelity" means, and what it has always meant. A speaker should never superimpose it's sonic personality onto the program material. The best speakers have as little personality as possible, and they simply reproduce what is being played through them. If you've heard a really pristine, lifelike recording played through extremely accurate speakers, you know what I mean, and you have been spoiled.

Paul is there a demo CD that you would recommend?

For natural sound, the best jazz CD is probably "With All My Heart" by drummer Harvey Mason. The recording is very close, tight, and big, with stunning detail and a deep punchy bass drum. Piano and bass are perfectly recorded. Personnel is different on all tracks, and it's a who's who of jazz piano players with Mulgrew Miller, Herbie Hancock, Chick Corea, Cedar Walton, Kenny Barron, Dave Grusin, etc.

I still like "The Raven" by Rebecca Pidgeon for it's vocal purity.

Almost any Reference Recordings symphonic CD is excellent.

Paul would gold monitors (about 3 years old) be a ok match for rears? With new plats lcr up front?

Sure, they'll work. They actually sound as good as Platinum LCRs, but they won't play to the brain-damaging levels of the Platinums. Yeah, they'll work great.

And, by the way, if you're planning on using Platinum LCRs up front with Gold Monitors for surrounds...I like the way you roll.