eD Owner's Thread - Page 69

I borrowed carp's base model Cinema 12's for the last week while he was on vacation. Thanks man -- I really appreciate you letting me try them out!

I absolutely love them for live sound and preformance, but like my Wharfedale Sapphire 89s better for non live recorded sound - which is most of my MP3 recordings. I think the ED's clearly have the upper hand for movies because the center channel is so strong on the Cinema 12s with a matching front soundstage of three of these beasts! The center channel never sounds "small" or "strained" which is typical of most every other set of speakers I've ever listened to --- including the five or so various Wharfedale center channel speakers I've tried. I wish there was a way to dial back the treble a bit. That big horn tweeter is a bit too sharp in my tile, non treated home theater room on some of the music mp3 tracks I played. That's why I was curious about the upgraded tweeter --- if perhaps it was a bit less agressive. If I had a softer carpeted room or sat further from the speaker I'd probably have a better match for the standard base model tweeter as I think the set sounds fantastic in carps room. At any rate I watched the This is It movie with all the Michael Jackson songs in a live stage settings and I don't know that I've ever heard better sound than that disc sounds on these EDs. It was incredible!!! Overall the ED Cinema 12 front sound stage was always either 1) fantastic, or 2) a bit too agressive on the treble in the varoius things I've auditioned this week. I blame my room - because I think the Cinema 12 is a incredible speaker overall and well worth the price of admission. For the graph below - the Wharfedale and ED were level matched, but they definately still sounded very different on the treble bias. The ED horn is much more aggressive sounding at or around the same dB rating on the Wharfedale Sapphire tweeter.


Here are the two graphs using 1/6 smoothing of the two stereo pairs in my room.

Edited by Archaea - 7/14/12 at 1:32pm

It got lost? after more than 6 months of waiting? Why don't you just cancel that order, knowing from your experience that you have to wait that long.

No problem, I'm glad you got to hear them in your room, it would have sucked to order them after only hearing them in my room and then finding out they were a bit harsh in your room. Like I said in the PM before I saw this, I have never heard your speakers sound harsh so obviously they are keepers, too bad about not finding the center you want though...

BTW, listening to my Axioms again right now. I'm not minding it like I was last time since I've had a week with no music (well, other than car stereo music not turned up very loud). Still though, they do sound weak and tinny in comparison to what I'm used to in here.

I listened to the Wharfedales on the This is It movie again after I turned the speakers over to Kevin. I went from having chills on nearly an entire length track with the EDs to no chills on my wharfedales on the same track at the same volume with the speakers level matched. The ED's really really really do well for live recorded sound with cymbals and drums and such. I've not ruled them off the list for purchase. I'd just have to figure out how to tame the tweeter a bit in my reflective room - or perhaps actually put in some room treatments. I wonder if i put a bit of foam in the horn tweeeter like what geddes and procella do?

I'd really like to hear the ED Cinema 12s face off against the JTR Triple Eights if you and Chis can make it happen sometime. I do realize there is a huge price difference between the two products, but I'm curious as to how significant and what differences there are since I've not heard them in the same room?

That's funny Archaea, I had a full house in the theater last night and it was just going to be a demo session and we ended up watching the entire "This is It movie". The Triple 12's are perfectly suited to that sound track (as I am sure the Ed 12's are) and I kept pushing the volume higher and higher. We had an 82 year old Italian grandma in the back row who was playing air guitar . Several of the younger attendees had seen the movie in the theater and all said this was a "totally new experience". I think most of the wow factor was due to the Orbit Shifters and Alex Al's synth bass as that guy is simply amazing. "This Is It" is a great test for an HT audio system.

I want to have another movie night some time soon over here. I'm thinking we should watch The Art of Flight and the rest of the time do demo's, I'd love to hear parts of This is It from you, Kevins, and RMK's description. Not my kind of music but I am curious. It would be really cool if we could get Chris to bring his JTR's and compare them. I'm thinking the weekend after next, but I don't know yet.

You didn't get around to trying out the Within Temptation concert? There are a few tracks in there (the one with the 2 female singer duets I think it's track 11 is non-stop goosebumps) from the half way point to the end that give me goosebumps, and that doesn't happen to me often. Hopefully you'll get the same effect on the Wharfedales, I'm telling you it's awesome on the eD's.

I cannot say I was not warned...

today is 6 weeks since I ordered a set of 3 Cinema-12s. Alex of eD did not keep the promise to have the speakers built and shipped by this time.
I just called them to cancel the order.

Did they actually cancel it, or did you get some lame excuse?

I watched a bit of it, but not the whole thing yet -- just the first couple tracks. I liked what I saw so far, which is the reason I've not turned it back over to you yet. :P Ha I hope you don't mind! I'll return it soon!

That Art of Flight disc was intense - both graphically and in the audio realm. It's a must purchase for me!

No worries, I want you to be able to hear it. My wife even liked it and needless to say she is not into "my" music. If you have the time check out the Metallica concert too.

Metallica just had a huge concert here like two weeks ago. Something like 15 bands. They played the entire Ride the Lightning album Sat and the entire Black album on Sunday.

the order is cancelled though I have not gotten the money refunded yet. my understanding it may take a day or two.

That would be a tough decision to make for me, but I would do exactly as you did. You pay good money for something and the seller doesn't come through as they say... give me my money back and I'll deal with somebody who can deliver. I'm the same way with everything in life, not just audio.

I appreciate you for helping to keep vendors honest.

Just out of curiosity, did they originally say 6 weeks or did they say less and you just gave them till now?

The 6 weeks deadline was agreed to at the time I placed the order. the timing was important, the goal was to compare the eD Cinema-12 to CHT SHO-10 in my room. had they kept the promise it would give me about a week for the audition.

Yeah, the Orion (all time favorite song BTW) festival, I heard about that. I'd have much rather been there on Saturday than Sunday!!

I know they have done all of Puppets before, they should do all of Justice sometime too, assuming they still know how to play Frayed Ends of Sanity.

Good for you that you were able to cancel your order.

I'd like to add my voice to the chorus of dissatisfied eD customers advising others not do any business with the company.

It's been 12 days since I cancelled the order and I am yet to see the money credited back to my charge account.
I called Alex 2 days ago to check on the status and he assured me that the refund was initiated and promised to call me back with the confirmation number "first thing in the morning". Needless to say that was the last time I heard from him.

I just filed a charge dispute with my credit card.

Would anyone care to predict how much longer eD can carry on with such defective business practices, or are they already dead but just don't know it yet?

Good move. Businesses are legally allowed to let a certain amount of time pass before refunding your monies. I don't recall whether that's something that varies state by state but you can probably find out by speaking to your CC company. BTW, I did think it was noteworthy that not only did ED not attend some recent speaker GTG in Iowa but according to a person who attended the event, also declined a request for a tour of the facility. While any number of good reasons could be offered for this, my guess is there's not much going on there. With this continued abysmal record, I can't see them lasting too much longer.

That's a shame. I was quoted 3 weeks when I inquired about 6 weeks ago, but my gut said don't do it. I am glad I listened. On a side note, how are you enjoying the Sho-10's?

SHO-10s are a lot of fun. They opened my eyes to this whole constant directivity high sensitivity loudspeaker design thing. I am convinced that for HT this is the only good option out there. And at this price range and with eD out of the equation, CHT offerings is the only choice short of DIY.

I will probably try going DIY route w/ either 4pi or SEOS based designs in the near future. But I am keeping the SHOs until I actually have a good replacement and then move them to the surround duties.

have you received a refund yet? Ed is dead by the looks of it.

My credit card company credited it back to my account but AFAIK they did get the money from eD yet.

eD officially dead as of friday 8/31... below is from their website

Official statement inside.
I’m sure at this point most people are wondering what’s going on at Elemental Designs. Phones haven’t been answered, lack of email responses, promised items not shipping, and not a peep from us. Well, I’m here to let you know what’s going on, right now.



You see, the company began to go into a very rapid downward spiral several months ago when a lot of criteria and standards were not being met. Even a lot of poor decisions were made. Our staff decreased in size very rapidly, leaving only a few to handle day to day operations. Stress levels sky-rocketed when our inventory was quickly depleted, RMA’s piled up, and we failed to satisfy customer’s orders.



The one person a lot of people spoke with was Alex. And Alex is, well, he’s not here. I am. And I am here to try my absolute best to make good with as many people as possible within the short time frame that I have.



Before Alex left, however, he did write an open letter and I’ll present you with that letter:





“Over the last six months we at Elemental Designs have been struggling due to a few key factors. You, our customers deserve the right to be aware of these issues.



Under my leadership for the past two years Elemental Designs has lost a large share of its customer base in both the home and car audio markets. This is due to inefficiencies in large scale business management on my behalf. The mismanagement of in house production caused an increase in customer lead times while our goal was to decrease them. Key raw materials which go into almost all home audio products reached critical inventory levels due to inadequate reordering management. Without these raw products we did not have the availability to ship orders in the quoted time.



This mismanagement of inventory meant that we had a surplus of products that would only sell when heavily discounted and not enough inventory on the items customers demanded. This was a large issue with home audio amplifiers and raw drivers, causing long delays between order placement and shipping times. To fulfill orders quickly it required us to use vendors based in the US. The largest issue here became shrinking margins and order quantity decreasing over the past six months. To complicate things even more, we ran into many out of stock parts on components we did require. This lead to item stocking issues and with warranty replacement issues. Without the proper inventory levels, we relied on repairing faulty amplifiers instead of shipping out a new unit.



All of this combined is what put us in the situation we are in today. We are putting the website in standby and are working on current individual open inquiries.





Thanks.



Alex Lindeman

CEO

Elemental Designs”



Because I cannot operate with such a large overhead with little inventory, and no staff, I have come to the conclusion that the doors at Elemental Designs will be closing by the end of Friday, August 31st, 2012.



“WHOA, WHAT! Where does that leave me!?” – says a lot of people right about now. What DOES this mean for you? If you have an open issue with Elemental Designs, email me. ( mtower@elementaldesigns.com ) I will reply, and I will try to work with you in whatever situation you are in. I need to do a lot of information gathering over the next few days, and your input would help immensely.



This hasn’t been easy, and it probably won’t be easy for the next several months, but you better believe I’m going to try whatever is humanly possible to help in any way I can.



Thanks.



- Matt Tower

Not sure if this is the right place for this (if it's not, Mods please delete my post or move it wherever it should be).

I have an A7s-450 bought in mid 2009 that is mint (and has been babied). It has the LT-1300 and has never been damaged or in for repair. I'm the sole owner. I'm willing to sell. PM for details.



As for eD going under, it was too little, too late as far as what they did to try and fix the internal problem. What a shame.
Edited by BufordTJustice - 8/30/12 at 2:05pm

If anyone is looking to get rid of an eD[c] 12 please send me a PM as I am looking for one as a center for the (2) eD[c] 12's I already have.

Sucks the company went under. My speakers and sub are still going strong.

Very unfortunate that such a talented company with great products went under. I hope they can recover from all this mess and make a comeback.

If anyone is still looking to get their hands on some eD[c]6 speakers, feel free to PM me. My brother and I bought...and managed to get delivery of...11 of these fantastic speakers to use in a dedicated home theater. 5 of them are still sealed in the box and the rest are barely broken in. The lady of the house wasn't too amused with their size if used as surrounds on the wall, so have to figure out a more aesthetic solution. The project is ongoing (as always) so the speakers aren't being utilized yet. If you had your hopes to get some eD speakers brand new, this might be your lucky day. I'm not sure if I really want to get rid of them either, but I'm starting to think 11.1 might be overkill in this particular room...who knows...this hobby never really ends.

Also, even though when we had ordered these, the shipments were delayed several times. However, I will say Alex was always trying to make things right for us and kept communications open. You could tell he was struggling, but I would have never guessed things were getting this bad.

EDIT: Just wondering...Has anyone heard back from Matt Tower? Had sent him a couple of emails to mtower@elementaldesigns.com address and haven't gotten any response.
Edited by asoofi1 - 12/12/12 at 12:21pm

I am looking for a L/C/R of the ed12 cinemas as well! PM me if you are looking to unload them.