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Black Diamond from Screen Innovations? - Page 102

post #3031 of 3545
...and a third confirmation with some other little bits of info:

-the 1.4 gain screen does not vignette as much as the .8, and after seeing both screens in my house (since I have both) I would have just gotten the 1.4 the first time around. The .8 is a tad darker in material but for all intents and purposes I like having the extra punch of the 1.4 - again this is in a "regular" home context, non-optimized rooms with white walls, etc. The extra gain seems to do more to extend the overall dynamic range of the image than deepening of blacks that the .8 does. Neither will be darker than the darkest light output of your projector.

-curiously, if you have a Dune HD media player as seen in my screenshots, the IR codes that the remote uses also trigger various functions that control the LED perimeter on the rear of the Zero Edge 2. So as I am navigating the menu screens the LED lights change color, go into strobe mode...no biggie I just turn on the LED's once the movie starts, just an FYI

-on the perimeter LED's white lowered in brightness about 50% is the best for "critical viewing", takes the edge off of high contrast scenes for your eyes...while the pure blue def looks the coolest from a home design perspective. I find it's fun to also match color of the led's to the content of the film, various Matrix, Dark Knight films look good with green or yellow, etc. But yeah, white is the best for any serious viewing since it won't throw your color perception of what's actually on the screen

-I understood that the perimeter light would add contrast and deepen perceptual blacks on the screen, but in action it is far more powerful than you think it will be. Best part is, you can create the same effect fairly cheaply on whatever screen you have now with the same parts from websites...but the trick is having that virtually non-existent bezel/border that presents basically a floating image

-the shimmering is more noticeable to me on wide shots where the elements on the screen are smaller and approach the size of the actual pixels from the projector...I find the whole effect to be somewhat less on the .8 screen than the 1.4 (which is what has been said by many others as well). But in general I find neither to be a real distraction, it's much less so than say, rainbows from a DLP projector

-have been glued to the living room couch for hours upon hours after installing the zero edge...again if you are in a similar non light controlled environment or want to have more of an all around screen for football movies, games, etc. then it's pretty perfect
post #3032 of 3545
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

With one of the newer JVC's you should be between 9 and 10 Foot Lamberts for 3D. In a good room that will be a lot brighter than what you see at the movie theater.
post #3033 of 3545
i bought a sensations 119" SI screen through Magnolia last October. Can i replace this screen material with a 1.3 gain. What i bought was a 1.0 gain screen/neutral.
I have a JVC HD350 in a light controlled room. Dark walls and ceilings in a 15 x 14 with 9' ceilings. I saw your posting about just changing the screen material and didn't know it was possible to do that.

Advise please.
post #3034 of 3545
Quote:
Originally Posted by rencan View Post

i bought a sensations 119" SI screen through Magnolia last October. Can i replace this screen material with a 1.3 gain. What i bought was a 1.0 gain screen/neutral.
I have a JVC HD350 in a light controlled room. Dark walls and ceilings in a 15 x 14 with 9' ceilings. I saw your posting about just changing the screen material and didn't know it was possible to do that.
Advise please.

Unfortunately the Sensation series frame and attachment system are not the same as the reference series so you cannot just replace the material. Our Reference screen series allows you to swap out any reference series screen material or black diamond materials.
post #3035 of 3545
Quote:
Originally Posted by kazkioken View Post

I have a fixed frame BD .8 in the bedroom (posted pics earlier in the thread) and just installed a Zero Edge 1.4 108" in the living room. OMG. This is the best money I've spent in a long time. It's simply beautiful. How much is a 108" lcd or plasma? I've got this paired with a cheap Panasonic AR100U and even with this lower priced projector the image is amazing. I've got all sorts of light spill, reflections, silver blinds, white walls, etc. and it doesn't matter...for just plain entertainment in the living room for movies, football, etc. it's more than I expected. I will take some pictures during the day to compare, but the rear facing halo led's really do wonders for the contrast on the screen. The minimal image border, along with the led light forces your brain to compensate the contrast and you really do end up with perceived deeper blacks. If you're on the fence don't hesitate, especially if you are looking for something that is not in a dedicated theater room.




Wow, that looks amazing! And I love the egg chair.
post #3036 of 3545
Hi Everyone,

I recently upgraded my plasma to front projection. I bought the new JVC x55. My room is small, so I was limited to 80" screen, I possibly could have gone to 92" if I replaced my tower speakers with bookshelves below the screen. I was going to buy 80" 16:9 fixed frame reference black diamond 1.4 from my dealer, when I stumbled upon a great deal on craigslist by random luck.

I found for sale, a new in the box 80" 1.4 black diamond. The seller said the screen was about 2 years, so the screen material had been sitting rolled for a couple years. I believe based on that age, it is a 2nd generation screen, and not the latest screen material. I could tell from the packaging that the screen had not been tampered with , the factory labels on the foam protecting the screen were intact. According to the seller, he got the screen as a gift, I think he said he had a family connection to someone who worked at SI.

Anyway, the screen was a total bargain compared to cost of new one, so I took a chance on buying it.

I have a few issues with the screen however, and would like to get opinions from fellow AVS members who have experience with screens, and the black diamond in particular.
The first issue is that after a couple weeks the screen is still not completely flat. When the projector is throwing an all white image, I can see some vertical bands down the screen lined up with where the bungees are putting tension on the screen. I believe this is because the screen is still a little bit curved from being rolled for so long. Do you think this will disappear over time?

The second issue, is that if I get within a foot of the screen, and look at in bright light, I can see some very fine hairline scratches. Is this normal? I can live with this as it's completely not visible from viewing distance when an image is on the screen. Although screen appeared packaged as new, I think it is possible it was some sort of demonstration screen based on label on the screen material roll.

The third and final issue is that there is 2 very small spots where it looks like there is an outward indentation in the screen material, like something has pushed on the material from the back side. I have attached a photo, the mark is about 2 inches from the bottom frame, and 6 inches from left edge of photo. This mark doesn't look pointed or sharp , so my hope is that it may disappear over time if the screen material flattens out with tension from the bungees. However, this mark is visible from viewing distance under an all white background, but not typically visible with normal material. Now that I know it's there, I occasionally notice it because I am looking for it.

Is it best to wait and see if these issues resolve themselves?

Since I am not the original owner, would SI give me any sort of support on the screen? I don't expect much, just wondering if they will answer my questions if I phone, and/or perhaps let me buy a replacement screen material without the frame.

Under worst case scenario, can I buy new screen material and reuse the existing frame. Would this be done through a dealer, or directly through SI?

Thanks for your help everyone.

Ryan

post #3037 of 3545
My screen (which I purchased used) has none of the defects which you describe. It is very flat, very smooth, with no dents/cracks of any sort. I'm sure you can purchase a replacement screen for the frame. I would wait to see is the screen smooths out however. I would also suggest a .8 gain screen from BD in your size as it is small in comparison to most projector screens and you will have better black levels....
post #3038 of 3545
Thanks saskroadie. There's no cracks, just minor surface scratches only visible if shining a bright led flashlight on the screen from 1 foot away. I'm planning to wait and see if the screen flattens out, will give it at least a couple months before doing anything. The screen has been mounted for about 2 weeks. You recommend 0.8? I've heard 1.4 is better for 3D since you lose some brightness in 3d mode. Was your screen re-rolled when you received it, or did you transport it assembled?
post #3039 of 3545
I transported my 92" screen assembled (pain in the ass too!) but didn't want to take a chance with the surface. I have an RS40 and it's plenty bright in low lamp mode, but I must admit I've never tried 3D. Send Blake at SI a quick pm to confirm the brightness of a .8 80" for 3D watching.
post #3040 of 3545
Does anyone know if the screen material on the Black Diamond fixed series is the same as on the Black Diamond Zero Edge models? I really would prefer to buy the 1.4 gain 16:9 100" or 106" (haven't finished measuring yet) Zero Edge with the LED kit as I find it more aesthetically pleasing (that thing is just AMAZING looking), but the fixed series appears to be cheaper. With that in mind, I was wondering if at least the picture would be identical between the two if I end up having to sacrifice looks for a slightly smaller hit on my wallet. Any help would be much appreciated!!!
post #3041 of 3545
So these Zero edge screens cost more then my projector 5020ub. They sure have some killer looking screens but I wonder what kind of premium they are charging for the screen to be 2K+ FRNs. I mean how much does it cost to manufacture vs what they are selling it for. Anyway the screen does look great but most people are going to drop that kind of cash on a screen.
post #3042 of 3545
Ryan Happy to help give me a call at the factory. Blake
Edited by BlakeSI - 1/2/13 at 1:08pm
post #3043 of 3545
Quote:
Originally Posted by dannyday2 View Post

Does anyone know if the screen material on the Black Diamond fixed series is the same as on the Black Diamond Zero Edge models? I really would prefer to buy the 1.4 gain 16:9 100" or 106" (haven't finished measuring yet) Zero Edge with the LED kit as I find it more aesthetically pleasing (that thing is just AMAZING looking), but the fixed series appears to be cheaper. With that in mind, I was wondering if at least the picture would be identical between the two if I end up having to sacrifice looks for a slightly smaller hit on my wallet. Any help would be much appreciated!!!

The Black Diamond Zero Edge and Black Diamond fixed frame use the same materials.
post #3044 of 3545
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlakeSI View Post

The Black Diamond Zero Edge and Black Diamond fixed frame use the same materials.

Okay awesome! Thanks for verifying that for me Blake! Now to figure out what the exact cost difference would be and which one I can talk my wife into, lol! Does Screen innovations sell these screens directly to customers like me or should I be looking for a reseller online to purchase? I'm doubtful that I have anyone in Chattanooga, TN that sells these locally!
post #3045 of 3545
The LED effects make me want to go purchase one right now. Was the light kit an add or did it come with the screen?
post #3046 of 3545
I'm a little confused by the LEDs on some screens. On the SI website, they completely seems like they light up all the way around and others its only the center of all 4 sides. Does the size matter or are some of these older models?
post #3047 of 3545
It's both. You can control the intensity, color, and effect with the remote.
post #3048 of 3545
Does anyone know if the LED kit is a separate piece from the screen that can be ordered after the fact? I was wondering if I could possibly buy the Zero Edge screen and then add the LEDs later if I felt the need...
post #3049 of 3545
Quote:
Originally Posted by 7channelfreak View Post

I'm a little confused by the LEDs on some screens. On the SI website, they completely seems like they light up all the way around and others its only the center of all 4 sides. Does the size matter or are some of these older models?

The new G2 version of Zero Edge has a more even distribution of the light effect around the edge.
post #3050 of 3545
So, I took my wife into the new Magnolia Center they just put in our newly remodeled Best Buy earlier this afternoon in an attempt to talk her into a projector for our bedroom. They had a Sony HW30 with a motorized 92" Firehawk screen and an Epson 5020UB with a 92" Black Diamond Zero Edge with an LED kit. After about an hour of walking back and forth between the two "Studios" looking at both of them, she finally decided that she was willing to go along with the whole "projector in the bedroom" thing. She indicated that she wanted to go with the Epson projector and the Black Diamond Zero Edge screen if we were doing this, as long as it had the LED kit.

Does anyone know if Best Buy is an authorized SI dealer? I went on the SI website and I think I read that for warranty support you need to have purchased the screen from an authorized dealer, but when I used their "find a local SI dealer" tool, best buy wasn't listed, so that has me a little worried.

Also, I looked the 100" screen I think I'll end up needing on the BB website and I don't see any mention of the optional LED kit being included with the price OR a way to purchase it separately (or the cost to do so). Does anyone have any clue why it isn't listed as included OR available for purchase? She REALLY wants the BD Zero Edge with the LEDs.

Thanks in advance for any help anyone can provide. Sorry for the long post (and I'm sure I'll have more questions)...I'd just like to get this all right the first time and this will be my first projector/screen purchase (we're upgrading from an 8000-series Samsung LED and I want this to be AWESOME!!!).
post #3051 of 3545
Quote:
Originally Posted by dannyday2 View Post

So, I took my wife into the new Magnolia Center they just put in our newly remodeled Best Buy earlier this afternoon in an attempt to talk her into a projector for our bedroom. They had a Sony HW30 with a motorized 92" Firehawk screen and an Epson 5020UB with a 92" Black Diamond Zero Edge with an LED kit. After about an hour of walking back and forth between the two "Studios" looking at both of them, she finally decided that she was willing to go along with the whole "projector in the bedroom" thing. She indicated that she wanted to go with the Epson projector and the Black Diamond Zero Edge screen if we were doing this, as long as it had the LED kit.
Does anyone know if Best Buy is an authorized SI dealer? I went on the SI website and I think I read that for warranty support you need to have purchased the screen from an authorized dealer, but when I used their "find a local SI dealer" tool, best buy wasn't listed, so that has me a little worried.
Also, I looked the 100" screen I think I'll end up needing on the BB website and I don't see any mention of the optional LED kit being included with the price OR a way to purchase it separately (or the cost to do so). Does anyone have any clue why it isn't listed as included OR available for purchase? She REALLY wants the BD Zero Edge with the LEDs.
Thanks in advance for any help anyone can provide. Sorry for the long post (and I'm sure I'll have more questions)...I'd just like to get this all right the first time and this will be my first projector/screen purchase (we're upgrading from an 8000-series Samsung LED and I want this to be AWESOME!!!).

Sent you a PM that may help you out. Check your in box.wink.gif
post #3052 of 3545
dannyday2,

I had the Geek Squad out to do a proposal on my home theater and they told me they were an authorized Black Diamond dealer. They told me they order direct from Screen Innovations and the product is shipped directly to your home. I am looking at getting the Screen Innovations Black Diamond Zero Edge G2 115". I haven't made the jump yet as the cost is a little steep and i'm still looking for feedback to see if there are any better screens out there.
post #3053 of 3545
I will be purchasing a BD Zero Edge 115" screen.

Question should I get a .8 or a 1.4? My projector will be an Epson PowerLite Home Cinema 5020UB. According to Screen Innovations Screen wizard my light level looks like it would be around 15 LC.Obviously I want it bright but I do not want any shimmer on the screen which I hear could happen at 1.4.
Any recommendations would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Jim
Edited by tiguej - 1/7/13 at 4:03pm
post #3054 of 3545
Great thread.. I have the 100" .8 screen and reiterate the last 2 pages. It's awesome for a regular living room no light control, white ceiling, white walls room. I even have a wall to the left of it with a sliding glass screen. Most of the time I have it drawn closed w/ the vertical blinds turned a bit to still keep a well lit room to watch tv during the day for the kids. For me, I usually close the blinds but it's in no way a dark room since there's light spilling in from the kitchen as well.

At night it looks like a plasma. I have the epson 5010 and have it in ECO mode.

I would though love to know if I can add that LED kit to it after the fact?

thanks

Peter
post #3055 of 3545
Great thread.. I have the 100" .8 screen and reiterate the last 2 pages. It's awesome for a regular living room no light control, white ceiling, white walls room. I even have a wall to the left of it with a sliding glass screen. Most of the time I have it drawn closed w/ the vertical blinds turned a bit to still keep a well lit room to watch tv during the day for the kids. For me, I usually close the blinds but it's in no way a dark room since there's light spilling in from the kitchen as well.

At night it looks like a plasma. I have the epson 5010 and have it in ECO mode.

I would though love to know if I can add that LED kit to it after the fact?

thanks

Peter
post #3056 of 3545
I Need Help to buy the fixed frame 2:35:1 size 92
i have panasonic ae4000 lcd lm 1600
My room white color and between projector to screen 9 feet
what the gain good for me
.8 or 1.4
post #3057 of 3545
Quote:
Originally Posted by tiguej View Post

I will be purchasing a BD Zero Edge 115" screen.

Question should I get a .8 or a 1.4? My projector will be an Epson PowerLite Home Cinema 5020UB. According to Screen Innovations Screen wizard my light level looks like it would be around 15 LC.Obviously I want it bright but I do not want any shimmer on the screen which I hear could happen at 1.8.
Any recommendations would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Jim

I am no expert but I maybe able to steer you the right way. I don't have a 5020 but I looked into getting one (i went with sony hw50ES). Here is my take:

If you are going to calibrate your projector go with the 1.4. The 5020 when calibrated will have much lower light output calibrated.

If you do not calibrate it and use the brighter modes then go with the .8. The .8 during the day will give you deeper blacks because the base material is darker. And using the epson in its brighter modes will have plenty of light to take advantage of a .8 screen.

Now of course all of this has to do with have far you mount your projector. If you plan to mount it really far from the screen (max or close to max) you may have to go with the 1.4 no matter what
post #3058 of 3545
epson 5020 white walls white 200 dollar screen blacks well not good. How much will the bd help. I am not happy with the current set up. Alot of things just look washed out even in complete darkness. If the seen is real dark then the blacks look alot better but not great but close. When things get bright on screen its alot worse. Should I go with the 1.4 or .8 I like the picture to have alot of pop and on screen contrast. Is the black diamond my anser.
post #3059 of 3545
Im a neby in the fp world
post #3060 of 3545
natas777,

Thanks for the response. I will be having the projector calibrated. It sounds like the 1.4 is the best option.


Can I ask why you choose the SonyHW 50ES over the Epson? I have been going back and forth and the decision is tough between the 2 as they both get great reviews.



Thanks for the feedback.

JT
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