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Black Diamond from Screen Innovations? - Page 111

post #3301 of 3549
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoonLaf View Post

Hi,

I'm building my own villa, and I'm planning to have a dedicated Home Theater Room.

I want to know the dimensions that I should choose for this room, after taking into consideration the below:

I'm thinking of getting the below Zero Edge BD screen:

Black Diamond 4K .8
56.3" x 132.6"
144"
SBZ144BD8

As for the projector, I'm thinking of:

Epson 5020UB Home Cinema 3D HDMI, 1080p 3LCD Projector

There will be 2 rows of (4) + (4) seats.

Appreciate your suggestions and comments.

Kind Regards,
Mouna.

Sent you a PM. smile.gif
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post #3302 of 3549
Do you have an anamorphic lens picked out to make your Epson do 2:35? The Epson 5020 will not stretch the image to fill a 2:35 aspect ratio without an anamorphic lens.
post #3303 of 3549
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlakeSI View Post

Do you have an anamorphic lens picked out to make your Epson do 2:35? The Epson 5020 will not stretch the image to fill a 2:35 aspect ratio without an anamorphic lens.

Blake, couldn't he zoom it manually depending on the projector placement? I thought the 5020 has a decent amount of zoom, 2.10:1.

Also, wouldn't he need an external scaler of some sort to do the vertical stretching as the 5020 doesn't do it?
post #3304 of 3549
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlakeSI View Post

Do you have an anamorphic lens picked out to make your Epson do 2:35? The Epson 5020 will not stretch the image to fill a 2:35 aspect ratio without an anamorphic lens.

Update: i checked with my buddy Jeff at Epson, the 5020 will not support anamorphic.
post #3305 of 3549
Quote:
Originally Posted by biliam1982 View Post

Blake, couldn't he zoom it manually depending on the projector placement? I thought the 5020 has a decent amount of zoom, 2.10:1.

Also, wouldn't he need an external scaler of some sort to do the vertical stretching as the 5020 doesn't do it?

I would move up to a 6020 that can support anamorphic. Panamorph has a fixed lense for under $2000 that will work with the Epson 6020 and you maintain resolution. You do need to place the projector in the perfect spot to avoid "lens bow" in the image.

I would avoid doing the zoom thing with an Epson. I have a 5020 in my house so I can tell you manually zooming between 16:9 and 2:35 would be a bit tricky. You cannot just Zoom, you have to lens shift the image also. This is all don manually with the 5020 and the lens shift works a lot like a echa-sketch up kind of goes up right and left kind of goes left down so not something i would want to have to do every time i watch a 2:35 movie.

For 16:9 viewing the Epson line is one of my absolute favorites but not so much for 2:35 zoom viewing. Add an anamorphic lens and you have a great anamorphic system that can work with the lights on.
post #3306 of 3549
BTW- Screen Innovations will show a Black Diamond motorized 132" in 2:35 at CEDIA in Denver.
post #3307 of 3549
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlakeSI View Post

I would move up to a 6020 that can support anamorphic. Panamorph has a fixed lense for under $2000 that will work with the Epson 6020 and you maintain resolution. You do need to place the projector in the perfect spot to avoid "lens bow" in the image.

I would avoid doing the zoom thing with an Epson. I have a 5020 in my house so I can tell you manually zooming between 16:9 and 2:35 would be a bit tricky. You cannot just Zoom, you have to lens shift the image also. This is all don manually with the 5020 and the lens shift works a lot like a echa-sketch up kind of goes up right and left kind of goes left down so not something i would want to have to do every time i watch a 2:35 movie.

For 16:9 viewing the Epson line is one of my absolute favorites but not so much for 2:35 zoom viewing. Add an anamorphic lens and you have a great anamorphic system that can work with the lights on.

Hi,

Thanks for the heads up Blake.

So, you would advise me to go for this projector:

http://www.amazon.com/Epson-PowerLite-Projector-Glasses-Ceiling/dp/B00AQ95DAC

and get lenses from Panamorph to achieve the required resolution.

Couldn't there be a Projector that would do the job without adding the lenses?
post #3308 of 3549
at that price for the 6020, I would just go with a sony hw50es, but that's just my opinion cool.gif
post #3309 of 3549
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoonLaf View Post

Hi,

Thanks for the heads up Blake.

So, you would advise me to go for this projector:

http://www.amazon.com/Epson-PowerLite-Projector-Glasses-Ceiling/dp/B00AQ95DAC

and get lenses from Panamorph to achieve the required resolution.

Couldn't there be a Projector that would do the job without adding the lenses?

Yes, but keep in mind you do not maintain full chip resolution or lamp brightness when zooming the image. On a smaller 2:35 screen like a 110" or 120" it looks fine but if you are going with a 144" you will notice the image is not as sharp or bright as your 115" 16:9 image on the same screen ( a 144: 2:35 is the same height as a 115" 16:9).

The panasonic 8000 works great with zoom memory in a bright room and is also LCD like the Epson. JVC projectors also do zoom and have the best black of an projector on the market but they are a little more expensive and not as bright as the Epson or Panasonic so best used in a light controlled room with little or no windows. Sony, JVC and Epson will all be announcing new models at CEDIA and i have it on good information that zoom memory will be a popular feature in projectors this year.

My philosophy has been and always will be "buy when ready because if you wait for the perfect wave you will never surf". However my other rule is "its never always but its always sometimes". Meaning there are a bunch of new projectors launching at CEDIA the last week of Sept.

I believe this will be the most exciting year yet for two piece projection. eek.gif
post #3310 of 3549
Blake is the Pure White screen superior to the Solar screen? Is there less sheen and sparkles on the pure white?

Also, are the LEDs offered only on the wall mounted zero edge or are they also available on the wire suspended version as well?

Thanks
post #3311 of 3549
Yes Pure White is superior to any white screen i have seen including our Solar. Less sparkle and super smooth image. 8K rated due to our ability to totally control the emboss pattern to be 9x finer than any screen material because we are not using screen material.


http://www.screeninnovations.com/screen-materials/pure-4k-1-3-white/#SliderNav0
post #3312 of 3549
Quote:
Originally Posted by Threefiddie View Post

at that price for the 6020, I would just go with a sony hw50es, but that's just my opinion cool.gif

i have been hearing very cool things about the new 55 as well that i believe Sony will show at CEDIA.
post #3313 of 3549
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlakeSI View Post

Yes, but keep in mind you do not maintain full chip resolution or lamp brightness when zooming the image. On a smaller 2:35 screen like a 110" or 120" it looks fine but if you are going with a 144" you will notice the image is not as sharp or bright as your 115" 16:9 image on the same screen ( a 144: 2:35 is the same height as a 115" 16:9).

The panasonic 8000 works great with zoom memory in a bright room and is also LCD like the Epson. JVC projectors also do zoom and have the best black of an projector on the market but they are a little more expensive and not as bright as the Epson or Panasonic so best used in a light controlled room with little or no windows. Sony, JVC and Epson will all be announcing new models at CEDIA and i have it on good information that zoom memory will be a popular feature in projectors this year.

My philosophy has been and always will be "buy when ready because if you wait for the perfect wave you will never surf". However my other rule is "its never always but its always sometimes". Meaning there are a bunch of new projectors launching at CEDIA the last week of Sept.

I believe this will be the most exciting year yet for two piece projection. eek.gif

Thanks for the information Blake.

I'm going to wait a little bit then, since it will take at least 1 year to build the villa.

Most probably, I'll go for JVC projector as the home theater setup will be in the basement (light controlled environment with no windows)

Appreciate if you could advise me with best dimensions for the planned room based on my suggested setup here.
post #3314 of 3549
Love this thread! I am in the middle of building my movie room (see link to image.. ) right now. This pic faces what will be the front of the room where the screen will go. I am undecided about which screen to buy or even if I should just paint it with Screen Goo. I am planning to use an Epson 5020UB and with a Pure Zero Edge, I could max out the space at a 114" diagonal screen. My theater room is very light controlled but I do plan to use it for some TV (sports) viewing but the main purpose will be movies. Here are my questions after reading the entire thread:

1. If I didn't want to spring for the BD screen, are the Pure Zero Edge screens any better at minimizing problems with ambient light (like when I want to watch sports with the lights on) than any other non-SI BD screen or Screen Goo? I didn't see anything on the SI website about the Pure screens being able to diffuse ambient light.
2. If I went with the Pure Zero Edge screen, in a very light controlled room like I'll have, and a very bright projector in the Epson 5020, would I want to go with the Pure White 1.3 gain screen or the Pure Gray .85 gain screen? Would one minimize the "sparkling" and hotspotting that I have read about in this thread with BDs and Pure zero edges? Would the Pure Gray .85 help out at all with the lights when I want to watch sports on the screen?
3. If the Pure Zero Edge screens are truly a reference screen for only dark room movie viewing, as has been suggested in this thread, what are my options if I want to watch a little TV (but mostly movies) but not spend the $$ for BD (nor would the BD allow me to maximize the screen size).

Thanks again for everyone contributing to this thread. It has helped but has also left me with some fundamental questions.

Thanks in advance for your insights.
post #3315 of 3549
Nice room. I just moved to south Florida and will be adding a room for my HT hopefully within the next year. Compared to Texas where I had a dedicated room, everything is tiny and expensive over here.
In any case, my suggestions are the following:
Don't use paint. First, you'll be surprised how hard it is to get a perfect even surface; even with someone very experienced with mudding and taping; in addition the 2x4s used in framing are never perfect with slight bends and twists; drywall is somewhat flexible and you'll see this on your wall hence the texture that is added to cover up these imperfections.
As far as BDs if you want to use lighting during your projector viewing it is one of the better options; Firehawks are also pretty good. One of the keys in getting the best results is to be sure to place your room lighting as far as you can from the center viewing axis as possible. If you are going with an Epson which is very bright maybe a 0.8 will give you the optimal results and possibly eliminate all the hotspotting; your throw distance is also important as the closer you'll be the more light intensity will be projected into the screen.
The material you are looking for is the black diamond regardless if it's a zero edge or conventional frame.
post #3316 of 3549
Quote:
Originally Posted by chad2282 View Post

Love this thread! I am in the middle of building my movie room (see link to image.. ) right now. This pic faces what will be the front of the room where the screen will go. I am undecided about which screen to buy or even if I should just paint it with Screen Goo. I am planning to use an Epson 5020UB and with a Pure Zero Edge, I could max out the space at a 114" diagonal screen. My theater room is very light controlled but I do plan to use it for some TV (sports) viewing but the main purpose will be movies. Here are my questions after reading the entire thread:

1. If I didn't want to spring for the BD screen, are the Pure Zero Edge screens any better at minimizing problems with ambient light (like when I want to watch sports with the lights on) than any other non-SI BD screen or Screen Goo? I didn't see anything on the SI website about the Pure screens being able to diffuse ambient light.
2. If I went with the Pure Zero Edge screen, in a very light controlled room like I'll have, and a very bright projector in the Epson 5020, would I want to go with the Pure White 1.3 gain screen or the Pure Gray .85 gain screen? Would one minimize the "sparkling" and hotspotting that I have read about in this thread with BDs and Pure zero edges? Would the Pure Gray .85 help out at all with the lights when I want to watch sports on the screen?
3. If the Pure Zero Edge screens are truly a reference screen for only dark room movie viewing, as has been suggested in this thread, what are my options if I want to watch a little TV (but mostly movies) but not spend the $$ for BD (nor would the BD allow me to maximize the screen size).

Thanks again for everyone contributing to this thread. It has helped but has also left me with some fundamental questions.

Thanks in advance for your insights.

I heard a great quote that I want to share.

"You date your projector but you marry your screen". This is soooo true when you think about it. Pure Zero Edge as well as Black Diamond Zero Edge are both 8K rated. So pick one and it will probably be the same screen for your first 1080P projector, your second 4K projector and even your 3rd 8K projector. After that we all have google eyeballs installed and all screens become obsolete.
The point is a screen is a long term investment so if you plan to watch some content with the lights on then buy a screen that was designed to work with both the lights on and the lights off. If you plan on building a reference screening room and watching all content in the dark then buy a Pure White.
White screens are built for dark rooms and loose shadow detail when just a tiny bit of ambient light is in the room. Without shadow detail you get a flat image with no depth of field because of the loss of shadow detail. So given how long you will own a screen be sure to pick one that meets all of your needs. Life is to short to have to live with a poor image.
post #3317 of 3549
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlakeSI View Post

I heard a great quote that I want to share.

"You date your projector but you marry your screen". This is soooo true when you think about it. Pure Zero Edge as well as Black Diamond Zero Edge are both 8K rated. So pick one and it will probably be the same screen for your first 1080P projector, your second 4K projector and even your 3rd 8K projector. After that we all have google eyeballs installed and all screens become obsolete.
The point is a screen is a long term investment so if you plan to watch some content with the lights on then buy a screen that was designed to work with both the lights on and the lights off. If you plan on building a reference screening room and watching all content in the dark then buy a Pure White.
White screens are built for dark rooms and loose shadow detail when just a tiny bit of ambient light is in the room. Without shadow detail you get a flat image with no depth of field because of the loss of shadow detail. So given how long you will own a screen be sure to pick one that meets all of your needs. Life is to short to have to live with a poor image.

So true. Usually screens and speakers are long term investments. Projectors and AVR's change as advancements are made and features added.
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post #3318 of 3549
Anyone with the new light kit figured out how to save the set color on the DIY buttons on the remote? Also, what do the quick and slow buttons do? The included documentation was, uh, sparse...
post #3319 of 3549
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stiltz View Post

If anyone in Portland, OR (or close to Portland) has a Black Diamond please let me know.
Thanks!

Best Buy in Tualatin (Magnolia section of course) has a black diamond zero edge on the showroom wall now.
J
post #3320 of 3549
Have a couple LED kit issues:

1. LEDs flicker while watching 3D with Sony VPL-HW50ES. Any solution other than to turn them off?

2. I have a 115" diagonal BD ZE 1.4 surface mounted on an 8' x 14' wall and find the LED wash on the ceiling and walls a bit bright and distracting. I'd rather have an isolated halo effect. Any thoughts on minimizing the wash?

Thanks!
post #3321 of 3549
Hello All,

I am 100% new to the projector/projection screen world. I am in the process of finishing my basement and am looking for a kickass setup. The Basement is pretty much completely open and has 7 large windows. I will have blackout shades but would love to have the ability to watch sports/tv shows with the shades open. The screen will be in a built in area with walls about 25inches deep. I will also be painting the built in area black or dark brown (hoping this would help with the color bleeding over).

Throw ratio 12ft
View distance 14ft
projector will be mounted about 6" higher than the top of the screen.
max screen size i can fit is 106" 16:9

For projector I was leaning towards the Sony HW50ES but this might be out of my budget.

With the Sony and my distances, would I be better off going with the Black Diamond 1.4 or .8?

Any help is much appreciated!!
post #3322 of 3549
Quote:
Originally Posted by marlo24 View Post

Hello All,

I am 100% new to the projector/projection screen world. I am in the process of finishing my basement and am looking for a kickass setup. The Basement is pretty much completely open and has 7 large windows. I will have blackout shades but would love to have the ability to watch sports/tv shows with the shades open. The screen will be in a built in area with walls about 25inches deep. I will also be painting the built in area black or dark brown (hoping this would help with the color bleeding over).

Throw ratio 12ft
View distance 14ft
projector will be mounted about 6" higher than the top of the screen.
max screen size i can fit is 106" 16:9

For projector I was leaning towards the Sony HW50ES but this might be out of my budget.

With the Sony and my distances, would I be better off going with the Black Diamond 1.4 or .8?

Any help is much appreciated!!

Sent you a PM with my recommendation. smile.gif
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post #3323 of 3549
Can someone post an image of a black Diamond with LED lights that is showing content with black bars.

I want to see how black bars look with LED back lights.
Edited by smuggymba - 9/4/13 at 1:49pm
post #3324 of 3549
Hi folks

FYI, have cross posted this question in the projectors forum but figured i would ask here from the BD veterans...

I have recently upgraded to a new 144" diagonal, scope, curved, 1.4 gain, screen innovations black diamond screen. Love the screen. Running it with my ancient but still good pioneer elite FPJ1 projector. Projector is quite obviously not bright enough, especially since I often (usually) watch with some lights on. The room is a multi use, movies, pool, games and TV room. It can be made pitch black if requid for serious movie watching. Walls are black or deep grey. But like I said, 60% or more of the use is with lights on, weekend football, kids movies and documentaries etc.

I was pretty much set on a Sony vw1000es, with a panamorph DC1 lens, auto sled, for the obvious reasons of picture, image, and overall sex appeal. That said, it is a ~$25k+ package and I am asking myself the age old question: "how much better" will the picture be versus a capable, top of the line cheap projector?

For large BD screens, say 130 diagonal and larger, what projectors are other using, with auto zoom and 3d?

The projector MUST deliver capable brightness (ie 2000 lumens although all the projectors notoriously over report), with good contrast and blacks and MUST have lens memory for zoom, and 3d. I know I could get one of the DP cine or projectiondesign entry level projectors for under 10k if I punt the 3d requirement t I've decided not to do that.

If Sony had a NON 4k projector that put out 2k lumens, and didn't cost 25k msrp, I would have bought that in a heart beat! If JVC's best was as bright as the panny or the epson 5020/6020, I would have bought that in a heartbeat as well.

What do the gurus recommend? How bright REALLY is the brightest JVC?
post #3325 of 3549
OK I have could use some expertise reccomendatios here as well. I am also in the process of finishing my basement which will include a "media" room. My room demensions will be about 16 feet deep by 14 feet wide. I won't have row seating really but have been contenplating building in a narrow counter that would be a few feet out from the back row with just enough room for some bar stools. Then a couch will back up to that. The counter will not be fixed so when not needed I'd be able to slide it against the wall flush and move my couch back a few feet. So my seating would be somewhere in the neighborhood of 13 feet down to around 10 feet from screen. the room will be light controlled however I plan to watch a lot of sports down there so I will want some controlled lights on and not sit in the dark all the time. I was thinking I can get away with a 120 inch 16:9 diag screen? I don't have the drywall up yet but I did my best to mock up the screen with painters tape and while it's hard to tell for sure it didn't seem to bad from my closest sitting distance. I am looking at getting an epson 5020ub for my price range for my first projector as this is a pretty bright projector and seems to get good reviews.

Now a couple things that throw me off with this whole 16:9 and 2.4 screen dimensions are just how will it look on a 120 inch 16:9 screen if I'm watching something in 2.4 with the black bars. My thoughts is I deal with it now with a 55 inch led tv and I forget about the bars after a few minutes of watching. Now with the much larger 120 inch screen will it really even matter if I get black bars?? Again I want my sports to look the best they can so for HDTV watching 16:9 seems the way to go.

I guess I would like some suggestions for what would be the best options for my room. Again...

HD sports watching with lights (controlled) on.
watching wide format movies on a 16:9 screen
120" diag screen with sitting distance 10 - 13 feet away
Placement of the projector? 15 feet from lense to screen ok? I can go closer I suppose had planned for the electric to be on back wall.
Would the epson 6020ub be much better then the 5020ub?

I'm really leaning and thinking my best option would be a BD Zero Edge with the LED light kit. My plan however is to get the room done, Get the projector and then use the wall and play around with the settings. However I'll have to wire the room for projector placement before hand and my first thought was to use the back wall and a shelf. So my throw would be between 15-16'.

Again thank you for any suggesstions you can provide me! I want to make sure I do it right and I'm on the right path.
Edited by gec5741 - 9/6/13 at 8:31am
post #3326 of 3549
Quote:
Originally Posted by h00kemh0rns View Post

Looks like I'll be one of the lucky ones that will get to view this in person at the SI office. I'm impressed by the video and want to see if it lives up to expectations. I'll be candid in my opinion and hopefully I can see a side by side with other screens (i.e. silhouette, visage, etc.)


I'm hoping this thing really lives up to the video and hype. And I'm sure SI is as I'll be first in line to buy the BD.

I would love to show off our stuff at the factory! Contact me after Oct 1st and we can get together then. We are currently packing up for CEDIA (sept 26-28) so my demo room is full of trade show stuff.
post #3327 of 3549
Quote:
Originally Posted by scchang View Post

Have a couple LED kit issues:

1. LEDs flicker while watching 3D with Sony VPL-HW50ES. Any solution other than to turn them off?

2. I have a 115" diagonal BD ZE 1.4 surface mounted on an 8' x 14' wall and find the LED wash on the ceiling and walls a bit bright and distracting. I'd rather have an isolated halo effect. Any thoughts on minimizing the wash?

Thanks!

BEFORE I:



BEFORE II:


AFTER I


AFTER II
post #3328 of 3549
Quote:
Originally Posted by Salloom View Post

BEFORE I:



BEFORE II:


AFTER I


AFTER II

Yes! How did you achieve this?
post #3329 of 3549
PM sent
post #3330 of 3549
How to reduce visible texture?

Hi folks

So I've got a 144" diagonal, BD, 1.4 gain, curved, scope. I am currently projecting it with a old pioneer elite FPJ1 projector. Have purchased and will be upgrading to a sonyvw1000es n a week or so.

Challenge is, how much ever I might try to deny it, I can see significant visible texturing. Not sparkles, unless they are the same thing. The screen just has a soft texture to it on white, bright scenes. Don't get me wrong. Love the screen etc. amazing with lights. But can I do something to play with the texture?

Screen is installed 4' of the ground, slightly angled down. It's angled because the top is on the installation hooks and the bottom is not.
Viewing distance is 15'. Throw is 14'. Top of screen level with projector.

Will it make a difference if I lower the screen, increase the throw, or get rid of the slight angle?
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