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The Official Salk Sound Owner's And Discussion Thread - Page 246

post #7351 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by Monkish54 View Post


That is a damn shame! The S-1EX is one of my favorite speakers. Andrew Jones is my favorite designer. The S-1EX can be had for about 5K. I had a dealer offer me the floor model for 5K, but I could have talked him into new.

Idk why they wouldn't sell you three S-2EX. I would have been uber mad and gone to another dealer. What dealer did you go to?

**By no means do I want to take away from Jim & Dennis. They makes some very nice looking and sounding speakers. I was just saying. :P

That was Audio video logic, they advertise on Audiogon. I had a hard time finding dealers. It's probably a good thing since I would probably catch a lot of grief with 3 of those. It was considerably more money as well.
post #7352 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by saeyedoc View Post


That was Audio video logic, they advertise on Audiogon. I had a hard time finding dealers. It's probably a good thing since I would probably catch a lot of grief with 3 of those. It was considerably more money as well.

The website is really bad for finding dealers. I found one by coincidence. It doesn't even show up on the Pioneer website. O.O

I'll have to look up Audio Video Logic
post #7353 of 9127
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by repete66211 View Post

Attachment 247623

Attachment 247624

Attachment 247626

Attachment 247627

Well, here they are as promised. As you can see, things are a bit tight, but they're settling into their new home nicely. Everything in my place is so beige and bright that I wanted a nice dark veneer for contrast, so I went with espresso on walnut. I was afraid the dark dye might hide the grain, but it shows through much more nicely than these pictures indicate. (The Surround I rears, not pictured, are against the back wall.)

I think they're beautiful and I love looking at them, but hearing the new sounds and lower frequencies on familiar sountracks have been making me downright giddy. Thanks again Salk and company.

Looking sweet buddy!

saeyedoc,

You made the right decision.
post #7354 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

Some advice, if I may: Listen without Audyssey entirely for a while. Input the speaker distances and level matching settings yourself using a SPL meter (if applicable with your preamp/receiver). Audyssey can do great things below the Schroeder Frequency but can also muck up the mids and highs...)

Allow me some brief comments irt to the Audyssey advice. IMO if one has an Audyssey-equipped processor, it makes more sense to simply run Autosetup first thing. That not only does an Audyssey calibration, it accurately sets channel levels and distances for the MLP. Then, to hear the unEQd room affects Jim's speakers (which themselves require no EQ at all) just make the EQ setting= Off. A little understood option if one has a sub and listens in 2.1, is to select "Audyssey Bypass L/R" to EQ just the sub, not the speakers.

Then, once you've listened for awhile you can simply turn Audyssey ON, selecting the Std Audyssey refrence curve, or Audyssey Flat, depending on your preference.

I used to hear some minor undesirable things in the high end with MultEQXT, but those who have not yet heard XT32 will be pleasantly surprised how well it corrects below Schroeder Freq in both the sub and speaker channels and doesn't muck up the highs. Note that Audyssey Pro is not required to achieve this because the smarter fuzzy logic allocation of filters to the low freqs is built into XT32. Pro adds more accuracy, polish and customizability, but at considerable added expense ($700).
post #7355 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

........ A little understood option if one has a sub and listens in 2.1, is to select "Audyssey Bypass L/R" to EQ just the sub, not the speakers.

What processor are you referring to? I have an Onkyo 5508 with XT32 and don't have that option.

..........Peter
post #7356 of 9127
^Denon AVR A100 (4311), it comes up as I scroll through the EQ options. Sorry, thought it was a generally available, if rather odd, Audyssey option. The Audyssey thread would be the place for us to sort out if it's only offered in Denons.
post #7357 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

^Denon AVR A100 (4311), it comes up as I scroll through the EQ options. Sorry, thought it was a generally available, if rather odd, Audyssey option. The Audyssey thread would be the place for us to sort out if it's only offered in Denons.

I have that option on my Denon 3808 also.
post #7358 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

^Denon AVR A100 (4311), it comes up as I scroll through the EQ options. Sorry, thought it was a generally available, if rather odd, Audyssey option. The Audyssey thread would be the place for us to sort out if it's only offered in Denons.

I've heard that the Denon offers a few more configurations than Onkyo. That l/r bypass would be nice actually.
post #7359 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundofMind View Post

I used to hear some minor undesirable things in the high end with MultEQXT, but those who have not yet heard XT32 will be pleasantly surprised how well it corrects below Schroeder Freq in both the sub and speaker channels and doesn't muck up the highs.

I agree totally with SoM's thoughts. I recently bought the 4311 to replace my Onkyo 886 and specifically to get XT32. I could not listen to 2CH music using the 886 with Audyssey XT. I bought a Parasound 2100 for 2CH music listening (CS/SACDs) and used the 886 for MCH music (SACD/DVD-A). Since placing the 4311 in my system and calibrating with XT32 it has made a very nice improvement in the SQ of my system. So good in fact that I haven't used the 2100 in several weeks. I have Audyssey set to Flat and music both 2CH and MCH sound excellent.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pstrisik View Post

I've heard that the Denon offers a few more configurations than Onkyo. That l/r bypass would be nice actually.

It is true that Denon offers quite a few more Audyssey options than with the Onkyo. It really is amazing that the settings for Audyssey on the Onkyos are minimal when compared to the Denon.

Bill
post #7360 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

I agree totally with SoM's thoughts. I recently bought the 4311 to replace my Onkyo 886 and specifically to get XT32. I could not listen to 2CH music using the 886 with Audyssey XT. I bought a Parasound 2100 for 2CH music listening (CS/SACDs) and used the 886 for MCH music (SACD/DVD-A). Since placing the 4311 in my system and calibrating with XT32 it has made a very nice improvement in the SQ of my system. So good in fact that I haven't used the 2100 in several weeks. I have Audyssey set to Flat and music both 2CH and MCH sound excellent.


Bill

Lets make that 3 then...

I bought the Integra 80.3 (replaced D2v) for my great room and my Paradigm Sigs, and liked it so much, I bought another to run on my SoundScape M7's - sold off my Parasound 2100 / EE DAC+. I couldn't be happier. XT32 is fantastic.

As of right now, I just let it do its thing with Audyssey EQ and call it a day. IMO - far better bass EQ . Nothing lost elsewhere for me...
post #7361 of 9127
Just recieved my Song Towers last night....

Love them!!!

I will probably changing my worthless Pioneer sc35 for something that actually works...

I have been looking at either Anthem or Emotiva... any suggestions?
I want to be able to llisten in 2 channel and HT modes.... about 60/40 music...

not sure if i want to do separates or not... but would like a tube in there somewhere if possible...

Frank
post #7362 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by wyowolf View Post

Just recieved my Song Towers last night....

Love them!!!

I will probably changing my worthless Pioneer sc35 for something that actually works...

I have been looking at either Anthem or Emotiva... any suggestions?
I want to be able to llisten in 2 channel and HT modes.... about 60/40 music...

not sure if i want to do separates or not... but would like a tube in there somewhere if possible...

Frank

I think a proper way to power STs is AVA processor + amp. O yeah, don't forget a turntable.
post #7363 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by wyowolf View Post

Just recieved my Song Towers last night....

Love them!!!

I will probably changing my worthless Pioneer sc35 for something that actually works...

I have been looking at either Anthem or Emotiva... any suggestions?
I want to be able to llisten in 2 channel and HT modes.... about 60/40 music...

not sure if i want to do separates or not... but would like a tube in there somewhere if possible...

Frank

I have the Pioneer SC-37 and simply added a 5 channel amplifier to it and retasked it as a pre-amp. It was a good move because 140wpc wasn't cutting it for me.
post #7364 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by wyowolf View Post

Just recieved my Song Towers last night....

Love them!!!

I will probably changing my worthless Pioneer sc35 for something that actually works...

I have been looking at either Anthem or Emotiva... any suggestions?
I want to be able to llisten in 2 channel and HT modes.... about 60/40 music...

not sure if i want to do separates or not... but would like a tube in there somewhere if possible...

Frank

Frank,

Congrats! You will love the STs as I've had mine for over a year and I'm still in awe of the SQ.

I would suggest the Denon 4311 which was on sale at Electronics Expo for $1238 shipped. I'd give EE a call to see if that price is still available and if they have any in stock. The 4311 would be a great start and should have no problems powering the STs without an external amp. Although adding an amp is always a nice upgrade. I'm using my 4311 as a prepro with a Boston Acoustics A7200 (Sherwood A-965 clone). If the A7200 did crap out I could use the amps in the 4311.

Bill
post #7365 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by Enterion View Post

I have the Pioneer SC-37 and simply added a 5 channel amplifier to it and retasked it as a pre-amp. It was a good move because 140wpc wasn't cutting it for me.

What amp are you using?
post #7366 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by yveletnik View Post

I think a proper way to power STs is AVA processor + amp. O yeah, don't forget a turntable.

I have looked into AVA stuff, sound good but no HDMI is kind of a deal breaker for HT... if it was just two channel that would be fine...
post #7367 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by wyowolf View Post

Just recieved my Song Towers last night....

Love them!!!

I will probably changing my worthless Pioneer sc35 for something that actually works...

I have been looking at either Anthem or Emotiva... any suggestions?
I want to be able to llisten in 2 channel and HT modes.... about 60/40 music...

not sure if i want to do separates or not... but would like a tube in there somewhere if possible...

Frank

Frank,

If I was starting with just Salks, I would pick up the Denon 4311ci as suggested for your HT processor. You can use it to power everything initially and it seems to have the best consumer implementation of Audyssey XT32. Next, when ready, external two channel amp or two monos to power your mains. I would continue to use the Denon for center and surrounds. Emotiva is the best bang for the buck for amps I think (I have UPA-1 monos). They resell well if you want to upgrade to an AVA, Conrad Johnson, etc later. Next step in the project would be to get a good stereo preamp with home theater bypass. My current thinking is to put the tubes in the preamp and use solid state amps. Best of both worlds and the most practical in management and maintenance if you are going to have tubes somewhere. If you really want to go for it, after preamp, look at external DAC (can get tubes there as well).

This is all ignoring the source which is of course important as well.

The beauty of an AVR like the Denon (I have an Onkyo) is the flexibility. You can start there, and it's no slouch, and build piece by piece with the AVR at the center. If you get external amps for the mains and a preamp, you bypass the denon entirely for two channel music.

No rush though!

P.S. - I think Anthem makes better quality stuff, but their AVRs are not up to date in features and flexibility like the Denon and Onkyo.
post #7368 of 9127
Thread Starter 
^ Now that is some quality advice.
post #7369 of 9127
Crown Amps are excellent too (and less money). Although, they look bleh.
post #7370 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuance View Post

^ Now that is some quality advice.

.


.
post #7371 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by wyowolf View Post

What amp are you using?

Wyred4Sound MC5 - http://www.wyred4sound.com/webapps/p.../117839/332926
post #7372 of 9127
thanks for the detailed reply...

I am leaning toward keeping the Pio and just adding a two channel amp for the STs...

can you recommend between the AVA, Emotiva , CJ , Anthem , Jolida , Niteshade, which would be a good two channel amp? will probably buy used since i can get a better amp, would like to spend <1k for the amp itself...

I would like to try the Jolida or Niteshade as tube amps..
I think the AVA also makes a tube as well...

I know the Emotiva is ~800 for the XP2

the rest I am not as familiar with...

I am a bit hesitant to get the Denon, while I have read great things about it... i got a 991 about a year ago and it had to go back because of the HDMI card that went out after just a few weeks

thank you for your advice

Quote:
Originally Posted by pstrisik View Post

Frank,

If I was starting with just Salks, I would pick up the Denon 4311ci as suggested for your HT processor. You can use it to power everything initially and it seems to have the best consumer implementation of Audyssey XT32. Next, when ready, external two channel amp or two monos to power your mains. I would continue to use the Denon for center and surrounds. Emotiva is the best bang for the buck for amps I think (I have UPA-1 monos). They resell well if you want to upgrade to an AVA, Conrad Johnson, etc later. Next step in the project would be to get a good stereo preamp with home theater bypass. My current thinking is to put the tubes in the preamp and use solid state amps. Best of both worlds and the most practical in management and maintenance if you are going to have tubes somewhere. If you really want to go for it, after preamp, look at external DAC (can get tubes there as well).

This is all ignoring the source which is of course important as well.

The beauty of an AVR like the Denon (I have an Onkyo) is the flexibility. You can start there, and it's no slouch, and build piece by piece with the AVR at the center. If you get external amps for the mains and a preamp, you bypass the denon entirely for two channel music.

No rush though!

P.S. - I think Anthem makes better quality stuff, but their AVRs are not up to date in features and flexibility like the Denon and Onkyo.
post #7373 of 9127
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by wyowolf View Post

thanks for the detailed reply...

I am leaning toward keeping the Pio and just adding a two channel amp for the STs...

can you recommend between the AVA, Emotiva , CJ , Anthem which would be a good two channel amp? will probably buy used since i can get a better amp, would like to spend <1k for the amp itself...

I know the Emotiva is ~800 for the XP2

the rest I am not as familiar with...

I am a bit hesitant to get the Denon, while I have read great things about it... i got a 991 about a year ago and it had to go back because of the HDMI card that went out after just a few weeks

Out of those I'd choose the AVA. I recall a post from Dennis Murphy in which he explained he had just received an AVA amp from Frank that was rated at 125 watts into 8 ohms, or something like that; his current amp was rated at 200 watts into 8 ohms. While he was driving speakers his current amp would shut down and go into protect mode, but using the same speakers at the same volumes the lower powered AVA kept on singing without issue. That has always stuck in my mind, and I think it's a testament to how well made the AVA amps are. So out of those choices, AVA all the way.

I would also choose the Denon 4311 over the Pioneer, but you need to do what's best for you.

Just my $0.02
post #7374 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by wyowolf View Post

thanks for the detailed reply...

I am leaning toward keeping the Pio and just adding a two channel amp for the STs...

can you recommend between the AVA, Emotiva , CJ , Anthem , Jolida , Niteshade, which would be a good two channel amp? will probably buy used since i can get a better amp, would like to spend <1k for the amp itself...

I would like to try the Jolida or Niteshade as tube amps..
I think the AVA also makes a tube as well...

I know the Emotiva is ~800 for the XP2

the rest I am not as familiar with...

I am a bit hesitant to get the Denon, while I have read great things about it... i got a 991 about a year ago and it had to go back because of the HDMI card that went out after just a few weeks

thank you for your advice

If the Pio functions the way you want for HT, no reason to swap it out first unless you have the bucks to burn. External amp would be a good first move. I don't have direct experience with any of the amps you list. I do have Emotiva UPA-1 monoblocks, which are excellent for the money. No doubt there are lots of better amps, but not at that price new. Hard to find XPA-2's used - have to stay vigilant. If I were to buy a two channel amp today, I would likely get a used Conrad Johnson solid state or hybrid. There are a couple on Audiogon now, one at $900, one at $1100 - at ~200wpc.

Here is a used AVA. You could ask Frank and/or post on the AVA circle forum about this particular model. A bit above your price range and in Los Angeles though.

It is a good strategy to buy used if you can so you can resell without losing much if you want to swap out. That way you can try a few amps and get a feel for what you really like and go from there.

Happy hunting!
post #7375 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by wyowolf View Post

thanks for the detailed reply...

I am leaning toward keeping the Pio and just adding a two channel amp for the STs...

can you recommend between the AVA, Emotiva , CJ , Anthem , Jolida , Niteshade, which would be a good two channel amp? will probably buy used since i can get a better amp, would like to spend <1k for the amp itself...

I would like to try the Jolida or Niteshade as tube amps..
I think the AVA also makes a tube as well...

I know the Emotiva is ~800 for the XP2

the rest I am not as familiar with...

I am a bit hesitant to get the Denon, while I have read great things about it... i got a 991 about a year ago and it had to go back because of the HDMI card that went out after just a few weeks

thank you for your advice

Jump on this quick.
app.audiogon.com/listings/anthem-mca-20
post #7376 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by wyowolf View Post

thanks for the detailed reply...

I am leaning toward keeping the Pio and just adding a two channel amp for the STs...

The Pio should be suffficient to drive those ST speakers, did you re-run MCACC to equalize for the room? I am curious why you deem this amp to be "worthless" because I have a radically different impression of its quality. It's also capable of biamping, so you have options. Into 4 ohms, the SC-35 reaches 0.1 percent distortion at 219.0 watts, and 1 percent distortion at 270.9 watts.

My shortcomings with the amp portion had to do with the demands of my Soundscape 12 speakers (they are hungry).

If audio is bad I'd much rather look at placement and room treatments first and possibly cabling before forming conclusions.

Hope this helps.
post #7377 of 9127
A very good question

I have taken this Pio in once already for shutting down on me... and they "found nothing wrong with it"... so took it back.. still did it. sometimes several times a day... sometimes not for two or three days...

unhooked everything... new cables that were terminated... no difference...

i suspect something in the power amp section gets hot and somehow shuts it off... then it comes right back on... but it resets everything... which is a drag.. in the middle of the movie worst part it was out for 3 weeks ... so i figure if i just bypass that part of the amp it will be better..

plus i like the idea of more power for the towers themselves in any event...

i have had terrible luck with receivers the last year... 3 different ones... before that... not ONE problem in 20 years...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Enterion View Post

The Pio should be suffficient to drive those ST speakers, did you re-run MCACC to equalize for the room? I am curious why you deem this amp to be "worthless" because I have a radically different impression of its quality. It's also capable of biamping, so you have options. Into 4 ohms, the SC-35 reaches 0.1 percent distortion at 219.0 watts, and 1 percent distortion at 270.9 watts.

My shortcomings with the amp portion had to do with the demands of my Soundscape 12 speakers (they are hungry).

If audio is bad I'd much rather look at placement and room treatments first and possibly cabling before forming conclusions.

Hope this helps.
post #7378 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by wyowolf View Post

A very good question

I have taken this Pio in once already for shutting down on me... and they "found nothing wrong with it"... so took it back.. still did it. sometimes several times a day... sometimes not for two or three days...

Is the Sc-35 on stable electrical current? My Receiver and TV used to shut down on occasion under heavy load because of fluctuating AC power. I ran a dedicated 20A line from the breaker and it never happened again.

These amps draw a lot of power and the circuit may be overloaded. Possible?
post #7379 of 9127
Who knew when we purchased these speakers that it was just the beginning. I thought I'll go ahead and spend more on the speakers than I want to because they are the most important. Life was simpler before my my HT2-TLs. Now after just a few weeks, Its all I do is research new stuff, trying to figure out the best combination of products, while keeping in check financially, wanting clean natural sound. Its over whelming. There's AV, and two channel. I went from 50/50 to about 90/10. Heavy on the music. Most of us start with the av receiver, I did. I bought a Parasound 2250 to pre out from. I'm 100% mac mini sourced. It keeps thing simpler for me. (except of course there is the software factor). So I'm experiencing some of the best sound I personally have heard. But you want more and better. My path then took me to a DAC to clean up the signal and I chose the w4s dac 2, I bought locally and used. This is where it starts getting over whelming. When should I start adding tube stuff? The DAC, the pre amp? or the amp? My thoughts changed after I realized I could use my DAC as my pre amp, and it has HT bypass, and I can control it with my harmony 1. I think It sounds great. ( but I thought is was great before!) I was prepared to get the ava hybrid pre amp. But thats Like 3 grand If you want remote. Thats a hell of a lot of money. I'm hoping my new dac/pre combo will hold me over. I've read that separating your 2 channel from the av is a major step in the right direction, not sure if I'm properly doing that. Maybe now my next step could be get get a tube amp to warm up the sound a little? then add a tube pre? If it wasn't enough? Not sure if there is a question there or if I'm just sharing my experience with the aftereffects of purchasing new Salk speakers.
post #7380 of 9127
Quote:
Originally Posted by Enterion View Post

Is the Sc-35 on stable electrical current? My Receiver and TV used to shut down on occasion under heavy load because of fluctuating AC power. I ran a dedicated 20A line from the breaker and it never happened again.

These amps draw a lot of power and the circuit may be overloaded. Possible?

All the AV is on one dedicated circuit, I ran it that way when I built my lighted soffit.

I pulled everything out of the cab and hooked up just the speakers, fronts only. and then just the optical from the blu ray... "so far" it hasnt done that... but its only been a couple hours... i have my doubts...

I do notice one thing... when i run in direct mode the bass is much stronger then pure direct? pure to me sounds too "tinny" , btw I am using Jims demo cd for this..
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