Magnavox 537, 535, 533, 515, 513, 2160A, 2160, 2080 & Philips 3576, 3575 - Page 673

hi wajo..

yes, i have all my machines set for MRC...

also, a stupid thing here... i'm wondering if imgbrn is actually finalizing the disc... i presume it is, since the things play on the cheapo machine just fine...

nocturnal - i'm using imgbrn for quick and/or full erase...

still testing...

rgds,
ron g

Yes, but not in the way you are thinking. A DVD recorder is a multi session device allowing you to burn titles to a disk one at a time until you have all the desired content in place. During this process the disk is in a meta-stable state. The finalization process generates the menu files, arranges the folder structure to be DVD Video compliant and locks the disk after burning.

When you author on a PC, the final folder structure the authoring software generates for the project is in essence "finalized". It contains all the menu files and is in proper folder structure. All ImgBurn does is burn it to disk in the proper video format (i.e. folder/file placement and UDF version) and verify/lock the disk after burning.

Where do these refurbished Magnavox 513's and 515's that are carried by J&R and other vendors come from? Are they units that have been returned to retailers, to Funari for warranty service but were replaced instead, etc.?

Stop that!

Many of us don't have any more TVs to hook one up to!

Hmm...

I did see an online computer parts store that says one of their refurbed monitors takes Composite input...

I installed the latest version of ImgBurn and quick erased the DVD-RW with that. When I inserted it into my 515, it went through the formatting process again. I wonder why that doesn't happen for you.

ok, here we go... believe i've figured it out...

due respect to nocturnal... i believe he probably authored material from PC FIRST... that is, virgin disc went into PC to author material as the first operation on that disc...

here's the deal....

1 - using a virgin DVD-RW and authoring on PC as the first operation works.

when the PC authored DVD is inserted into Mag, it only READS and does not FORMAT... the apparent sequence of events for Mag is to read first and, if virgin, format for future operations in the +VR arena... if not virgin, read what it has and run with it...

once the Mag ' transforms ' ( for lack of better word ) the DVD for use in the +VR environment, the +VR environment now owns the disc, and will continue to own the disc, apparently forever, and no amount of erasing will restore the disc to its virgin status...


sooooooooooo... for purposes of getting the Mags to read a DVD-RW and play fine, the disc must NOT have been FIRST initialized to be used in the +VR mode environment. best i can tell, once it's done, it's done, and the disc that's initialized in the Mag / Philips environment can no longer be utilized as if it were a conventional disc, eg, for authoring from PC or other non +VR environment...


the virgin worked perfectly for me...

i have not yet tried to ' erase ' the PC Authored disc in the Mag, but my sense is that it will either fail, or the Mag will ' format ' it and, as such, cause the disc to become a member of the +VR club...

rgds,
ron g

I just noticed that I had MRC off on my 515 when I ran my tests. I thought it was on (it is on for my V513 and V2160A units). Would there be any reason for me to try it again with MRC on?

I have a hard time believing the "virgin disc" hypothesis, but I don't have any unused DVD-RW discs to try.

OK. After turning MRC on, I did the same test and got the same results.

Wajo,

Why don't you just take the extra mag remote, turn it on its side and lean it against the display of the Maggie that is to be blocked. It works everytime for me.

Hi wajo,

I was experimenting with your kluge design just yesterday. Instead of using a greeting card, I cut a piece out of a manila file folder. I found that the IR signal from the remote went right through it. So I thought that maybe it wasn't thick enough so I cut another piece and scotch taped it to the part that covers the eye on my 515. IR was still leaking through. So I sat and thought. Then I got a piece of aluminum foil and put it over the eye. Worked great except a piece of aluminum foil by itself is not very manageable. So I put a piece of foil between the two layers of file folder creating a lamination effect for the part covering the eye. Works wonderful even from point blank range. I made mine a bit larger, 5" wide like yours but 2-1/4" for the part covering the eye and because of the extra weight of that part, I extended the 4" part to 8" using several thicknesses to add enough weight and rigidity to hold the whole thing in place.

It fit nice and with the remote right up to the machine, it was almost impossible to find a place that the IR would leak through.

You might want to do your own experimenting, but I believe metal of some sort is the answer to successfully blocking the IR. Maybe even a greeting card that has foil on it.

3575 stopped formatting new +R (Sony 6x) and +R/W (TDK 4x--not the new cheap white-package ones) disks--it starts the Reading process, then stalls on Format at 0% and puts up a "cannot record on this disk" message. Oddly enough, those reject disks format without hesitation on my other 3575 and then record with no problem on the offending unit. Doesn't matter whether it's set to Make Compatible or not. Nor is any other DVD function being cranky or slow. I don't have any -R or -R/W disks to test at the moment, but the behavior has been consistent for three days now. Unplugging and waiting didn't shake anything loose. If it were mere mechanical or laser wearing-out, I would expect more general failure. Or is there something about the formatting process that makes specific demands on the burner?

Silly boy. Because, like me, he has all but the bottom one in each stack sitting on a same or similar sized device, not on a shelf.

"Can not record on this disc"

ERROR E 3 00000000

On my Mag 515, I got this message, but I can't exit out of it. Stop, eject, power, OK, nothing works, either from the remote or the front panel. What do I do? I'd hate to pull the plug.

I ended up pulling the plug for about 5 seconds. Luckily it powered back up without a hard reset and a 4 hour wait. Then a message came up asking if I wanted to cancel the disc repair...since it wasn't a rewritable I just canceled the repair and tossed the disc. Hopefully it was just a single disc anomaly.

Ok... next step... sorry if it's a bit long... trying to narrow it down, here...

Sequence -

1 - Virgin Into PC
2 - Author Title
3 - Plays Ok In Mag
4 - Attempt Erase In Mag ( failed - display says already finalized )
5 - DVD-RW Back Into PC
6 - Quick Erase ( theory - to at least eliminate ' finalized ' condition )
7 - Erased DVD-RW Back Into Mag
8 - Mag ' loads ' only; no ' formatting ' displayed
9 - After Loading - Mag Display = ' -- '
10 - Title Display Does Not Come Up
11 - Engage ' Disc Edit '
12 - Display Shows ' Erase Disc ' only; no other options
13 - Select ' Erase Disc '
14 - Mag Successfully Erases Disc; produces usual ' Empty Space ' entry
( also allows dubbing option here )

15 - DVD-RW back into PC
16 - Imgbrn Disc Discovery Now Shows 1 Incomplete Session

Note - I did NOT Finalize the Mag Erased Disc While In The Mag

17 - Imgbrn - Quick Erase
18 - Imgbrn - Disc Now Shows No Sessions
19 - Author Title On PC
20 - PC Authored DVD-RW Back Into Mag
21 - Mag again ' loads ' , does not format , and cannot play title.
22 - Select ' Disc Edit ' ; Display Only Allows ' Erase Disc '
23 - Select ' Erase Disc '
24 - Mag Successfully Erases Disc; produces usual ' Empty Space ' entry
( also allows dubbing option here )

Repeat 17-24 Above, but with FULL erase... no change...

25 - Manually Record Short Title On Mag
26 - Confirm Title Is Recorded And Plays

27 - DVD-RW back into PC
Note - I did NOT Finalize the Disc In Mag
28 - Imgbrn - Will Not Write New Data Unless I Erase

29 - Imgbrn - Quick Erase
30 - Imgbrn - Disc Now Shows No Sessions
31 - Author Title On PC
32 - PC Authored DVD-RW Back Into Mag
33 - Mag again ' loads ' , does not format , and cannot play title.
34 - Select ' Disc Edit ' ; Display Only Allows ' Erase Disc '
35 - Select ' Erase Disc '
36 - Mag Successfully Erases Disc; produces usual ' Empty Space ' entry
( also allows dubbing option here )

As a last resort, I recorded a title on the Mag, FINALIZED it, and repeated steps to PC Author a title... same result.... will not play on the mag...


Summation - I believe that this is conclusive ( at least with my machines )...

1 - A Virgin DVD-RW can be used to author titles ( on a PC ) and it will play properly on the Mag

2 - The same disc can be erased and re-authored ( on a PC ) and it will play properly on the Mag

3 - A DVD-RW previously authored on a PC cannot be erased using the Mag erase disc function ( Mag thinks it is a finalized DVD and will not erase it; errors out ).

4 - The same disc can be erased ( on a PC ), and then erased on the Mag.
( this process is successful, and makes the disc usable on the Mag ).

5 - Once the disc has been effectively ' violated ' by the Mag, through either erasure or initial insert formatting, it becomes part of the +VR club and will no longer be usable as a ' PC Authored Source Disc '... it CAN be used within the Funai family, to record, play, transfer, etc...

6 - In all cases, the same disc will play a PC Authored title fine on my cheapo DVD player.

7 - At NO TIME during any of these tests, did the Mag indicate that it was Formatting ( as it does when a virgin disc is first inserted into the Mag )...

I will retain some virgin DVD-RW discs to be used to transfer PC Authored Titles over to the Funai's

rgds,
ron g

As do I.

I do what you are trying to do all the time. I use VideoReDo and ImgBurn. What program are you authoring your DVDs with?

i use DVD Flick ( pub domain )....

however, for these tests, the only applicable software is, indeed, the imgbrn software... the authoring software was used to author a couple of short titles, and was not used again... the testing process used the exact same
authored content and file structure, imported into the imgbrn software for both the ' successful ' burns and the failed burns.

i DO note ( within imgbrn software - disc discovery mode ), that 1 parameter is different, once the disc has been violated by the Mag...

as follows -

Physical Format Information (Last Recorded):
Book Type: DVD-RW
Part Version: 3
Disc Size: 120mm

the above example is from a virgin DVD-RW....

once the disc has been violated, the ' Part Version: ' is read as ' 2 ' when the disc discovery mode is invoked.

there is no particular description i can locate as to what this parameter means

rgds,
ron g

==========

That doesn't make sense. Exactly how are you attempting to erase it?


The quck erase should render the disc effectively blank (like new).


When I insert a blank disc, it always gets formatted. I don't understand why that doesn't happen for you.


I wouldn't expect it to.


This is what should have happened in step 4.


In this case, it should not format. That only happens with a blank disc. However, I would have expected you to be able to play the title if it had been authored properly.

I wonder if there is something wrong with your ImgBurn settings or usage. It seems that whenever a disc comes out of your PC, it behaves strangely (and differently from my experience) in your Magnavox.

[quote=Nocturnal;21935294]
That doesn't make sense. Exactly how are you attempting to erase it?

after i iinsert the virgin ( and PC authored ) DVD-RW into Mag, it plays the PC authored titles fine...

then - select ' disc edit '
Mag displays ' ERASE DISC '
select this ( the only ) option
Mag begins, then stops with failure error ( cannot erase, disk is finalized )...


[quote=Nocturnal;21935294]
The quck erase should render the disc effectively blank (like new).

i assume you mean quick erase inside imgburn... yes, this appears to render the disc blank, and i can repeat the process ( pc author, playback, etc ) without issue.

HOWEVER, once that same disk has been violated ( again, for lack of better term ) in any way ( recorded to, or erased after imgburn erase ) by the mag, i can no longer PC author using that disc and have it play on the Mag... the Mag will not play it... even though it WILL play on the cheapo player...

the disc DOES get built inside imgburn ( always )... it just won't play out on the Mag.

also, as stated previously, disc discovery produces 1 difference after Mag violation that PERSISTS even through a FULL or QUICK erase... that difference is ' Part Version '...

pre-violation - Part Version: 3
post-violation - Part Version: 2

[quote=Nocturnal;21935294]
I wonder if there is something wrong with your ImgBurn settings or usage. It seems that whenever a disc comes out of your PC, it behaves strangely (and differently from my experience) in your Magnavox.

you may well be correct about imgburn settings... the documentation does not appear to be that great, and i am not an expert, and i cannot find anything about this ' Part Version ' parameter... i am running with whatever the installed ' default ' settings are...

i'm using ' build mode ' and importing plain old ' video_ts ' and ' audio_ts ' folders...

then i hit the ' go ' button...


[quote=Nocturnal;21935294]
When I insert a blank disc, it always gets formatted. I don't understand why that doesn't happen for you.

this may have something to do with this ' Part Version ' thing... the only time i EVER see the Mag ' formatting ' ( same as philips, by the way ) is when a virgin disc ( right out of the box ) is inserted FIRST into the Mag... i never again see the Mag perform a ' format ' on that disc again, under any circumstances...

these things would point, most likely, to an imgburn parameter setting that's not right. but i'll be darned if i know what it is...

rgds
ron g