Magnavox 537, 535, 533, 515, 513, 2160A, 2160, 2080 & Philips 3576, 3575 - Page 732

I'd say it's more like: The FCC......"Industry lobbying dollars at work!"

Our machines can't receive most channels on most cable systems CURRENTLY; the only ones being available are pretty much local OTA channels carried by the cable service.

I don't believe the article said anything about OTAs being encrypted. I don't believe the it's even LEGAL for them to encrypt OTAs, is it?

Can someone point out to me where the article says OTAs are being encrypted?

In the case of many cable channels now, you can't even record them from the cable box, and need some type of filter in order for them to be recordable without limits.

Yes it is legal. There was a flurry of activity on this rule last July. It's finally come to a head. Note that previously carriers were allowed to encrypt locals if they could show there was significant theft of signal (Cablevision in NYC). This was done by Julius Genachowski, appointed by PRESIDENT OBAMA to be chairman of the FCC.

scott s.
.

The only cable channels I can't 'get' with my 513 is the premium ones (HBO, Starz, Encore, etc) or pay-per-view. This is the ONLY good thing about my cable provider

hi folks...

as soon as i confirm it, i'll post a source for the magic ribbon cable... i don't want to post until i make sure it's the correct one, since this is my 2nd go-around after having received an incorrect version of the cable...

i stupidly fried one of these in my MDR-513. although it was melted, it still functions, and i am awaiting the replacement....

rgds,

ron g

With the 537, can you EDIT an HDD recorded program with FRAME granularity, similar to the capability on the old Panasonic DMR-E100H ? In reading the Manual, it seems that you cannot, but its a bit confusing because of terminology.

hi again all...

ok, i've received my replacement cable and can confirm that it is correct. this cable should be a good HDD replacement cable for 357x and 513 / 515 DVRs ...

the cable is available from Mouser electronics. it is made by Molex...

The Molex Part Number = 21020-0438

The Mouser Part Number For Ordering = 538-21020-0438

The cable is defined as a Molex FFC / FPC Jumper Cable with 0.5mm spacing and 40 Positions.

Be careful as the cable comes in 2 varieties ( the above part numbers represent the correct variety ), Type A and Type D.
Our machines use the Type D variety. The difference is that the connections on the Type D are reversed from end-to-end, and they are not reversed on the Type A.

I hope this helps for those trying to track down a replacement ribbon for the HDD.

rgds,
ron g

Hi, my friends,

I want to ask your honest opinion.
It is not an official servey but just my private marketing act to know US peoples interest.

As you may know we have Blu-Ray Recorder in our range for Japan market.
My question is how do you think the valu\e of the product.

= Blu-Ray Recorder DXBS1000 =
- Blu-Ray Recording (High Difinishion=HD)
- DVD (DL) Recording (AVCREC HD)
- HDD Recording (HD)
- CD music Playback
- SD card/ USB data copy to HDD (AVCHD HD Video and JPEG Picture)
* "AVCHD Video" is usually used for Camcorder.

- Digital HD double tuner (2ch simultaneous recording)
- HDD <--> BDR (both direction dubbing)
- 1TB HDD
- Title number limit 2000 (HDD), 200 (BDR)
- 2ch Remote Control
- CEC external device control
- EPG

= Existing tech =
The Japan model does not contain below feature but we have below tecnology.
If we can add it, does the value rise up?
- Internet streaming service (Netflix, Hulu, Vudu...)
- External USB HDD connection
- 8ch fulltime recording (No need timer program because FULL TIME Recording!)

= New feature =
We do not have enough knowledge but how do you like?
- Cable card control
- Auto Time adjustment (NTP or WWVB PM)
- Music juke box (copy from CD and make file name with the song title received via internet server)
- Music store connection and storing to HDD

234

234, you are going to have a lot drooling on their keyboards this morning.

じゃ、それをください。

キタ━━━ヽ(ヽ(゜ヽ(゜∀ヽ(゜∀゜ヽ(゜∀゜)ノ゜∀゜)ノ∀゜)ノ゜)ノ)ノ━━━!!!!

ヾ(＠⌒▽⌒＠)ﾉ

hi wajo..

yes, that's it....

rgds,
ron g

Sounds great.

I'm not sure I care about any of these though:

That all sounds great. I would be very interested in all of those features except for the music.

CableCARD would be fantastic! I already use a CableCARD tuner in my computer.

I think the radio clock setting would be worthwhile. WWVB info here.

I wouldn't mind seeing the return of the ability to play other types of media. I use the mp3, DivX & XviD playback on my 3576. It would be great to see these play a large variety of media files such as x264/mkv, DivX/avi, mp3, ac3, aac, idx/sub/sup, etc.

Also, I'd like to see it be able to play these from a USB port as well as from a disc... and record from these sources to the HDD.

I'm pretty strongly opposed to the addition of 'smart' content and internet apps.
They just seem like an excuse to jack up the price of equipment, are rarely well implemented or useful, and pretty much all new TVs already have this built in.

Btw, with 3D becoming prevalent, should an upgraded unit be able to record and play 3d content? I'm neutral on this but wouldn't mind the compatibility.

And a question: Is the HD channel recordings the raw stream or are they re-encoded as they are on the current models?

DXBS1000 conversation :

I particularly like the 1.3X speed playback ( with sound ) of the Magnavox / Philips. Does the DXBS1000 have it ?

That's a good question and given that it's primary function is to burn BD disks and AVCHD DVD's I would expect it to almost certainly have an H.264 encoder with several average bitrate profiles. The incoming transport streams for ATSC HDTV are MPEG-2 and can vary in bitrate from 7Mbps (ABC) to 17Mbps (CBS). Since people like to think in terms of recording time on a disk, such bitrate variability would make that impossible. Having an H.264 encoder would allow all the incoming source to be encoded to certain average bitrates that would correspond to certain recording times. Also, H.264/AVC is the preferred codec for BluRay but the required codec for AVCHD which is the format it will record onto DVD media -- an HDTV BD recorder is unlikely to make DVD video disks any more than a DVD recorder can make VCD disks. That means a recording paradigm shift and the need to buy a couple BD players if you want to play the disks you make on other TV's.

I think $650 is a very reasonable price for a dual-tuner HDTV BD-R recorder. Such a recorder would be of high enough value to be sold in traditional electronics outlets like BB. Cable card is unlikely to be licensed for anything that burns removable media and a clear QAM tuner would be as troublesome as it is now -- and soon to be useless. So this would be largely targeted at the OTA crowd and there it would be competing with TiVo and media-PC's. At that price-point it has a shot.
Edited by Kelson - 10/17/12 at 8:18pm

@Kelson - I'm a bit unclear about your argument/statement, but BD's can use mpeg2 or AVCHD, and BD content can be burned to DVD5 and DVD9 (as BD5 and BD9) with good cross hardware compatibility. Sure mpeg2 isn't the best quality for HD, but this is TV broadcasts we're talking about.

I do question your bitrate numbers though. By and large from what I've seen, a standard 1 hour TV show in 1080i (with commercials cut (about 45-50 minutes)) can easily fit as a BD5.

I would think any HD DVR would need an mpeg2 encoders for SD content at the very least (so as not to wastefully upscale everything) and at best to encode HD non-tuner input or re-encode shows at various preset bitrates to fit on discs. (Just like the existing High Speed dub for untouched and then various HQ, SP, EP, etc.)

I think an AVCHD encoder is an unnecessary addition that would only increase the cost for questionable function (besides, cutting/splitting AVC content is more problematic). If that is important there's no reason you couldn't burn rewritable discs in untouched or high bitrate mpeg2, import it to a PC, re-encode and build your own AVC blurays. (Hopefully BD-rw is supported.)

The ability to leave raw HD video and AC3 audio alone when recording is pretty important. I'd rather have mpeg2 on BD discs then re-encode unnecessarily to AVCHD. In fact I consider a situation where all HDTV is re-encoded to be a deal breaker.

So that leaves many questions, including if SD content can be recorded as SD and can HD content be downscaled and burned as DVD-Video.

Oh and +1 on the 1.3x playback speed. I use it ALL the time. (In fact I wouldn't mind an additional play level a bit faster like 1.5x - 1.7x).

I also think it is a bit premature to throw out the QAM tuner. While the current one in my 3576 is useless with my provider, that is because it isn't current tech, not because I'm not getting content.

There is no guarantee what the FCC or any individual cable provider will do... which can change at any time.
There are several ATSC DVR boxes, but AFAIK no QAM ones.

IMHO, the most important item is Internet streaming service (Netflix, Hulu, Vudu...)

Remember, most modern BR/DVD players have Internet video streaming. You can't sell these products without it. This capability might not be important to us (i.e. techies) because we can get it in other way if we want. But try to sell this recorder to younger, regular consumers without Internet connection these days is not going to be successful. So to get other capabilities such HD recording, we will need to pay for the cost of this particular item.

WE LIKE.

GIVE US THIS IN SIX MONTHS.

YES, PLEASE!!!

(But PLEASE do not take away timer recording, because we might want to isolate a one-hour TV show or a movie, and keep it permanently.)

Dear 234,
Thank you for trying to have a better product. Just check the wish lists for desires. Good luck and stay safe.

Dear all friends,

Thank you for straightforward opinion.

I knew that most of people like an item more feature than less feature.
Even me, I prefer Netflix model to no Netflix model in spite of no service in Japan!

I want to hear how do you think the value of it.
If such product retail is $5000, nobody buy.

If it is $2000?
$1000?
$500?
$250?

Please notice.
Quality + Feature + Service = Cost
Cost + Profit = Sales Price
(Production volume can be a reason of cost down)

Less feature product would be cheaper.
But much feature with good quality must be expensive.
I need to find best balanced point.

For your reference, DXBS1000 is sold at Amazon.jp about US$400.
Do you accept $400?

234

234,

$400 is a reasonable price level for me if HD and Blue Ray.

Charles

My comments were based on reading the product page link for the DXBS1000 that wajo posted above. In that link it says the unit only burns AVCHD to DVD media, therefore it must have an H.264 encoder.

AVCHD is not a codec, you don't encode to AVCHD. It is a disk format derived from BluRay Video format and originally developed for HD camcorders. While the BD video spec includes MPEG-2, H.264 and VC-1 video codecs, along with HD audio, AVCHD only uses H.264 for video and AC3 or LPCM for audio. AVCHD was meant to be burned to DVD media. Yes you can burn BD video format to DVD media (I've done it) and BD-9 is part of the BD ROM spec, but it never caught on and few if any BD players support playback of BD-5 or-9 disks. None of the BD players I tried could play it. When a BD player sees a BD-R it expects to see BD video format; when it sees DVD-R or DL it expects to see DVD video or AVCHD format -- you generally see this in the specifications for the unit.

As I noted, bitrate varies from station to station depending on the broadcaster. An ATSC channel has 19.2Mbps of bandwidth. That is split between the HD main channel and the SD subchannels. I have been recording OTA HDTV from Philly for 4 yr. In the beginning, CBS had no sub-channels and devoted nearly 19Mbps of their bandwidth to their HD feed. More recently they introduced a sub-channel and dropped their HD bandwidth to ~17Mbps. At the other extreme is ABC. In Jan 2012 they decided to have an HD sub-channel in addition to the HD main channel. So they cut the bitrate of their two HD channels to ~7Mbps each. So if we just consider the four major channels in Philly, here are typical primetime bitrates of the MPEG-2 HD transport streams and file sizes for a 1hr show with commercials removed (~42 min of content).

CBS 1080i 17Mbps 5.3GB
NBC 1080i 14Mbps 4.3GB
FOX 720p 14Mbps 4.3GB
ABC 720p 7Mbps 2.1GB

Yes, you can put a single episode from NBC or FOX on a DVD-R and probably fit 2 episodes of ABC on a DVD-R -- but why the heck would you want to. 1 BD-R = 5xDVD-R; I pay less than $1/disk for BD-R blanks. Recording HDTV to DVD-R is just silly, like recording DVD video to CD-R would be.

Again, based on the DBXS1000 product sheet, it's an HD recorder not an SD recorder -- and there is no indication of non-tuner inputs. If it has an encoder it will be an H.264 encoder so it can make AVCHD compliant disks -- which again is what the product sheet says it burns to DVD -- so actually it has to have an H.264 encoder. It may have the option to retain the original MPEG-2 transport stream, but probably not. I would suspect it has several H.264 bitrate profiles to "fit" 2 hr or more on a DVD-R -- H.264 supports resolutions from 480 to 1080 so there is no resolution scaling. H.264 also degrades more gracefully than MPEG-2 as you starve it for bitrate.

Again, AVCHD is not a codec but a disk format so I'm not sure what you are trying to say here.

Actually, so do I. That is why I use a TiVo and a media-PC/HDTV tuner for my HD recordings, so I can capture the MPEG-2 transport stream as it is broadcast and retain the original HD picture quality. I have the ability to encode to H.264, but I see no reason to do so. I suspect any BD-R recorder like the DXBS1000 will force the issue and recode the transport streams to H.264. If that is a deal-breaker for you, I suggest you look into a TiVo.
eh?, CM-7400 and TiVo support QAM, not to mention all the ATSC/QAM PC tuner cards and a couple that support cable-card.

Yes.

One important feature I would like to see is the option to remove the dub date time stamp from the menu of the burned DVD / BD. This is useless and a distraction when dubbing from an external source like a VCR or camera. お願いします。
Edited by plplplpl - 10/17/12 at 9:25pm