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Help setting up Casablanca III?

post #1 of 15
11/23/07 at 4:08am
Thread Starter 
I have had the Casablanca III for several years, but do to very bad back propblems for the last 6-8 yrs and I have had not been able to spend alot of time actuallty tweaking my system. I am currently just renting in San Francisco and my HT room is on the small side, about 12'wx15'x8'. We do plan on buying a home sometimeover the next 6 months, but int he mean time I am trying to tweak my system bitmore and I having a hard time trying to figure out which crossover to use and also where to cross them over and at what slope. I am using the Dynaudio Contour 1.3SE's L,R, Contour 2.1 C, B&W DS 6 dipole for surround and a Rel Storm III sub. I am currently using Butterworth for all speakers and the LCR are using Full w/LOP. HP 63hz, HP Slope: 24db, LP: 63hz, LP Slope: 24db, LP Phase: 180. For the surrounds I am using Butterworth set to crossover, HP: 125hz, HP Slop: 24, LP: 63, LP Slope 24, LP Phase 180, Sub 1, crossover. I have DVE and HD DVE and when I play the LF sweep I notice that it is stronger when it is coming from just the right speaker and weakest when the signal is sent to all speakers, is this normal? What is the easiest and quickest way to switch to differenct crossover settings on the fly? Do I just map the same cd player to several different inputs? Also I am trying to figure out the best way to be able to easily compare the sound of analog direct using the analog out to that of the digital out from cd player using stero? Should I just put that cd player on two different inputs?
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post #2 of 15
11/23/07 at 7:34am
I've got Aerial 9s, CC5 and three Aerial SW12s with my five Theta Enterprise amps and Theta CB3 and Six Shooter. CB3 crossover set at Full W Low Pass, 40 Hz 12 dB.
Over the years I've found that anything more than 6dB degrades musicality,
and that same thing applies the higher the crossover Hz. I have all floortstanding speakers and find crossovers and slopes in my setup apply the same across the board. But that's my room and system.

And yes, if you want to compare say CD analog out into CB3 vs into Six Shooter, set up two different inputs and level match, then switch between them using the CB3 input button on the remote.
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post #3 of 15
11/23/07 at 12:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by speters View Post

Also I am trying to figure out the best way to be able to easily compare the sound of analog direct using the analog out to that of the digital out from cd player using stereo? Should I just put that cd player on two different inputs?

The way to compare the analog outputs of your cd player, to the digital out of your cd player, on the fly for 2 channel stereo, would be to map both the digital coax (set to stereo) and the analog RCA cables (set to analog direct) to the same blanca input # and switch between them with the A/D button on the remote.

Of course the multitude of other settings for that input should otherwise be identical. I think this is one of the things your trying to accomplish.

Then...I would map both of these CD ouputs to yet another A/D blanca input and change all the crossover settings in that input to A/B that differance as well.

I think this is the other thing your trying to do.
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post #4 of 15
11/23/07 at 12:22pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbrother52 View Post

The way to compare the analog outputs of your cd player, to the digital out of your cd player, on the fly for 2 channel stereo, would be to map both the digital coax (set to stereo) and the analog RCA cables (set to analog direct) to the same blanca input # and switch between them with the A/D button on the remote.

Of course the multitude of other settings for that input should otherwise be identical. I think this is one of the things your trying to accomplish.

Then...I would map both of these CD ouputs to yet another A/D blanca input and change all the crossover settings in that input to A/B that differance as well.

I think this is the other thing your trying to do.

WOOPS! Bigbrother goofed!!!. Do what I said about and put the analog vs digital CD on separate inputs because then you can adjust the speaker volume levels in one of the input menus so that both inputs sound the same volume. Otherwise, as our objective friends correctly point out, one input louder than the other may fool you and sound better.
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post #5 of 15
11/23/07 at 12:24pm
What CD player are you using for analog out - and what CD player are you using for digital out? What DACs are in your CB3 for front stereo left and right?
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post #6 of 15
11/23/07 at 12:25pm
Not for nuttin, but why can't I adjust the anaolg level to match the dig output level, in the same input?
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post #7 of 15
11/23/07 at 12:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbrother52 View Post

Not for nuttin, but why can't I adjust the anaolg level to match the dig output level, in the same input?

The analog level adjustment isn't the same as speaker level and won't do this properly, that's why. HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!

The analog level adjustment in the menu is to be set with source material running so that the meter in the front panel display of the CB3 goes as high green as possible without going into the red.

The speaker level adjustment actually sets speaker level whether the source is analog or digital.
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post #8 of 15
11/23/07 at 1:25pm
I don't think I goofed.

It may still be done only using one input to do the A/D comparison and one for the crossover A/B comparison.
The way your telling him to do this thing, isn't he gonna need 4 different inputs to A/B crossover and D/A differences just to avoid using the analog level adjustment, which he may not need to use anyway. The CD player will determine that.

Certainly it'll accomplish what jpeters is looking to do, again, unless he'd be over-driving his speakers with the analog signal to get the levels the same.

Unless I had 4 free inputs to do this thing, if I was doing what he's trying to do....
I'd still listen to me first...this time. :-)
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post #9 of 15
11/23/07 at 1:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbrother52 View Post

I don't think I goofed.

It may still be done only using one input to do the A/D comparison and one for the crossover A/B comparison.
The way your telling him to do this thing, isn't he gonna need 4 different inputs to A/B crossover and D/A differences just to avoid using the analog level adjustment, which he may not need to use anyway. The CD player will determine that.

Certainly it'll accomplish what jpeters is looking to do, again, unless he'd be over-driving his speakers with the analog signal to get the levels the same.

Unless I had 4 free inputs to do this thing, if I was doing what he's trying to do....
I'd still listen to me first...this time. :-)

For comparison of how different subwoofer crossover frequencies and slopes sound, just do it on the same input and change on the fly. As you say.

But if you want to compare the sonics of your CD player using its digital vs its analog output, then ya gotta set up two different inputs on the CB3 as noted above.

Case closed. We're both right. Talking about different things.
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post #10 of 15
11/23/07 at 1:33pm
I'll buy that.

I was Just trying to get this test down to two inputs.
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post #11 of 15
11/23/07 at 1:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigbrother52 View Post

I'll buy that.

I was Just trying to get this test down to two inputs.

But if you can control volume level accurately by using the analog input control as opposed to speaker level than you are a magician!!!! HA!
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post #12 of 15
11/23/07 at 3:24pm
Thread Starter 
For a cd player I am using a Sony DVP 9000ES with a level 5 VSE mod. I also have an sdi modded Denon 3910. So I want to give a good listen to the modified analog out of the Sony compared to the digital out of that player as well as the digital out of the Denon. As I said earlier, I have had all of this stuff for years, but because of back problems I haven't been able to do to much listening. So I finally have the pain under better control and now I want to start tweaking. My CB II has the extreme dacs up front and superior for the rear. I also have a pair of Dynaudio Contour 1.3mk II's that are siting in my closet. I just don't have the room to use them right now. So I do realize that the surrounds I have right now are less than ideal.

So to compare crossover points, slopes, etc. I would have to map the same source to two inputs, because the crossover is set to match the input and not the source, corrrect? So if I had the digital out of the Sony mapped to input 1 and also had the analog outs mapped to that same input, the crossover would stay the same when switching between sources?

So what is the best way to determine the crossover points and slopes for each speaker? Also, what processing do you guys like for playing 2 channel stereo or SACD in 5.1? I have had a hard time finding anything that I really like. I like the ambience that the surround modes can give but I don't like the way they make vocals sound. I seem to lose that sense of dimension to the voice that I can get from just the two front speakers. So any tips on adjusting the settings for the different music surround modes?
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post #13 of 15
11/23/07 at 5:05pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by speters View Post

So to compare crossover points, slopes, etc. I would have to map the same source to two inputs, because the crossover is set to match the input and not the source, corrrect? So if I had the digital out of the Sony mapped to input 1 and also had the analog outs mapped to that same input, the crossover would stay the same when switching between sources?

Correct.

Yes
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post #14 of 15
11/24/07 at 2:41pm
You may want to check out these measurements on your Contour 1.3 SEs:

http://www.stereophile.com/standloud...33/index4.html

From these measurement I would recommend the L/R cross over with 50 Hz and 12 dB/octive settings.
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post #15 of 15
11/24/07 at 4:10pm
Thread Starter 
Thanks guys.
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AVS › AVS Forum › Display Devices › Ultra Hi-End HT Gear ($20,000+) › Help setting up Casablanca III?