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Custom Resolution Tool for Intel Graphics: Easier Overscan Correction - Page 2

post #31 of 1277
Quote:
Originally Posted by archibael View Post

That is wacky. So it now allows 720x480 to your other displays now that it is enabled on the TV output? [there needs to be an emoticon for a Spock-like single raised eyebrow] Sounds like the pruning for Cloning is in effect (prunes modes that cannot be displayed by both monitors), but don't see why if you didn't have TV display enabled before.

As long as it works... [grumbles about weird pruning rules]

Sorry for the confusion, i'm talking about two systems:
One is my notebook connected to a TV (which is not so important, only to test the DTDcalc tool )

The other is a Car-PC connnected to a 'K90 - 7" InDash VGA Touchscreen'
which refuses to work with 720x480 (which of i'm not the owner ).
post #32 of 1277
Quote:
Originally Posted by SugoE View Post

Sorry for the confusion, i'm talking about two systems:
One is my notebook connected to a TV (which is not so important, only to test the DTDcalc tool )

The other is a Car-PC connnected to a 'K90 - 7" InDash VGA Touchscreen'
which refuses to work with 720x480 (which of i'm not the owner ).

Oh well. Back to the start of the thread then

What motherboard/ IGP is the Car-PC?

As per Archi's posts, have you tried a non standard timing to fool the BIOS? If you have I guess we're back to my requests for DTD's and Registry keys.

Wo0zy.
post #33 of 1277
Thread Starter 
Have you tried manually typing in the following Modelines into the left panel to generate DTDs, and then try them on the CarPC...

"832x624" 57.28 832 864 928 1152 624 625 628 667 -hsync -vsync
"800x480" 40.00 800 864 928 1088 480 481 484 509 +hsync +vsync

They're from

http://www.mp3car.com/vbulletin/linu...ml#post1137622

He's using the 845G, which uses the embedded drivers, and that guy preferred the 832x624 on the K90 because it sounds like the touchscreen didn't like 800x480, but he also provided one for that, too.
post #34 of 1277
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wo0zy View Post
I've not come across a system that has predefined DTD's active by default. All of the desktop systems we've tested have TotalDTDCount set to "0".
Wo0zy
Originally after updating to the latest driver, TotalDTDCount was 0 but there are definitions for five DTD_?.

I appended the registry from my HTPC with G965 on Vista*32, no modifications done so far.

I'm unsure to use the tool and wipe out these entries.

Regards

 

G965_registry.txt 25.390625k . file
post #35 of 1277
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wo0zy View Post

What motherboard/ IGP is the Car-PC?
Wo0zy.

It's a CALUCORE-MC - Core2Duo Car-PC Barebone with Intel 945GM / ICH 7M
Since i'm not the owner it's hard to do many tests.
post #36 of 1277
Quote:
Originally Posted by archibael View Post

http://www.mp3car.com/vbulletin/linu...ml#post1137622

He's using the 845G, which uses the embedded drivers, and that guy preferred the 832x624 on the K90 because it sounds like the touchscreen didn't like 800x480, but he also provided one for that, too.

As i said before, there is no problem to display the wanted resolutions with the embedded driver.

Thanks
post #37 of 1277
Quote:
Originally Posted by SugoE View Post

Originally after updating to the latest driver, TotalDTDCount was 0 but there are definitions for five DTD_?.

I appended the registry from my HTPC with G965 on Vista*32, no modifications done so far.

I'm unsure to use the tool and wipe out these entries.

Regards

That's exactly what's expected. The registry does include some timings but as the TotalDTDCount is "0" they are not available or used. If the resolutions happen to match options in the intel graphics tray it's because the screens EDID is telling the driver that's what it supports. Nothing to do with the DTD's.

The INF (which is used for creating the reg keys) includes the following (as expected if matches your keys perfectly.

[NonEDIDMode_AddSwSettings]
HKR,, TotalDTDCount, %REG_DWORD%, 0 ; This shows number of DTDs to be used. ; 0-->Disable the feature.
;Following keys have 20 bytes (18 byte DTD + 2 Byte flags).
HKR,, DTD_1,%REG_BINARY%, 01,1D,80,18,71,1C,16,20,58,2C,1A,00,00,00,00,00,00,86,37,01\ t ;1920x1080@60...Interlaced
HKR,, DTD_2, %REG_BINARY%, 01,1D,80,D0,72,1C,16,20,10,2C,1A,80,00,00,00,00,00,86,37, 01 ;1920x1080@50...Interlaced
HKR,, DTD_3,%REG_BINARY%, 01,1D,00,BC,52,D0,1E,20,B8,28,25,40,00,00,00,00,00,04,37, 01 ;1280x720@50....Non-interlaced
HKR,, DTD_4, %REG_BINARY%, 01,1D,00,72,51,D0,1E,20,6E,28,25,00,00,00,00,00,00,06,37,01\ t ;1280x720@60....Non-interlaced
HKR,, DTD_5,%REG_BINARY%, 00, 00, 00 ,00, 00, 00,00, 00, 00,00, 00, 00,00, 00, 00,00, 00, 00,00, 00 ;Fifth DTD

Before the manual reg editing and then DTD Calc this is where Archibael recommended adding the timings.

If you only want one custom timing you only need to click "more" once and add the new timing to DTD_1 (overwriting the existing values). This will have no impact on system stability. The only effect will be an extra resolution in the graphics tray (which may or may not work depending on the DTD values you've created).

If you don't trust the tool to do it for you you can manually do it. Either way there is no reason not to overwrite the existing values. Even if something happens that neither Archibael or myself have ever seen, you can restore the defaults by simply reinstalling the drivers.

Good luck.

Wo0zy.
post #38 of 1277
Quote:
Originally Posted by SugoE View Post

As i said before, there is no problem to display the wanted resolutions with the embedded driver.

Thanks

As it worked with the old drivers I don't think BIOS pruning can be stopping it so adding the values Archibael suggests using DTD Calc and the new drivers should also work.

As per previous posts reset TotalDTDCount to 1 (using DTD Calc or the manual methods, whichever you prefer). Enter the values Archi suggests and add them to the first (and only) available DTD slot and see what happens. It might be worth uninstalling and reinstalling the drivers first to give us a level playing field (the registry keys should then be the same as yours).

I appreciate that it's difficult to know exactly what's going on as none of us have got direct access to this system. Also, I've never tried/ tested the DTD editing method (with or without DTD Calc) on a system like this but it should work.

If you do this and it still doesn't work get your mate to post his Reg Keys.

Best of luck SugoE.

Cheers,

Wo0zy.
post #39 of 1277
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SugoE View Post

As i said before, there is no problem to display the wanted resolutions with the embedded driver.

Thanks

Yes, my point is since the user I mentioned published those Modelines, those Modelines are valid for the monitor and the graphics drivers (non-embedded) can use the same values. DTDCalc can accept those Modeline parameters in the left panel and construct the proper DTD, which DTDCalc can stuff into the registry.

The registry had five DTD_* parameters available, and TotalDTDCount indicates how many of them are active (i.e. available as a mode) at any given moment (starting at 1 and going in order). DTDCalc Registry Hack screen changes TotalDTDCount with the More and Less buttons, and the Get Calculation grabs the current DTD you're working on and stuffs it into the appropriate DTD_* entry.

That part of DTDCalc is purely a GUI for the registry editing process; we used to have to do it manually (and still can). The power of DTDCalc is really in the mode modification to cope with overscan, IMO, though it's still useful if all you want to do is convert a Modeline to a DTD for your own nefarious purposes.

Again, there's nothing about the 720x480p resolution which the Intel driver can't handle unless the BIOS is refusing it, and you'll only be able to get around that with 718x480 or 722x480. There is a less likely possibility, and that is that there is a monitor driver present (.INF file somewhere providing specifics of what frequencies are supported by that monitor), and the frequencies of 720x480 are below that level... but that's not an Intel thing, that's a Windows thing. And I would expect the embedded drivers to be affected by that condition, too.

The embedded drivers may let you do more because they are meant for developers, not consumers, and have less checks and balances in place to protect us from ourselves (from back in the day when sending a monitor badly constructed timings could physically damage it)... but really aside from BIOS considerations, using a custom DTD should be able to accomplish anything the embedded drivers can do resolution-wise.
post #40 of 1277
Can one you guys help me with this please as the report doesn't mention all modes supported by the TV Thanks

Gamma Value: 2.20
DDC2 Protocol: Supported
Maximum Image Size: Horizontal: 27.0 inches
Vertical: 15.0 inches
Monitor Supported Modes:
720 by 480 (60 Hz)
1920 by 1080 (50 Hz)
Display Power Management Support:
Standby Mode: Not Supported
Suspend Mode: Not Supported
Active Off Mode: Not Supported
Raw EDID:
00 ff ff ff ff ff ff 00 4d d9 00 84 01 01 01 01
32 0f 01 03 80 46 28 78 0a ee 91 a3 54 4c 99 26
0f 50 54 00 00 00 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01 01
01 01 01 01 01 01 02 3a 80 d0 72 38 2d 40 10 2c
45 80 df a4 21 00 00 1e 8c 0a d0 8a 20 e0 2d 10
10 3e 96 00 df a4 21 00 00 18 00 00 00 fc 00 53
4f 4e 59 20 54 56 0a 20 20 20 20 20 00 00 00 fd
00 30 3e 0e 46 0f 00 0a 20 20 20 20 20 20 01 da
02 03 22 77 4e 14 03 04 12 13 05 01 07 16 9f 10
15 11 06 23 09 07 07 83 01 00 00 66 03 0c 00 10
00 80 01 1d 00 72 51 d0 1e 20 6e 28 55 00 df a4
21 00 00 1e 8c 0a d0 90 20 40 31 20 0c 40 55 00
df a4 21 00 00 18 01 1d 00 bc 52 d0 1e 20 b8 28
55 40 df a4 21 00 00 1e 01 1d 80 18 71 1c 16 20
58 2c 25 00 df a4 21 00 00 9e 01 1d 80 d0 72 1c
16 20 10 2c 25 80 df a4 21 00 00 9e 00 00 00 49
post #41 of 1277
Thread Starter 
It's only reading the DTDs from the first block, for whatever reason. You can stuff each of these into the Reverse Calculation tab of DTDCalc to find what they are (which is what I did):

02 3a 80 d0 72 38 2d 40 10 2c 45 80 df a4 21 00 00 1e: 1080p @ 50Hz
8c 0a d0 8a 20 e0 2d 10 10 3e 96 00 df a4 21 00 00 18: 720x480p @ 59.94Hz

01 1d 00 72 51 d0 1e 20 6e 28 55 00 df a4 21 00 00 1e: 1280x720p @ 60Hz
8c 0a d0 90 20 40 31 20 0c 40 55 00 df a4 21 00 00 18: 720x576p @ 50Hz
01 1d 00 bc 52 d0 1e 20 b8 28 55 40 df a4 21 00 00 1e: 1280x720p @ 50Hz
01 1d 80 18 71 1c 16 20 58 2c 25 00 df a4 21 00 00 9e: 1920x1080i @ 60Hz
01 1d 80 d0 72 1c 16 20 10 2c 25 80 df a4 21 00 00 9e: 1920x1080i @ 50Hz

I don't see 1080p @ 60Hz on here, which is what I suspect you might want; your TV's not reporting it as a capability, though it will probably work anyway. In that case, go to the Standard Timings pulldown in DTDCalc and use the industry standard (not specific to your monitor) timings listed there.

Edit: Sorry, forgot the Short Video Descriptors at the beginning of the second block:

1920x1080i50
720x480p60
1280x720p60
720x576p50
1280x720p50
1920x1080i60
640x480p60
720x480i60
720x576i50
1920x1080p50 (native)
1920x1080p60

1080p60 is listed, but there's no DTD available for it. My recommendation to use the "standard timings" does not change.
post #42 of 1277
Hi, still can't get DTDcalc to work as expected.
1.) System is a G965 Vista*32
2.) Run DTDcalc as administrator
3.) Select 720x480 from the standard timings
4.) Calculate
5.) Add one more to Registry Hack (DTD_1)
6.) Get Calculated
7.) Write to registry
8.) Reboot

Check DTD_1 with DTDcalc, filled with zeros '00 00 00 ...'

Retried several times, no change.
It doesn't like me ?
post #43 of 1277
Thread Starter 
There's an anti-Austrian bias to the software, alas. I'm afraid you'll have to find a different solution.

Woozy's the software guy on this one, so I'll have to let him answer, but here's my guess...

The registry has several copies of the DTD information, and if the right one is changed, it will get copied to the Current Settings on the next reboot. If the wrong one is changed, the Current Settings will get overwritten on the reboot.

There have been some questions on which are the right ones to overwrite. My G965 XP registry looked different from Wo0zy's G35 and G33 Vista, for example. We did our best to hit all the configurations (at least all the ones we had access to) but I suspect your configuration is using a different registry entry as it's "copy to Current Settings" source.

Can you search your registry for all instances of "DTD_1" and list them either here or in a PM to Wo0zy? This will help us fix the DTDCalc SW for you and others like you.
post #44 of 1277
Managed to sort the overscan perfectly but(and there's always a but) now the driver keeps failing and recovering from a serious error(can't remember the exact terminolgy)

I really don't think this is gonna work out for me, the Intel drivers seem to be very immature and I don't think I can go through this again having been through it both with nvidia and ATI.

I really do appreciate your efforts though and maybe I will revisit Intel graphics when the drivers have matured somewhat in 6 months time or so. It really is a shame as the audio solution is the best we have for the PC at the moment.
post #45 of 1277
Thread Starter 
Sorry to hear that, bingobill, though I understand your consternation. Please let Intel Customer Service know why you selected another vendor. Unless they hear it from their customers/OEMs, there will be no improvement.
post #46 of 1277
Quote:
Originally Posted by bingobill View Post

Managed to sort the overscan perfectly but(and there's always a but) now the driver keeps failing and recovering from a serious error(can't remember the exact terminolgy)

I really don't think this is gonna work out for me, the Intel drivers seem to be very immature and I don't think I can go through this again having been through it both with nvidia and ATI.

I really do appreciate your efforts though and maybe I will revisit Intel graphics when the drivers have matured somewhat in 6 months time or so. It really is a shame as the audio solution is the best we have for the PC at the moment.

Without wishing to get involved in Intel Driver issues I have seen this happen but only with "some" custom timings and only with the latest (15.7) drivers.

If you want one more small attempt try a timing based on the 720P DTD for your screen rather than the 1080P timing (would be helpful for us too if you can spare the time ). Also, as a temp fix, you could use the vertical and horizontal sliders under the "aspect ratio" button in the Intel Graphics Tray. These will scale you image down to fit the viewable area rather than give a pixel perfect image but it might make the system useable until new drivers appear.

Cheers,

Wo0zy.
post #47 of 1277
Wo0zy, 10 minutes too late. I already removed the board from the case as this build has been going on a few days now for one reason or another and i'm getting somewhat frustrated with it.

I will be replacing it though with a Gigabyte G33 which I have here, so i will try it on that before I put the ATI 2600XT in.

I really want the 1080p res though rather than 720p, as mentioned though I'm not prepared to go through months of frustration whilst Intel get their drivers right like I did with nvidia and ATI.

I was really very happy with the ATI video of late, I only tried switching to Intel for the audio.

BTW, there were no sliders to ajust the overscan.
post #48 of 1277
Quote:
Originally Posted by bingobill View Post

Wo0zy, 10 minutes too late. I already removed the board from the case as this build has been going on a few days now for one reason or another and i'm getting somewhat frustrated with it.

I will be replacing it though with a Gigabyte G33 which I have here, so i will try it on that before I put the ATI 2600XT in.

I really want the 1080p res though rather than 720p, as mentioned though I'm not prepared to go through months of frustration whilst Intel get their drivers right like I did with nvidia and ATI.

I was really very happy with the ATI video of late, I only tried switching to Intel for the audio.

BTW, there were no sliders to ajust the overscan.

Fair enough. I didn't have sliders with 15.6 when other people did. In 15.7 they magically appeared (same board, same TV everything). Very odd.

I really appreciate the offer of a test as you must be very frustrated by now but I won't trouble you as the solution is going to be of no use in your final build and I'm already sure 1080P with custom DTD will work using 15.6 (I've done it myself on several systems).

Slightly off topic but is that the gigabyte board with a x4 PCI-E slot? I'd like to know how that performs with the 2600 if you don't mind posting a short update when you're done. Thanks.

Good luck with the project mate

Wo0zy.
post #49 of 1277
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wo0zy View Post

Slightly off topic but is that the gigabyte board with a x4 PCI-E slot?

the spec says "1 x PCI Express x16 slot supporting PCI Express x4 mode"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wo0zy View Post

I'd like to know how that performs with the 2600 if you don't mind posting a short update when you're done.

NP m8, i'll let you know.
post #50 of 1277
Thread Starter 
SugoE,

I wanted to apologize to you: I was away from my machine when I said "720x480 should work". It should, but when I put the settings into DTDCalc, while DTDCalc wrote them properly to the registry the lowest resolution which showed up as selectable was 800x600. Weird.

Even weirder is the fact that if you download ResChange and execute

reschange -width=720 -height=480 -depth=32 -refresh=60

it works just fine and gets added to the selectable resolutions.

So your experiences were right and I spoke way too soon. It is possible, but much more cryptic than I thought.
post #51 of 1277
Great program, makes it so much easier.

However there is one bug if you run in non-US regional settings.

It reads the pixel clock and sets a . within it, however on non-US regional settings the . is just a delimiter, and then it writes XX XX in the first entries, and cannot (off cause) write that to registry.

If I manually change "." to "," it works great.
post #52 of 1277
Quote:
Originally Posted by Binnerup View Post

Great program, makes it so much easier.

However there is one bug if you run in non-US regional settings.

It reads the pixel clock and sets a . within it, however on non-US regional settings the . is just a delimiter, and then it writes XX XX in the first entries, and cannot (off cause) write that to registry.

If I manually change "." to "," it works great.

Thanks Brian.

Very useful feedback. It's much appreciated.

We'll look into getting the problem resolved and post here when the new download is available. Sorry for the oversight.

Keep up the great work at your end!

Cheers,

Wo0zy.
post #53 of 1277
Hi, the decimal delimiter was the same problem for me.
Changed it in Controlpanel/Regional Settings and Registry Hacks saves were OK,
thanks to Binnerup.
post #54 of 1277
Quote:
Originally Posted by SugoE View Post

Hi, the decimal delimiter was the same problem for me.
Changed it in Controlpanel/Regional Settings and Registry Hacks saves were OK,
thanks to Binnerup.

Excellent!

We'll have the Euro-fixed version available for download shortly.

Thanks to both SugoE and Brian for the feedback.

Wo0zy
post #55 of 1277
Thread Starter 
You Brits are way too US-centric.
post #56 of 1277
Well guys, totally different story with the G33, installed the same drivers, created the custom res for the overscan and it all works perfectly. Drivers haven't failed once. Essential tool for anyone with Intel graphics, I even managed 50Hz, something impossible to do with the ATI.

I haven't decided yet how the video compares with the 2600XT, gonna need to do some more testing.

FYI I tested mpeg4 AVC (Fantastic Four 2) which is Blu-ray BD+ and with my E6600 and the CPU peaked at 94%, with the average being in the mid 80s, so the E6600 at stock 2.40 is really borderline, I would like to see the difference with a Q6600. The thing that worries me about this is the heat as my new build uses a slimline case, slim, quiet and cool is tall order.

@Wo0zy, I'm gonna bung the 2600XT in tomorrow and see how it performs.

BTW, what are the plans for the Intel drivers? are we going to see a more comprehensive control panel? It's very strange not have the tweaks we have with the likes of the ATI and Nvidia control panels and how often do Intell release new drivers?

UK chap here also
post #57 of 1277
Ok, followed the instructions, everything went smooth. T'll I seletected the final (post-tuned) resolution (which turned out to be 1238x694 (on a 55" Sony LCD TV connected to an HTPC via DVI)

When I select that custom resolution, everything turns red. Yes "red". Not sure what's going on.

Using Windows XP on a G33 (3100) Gigabyte board, latest drivers 14.x

Any suggestions? I can upload a pic of my TV if you don't believe me

EDIT:
Here's the pic
http://i1.tinypic.com/86jxkbq.jpg
post #58 of 1277
Quote:
Originally Posted by bingobill View Post

Well guys, totally different story with the G33, installed the same drivers, created the custom res for the overscan and it all works perfectly. Drivers haven't failed once. Essential tool for anyone with Intel graphics, I even managed 50Hz, something impossible to do with the ATI.

I haven't decided yet how the video compares with the 2600XT, gonna need to do some more testing.

FYI I tested mpeg4 AVC (Fantastic Four 2) which is Blu-ray BD+ and with my E6600 and the CPU peaked at 94%, with the average being in the mid 80s, so the E6600 at stock 2.40 is really borderline, I would like to see the difference with a Q6600. The thing that worries me about this is the heat as my new build uses a slimline case, slim, quiet and cool is tall order.

@Wo0zy, I'm gonna bung the 2600XT in tomorrow and see how it performs.

BTW, what are the plans for the Intel drivers? are we going to see a more comprehensive control panel? It's very strange not have the tweaks we have with the likes of the ATI and Nvidia control panels and how often do Intell release new drivers?

UK chap here also

Hi fellow brit

Great to hear you've had success m8! Interesting that G33 is behaving differently to G35.

There do seem to be some quirks with G35 and the latest drivers. I've been doing some testing myself tonight and sent a detailed (read "long winded") report to Archi for his assessment.

Look forward to hearing your thoughts on the 2600 compared to the G33 (other than CPU utilisation which is a given ).

Cheers,

Wo0zy
post #59 of 1277
Quote:
Originally Posted by stokkes View Post

Ok, followed the instructions, everything went smooth. T'll I seletected the final (post-tuned) resolution (which turned out to be 1238x694 (on a 55" Sony LCD TV connected to an HTPC via DVI)

When I select that custom resolution, everything turns red. Yes "red". Not sure what's going on.

Using Windows XP on a G33 (3100) Gigabyte board, latest drivers 14.x

Any suggestions? I can upload a pic of my TV if you don't believe me

EDIT:
Here's the pic
http://i1.tinypic.com/86jxkbq.jpg

Hi stokkes,

Welcome aboard

I do believe you. I've seen it for myself but I can't explain it yet. I'm not the expert here on these sort of things (that's Archibael's job ).

I've posted a load of detailed timing info to him tonight for assessment (see previous post). One of things included in the report is the blue/red colour swap issue.

You may find shrinking the horizontal and vertical active pixels by another couple will swap it back again. Seriously. In the example I sent to Archi 1918x1078 reversed the colours but 1916x1076 was normal.

If you get a chance to try it and can post the corresponding DTD's the feedback and data would be most appreciated.

Cheers,

Wo0zy
post #60 of 1277
Quote:
Originally Posted by archibael View Post

You Brits are way too US-centric.

LOL! Too many years dealing with Intel and Microsoft can do that to a man
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