Master Burn-In/IR/Break In Thread Part II: All Posts Here Only - Page 118

Hi all,

I have a problema which I very much don't know how to solve. I did the break on of my plasma as advised here, 200h on low brightness and contrast with the image always streched so that no logos were visible.

Unfortunately I am deaf and as such I have teletex subtitles enabled by default. It is something so natural for me that I didn't even thought about it.

As result at the end of the 200h I noticed that the area where the subtitles use to be is uneven, there is nothing burned there but the area is slightly darker that th rest of the tv. This is very faint and on normal images it can't be noticed but on white background I can spot it.

I put the TV 6 h today on slides, and left it rest for 3h but this is still there.

Is there any way to make this go away and even the screen again?

Of course that in the meantime I have turned off the subtitles and if I manage to recover the screen I will only use them when I am indeed whatching TV.

Since you have switched off the running subtitles,this should start the screen healing process.In one or 2 weeks time this should fade away completely.But if you need teletext & subtitles for convenience then i would suggest you buy a lcd tv.

love,
kris.

Thanks Kris, it was a great help, I was worried that I would be able to get rid of this.

I have been kicking myself in the last days for not having thought about this before going for a plasma as I did an extensive research about plasmas before buying mine. But using subtitles is just so natural for me that it totally slipped my mind.
Now it is too late to switch for a LED which would cost more than the double of what the plasma cost. Besides I love the plasma image quality, the colours and movement are just so cinema like that is just like having my private own cinema. I have never seen a LED with such image they always look artificial.

I have disabled teletext subtitles which I suspect was the main problem: they are displayed in big black boxes with big white characters inside. I am only using now HD broadcast subtitles which are a lot smaller, they don't stay as much time on screen, their position varies from channel to channel, and they don't have the teletext black box, and even these are only ON when I am indeed seeing TV, instead of always as I used to have before. Hopefully this will be ok, there is not much more I can do.

Thanks once again.

Darksider,

I'm very happy that your problem went away! I think a lot of image retention causes stress for people who aren't used to seeing it (especially after paying all that money). I don't own a plasma yet (going for a 2012 model Panny), but I appreciate what you said about the picture quality being "cinema-like". I've tried to talk myself into getting LED, but plasma's picture just outperforms it every time I see it. I have personally been worried about movies putting black bars on the screen, but I'm happy to find out that MANY movies don't even have black bars! (Not even many of the 1.85:1 aspect ratio movies). Anyway, just wanted to say I'm glad to hear your tv improved!

Hi,
I understand what you have said,but things are not so grim when it comes to plasma tv.Use it carefully for the first 200hrs or 6 months of regular use.the screen could gradually toughen up.i.e after that period you can watch a 3 hour movie or program at a stretch and then switch to a channel,program or movie which does not have teletext or running stickers or titles.Just give your baby(plasma Tv) sometime to settle down.
My panasonic plasma is about 10 months old now and even i did get IR in the first 100hrs.And believe me those IR were from the pop-up menu from the tv and HD Set top box ! While viewing the programs these would fade off gradually in 10 to 15 minutes time.But now i do not get any IR at all.
So it seems that new plasma should be used very carefully for the first 100hrs and at cold start up.i.e while switching the tv On,Do not allow the screen to display static images for more than a minute or 2.
Better still while switching on and off keep the tv to a tv channel which displays snow.i.e when a tv channel is off air you see white and black dots moving.once you have switched on all the desired gadgets then select the hdmi mode of the concerned equipment.I think you follow what iam saying.

And start enjoying your plasma tv.

Love,
kris.

Hi guys newbie here. I'm running the evangelos color slides on my new panny 55gt30 with d-nices settings. My TV is letting off a funny smell, dunno if its because its a brand new unit or do i have a dud. Display on the tv is fine tho, just the smell coming from the back. It's not quite a burning smell....but rather something else.

Is it that awesome new TV smell? It might be that.

I'm not being sarcastic about that BTW. They give off this smell of "new" for a little while, and that might be what you're smelling. I don't really know how to describe it though.

Could be a new tv smell, just wanted to see if anyone else had this. Thanks tho

how bad is watching movies with black bars within the first 200h? if i ran color slides in between would it be alright? or should i avoid it all together

[quote=Str0ud;21478781]
That really sucks and at that point I would have to end my allegiance to Samsung.

I watched Football all weekend and I can faintly see a Fox logo embedded in the picture. I ran snow screen and slides but it is still there but very faint.

I am hoping this is not going to be an ongoing issue to where I have to constantly worry about whether the kids have turned off the PS3 or the wife snoozing with a soap opera paused for hours on end. I understand the need for common sense but if this becomes a labor of love, I guess It's back to LED!

Just purchased the panasonic tc-p42st30 plasma set.

Should I avoid the "full" aspect setting? Avoiding the top and bottom bars during break in?

Should I use Just or Zoom (no bars)?


Is using the factory setting Cinema mode ok to use now or should I get this set calibrated (diy). Any recommendations for a diy disk?

thanks

Yeah, zoom no static images for at least 100-200 hrs, and even then test you tv with a movie with black bars say 30min or a static logo, and then see if you have any image retention, if so see how long it take to go away.

John.

Howdy everybody!,


I just wanted to throw this out: If you are breaking in your new plasma, and are zooming to get rid of the black bars on top and bottom of movies, keep in mind that many movies don't have black bars because they are presented in the 1.78:1 aspect ratio. A quick Google search can net you lists of these movies. (So you don't have to zoom these movies in).

Also, many movies are LISTED as being in the 1.85:1 aspect, but they may still be formatted in such a way that they may have no black bars. If they do have black bars, they are the very thin ones. There is a little trick you can do with your settings to get rid of only those thin black bars without losing very much of the rest of the picture. I believe in Samsung it's called "16:9" and Panasonic it's called "HD 1". (I think!) Both of these settings will only zoom in about 5% or so, just enough to get rid of those very thin black bars in the 1.85:1 movies.

With a little help from Google, you can find tons of movies in the 1.78:1 (also called 16:9), and also the 1.85:1 aspects. The only movies you want to limit for a while are the movies listed in the wider scope (2.35:1, 2.40:1, 2.x:1, etc).

So, there ya go! I hope that helps some people to enjoy their new plaz!

thanks for the quick replies and very informative information about movies and their aspect ratios.

Another question, I have Direct TV installed, non HDTV feed. I noticed that the picture quality is awful on most channels. Until I get HDTV installed, are there any settings that can improve the picture quality? I had better picture quality on my old Toshiba 34 inch tube TV.

Here's a useful video link :-

Sd Feed


Hd Feed



.

I have a 5yr old sharp aquos LCD and I am going to replace it with a 60 to 65 inch display and I am considering a plasma but have a few questions.
1. Is burn in really still an issue as I will be playing ps3 and xbox on it?
2. My kids will also be watching content such as sponge bob, prolly countless hours when I'm not home.
3. Do they still consume as much energy as they used to?

Or should I just stick with a good LCD and forget about plasma?....I really dont want to make this another case of spending 2 months and countless hours of research on finding the "perfect" Tv...it also seems as if plasma's for the most part are cheaper than a good LCd...

Really, if you have kids and your not going to be around, you most likely to get some type of burn-in , because you are not likely to be able to do the 200-1000hr phosphor ageing that is needed to help prevent permanent burn-in, but burn-in can most of the time be reversed, but it can take hours or even months to remove.

An lcd would be recommended, but can you get a 60" at affordable prices?

Or just put up with a bit of burn-in that will most likely go away in a few hours, it`s very hard to say.

Just make sure that the orbit anti-burn is enabled, as long as the kids change the channel every hour or so, so that the channel logo is not in the same place for hours you should be alright, you will get some tem-burn-in but it should be reversible.

John.

Quick question,

Anyone who has experience running the break in slides, Should the break in process strictly be done using the slides and nothing else, or can watching tv/playing video games during this phase of breaking in the plasma OK as long as it is done in moderation?

I plan on using the break in slides, but I just want to clarify if I can enjoy it during the break in process or just go ahead and get the break in (100 hrs.) out the way?

No, true burn-in, can not be reversed. Bad IR yes, it can, but actual burn-in, no.

One guy it took him 4 months to remove the image, is that burn-in or image retention.

That was a case of bad image retention. Actual burn-in, is damage of the phosphors in the panel and it is permanent, and it can not be reversed. Sure you can try, and also will probably fail miserably at doing so, to do some sort of wearing out of the non burned-in section of the set in some way, in order to try and match the burned-in area so it is not as visible, but that is not in any way a reversal of the burn-in. All that would be, is trying to force a burn-in of the rest of the set to try match the damaged burned-in area.

Howdy everybody!, (<--- I love saying that.)


I think there is a lot of confusion about the difference between "image retention" and "burn-in." I'm going to try to clear it up a bit, you know, for kids..


Image Retention = a ghost-like image on your screen that you got rid of!

Burn-In = a ghost-like image on your screen that you can't get rid of and it's making you mad and start to panic and feel buyer's remorse and regret and hate life and... then it goes away... oh, never mind! That was image retention too! (However, if you would have gotten rid of your TV BEFORE the image retention went away, you would still classify it as burn-in as a technicality).


Seriously though: Burn-In is unlikely unless you crank your contrast and brightness hardcore max and pause the screen and perform some kind of transcendental meditation for hours and hours while focusing on the burning bright still image. Even then, it may still only be image retention. It's a fuzzy kinda thing. Someone should write a book: Zen and the Art of Plasma TV Break-In.


P.S. Black bars don't burn-in your screen. That's just called uneven wear. To get rid of uneven wear, even it back out with some full screen viewing. Tada!

No, you are wrong. Uneven wear from overuse of black bars, is also actual non-reversible burn-in if it eventually don't go away. If it eventually goes away, then it was a case of image retention. All actual burn-in is indeed uneven wear, and yes constant viewing of stuff like 4:3 material with black bars on a widescreen set, can and will cause actual burn-in that can not be removed if you don't mix up your viewing habits.

"No, you are wrong." <---- *Oh my gosh!*

"Uneven wear from overuse of black bars, is also actual non-reversible burn-in if it eventually don't go away."

So if it doesn't go away, it's non-reversible? That seems to make sense!

And so if it did go away, it WAS reversible?


Kidding kidding!


"Burn-in" is sort of a hindsight rationalization. If YOU couldn't get it out, it doesn't necessarily mean someone else couldn't get it out. But, I agree with you on the point of "if it's perm, it's burn-in." The question is, how does anyone ever really absolutely know? I say, think positive!


I think of "burn-in" as being images on the screen that cause EXCESSIVE wear compared to every other part of the screen. Meaning, in order to get rid of that burn-in, you would have to excessively wear OUT your tv. This leaves you in a catch 22. However, with black bars, you simply must wear your black bars down to match the middle part of the screen. I've only read anecdotal accounts of this working since I haven't done it myself. Maybe there is something I'm not considering?


P.S. If you (the reader) are reading this message and you tend to make a lot of assumptions, please keep in mind I am NOT saying it is OKAY to watch movies with black bars NON-STOP forever. If you got that out of my posts, well, you know what happens when you assume.

Ohhhhh... I get your point now Johnla! I didn't understand why you typed that post until now. Sorry for that!

Okay, when I said black bars don't "burn-in" your screen, what I meant was that the image retention caused by black bars isn't a form of phosphor damage as would be the case with a static image from a video game that sat in the corner for too long.

In other words: People say "you can get burn-in from black bars". When they say "burn in", they mean "an effect that THEY may not be able to get rid of."

I think the term "burn in" is so ridiculously vague. When I use the term burn-in, I'm talking about phosphor damage or extreme phosphor wear, or possibly even MgO sputter/damage. Really, when I say burn-in, I mean damage. When other people say "burn in", they mean "an effect I can't get rid of." 2 different meanings. Confusing.

Burn in- is permanent , image retention is not , in most cases it is a form of heavy image retention that could take months to get rid off. We should focus more on fixing the "image retention" then so much on the definitions. I liked when jOhnnyfive mentioned a way of possibly getting rid of image retention of a logo.

jOhnnyfive, Also, to correct burned in logos, I'm thinking of a protocol to follow where you hook the TV up to a computer and somehow create a reverse image of the burn-in. You create a custom slide with this reverse image and let it run (should correct the problem).

I've been running the slides non-stop and finally approaching the 100 hr mark. My question is how much electricity does the tv use up, would I see a drastic increase in my pg&e bill? btw the tv is a panny 55gt30. Thanks in advance.

Gang,

Running the Evang. slides via DVD-R, do you have to set the DVD player on a loop I assume? My Sony BDP-S570 assumedly has that option...

Pardon any redundancy of the issue...

Thx!

KF

Don`t quote me on this, but i think you use the a-b loop key on the remote.

John.

Hey Hungro!


Yeah, I don't see why one couldn't connect their plasma to a PC (temporarily), and use a paint program to somehow outline the retained image creating a customized slide which they could (carefully) run and see how it affects the screen. Hopefully this would lead to improvement. Once enough improvement has been reached, one could then use regular break-in slides to smooth it all out. I am a fan of not using the "full" break-in slides to fix everything as this (I assume) just ages your TV, perhaps more than necessary.


And I agree that talking about definitions gets old. But, I'm starting to cringe every time I see the term "burn-in" now. It's a useless term that conjures up a feeling of permanence and hopelessness. lol Woe is me!