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Enough with all the clutter (graphics) on my HD screen! - Page 104

post #3091 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakes View Post

If the channel logo bothers you that much then don’t watch that free channel. Complaining about it here will get you nowhere.
It's not that easy, unless one wants to crawl under a rock and never watch TV they are FORCED to watch bugs, screen clutter and scrolls and while I agree complaining about it "here" may not get you anywhere, where other than in a thread entitled Enough with all the clutter (graphics) on my HD screen! would you suggest it be posted? IMO if you don't want to read posts of people complaining about screen clutter then don't read a thread entitled Enough with all the clutter (graphics) on my HD screen!.....just a thought. Oh and for anyone watching "free" TV via cable/satellite, it's NOT free. Such services pay something called a carriage fee to those "free" stations and in the end the pay providers just pass those carriage fees onto their customers so saying such TV is free is just not the case.

On another note today I caught the last few minutes of a syndicated program on my local FOX channel(The Ricki Lake Show) and during the last few minutes(not just the titles but a few minutes before they even started) they showed several full fledged commercials on the bottom 1/3rd of the screen! Not a bug, not a snipe, but full fledged commercials mad.gif
post #3092 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjeff View Post

On another note today I caught the last few minutes of a syndicated program on my local FOX channel(The Ricki Lake Show) and during the last few minutes(not just the titles but a few minutes before they even started) they showed several full fledged commercials on the bottom 1/3rd of the screen! Not a bug, not a snipe, but full fledged commercials mad.gif

Sounds like the Channels and Networks are getting DESPERATE, with many people using DVRs and other recording devices to record shows, to watch later. You might say I time-shift my TV Shows as well, some of the shows I'm watching for the first time actually aired for the first time over 60 years ago! biggrin.gif
post #3093 of 3285
First off, a previous posting indicated that bugs were for advertising. Sorry, not true. The damn bugs initially came about before cable systems had the ability to identify channels as you channel surfed. Of course, if you channel surfed thru a commercial break, it was of no help. Unfortunately, even after the ability to know what channel you were on, including during commercial breaks, became standard, the A-holes left the damn bug on the screen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjeff View Post

It's not that easy, unless one wants to crawl under a rock and never watch TV they are FORCED to watch bugs, screen clutter and scrolls

The rock that I've crawled under has a wealth of TV programming, without bugs, snipes and slaughtered closing credits, i.e., there are real closing credits. You just need to find the right rock to climb under. biggrin.gif
post #3094 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrvideo View Post

First off, a previous posting indicated that bugs were for advertising. Sorry, not true. The damn bugs initially came about before cable systems had the ability to identify channels as you channel surfed. Of course, if you channel surfed thru a commercial break, it was of no help. Unfortunately, even after the ability to know what channel you were on, including during commercial breaks, became standard, the A-holes left the damn bug on the screen.
The rock that I've crawled under has a wealth of TV programming, without bugs, snipes and slaughtered closing credits, i.e., there are real closing credits. You just need to find the right rock to climb under. biggrin.gif

SECONDED! biggrin.gif
post #3095 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrvideo View Post

The rock that I've crawled under has a wealth of TV programming, without bugs, snipes and slaughtered closing credits, i.e., there are real closing credits. You just need to find the right rock to climb under. biggrin.gif
Guess we've both found the same rock!
Only thing is- and it's a very minor inconvenience- you usually have to wait 24hrs after airing to view your programs.
But, it's well worth it to see a bug/snipe/fly-in free screen.
post #3096 of 3285
Quote:
Simple - BRAND RECOGNITION. Have you really never heard of that?

Please provide us with actual EVIDENCE. I've heard the "brand recognition" argument for years, with NO evidence to back it up. The only thing bugs do for me as far as brand recognition goes is that they remind me of companies that hate their viewers and programming so much.
Quote:
Further, I highly doubt that the free-for-all-to-access ABC has lost any viewers over the years due to their small on screen logo. Calm down.

They've lost me- that's at least one right there. Has this so-called "BRAND RECOGNITION" been worth that? Have they GAINED a greater number of viewers from it- does at least one person now watch their shows specifically because they like seeing the logo there?
post #3097 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8traxrule View Post

Have they GAINED a greater number of viewers from it- does at least one person now watch their shows specifically because they like seeing the logo there?
That's not the right question to ask. A more appropriate question would be: have they gained viewers due to somebody talking about the show and remembering what channel it was on because of the bug? I have no real answer to that question, but my guess would be that it has happened, even if the person watching didn't realize it.
post #3098 of 3285
Bickering removed. Well, some of it. Keep it civil. MORE civil.

As for channel bugs, Mr Video is quite right. Add to that that not all audience measurement is done by Nielsen nor is it all electronic. Call a viewer and ask them "What channel are you watching right now?" and, minus the bugs, they're likely to say "I dunno." Same with diary measurement techniques.

The bugs are still there because not all of us use a cable box with a handy guide. You still have a TON of sets in use that are subscribed to analog cable and, therefore, guide-free. And there are a lot of digital subscribers who do it "the old fashioned-way." We have a co-worker whose husband couldn't find the guide button if his life depended on it. This is a guy who still uses phone books. I have watched him surf up until he saw the bug of the channel he was looking for. He knows where ESPN is. TLC? Not a clue. Surfs till he sees the bug. The networks know this and they've always been a lowest-common-denominator business. The bugs are there so everyone can find the channel, associate the program with the channel and hopefully tell others about the channel.
post #3099 of 3285
Again, I have seen NO PROOF of that ("have they gained viewers due to somebody talking about the show and remembering what channel it was on because of the bug?") There's more proof of this practice turning off viewers than there is of any of these theories (look at the rec.arts.tv newsgroup when this started, as well as "Video" magazine for starters. There were several letters to the editor printed about that practice, and in 1994 the magazine had a survey of things that annoyed readers with "Network logos on TV images" being the **TOP** complaint- and this was BEFORE the "big 3" had started and was a somewhat rare occurrence altogether on broadcast TV other than Fox.) Again, what actually HAS been gained by doing this for 15 years??? (I'll admit I've gained a lot more free time since this started!)

("Bickering" edited, hopefully to moderators' satisfaction. Remembering there was a guy on the newsgroups whose signature was "Just bicker?" and "bicker" may have been his username as well.)
Edited by 8traxrule - 3/29/13 at 9:35am
post #3100 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDon View Post

We have a co-worker whose husband couldn't find the guide button if his life depended on it. This is a guy who still uses phone books. I have watched him surf up until he saw the bug of the channel he was looking for. He knows where ESPN is. TLC? Not a clue. Surfs till he sees the bug.
All part of the "dumming-down" of America frown.gif
God forbid they take the station/network bugs off and make this individual actually use his brain to remember something.
post #3101 of 3285
Quote:
The bugs are there so everyone can find the channel, associate the program with the channel and hopefully tell others about the channel.

Uh, yeah- like here, tell others about how ANNOYING that channel is. And I've NEVER gotten a call asking what channel I was watching. You'd think broadcasters would have some consideration for those of us who DON'T have cable as well, although now most broadcast networks and stations are owned by the same companies that also own cable channels. (When I first complained to our local CBS station about their use of the bug, hoping the station owners might also be upset about it, I got a response saying "Cable channels have been doing this for a while, CBS just followed suit." So it's OK to just pick up any bad idea anyone else comes up with (didn't they used to run PSAs telling kids not to do stuff just because everyone else was doing it?), and also CBS was not a cable channel last time I checked! They were in business since the very beginning of television, and have irreparably tarnished their legacy by doing this.)

Yet again, I dare ANYONE to tell me what the BROADCAST networks (mainly NBC, CBS and ABC) have GAINED by deliberately spoiling their picture quality.
post #3102 of 3285
1: You are not the customer
2. I already told you. So stop with the "proof" demands. It works or they wouldn't bother.
post #3103 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDon View Post

It works or they wouldn't bother.
Bottom line.
post #3104 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8traxrule 
[CBS] were in business since the very beginning of television, and have irreparably tarnished their legacy by doing this.)
"Irreparably tarnished their image?" Really? I think you may be overreacting just a tad. When I hear people talk about CBS, it's usually about their programming, news or ratings and never about on-screen graphics. In fact, outside of us nerds who obsess over such things, most people don't seem to care whether there's a bug or not.

You're really throwing the baby out with the bathwater here. Some of the best television of all time is being produced today, and you're allow yourself to miss out based on something annoying the networks do. But haven't TV networks been in the business of annoying their viewers one way or another for 65 years?

I don't like network bugs either, but over the past two decades I've adapted and can now tolerate them and enjoy the show. If I have to ignore an AMC logo while I watch the latest Breaking Bad or an FX logo so I can watch Louie, I will.
post #3105 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8traxrule View Post

Exactly- it appears that most people don't notice them at all, and those who DO notice are annoyed by them, so why do they continue to do it? "Bottom line" is how exactly HAVE they benefited from it?

Like a lot of advertising just because you don't notice them it doesn't mean they don't influence you...

There are endless articles on their value if one cares to look... such as rebranding yourself.... if you don't like these two read any of the other millions...

While many companies have a little wiggle room when it comes to a logo design—they can modify the design a little bit over time—Discovery Velocity does not have this luxury. The new channel has only has one chance to make a first impression on their core audience. If the target market checks out the channel and does not identify with it, Velocity will be stopped by a lack of momentum. It will become just another cable channel competing for the time of housewives and science geeks.

http://www.logodesignworks.com/blog/beam-me-up-discovery

Out of the hundreds and even thousands of networks out there, most people return to just a handful of favorites every night. This is due not just to the quality of programming, but to the quality of branding as well. Many people continue to watch their favorite channels because they identify with the brand and, as any good logo designer can tell you, the logo design is the root of the brand. These logos do a great job of expressing the network’s values and purpose so viewers know exactly what to expect when they pick up the remote control.

http://www.logodesignworks.com/blog/top-10-tv-channel-logos
post #3106 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles R View Post

Out of the hundreds and even thousands of networks out there, most people return to just a handful of favorites every night. This is due not just to the quality of programming, but to the quality of branding as well. Many people continue to watch their favorite channels because they identify with the brand and, as any good logo designer can tell you, the logo design is the root of the brand. These logos do a great job of expressing the network’s values and purpose so viewers know exactly what to expect when they pick up the remote control.

http://www.logodesignworks.com/blog/top-10-tv-channel-logos

Really? Is that company serious? That has to be a self-serving piece of crap. I've never been influenced by a network/.cable logo, in that it makes me want to watch them, just because the bug looks good.
post #3107 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrvideo View Post

Really? Is that company serious? That has to be a self-serving piece of crap. I've never been influenced by a network/.cable logo, in that it makes me want to watch them, just because the bug looks good.
You, like most of us on this board, aren't "typical." wink.gif
post #3108 of 3285
I'm fairly certain that my daughter and son-n-law haven't either and as previously mentioned, they've not complained about the bugs and snipes like I have.
post #3109 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by 8traxrule View Post

And this month marks FIFTEEN YEARS since ABC started keeping their logo onscreen, being the last of the "big 3" networks to do this. Again, I have yet to hear a single thing anyone has GAINED by doing this, and if it has been worth losing even one viewer for.

ABC has now started their annoying screen text on the lower left corner of the screen advertising Dancing With the Stars or some lame reality show. Most cable networks do this and now one of the big 4 networks are doing it. This practice is unacceptable IMO. That goes double for cable networks that charge for their channels. Now viewers have the logo and screen text cluttering up the screen.
post #3110 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by borntocoast View Post

Sounds like the Channels and Networks are getting DESPERATE, with many people using DVRs and other recording devices to record shows, to watch later. You might say I time-shift my TV Shows as well, some of the shows I'm watching for the first time actually aired for the first time over 60 years ago! biggrin.gif

A year ago I started watching Get Smart and Car 54 Where Are You for the first time. I started watching all 9 seasons of The Beverly Hillbillies and its like watching them for the first time because I don't remember any of them.
post #3111 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedi Master View Post

A year ago I started watching Get Smart and Car 54 Where Are You for the first time. I started watching all 9 seasons of The Beverly Hillbillies and its like watching them for the first time because I don't remember any of them.

It doesn't matter how old they are, If you haven't seen a show before, it's still "new" to you. cool.gif
post #3112 of 3285
For those who bitch about a mostly transparent small logo at the bottom of the screen that pervades almost all TV these days, do you also bitch about the chrome logos on your car, or the logo on so many golf/polo shirts, or the logo on your athletic shoes. I doubt it. Its simply the networks branding their product so viewers know who's providing the program they are watching. If you can't ignore them while you're watching, I'd say that you have the problem, not the network. That being said, yea, I get annoyed by the snipes for other shows or even products that do disrupt so many shows on the air or cable these days. Those actually take you out of the story for the moment, and the use of them is shameful.
post #3113 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by mscottc View Post

For those who bitch about a mostly transparent small logo at the bottom of the screen that pervades almost all TV these days, do you also bitch about the chrome logos on your car, or the logo on so many golf/polo shirts, or the logo on your athletic shoes. I doubt it.

What a ridiculous comment. rolleyes.gif

Television is a visual medium. Your analogy is flawed by referring to objects whose primary purpose is not aesthetic.
post #3114 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by mscottc View Post

For those who bitch about a mostly transparent small logo at the bottom of the screen that pervades almost all TV these days, do you also bitch about the chrome logos on your car,

I would if they put them on the windshield and it covered up the place I was trying to watch the road.
post #3115 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by borntocoast View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedi Master View Post

A year ago I started watching Get Smart and Car 54 Where Are You for the first time. I started watching all 9 seasons of The Beverly Hillbillies and its like watching them for the first time because I don't remember any of them.

It doesn't matter how old they are, If you haven't seen a show before, it's still "new" to you. cool.gif

 

Except when you're an alcoholic for years and you finally quit drinking, then you get to enjoy all of your favorite shows again for the first time. cool.gif

post #3116 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by mscottc View Post

For those who bitch about a mostly transparent small logo at the bottom of the screen that pervades almost all TV these days....

 

Those who started "bitching" about that 15+ years ago warned it'll get worse.

 

Yup, today it's terrible and everyday it's STILL getting worse.

post #3117 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solfan View Post

Those who started "bitching" about that 15+ years ago warned it'll get worse.

Yup, today it's terrible and everyday it's STILL getting worse.
Agreed! For those who say bugs are just a small small transparent logo in the corner of their screen(like the CBS eye, which don't like but can live with) apparently they haven't watched any of the garbage on a channel that use to show arts type of programming, Bravo. I was channel surfing the other day and landed upon Bravo and one of it's typical Housewives of.... programs. Not only was the entire lower right area of the screen masked by a permanent(except during commercials rolleyes.gif) non opaque:

The real housewives
of Beverly Hills
REUNION
Tonight 9/8c
* by Bravo


but at times they had another banner on the left side that would move around advertising another show rolleyes.gif
So while I've become accustomed to things like the CBS eye, a bug can get so much worse and probably will in the future frown.gif Of the OTA channels ABC seems to have the most screen clutter/snipes, luckily I don't watch much ABC(not so much because of their screen clutter but because of their programming).
post #3118 of 3285
I have no problem with Bravo masking Real Housewives with graphics. It's a public service to humanity.
post #3119 of 3285
I will say, when it comes to editing commercials out of a program, they do come in handy. You can scroll through a show at pretty high speed just staring at the bug. When it's gone, it's a commercial break. Easy to edit out the spots without spoiling the show. Yeah, I know.. there are programs that'll do that FOR me, but they miss rejoins too often.
post #3120 of 3285
Quote:
Originally Posted by AKAWalrus View Post

I have no problem with Bravo masking Real Housewives with graphics. It's a public service to humanity.

This I have no problem with! biggrin.gif
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