Enough with all the clutter (graphics) on my HD screen! - Page 3

It's a Catch-22: If a person says no to "Clash" (or perhaps to other shows in proportion to "Clash"), it tells NBC to increase either "Clash" and/or other programming's promotion through non-traditional methods ("Clash of the Choirs" HAS been heavily hyped traditionally), including constant bugs. If a person says yes, and Clash bugs have already been aired (and it seems that was the case), then it tells NBC that the SuperbadBug tactic "works" and is a good idea to try on other shows. Either way, I suspect NBC wants to continue this no matter what, and uses these surveys to provide "rationale" for it.

There's no way for us to win but not to watch (or take the surveys). Although, if ratings drop, I doubt the executives will ever even consider placing any blame on themselves.

BTW, NBC, if you're reading this, please remember two principles:

1. The K.I.S.S. principle: No, not the band KISS, headed by Gene Simmons (who happens to be one of the cast members of Celebrity Apprentice, coming in January to NBC, but you knew that already), but Keep it Simple Stupid (please don't ban me, mods). The less clutter that's placed on the screen, the better. Tastefulness, sophistication, and class in execution is something that Americans still yearn for, especially today, yes, even in their TV programming.

(On a semi-related note: This SuperbadBug thing reminds me of the people who try to stop [insert construction project here] because they feel that the result would be an eyesore. Maybe they have a point.)

2. The goose that laid the golden eggs. Remember how the farmer got greedy and killed the goose to try to get more than the eggs than he could get with the traditional method? Now you're trying the same tactic here: Trying to grab as much money as you get, in as short a period of time as possible, forgetting the original point as to how to make the money. It never works.

We want you to stay broadcating, and we know you need to make cash. Just, we don't want to get bombarded with constant advertising. Maybe we're a bunch of minority renegades, but how would you know the general public doesn't think the same way on this? How sure are you that you're getting a true cross-section of Americans with those Internet polls? Some don't have the time for them (stay-at-home moms, for instance, most in that coveted 25-54 demo). How do you know Americans overwhelmingly don't agree with Lewis Black's anti-bug speech at the '07 Emmys?

25-54 is still the prime demo, and if you want to get the younger of those viewers, fine. Still, you still have to get the older ones, and alienating them won't help the overall number. More 35-54 yr. olds watch TV than 25-34 yr. olds, and that's not changing right now. If it was, CBS, who doesn't have those obnoxious bugs, on both the SD and HD sides, wouldn't be gathering so many viewers with shows that aren't critic favorites, but are still pulling in very good numbers, especially in the 25-54 department. They're certainly doing better than you in the ratings, overall. So, placing these bugs to catch 25-34's, in exchange for some 35-54's becoming resistant to catching new programming, well, that's not helping your bottom line: You're 100% guaranteed to have viewers not catch ads and promos if they don't watch or TiVo them. In this case, 100%'s a whole lot worse than, say, the 30% that would DVR the shows (and that's a pretty high estimate), that is, unless you want to go broke.

Have a nice day.

I was watching NHL TV today and it was so refreshing to see a game from the early 80s in 4x3 with nothing but the game action on TV. You could probably see more of the action that you can today on a 16x9 screen cluttered as the sports networks keep their screens.

This is just an outrageous statement.

Have you watched popular tv programming in the last 5 years?

I am getting disgusted with NBC Network's propaganda of leaving ads on the screen during almost the entire show. Now CW which I used to think wasn't so bad of a network is doing the same annoying thing. Since CW is co-owned by Viacom's CBS division and Warner Brothers, I suppose CBS will also start this disgusting new trend within a year or two.

Is there a website where people can petition the networks, FCC, or someone high up to let them know that these are annoying nuisances?

I am not against the Networks putting up their network logos or putting up ads for upcoming shows. I am against the networks' practice of putting ads on every couple of minutes or leaving them on through a whole segment of a show. One 30 second or less ad during the show per segment seems fair to me. That would be like around 4-6 ads about 3 minutes maximum out of 42 minutes of show.

NBC and CW are not gaining anything by running these annoying ads as they are advertising the same show over and over again. I doubt the ratings increase is anything significant from these ads. In fact it is likely they know they aren't gaining anything from these ads at NBC since they don't put them on HD NFL Games or Today Show when they are #1 in ratings.

Hopefully NBC and CW people will read this. I know it has made me feel more negative about these networks since they have started this practice.

-YakHDTV06

For over the air, your only recourse is to stop watching and notify the network why you stopped watching. For cable/satellite, you can stop watching too but a better solution is to cancel your programming and notify your provider and the networks why you canceled. I realize that the network is to blame and not the provider, but the provider will have a vested interest if and when they start losing subscribers because of what the programmers are doing. If they played hardball with the programmers during carriage negotiations or simply refuse to carry their channel, maybe it will get their attention?

That only works if you're willing to give up nearly every channel to send a message to the one that is the worst offender.

You're absolutely right, but, more and more of the channels are jumping on the bandwagon and inserting all the garbage during programming. Unfortunately, many people won't cancel and will just accept what's forced on them. That's the American way?

God forbid that a station tries to advertise on their own shows. It isn't THAT BAD! It's in the bottom left corner and is see-through.

People have a new thing to complain about every day.

That's what commercial breaks are for. Putting up on screen banners for DVDs, unrelated shows and other elements only distracts me from the show. It doesn't belong in the program.


That's the problem - it's not just a see through corner bug. It's lower third banners. It's bright white text over dark video. It's animated snipes running across the bottom of the screen. Heck it's also large solid bugs with animated elements in them.


You're right. Today I'm going to complain about your useless contribution to a thread you could have easily passed by.

No full-time promos on CW tonight, though the stupid reminders of the current show, Gossip Girl, and 'oh yeah, the season 4 DVDs are on sale,' were still present when coming back from some of the commercials. This seems to be a race between NBC and CW for the worst network on TV. Does it really help to promo your crap when no one is watching?

TiVo is now shooting themselves in the foot. During the movie trailer for Atonement on the repeat of the 2004 pilot episode of House last night, an obnoxious "thumbs up" appeared with the message "Click to learn more". Clicking on the bug branches the DVR to the TiVo "Showcase" version of the trailer, which is the same 3-minute length as the theatrical trailer (which I have already seen three times prior during holiday movies at the Theater).

These obnoxious pop-up graphics are NOT transparent, and they appear to be of fixed pixel size, since they are larger on a 720p program than a 1080i program. The graphic plus the framed bitmap image of the movie poster occupied approximately 1/4th the 720p screen in the upper right corner.

YES it was during a commercial break and not the main program. But I was using the undocumented "30-second skip" button and if I tried to skip the movie trailer, it branched away from the program and into the Showcase. This forces you to navigate back to the program to "Resume" watching the recording. The ad is buried in the recording and the problem happens every time you replay that portion of the program. This forced me into the "fast forward" version of commercial skipping.

I'm also an NBC complainer, I hate the constant ads for other shows in the corner, can't just show it a few seconds?

I know NBC that you have new shows this week, but you don't have to rub them on our faces every freakin time!

This is why I wish we had ala-carte programming. I'm not willing to dump my entire cable lineup, but I would dump NBC in a second over their crappy bug. Sure I'd miss out on about 2 NBC shows I watch (Chuck and The Office) but I could live with that.

Being that NBC is a free broadcast network, I don't think you would save too much cash by dumping them.

I was going to say that, but he seemed so sincere, I didn't want to discourage him...

These networks get more than enough opportunities to plug their shows duing endless commercial breaks, and during the closing credits. I don't need animated ads flying in and out during actual program content with actors waving at me. The promo bugs, transparent or not, are yet another annoyance and clutter.

How about if NESN-HD put up a promo bug during an entire Red Sox game plugging the post-game show or an upcoming contest.

Edit: Comcast Sportsnet carries the Celtics so my example is incorrect.

It's the principal of the thing!

Only thing that gets my on nerves is a giant graphic taking up half of the football field saying "2nd & 5" when right under it on the scoreboard it says "2nd & 5"

And also the announcers will say it, and I'm sure it also shows up if you have cc turned on.

Beat me to the punch. I was going to suggest a big bug in the middle of the screen.

It is very welcome change last night on CW to see no ads for an upcoming show next to the CW logo. I hope this means it was a one-time thing since the ads were all for the Season Premiere of One Tree Hill.

I am going to give CW the benefit of the doubt for now.

But as for NBC: NBC had better start changing their name to Nothing But Commercials. I guess us viewers shouldn't expect much from this network that give us terms like "the biggest loser" and "no deal" and "you're fired."


- YakHDTV06

The graphic isn't that big, is only covering up grass, and disappears when the play starts. I don't see the big deal, and I actually like these graphics.

The Fox version usually stays in place for the whole play.

I absolutely HATE these on screen logos. When I first got HD, it was different. HD was a wider, better quality picture sans obnoxious ads and other BS. Some shows I really liked, HD CBS sitcoms that showed the normal ending credits instead of the lower third credits with the CSI promo being shown for the millionth time.

Then, logos started getting bad last season with that hideous white NBC logo on the wrong side fo the screen. Now this year NBC has resorted to constant full color logos and adding the santa hat and new years hat. And they are copying the cable networks over-advertising of shows.

But still, the thing that really cranks me abou NBC is the logo is on the WRONG F_CKING SIDE OF THE SCREEN!!! Who the hell came up with this sh-- and who greenlit this to be on the air? Those people need to be fired!

Just wait till you local affiliates get newer equipment and have the ability to overlay graphics on the HD channel. Our Cleveland ABC affiliate, ABC5/WEWS converted to HD news last January and by mid to end 07 they overlay their garbage on my HD channel. For example, WEWS puts a crawl on the bottom of the screen advertising what is coming up on Oprah tomorrow duing Wheel and Jeopardy. They also put the lotto numbers on screen. The HD versions of these shows used to not have this garbage on screen until later in 07. Now, I'm forced to endure a oversized crawl with lotto numbers and Oprah advertisements during Wheel and Jeopardy. Plus, they manipulate the end of Jeopardy into split screen so the obnoxious weather man Mark Johnson can tell us a weather forecast is coming up at 11.

And with the ability to add ad crawls, they've also tried to put their own news crawl over the HD broadcast of GMA, leaving a hideous mess. The damn thing is not aligned right so you can still see the top of the ABC crawl under the local news crawl.

my local CBS and FOX also do it. CBS 19 inserts their own bug around the top of the hour and FOX leaves their "FOX8-1" bug on during all HD FOX programming.

I guess it was only a matter of time before HD was polluted, just like SD.

First it was NBC's Today. Right before they went HD, they added that obnoxious animated Today bug. I could deal with it at the time, since it was on the right side of the screen. Then, they decided to move it to the WRONG side of the screen to match the rest of their graphics and they added a scrolling "nbc.com" to it.

The morning show I used to like was Good Morning America. GMA used to have separate bugs. The SD channel had the ABC logo in its regular place with the time to the left and the HD channel had a smaller logo in the sidebar area with the time under it. This way there wasn't a "floating bug" in the middle of the screen. Then this October they went and ruined it by adding their hideous animated ABC News BS and keeping it 4:3 safe.

And I'm still waiting to see what happens at The Early Show. After their disappointing new set, music and graphics, they still didn't go HD. Wonder what the HD CBS graphics/bug will look like?

So do you have 2 bugs that say FOX on it, or just one?

I was watching Law and Order CI yesterday in a regular analog TV, the show was letterboxed and with the advertisement on the logo, as if it doesn't look small enough letterboxed adding the clutter makes it look way smaller.

Except for certain circumstances, there can only be one. Fox doesn't insert a network bug for the vast majority of their programming, since they control the Splicer at each station that inserts the local bugs. And for some programming (sports) they don't have any bug (local or network) at all.