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Marantz AV8003 and MM8003 - Page 3

post #61 of 3462
We'll be comparing it at some point as we carry both lines.

Questions will be coming, but most reps are at EHX for the week. Expect answers next week.

Richard
post #62 of 3462
spcav wrote:

Quote:


Denon seems to be the only one still caring for SACD / DVD-AUDIO (Denon Link)....

Denon Link is an older technology that is proprietary. HDMI can stream DVD-Audio PCM and SACD DSD in native format for D/A conversion in the pre/pro or receiver.

The AV8003 (and some others) support DSD and PCM D/A conversion. So there
is no need for Denon Link.

If your player doesn't support HDMI for these formats, the Oppo DV-980H has HDMI output, plays SACD and DVD-A, and will stream DSD (for SACD) and PCM (for DVD-Audio) multichannel to the AV8003. It is not expensive and it outperforms many players costing in the $1000+ range.
post #63 of 3462
FYI.
Called local dealers and they said they will not accept orders until Apr. 1st and units to ship in June.
post #64 of 3462
Yup I mentioned that in the writeup. I'm getting so many PMs and emails for this, let me say this now:

If you are interested in these pieces and have questions, please email me at richard@avscience.com with Marantz Pro/Amp in the subject line. I will be sending questions on to Marantz as I get them and will be blasting them out in emails and posting here.

This is NOT a pre-order list or an order list. Pricing may be subject to change once official orders become available in April and we're not everyone's dealer.

But I will be trying to get as much information for you guys as possible.

This is the easiest way to do it.

Richard
post #65 of 3462
The AV8003 is very interesting! Does anyone know the dimensions - it looks fairly tall - I'm concerned about rack space & clearance.
post #66 of 3462
I'll see if I can't call Marantz tomorrow at EHX and let them know people are buzzing about this on the forum.

Hmmm, too bad there's no live interview feature on the forum.

Richard
post #67 of 3462
Hi Richard,

When you call Marantz can't you ask them regardign the blu-ray BD8003 player and if and when this will be released?

Thanks Patrik
post #68 of 3462
Patrik,

Release is about the same time in June as the pro/amp combo.

Richard
post #69 of 3462
ANSWERS TO QUESTIONS:

I spoke with my guy at Marantz this morning, he was very gracious in answering my questions while at a convention. These were asked in this thread and are in no particular order.

1. OSD will go through HDMI. (AV8003)
2. No THX Loudness PLus (THX UltraII certified though). (AV8003)
3. XLRs & RCAs active at the same time. (AV8003)
4. Audyssey is the MultEQ (AV8003)
5. Overall size of both is close to the SR8002. (AV8003 and MM8003)
6. Discrete commands for both HDMI out but not simultaneous use. (AV8003)
7. Prices are fixed, no expectation of price increase due to rise of oil/dollar. (AV8003, MM8003, BD8002)
8. No 2.0 upgrade. (BD8002)

That's it for now, but next week I'll be putting all teh other questions into an email and getting your answers.

Keep emailing me your questions.

Richard
post #70 of 3462
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVSRichard View Post

ANSWERS TO QUESTIONS:

I spoke with my guy at Marantz this morning, he was very gracious in answering my questions while at a convention. These were asked in this thread and are in no particular order.

1. OSD will go through HDMI. (AV8003)
2. No THX Loudness PLus (THX UltraII certified though). (AV8003)
3. XLRs & RCAs active at the same time. (AV8003)
4. Audyssey is the MultEQ (AV8003)
5. Overall size of both is close to the SR8002. (AV8003 and MM8003)
6. Discrete commands for both HDMI out but not simultaneous use. (AV8003)
7. Prices are fixed, no expectation of price increase due to rise of oil/dollar. (AV8003, MM8003, BD8002)
8. No 2.0 upgrade. (BD8002)

That's it for now, but next week I'll be putting all teh other questions into an email and getting your answers.

Keep emailing me your questions.

Richard

Well Rich, since you invited more questions...
  • Which audio and video formats can be streamed to the AV8003?
  • Will the AV8003's firmware be easily updateable by the owner via ethernet?
  • Will OSD interface for streamed media have media center-like features (cover art, ability to search for specific songs or artists, etc)? In other words, will AV8003 essentially have a media player built into the unit?

Thanks.

Eric
post #71 of 3462
Can u guys tell my why you would prefer Marantz AV8003/MM8003 vs. SR8002.
The power difference is 140W 8003 vs. 125W 8002.
I am not interested in streaming music or anything else as I do have HTPC.
OSD over HDMI sounds good, but what another options do u like to justify huge price difference?
I got new speakers recently : Paradigm Studio 100, CC-690 and ADP-590 and looking for new receiver.Waithing for 8003 to read full SPEC. What about you?
Thanks
post #72 of 3462
I'm going to guess even though the SR8002 has a toroidal power supply, the current behind the MM8003 is going to be higher which means more headroom for your dynamic range, which means you can hear more frequency response no matter whether your volume is soft or loud.

I'll try to get more specs.

Richard
post #73 of 3462
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVSRichard View Post

I'm going to guess even though the SR8002 has a toroidal power supply, the current behind the MM8003 is going to be higher which means more headroom for your dynamic range, which means you can hear more frequency response no matter whether your volume is soft or loud.

I'll try to get more specs.

Richard

Thanks Richard for reply.
I really appriciate it. We spoke about SR8002 in January (by phone) and I decided to wait 8003 separates to see the SPEC's.
I don't want to say anything negative about Marantz or separates - I am just looking for price justificaton.
So for 5K MSRP vs. 2K MSRP it should be really good addition features. That's what I am trying to find out.

And regarding toroid transformers - I don't know why people on this forum think that toroid is any better than any other transformer. Transformer has a rating, for example 1000KVA or 800KVA or 1500KVA. It doesn't matter what kind of transformer do you use as soon as transformer choosen for the right current, have shilded space in receiver or amplifier, made with good material/quality. If I am not mistaken differnce in 15W (140W - 125W) will give about 2V diffence.
Given P=U x I, I can be as I=U/R, R in this calculation = 8 Ohm. I've got 33.46V at 140W and 31.62V at 125W.
What I am missing here?
I don't really care about 125 or 140W. I currently have Marantz 8200 (6 year old receiver), that I like very much, but doesn't have any HDMI or Audissey and other newest features.I would like to see what features or advantages AV8003/MM8003 will have over SR8002 for the price.
Thanks
post #74 of 3462
Richard, Any plans for a pre/pro with 6+ hdmi ports?
I would hate to buy a new prepro and use up all of the hdmi inputs on the first day.
post #75 of 3462
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVSRichard View Post

Yup I mentioned that in the writeup. I'm getting so many PMs and emails for this, let me say this now:

If you are interested in these pieces and have questions, please email me at richard@avscience.com with Marantz Pro/Amp in the subject line. I will be sending questions on to Marantz as I get them and will be blasting them out in emails and posting here.

This is NOT a pre-order list or an order list. Pricing may be subject to change once official orders become available in April and we're not everyone's dealer.

But I will be trying to get as much information for you guys as possible.

This is the easiest way to do it.

Richard

Hi:
A couple questions about the AVR 8003 -
1. For a 5.1, (Zone 1), system, could I bi-amp the LC& R speakers, (all at once)?
2. How many subwoofer outlets? Are these XLR or RCA?
3. For the two HDMI outputs, is it possible to have only one
HDMI output active at any one time?
4. What's the length of the warranty for the AVR 8003 and the MM8003. Will an extended for either unit be available? Length of the EW?

Thanks for your time with this
post #76 of 3462
I'll get this to Marntz and find out and hopefully have a big update this week on questions and answers.

Richard
post #77 of 3462
More answers:

1. Yes you can bi-amp on the AV8003. There are 8 channels of Marantz power – 6 channels would cover the L/C/R in Bi Amp mode and the remaining 2 would cover the LS/RS. (AV8003)

2. There is 1 sub output but it is available via XLR and RCA. (AV8003)

3. It has discrete codes for each HDMI output and only one output is active at a time. (AV8003)

4. 3 years parts and labor to the original purchaser (AV8003, MM8003)

5. They are working on the final specs right now but Audio, Video (up to 1080P) and photos. (AV8003)

6. It is too early to tell what updates can be done by the user vs updates that may need to be done by a service center. This holds true for past and current products (as some have be user updatable and others needed to go to a service center). (AV8003)

7. Yes, there is a Digital Media Player built into the unit. (AV8003)

8. Reasons to purchase this would be The AV Preamp has all new audio and video circuitry as it now has balanced outputs and inputs, they've added scaling and have a Digital Media Player built-in for streaming audio, video and photos. The AV8003 also has a new transformer. (Gee I was right it has a better transformer). The power amp is all new, based on a combo of the SR9600 / PM-11S1 8 channels so it drives a full in-wall system. (AV8003)

9. If you need more HDMI inputs, you can buy the VS3002 – 6 inputs, 2 outputs and add it to this preamp or a AV Receiver such as the SR8002. (AV8003)


Richard
post #78 of 3462
Richard, I'm sorry, but I do have more questions.

1. Is there a phono preamp in the AV8003.

2. Does the audio stay in the analog domain from the balanced inputs all the way to the analog outputs?

3. Will the AV8003 accept a DSD stream through the HDMI inputs and do digital to analog conversion, or will it convert the DSD to PCM first?

4. I have Apogee Mini-Grands, which can provide a very difficult load to an amp. The ribbons in the Stage panels can occasionally present loads below 3 ohms. Could you ask the Marantz guys whether the MM8003 handle such difficult loads?

thanks, Steven
post #79 of 3462
Sure. Here you go.

1. No phono pre-amp. I get a buck next time someone asks this.


2. I believe so, as long as you aren’t applying surround to the unit


3. Yes, DSD.


4. Yes it can, is should handle even 2ohm loads with its dynamic output capabilities.

I might find room for these in my theater. I'm so intrigued.

Richard
post #80 of 3462
Richard, a couple of questions/points I'm still not 100% clear on:

1) Will the AV8003 output any audio source to the second audio zone? ...can I select a multi-chan DSD source from HDMI and output it to the second zone in stereo, or are there limitations? If so, what are the limitations on audio sources that can be output to the second zone?

2) Does the OSD support video overlay of status messages/volume changes, etc over HDMI (not just full-screen OSD)?

I'm very excited about this unit. I can't wait to get my hands on one.
post #81 of 3462
Thanks for the info Richard.

Now that I know the MM8003 will easily drive my Apogees, I can sell my separate power amps to cover some of the cost of the new separates. I also now know I need a phono preamp. I also know I can connect my phono preamp to the balanced inputs and stay in the analog domain.

Richard, if you mean that you are considering Apogees for your home theater, I can't recommend them highly enough. They are incredible with music and movies' soundtracks. Unfortunately ADS bought out Apogee and closed the company down in the late 90's so pick your models wisely.

Some Apogee models can be repaired. Some cannot. The repairs are difficult and often costly. However, if you do have an Apogee repaired it will likely sound better than it did when it left the factory.

The ribbon replacements are being manufactured by a great Australian named Graz. He makes the replacements there, and has authorized a few North American and European repair facilities. Most of those who have had repairs done, swear that Graz' replacement ribbons are better than the original Apogee ribbons.

Some of you reading this thread have wondered whether the AV8003/MM8003 combo will be worth the extra money over the SR-8002.

I can tell you this.

I absolutely love my SR-8500, which was the first in the Marantz receiver line that produced the SR-8002. If my SR-8500 had the modern codecs and HDMI switching, I'd probably not upgrade.

However, I do expect a really noticeable improvement in overall sound quality when I go to the AV8003/MM8003 combo. I would not expect as big an improvement with a change to the SR-8002.

That said, I think that if you don't have really top quality speakers, you won't hear enough improvement to justify spending the extra coin on the separates. If I had average+ speakers, I'd go with the SR-8002 and spend the extra $3000 on upgrading my speakers.

This is just my opinion. I am basing this on my belief that the Marantz receivers really kick butt for the money. I am not basing this on a belief that there won't be substantial value and extra performance from the Marantz separates. I just think that if you have $5k to spend, make sure your speakers are top shelf before you spend the extra cash on separates.

If you are still on the fence, I'd recommend that you find a dealer that will loan you an SR-8002 demo for a few nights, as long as you put down a decent deposit. Try the receiver with your speakers. If possible, bring it back and get the separates to try out for a day. If you don't immediately go nuts over the separates, bring them back, buy the receiver and upgrade your speakers. The dealer gets his sale and you get the most bang for your buck. A win / win situation all around!


Steven
post #82 of 3462
Scratch17,

I plan to do exactly that, borrow a current 8002 and use it as a pre/pro for a weekend. Hope to order the AV8003 in early April.

SC
post #83 of 3462
Quote:
Originally Posted by scratch17 View Post

Thanks for the info Richard.

Some of you reading this thread have wondered whether the AV8003/MM8003 combo will be worth the extra money over the SR-8002.

I can tell you this.

I absolutely love my SR-8500, which was the first in the Marantz receiver line that produced the SR-8002. If my SR-8500 had the modern codecs and HDMI switching, I'd probably not upgrade.

However, I do expect a really noticeable improvement in overall sound quality when I go to the AV8003/MM8003 combo. I would not expect as big an improvement with a change to the SR-8002.

That said, I think that if you don't have really top quality speakers, you won't hear enough improvement to justify spending the extra coin on the separates. If I had average+ speakers, I'd go with the SR-8002 and spend the extra $3000 on upgrading my speakers.

This is just my opinion. I am basing this on my belief that the Marantz receivers really kick butt for the money. I am not basing this on a belief that there won't be substantial value and extra performance from the Marantz separates. I just think that if you have $5k to spend, make sure your speakers are top shelf before you spend the extra cash on separates.

If you are still on the fence, I'd recommend that you find a dealer that will loan you an SR-8002 demo for a few nights, as long as you put down a decent deposit. Try the receiver with your speakers. If possible, bring it back and get the separates to try out for a day. If you don't immediately go nuts over the separates, bring them back, buy the receiver and upgrade your speakers. The dealer gets his sale and you get the most bang for your buck. A win / win situation all around!


Steven

Steven,
How do you qualify or quantify good vs. bad speakers?
I just upgraded to Paradigm Studio 100 fronts, CC-690 front and 2 surrounds ADP-590. If I tell you I spent 5000$+ , will you consider it's good?
I think it's pretty subjective, because somebody can afford speakers for 10K or 20K and they will call my speakers bad, right?
And regarding receiver. I have Marantz SR8200 for 6 years and don't have any problem with. It's driving my new speakers fine.I love it. Can it be better - I don't know, since I don't have new receiver yet. Reason for upgrade is HDMI switching,Audissey, flexible crossover adjustment.
But considering price of 8002 vs. 8003 combo I have to see real benefits of pre/pro to justify price difference, right? 125W Amp vs. 140W is not much difference.

Right now I have Oppo 981 upconversional DVD player and planning to buy blue ray later this year, Sony 52XBR4, HTPC. Since I have HTPC I don't need any stream functioanlity and probably need only HDMI + new formats decoding. I like new 8003 looking cases - match my Silverstone CW02B, but going to wait for the full specification of 8003 combo, before making decision.
Thanks
post #84 of 3462
Richard
I have a question about the digital media player. What file types will it be able to handle? A lot of media players don't offer support for flac files, however if the AV8003 is capable of decoding flac files that would make this thing really attractive. Thanks.
post #85 of 3462
What the heck is a flac file? Is that sanctioned by AFLAC?

I'll ask.

Richard
post #86 of 3462
Well word is they haven't finalized the list yet so I don't know if a flac file is on it yet or not. But they now know it's been asked about.

I'll update this thread when I find out the file types.

Richard
post #87 of 3462
Richard: FLAC stands for Free Lossless Audio Codec, an audio format similar to MP3, but lossless, meaning that audio is compressed in FLAC without any loss in quality. This is similar to how Zip works, except with FLAC you will get much better compression because it is designed specifically for audio, and you can play back compressed FLAC files in your favorite player (or your car or home stereo, see supported devices) just like you would an MP3 file.

FLAC stands out as the fastest and most widely supported lossless audio codec, and the only one that at once is non-proprietary, is unencumbered by patents, has an open-source reference implementation, has a well documented format and API, and has several other independent implementations.

I have a Request N200 Series Digital Music Server w/a 120 Gig Hard Drive. When using FLAC, I can store twice the number of CDs I can if I burn them uncompressed to the Request (400 vs 200). This is a high end piece of gear, and it was expensive but the fidelity is excellent. I'd be interested on more details about the built-in media server on the Marantz.
post #88 of 3462
Gotcha and thanks for the explanation.

Richard
post #89 of 3462
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVSRichard View Post

More answers:

1. Yes you can bi-amp on the AV8003. There are 8 channels of Marantz power – 6 channels would cover the L/C/R in Bi Amp mode and the remaining 2 would cover the LS/RS. (AV8003)

2. There is 1 sub output but it is available via XLR and RCA. (AV8003)

3. It has discrete codes for each HDMI output and only one output is active at a time. (AV8003)

4. 3 years parts and labor to the original purchaser (AV8003, MM8003)

5. They are working on the final specs right now but Audio, Video (up to 1080P) and photos. (AV8003)

6. It is too early to tell what updates can be done by the user vs updates that may need to be done by a service center. This holds true for past and current products (as some have be user updatable and others needed to go to a service center). (AV8003)

7. Yes, there is a Digital Media Player built into the unit. (AV8003)

8. Reasons to purchase this would be The AV Preamp has all new audio and video circuitry as it now has balanced outputs and inputs, they've added scaling and have a Digital Media Player built-in for streaming audio, video and photos. The AV8003 also has a new transformer. (Gee I was right it has a better transformer). The power amp is all new, based on a combo of the SR9600 / PM-11S1 8 channels so it drives a full in-wall system. (AV8003)

9. If you need more HDMI inputs, you can buy the VS3002 – 6 inputs, 2 outputs and add it to this preamp or a AV Receiver such as the SR8002. (AV8003)


Richard

Hi, Richard:
Thanks for the in-depth reply - greatly appreciated. 'Looking forward' to reviewing the new AVR's specs. Now, the hard part: waiting...
post #90 of 3462
I do what I can. But I'd like to point out that Marantz has been very forthcoming and supportive with everything. Big kudos to them too.

Richard
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