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Blockbuster BD rental discussion thread - Page 133

post #3961 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by caesar1 View Post

As far as streaming, unless and until 7.1 DTS HD is available, it will never be as good as a disc.

Lossless audio is in the UV CFF spec but I bet it will be a long time before anyone uses it, if ever. There is no incentive to double the storage requirements and the streaming data rates because most streaming viewers would never know the difference.
post #3962 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland View Post

Lossless audio is in the UV CFF spec but I bet it will be a long time before anyone uses it, if ever. There is no incentive to double the storage requirements and the streaming data rates because most streaming viewers would never know the difference.

Can you point me in the direction where an 7.1 DTS HD is equal to the bit rate and/or size of the video that accompanies it .. ?? A disk would even be fine ..
post #3963 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgkdragn View Post

Can you point me in the direction where an 7.1 DTS HD is equal to the bit rate and/or size of the video that accompanies it .. ?? A disk would even be fine ..

That was the entire point, there is none. Here is one example of 7.1 DTS HD bit rate. This sound track about equals or exceeds the average bit rate (video) of a HD stream from Netflix. If they were to use the referenced audio would mean the data rate would about double.
post #3964 of 4010
Now that Blockbuster is getting out of the disk rental business, who else besides NF is out there?
post #3965 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

Now that Blockbuster is getting out of the disk rental business, who else besides NF is out there?
Redbox
post #3966 of 4010
post #3967 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

Now that Blockbuster is getting out of the disk rental business, who else besides NF is out there?

on Shuloch of the Planet Dune, I honestly don't know .. wink.gifwink.gif
post #3968 of 4010
A few of the Network news shows picked up the closing story and went nostalgic on "Back in the day .. " Even had a clip of Arnold doing a schtick in a BB store ..

But I think the funniest post I saw somewhere was the guy that said "Screw you Blockbuster, I told you you'd never get that $23.75 in late charges .. "
post #3969 of 4010
post #3970 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post

Now that Blockbuster is getting out of the disk rental business, who else besides NF is out there?

You did not specify by mail or kiosk or B&M. If B&M: Family Video, for my area there is Ingle's Grocery Stores (a fairly large chain). Also try: Find Your Video Store. There are more mom & pop video stores than some folks think there is.

By Mail: Cafe DVD

As long as Netflix will deliver BD's to my mail box I will be happy.

Not sure what AVS is doing to: "http://www.familyvideo.com". Copy the URL into your address line for access to Family Video
Edited by Wendell R. Breland - 11/13/13 at 11:10am
post #3971 of 4010
uh, Redbox obviously.
post #3972 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by b_scott View Post

uh, Redbox obviously.
How did you get them to deliver discs to your house? tongue.gif

Btw, most Safeway grocery stores have DVD and some may have blu-ray for rental.
post #3973 of 4010
I piggy backed on Wendell's reply, which included B&M

I have about 3 redboxes within walking distance at home and a redbox in my building at work.
post #3974 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by b_scott View Post

I piggy backed on Wendell's reply, which included B&M

I have about 3 redboxes within walking distance at home and a redbox in my building at work.

Yeah, the sheer numbers of Redbox kiosks is amazing. For example, my old house was less than a mile from a strip mall that had stores on three of the four corners of an intersection of two section line roads. On one corner, there are two Redbox kiosks inside a Walmart Neighborhood Market. Across the street is another, outside a Walgreen store, and there is still another across the other street outside a CVS Pharmacy. It's not hard to find a Redbox Kiosk, to put it mildly.
post #3975 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

It's not hard to find a Redbox Kiosk, to put it mildly.

42,000 kiosks and counting. The irony is it was a Netflix co-founder, Mitch Lowe, who really put Redbox on the map. I remember from several years ago Netfix expressing their concerns about kiosk taking away from their DVD by mail business. IMO, Netflix has not put forth much effort to retain their DVD by mail subs.
post #3976 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland View Post

IMO, Netflix has not put forth much effort to retain their DVD by mail subs.

I agree that NF hasn't done much to preserve their disc by mail business. It seems to me that they think their future lies in streaming. I am inclined to agree. Since NF added original programming to their streaming package, I understand their business is booming, not that it wasn't booming before that.
post #3977 of 4010
I think Hastings has said from Day One, by the very definition of the company name, Netflix, the goal is to transition to more and more streaming and less physical media ..

One of his latest quotes :

“Eventually, as linear TV is viewed less, the spectrum it now uses on cable and fiber will be reallocated to expanding data transmission. Satellite TV subscribers will be fewer, and mostly be in places where high-speed Internet (cable or fiber) is not available. The importance of high-speed Internet will increase.”

Read into that what you will, but when it's all said and done, streaming is cheaper, more efficient, no back and forth mailing, allows the studios to get what they want (more control) etc ..

He has gone on to say that the day will come when pricing tiers will be implemented ..

Not to say that I agree, but from a business model perspective, it makes perfect sense ..

The day will come, whether in my remaining lifetime or not, that physical media will be an enthusiasts niche .. if a niche at all .. sad, yes .. inevitable, certain ..
post #3978 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

I agree that NF hasn't done much to preserve their disc by mail business.

Netflix makes a lot more money per sub from disc than from a streaming sub. I have always understood their streaming business model, never understood their desire to shove their DVD business under the train. Makes about as much sense as Honda neglecting their Accord line in favor of the Civic.
post #3979 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

I agree that NF hasn't done much to preserve their disc by mail business. It seems to me that they think their future lies in streaming. I am inclined to agree. Since NF added original programming to their streaming package, I understand their business is booming, not that it wasn't booming before that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland View Post

Netflix makes a lot more money per sub from disc than from a streaming sub. I have always understood their streaming business model, never understood their desire to shove their DVD business under the train. Makes about as much sense as Honda neglecting their Accord line in favor of the Civic.


For now, as long as it is profitable, I believe their DVD by mail business is here to stay. If they wanted to compete with Redbox they would have kiosks. More overhead and more headaches. That was never their business model or their place. I rarely have an issue with their service and I constantly get emails asking me when I received a title. That's not exactly the behavior of a video rental company that's neglecting their customer base.


Ian
Edited by mailiang - 11/13/13 at 8:48pm
post #3980 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgkdragn View Post

on Shuloch of the Planet Dune, I honestly don't know .. wink.gifwink.gif
Leto won't allow kiosks....tongue.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland View Post

You did not specify by mail or kiosk or B&M. If B&M: Family Video, for my area there is Ingle's Grocery Stores (a fairly large chain). Also try: Find Your Video Store. There are more mom & pop video stores than some folks think there is.

By Mail: Cafe DVD

As long as Netflix will deliver BD's to my mail box I will be happy.

Not sure what AVS is doing to: "http://www.familyvideo.com". Copy the URL into your address line for access to Family Video
Thanx for the info.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

I It seems to me that they think their future lies in streaming.
IIRC, they said this several years back.

Unless I am mistaken, NF is not streaming 1080/24p and lossless.
If this doesn't happen, I will never go to streaming.
As I understand it, the "tubes"biggrin.gif can't handle it.
With that in mind, a number of hardware manufacturers are releasing 4K displays....now what?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland View Post

Netflix makes a lot more money per sub from disc than from a streaming sub. I have always understood their streaming business model, never understood their desire to shove their DVD business under the train. Makes about as much sense as Honda neglecting their Accord line in favor of the Civic.
At NF, the Streaming vs. Discs question can better be defined as: Management vs. Accounts Payable.
IOW, Cost Cutting vs. Current Cash Flows.

Rather than looking for the next innovation, it is safer for Managers (and their employment stability) to look to cut costs as a way to maintain and/or increase profits.
Ultimately, cost cutters, if not restricted, always destroy businesses.wink.gif
post #3981 of 4010
They're having a sale!


http://blockbuster.m.delivery.net/w/webView?cid=14479096062&mid=1094409004&pid=55104&vid=13784&ee=bWFpbGlhbmdAYW9sLmNvbQ__&si=&mv=H&bv=H&oc=P&k=11Erii&sc=

Quote:
Originally Posted by oink View Post



Unless I am mistaken, NF is not streaming 1080/24p and lossless.
If this doesn't happen, I will never go to streaming.
As I understand it, the "tubes"biggrin.gif can't handle it.
With that in mind, a number of hardware manufacturers are releasing 4K displays....now what?


You are mistaken. biggrin.gif Netflix does stream in 1080/24p. Audio is not lossless, but is supplied on many titles using DD plus. They also offer more bandwidth now (Super HD) and 3D titles, but it can be problematic except through certain ISP's where they use their own CDN, Open Connect.



Ian smile.gif
Edited by mailiang - 11/14/13 at 7:14am
post #3982 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wendell R. Breland View Post

Netflix makes a lot more money per sub from disc than from a streaming sub. I have always understood their streaming business model, never understood their desire to shove their DVD business under the train. Makes about as much sense as Honda neglecting their Accord line in favor of the Civic.

You are absolutely right .. profit from disk == 47% profit from streaming == 23% / 2nd Quarter

Hastings has, however, seemed to have quit all advertising of the disk by mail business and even made it a bit more cumbersome on the site to even find the disk by mail service ..

But, on the flipside, the disk model is losing customers, which may be what they want .. and the streaming customer base is rising ..

I believe at least a quarter of the 40 million (if memory serves) streaming customers are outside the USA these days .. and will never have disk by mail ..

If you split the disk by mail business from the streaming business, the profit percentage is skewed by the number of subscribers .. 7 million disk by mail / 40 million (?) streaming .. so the question becomes, if you forget the percentage, what is the actual profit in real money between the two .. ??
post #3983 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by mailiang View Post


For now, as long as it is profitable, I believe their DVD by mail business is here to stay. If they wanted to compete with Redbox they would have kiosks. More overhead and more headaches. That was never their business model or their place. I rarely have an issue with their service and I constantly get emails asking me when I received a title. That's not exactly the behavior of a video rental company that's neglecting their customer base.

That's a good point. The speed and efficiency of NF's mail-order disc rental business was the thing that allowed them to kill off BB, leaving out for the moment BB's crushing debt. BB came into the mail-order disc rental market late and simply couldn't compete against NF's polished operation. Dish couldn't either, which is why they are closing up the BB operation.
post #3984 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwsat View Post

That's a good point. The speed and efficiency of NF's mail-order disc rental business was the thing that allowed them to kill off BB, leaving out for the moment BB's crushing debt. BB came into the mail-order disc rental market late and simply couldn't compete against NF's polished operation. Dish couldn't either, which is why they are closing up the BB operation.

Myself, I still believe there is a place for B&M .. which gets completely ignored in many cases these days .. in hindsight, 20/20, BB's obviously bad management team during the disk by mail time period, should have not even tried to do disk by mail .. instead, concentrate on the B&M business .. they did not have the 28 day delay to contend with, they could have restructured the pricing (which was way too high) and thus improve cash flow .. quicker liquidation of stale inventory, selective closing of marginal stores .. I could make a pretty long list ..

Instead, they splintered off and failed to do B&M management or disk by mail management well and at the same time, decided they wanted into the Kiosk business .. ignoring the very foundation that built the company in the first place .. thus beginning the downfall ..

I also believe that if Dish had been willing to devote the resources to the disk by mail business and/or the B&M side, they could have eventually become a solid contender .. but they had about as much lack of focus as the old BB management team ..
post #3985 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by mailiang View Post


For now, as long as it is profitable, I believe their DVD by mail business is here to stay. If they wanted to compete with Redbox they would have kiosks. More overhead and more headaches. That was never their business model or their place. I rarely have an issue with their service and I constantly get emails asking me when I received a title. That's not exactly the behavior of a video rental company that's neglecting their customer base.


Ian
I wished Netflix would treat all their customers like they treat you.
They just don't seem to have the service(turn around & new release availability) you describe in Seattle.
frown.gif
Quote:
Originally Posted by mailiang View Post

They're having a sale!


http://blockbuster.m.delivery.net/w/webView?cid=14479096062&mid=1094409004&pid=55104&vid=13784&ee=bWFpbGlhbmdAYW9sLmNvbQ__&si=&mv=H&bv=H&oc=P&k=11Erii&sc=
You are mistaken. biggrin.gif Netflix does stream in 1080/24p. Audio is not lossless, but is supplied on many titles using DD plus. They also offer more bandwidth now (Super HD) and 3D titles, but it can be problematic except through certain ISP's where they use their own CDN, Open Connect.



Ian smile.gif
How about most people don't have Open Connect or an ISP that allows 1080p/24.
So your observation is not the rule but the exception.

With standard ISP, I get better 1080p/5.1 DD streaming from Amazon than Netflix.
post #3986 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by 42Plasmaman View Post


How about most people don't have Open Connect or an ISP that allows 1080p/24.
So your observation is not the rule but the exception.

With standard ISP, I get better 1080p/5.1 DD streaming from Amazon than Netflix.

I'd have to say you're right on the Open Connect comment ..

Apparently some of the ISP's are reluctant ..

http://venturebeat.com/2013/11/11/netflix-shows-why-isps-should-start-using-its-open-connect-to-improve-video-speeds/
post #3987 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by mgkdragn View Post

what is the actual profit in real money between the two .. ??

Q3, 2013
Streaming Domestic: $166 million - 31,092 subs; International: (-$74 million) - 9,188 subs
DVD: $107 million - 7,148 subs

As of now (September SEC): streaming = 92 million in profit with 40 million subs vs DVD with a profit of $107 million and 7 million subs

If I were them I certainly would be doing more to promote my higher margin business but they seem content to let the DVD business fade away.
post #3988 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by 42Plasmaman View Post

I wished Netflix would treat all their customers like they treat you.
They just don't seem to have the service(turn around & new release availability) you describe in Seattle.
frown.gif
How about most people don't have Open Connect or an ISP that allows 1080p/24.
So your observation is not the rule but the exception.

With standard ISP, I get better 1080p/5.1 DD streaming from Amazon than Netflix.


It may not be the market, but the type of titles you subscribe to. I just rent new releases. Super HD is being offered to everyone now, and although the streaming can be erratic for some, there are many Comcast and Verizon members on the Netflix streaming threads who posted that they stream all 1080p HD content seamlessly all the time, and they do not currently have Open Connect


Ian
post #3989 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by mailiang View Post

It may not be the market, but the type of titles you subscribe to. I just rent new releases. Super HD is being offered to everyone now, and although the streaming can be erratic for some, there are many Comcast and Verizon members on the Netflix streaming threads who posted that they stream all 1080p HD content seamlessly all the time, and they do not currently have Open Connect


Ian
I to only want new releases but I'm lucky to get one a month playing the send disc back on Friday or Saturday.
Then I must pick catalog titles just so I get my money's worth.

I also can't seem to get new TV show releases reliably either.
What I do now is put my account on hold when a new release TV show comes out then restart a month later.
I've been at least been able to get new release TV shows using this madness.
I've pretty much been depending on Redbox for my new release rentals. Thanks to the promo codes, most of my Blu-ray rentals have only cost me $0.33.

I get 1080p HD with Netflix on my meager 15MB DSL but it's riddled with macroblocking and banding hell.
I can only assume they use the bare minimum bandwidth to send me 1080p DD 5.1 because VuDu and Amazon HD look fine.
post #3990 of 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by 42Plasmaman View Post

I to only want new releases but I'm lucky to get one a month playing the send disc back on Friday or Saturday.
Then I must pick catalog titles just so I get my money's worth.

I also can't seem to get new TV show releases reliably either.
What I do now is put my account on hold when a new release TV show comes out then restart a month later.
I've been at least been able to get new release TV shows using this madness.
I've pretty much been depending on Redbox for my new release rentals. Thanks to the promo codes, most of my Blu-ray rentals have only cost me $0.33.

I get 1080p HD with Netflix on my meager 15MB DSL but it's riddled with macroblocking and banding hell.
I can only assume they use the bare minimum bandwidth to send me 1080p DD 5.1 because VuDu and Amazon HD look fine.


I'm sorry to hear your not getting good service. The distribution center maybe having issues. Have you been getting follow up emails asking about when you received your titles? I would contact them and file a complaint to find out what is going on. Every one I know who has Netflix doesn't seen to be having these issues. Also, you can't compare Amazon and Vudu streaming to Netflix. The amount of traffic they generate isn't even close. If your ISP's delivery system isn't up to par you will continue to have problems. I believe we've been getting a bit off topic. I realize they're defunct, but isn't this still the BB thread? biggrin.gif


Ian
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