AVS › AVS Forum › Video Components › Home Theater Computers › GeForce 8200 - 8 Channel LPCM Output Fully Supported!!
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

GeForce 8200 - 8 Channel LPCM Output Fully Supported!! - Page 30

post #871 of 2308
5/20/08 at 7:50am
Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

I tested a couple of discs (all 5.1 channel). If I select HDMI Ouptput Modes > PCM output in PowerDVD 8, PowerDVD sends PCM to the receiver whatever sound track I choose (so AC3/DTS is decoded by PowerDVD besides TrueHD and DTS-HS MA) and I can't choose PLIIx in the receiver. So Windows always sends 7.1 LPCM?

That's what it looks like, and what I was experiencing.


Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

On the other hand if I select HDMI Ouptput Modes > AC3/DTS pass-through in PowerDVD 8, the receiver gets LPCM/AC3/DTS depending on the track and PLIIx works with AC3. LPCM is stereo only (maybe 7.1 with the surrounds blank)

Windows' speaker configuration does not affect the results at all unless I choose "Stereo" (e.g. even if I disable all the speaker except Front, I still get 5.1 from the speakers).

Makes sense. I could get 5.1 with both AC3 and DTS, but not with LPCM.

Do you even have the 5.1 channel option in the control panel? I only had Stereo and 7.1 channel. If I used an older HDMI driver (1.0.0.17 - see images), 5.1 was an option in the control panel, but didn't work. (I still got only 2 channel).

It would be nice if we could somehow figure out a way to make the 5.1 LPCM work (maybe there is a registry key or something) so we can matrix with our AVRs, otherwise we will be limited to players that can matrix for us, until nvidia (hopefully) fixes the driver.

Maybe someone in the g35 forum would have an idea about this, since they are probably the ones who have the most experience with LPCM and windows.
LL
LL
Reply
Reply

AVS Top Picks

post #872 of 2308
5/20/08 at 7:59am
Quote:
Originally Posted by CFC View Post

Here is the full list of currently available Geforce 8200/8300 motherboards available at Newegg:
AMD Nvidia Geforce 8000 series motherboards @ Newegg.com

As of 05/20/08 they have:

uATX:
- Asus M3N78-EMH (8200)

ATX:
- ECS GF8200A (8200)
- Biostar TForce TF8200 A2+ (8200)

- Asus M3N-H HDMI (8300/750a)
- Biostar TPower N750 (8300/750a)

- Asus M3N-HT Deluxe (8300/780a)
- Asus Crosshair II Formula (8300/780a)

Hope that helps someone looking for one.
I'll probably end up getting the Biostar TF8200.

CFC

Nice work! I hadn't noticed most of the 8300 ones. I have newegg's RSS feed in my bookmarks set to 8200 motherboards, so those hadn't shown up yet.

Be careful though, because the Biostar TPower N750 doesn't have an HDMI port, and the Asus M3N-H and M3N-HT ONLY have HDMI ports, so you couldn't hook up a monitor and digital display at the same time without an additional graphics card. That probably isn't a big issue for many, but worth mentioning.

I do like the look of the Biostar TF8200 though, I will probably get it after I RMA my ECS board. My current Biostar board has been rock solid (T7050), and I have noticed the last couple of 8200 series updates Gary Key has posted have been using the Biostar board, so that might tell us something.
Reply
Reply
post #873 of 2308
5/20/08 at 8:08am
Quote:
Originally Posted by cghebert View Post

Nice work! I hadn't noticed most of the 8300 ones. I have newegg's RSS feed in my bookmarks set to 8200 motherboards, so those hadn't shown up yet.

Be careful though, because the Biostar TPower N750 doesn't have an HDMI port, and the Asus M3N-H and M3N-HT ONLY have HDMI ports, so you couldn't hook up a monitor and digital display at the same time without an additional graphics card. That probably isn't a big issue for many, but worth mentioning.

I do like the look of the Biostar TF8200 though, I will probably get it after I RMA my ECS board. My current Biostar board has been rock solid (T7050), and I have noticed the last couple of 8200 series updates Gary Key has posted have been using the Biostar board, so that might tell us something.

Actually the Asus boards come with a VGA bracket. It's pretty weird, but I guess they assume you won't need VGA on the I/O panel itself, so in case you really need it they provided the bracket, and the header is on the motherboard. I made sure of it when I was investigating what to get.
You can actually see it in the picture here (you can zoom in): M3N-H Pics
They also provide a HDMI to DVI adapter. The Biostar N750 board comes with an HDMI/DVI adapter as well, but since the main header is DVI, I assume it won't support HDMI-audio. They will lose some folks on that. Doesn't seem to have a VGA header either. They must be exclusively targeting the gaming community with that one: Biostar N750 Specs
CFC
Reply
Reply
post #874 of 2308
5/20/08 at 8:24am
Quote:
Originally Posted by CFC View Post

Actually the Asus boards come with a VGA bracket. It's pretty weird, but I guess they assume you won't need VGA on the I/O panel itself, so in case you really need it they provided the bracket, and the header is on the motherboard. I made sure of it when I was investigating what to get.
You can actually see it in the picture here (you can zoom in): M3N-H Pics
They also provide a HDMI to DVI adapter. The Biostar N750 board comes with an HDMI/DVI adapter as well, but doesn't seem to have a VGA header: Biostar N750 Specs
CFC

You are correct, thanks for pointing that out.

For the N750 though, I doubt HDMI audio will be available using the adapter, since DVI only carries video. I believe ATi made some special adapters modified such that they could carry sound, but I'm not sure about this one.
Reply
Reply
post #875 of 2308
5/20/08 at 8:28am
Quote:
Originally Posted by cghebert View Post

You are correct, thanks for pointing that out.

For the N750 though, I doubt HDMI audio will be available using the adapter, since DVI only carries video. I believe ATi made some special adapters modified such that they could carry sound, but I'm not sure about this one.

Yes, I doubt that as well. I was making some editing to point that out while you were replying.

CFC
Reply
Reply
post #876 of 2308
5/20/08 at 9:20am
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cghebert View Post

Do you even have the 5.1 channel option in the control panel? I only had Stereo and 7.1 channel. If I used an older HDMI driver (1.0.0.17 - see images), 5.1 was an option in the control panel, but didn't work. (I still got only 2 channel).

I tried only the latest driver 175.16 that shows only Stereo and 7.1 Surrounds.
Reply
Reply
post #877 of 2308
5/20/08 at 9:56am
Thread Starter 
GIGABYTE's GA-M78SM-S2H appeared in its website. But it's not the one everyone wants.
Reply
Reply
post #878 of 2308
5/20/08 at 10:16am
Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

I tried only the latest driver 175.16 that shows only Stereo and 7.1 Surrounds.

If you are feeling brave and/or generous, would you mind testing out the .17 HDMI driver to see if the behavior is the same? It is available on the Asus website

It is fairly easy to install and uninstall just the HDMI audio driver, then you don't have to mess with the video drivers at all. I have a feeling that the 5.1 channel option won't work, but it would be nice to confirm.
Reply
Reply
post #879 of 2308
5/20/08 at 10:30am
Quote:
Originally Posted by CFC View Post

Here is the full list of currently available Geforce 8200/8300 motherboards available at Newegg:
AMD Nvidia Geforce 8000 series motherboards @ Newegg.com

As of 05/20/08 they have:

uATX:
- Asus M3N78-EMH (8200)

ATX:
- ECS GF8200A (8200)
- Biostar TForce TF8200 A2+ (8200)

- Asus M3N-H HDMI (8300/750a)
- Biostar TPower N750 (8300/750a)

- Asus M3N-HT Deluxe (8300/780a)
- Asus Crosshair II Formula (8300/780a)

Hope that helps someone looking for one.
I'll probably end up getting the Biostar TF8200.

CFC

Sigh. The 750a and 780a are NOT based on the 8200/8300 chipsets! They are the based on the MCP72 platform, and not the MCP78 platform that the 8200/8300 are based on. They do not have HD audio over HDMI capability, but do have purevideo support.

I do not think that the 750a or 780a chipsets are a good fit for anyone really interested in this thread.
Reply
Reply
post #880 of 2308
5/20/08 at 10:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeSM View Post

Sigh. The 750a and 780a are NOT based on the 8200/8300 chipsets! They are the based on the MCP72 platform, and not the MCP78 platform that the 8200/8300 are based on. They do not have HD audio over HDMI capability, but do have purevideo support.

I do not think that the 750a or 780a chipsets are a good fit for anyone really interested in this thread.

Well,
Asus lists the M3N-H HDMI as an 8300 board on their site:
Asus M3N-H HDMI Specs



EDIT: Ahhh I see, the board on newegg is actually a M3N-HD HDMI, which is 750a. I'll correct the info on my post, I hate to spread bad info... my bad guys.
Thanks for the clarification Mike
CFC
Reply
Reply
post #881 of 2308
5/20/08 at 10:37am
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeSM View Post

Sigh. The 750a and 780a are NOT based on the 8200/8300 chipsets! They are the based on the MCP72 platform, and not the MCP78 platform that the 8200/8300 are based on. They do not have HD audio over HDMI capability, but do have purevideo support.

I do not think that the 750a or 780a chipsets are a good fit for anyone really interested in this thread.

Regardless of what exact platform they are based on, they all seem to have HD audio support. See Gary Key's article here.

"On the audio side, the HDMI interface offers support for 8-channel LPCM, provided you install the necessary NVIDIA driver set. Our driver support disks had this driver installation tucked away from the normal chipset installation, so be sure to load it if you want multi-channel LPCM. This feature matches Intel's G35 chipset and is a far better alternative to the AMD 780G that sports 2-channel LPCM for the HTPC audience."

Gary Key also adds this is in a comment:

"I personally believe the 750a would make an excellent HTPC system if you utilize a ATX case design, might plan on using it for gaming with a discreet video card, and can afford it. The GF8300 board that just arrived is a better solution at first glance (if a uATX design and not having SLI capability is important) and compares favorably to the 780G from a price to performance viewpoint, more so than the GF8200. We will have an update on it next week.
We received the 175.16 drivers right after the article went live and will have some post-processing comparisons (174.14s did not handle this right) this weekend between the two chipsets. Right now, it is a toss up in my opinion, and due to that fact, I would go NV for the multi-channel LPCM."
Reply
Reply
post #882 of 2308
5/20/08 at 10:45am
Quote:
Originally Posted by CFC View Post

Well,
Asus lists the M3N-H HDMI as an 8300 board on their site:
Asus M3N-H HDMI Specs



EDIT: Ahhh I see, the board on newegg is actually a M3N-HD HDMI, which is 750a. I'll correct the info on my post, I hate to spread bad info... my bad guys.
Thanks for the clarification Mike
CFC

I don't think that's correct.
Reply
Reply
post #883 of 2308
5/20/08 at 10:49am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajamils View Post

I don't think that's correct.

Which part?
Reply
Reply
post #884 of 2308
5/20/08 at 11:03am
Quote:
Originally Posted by cghebert View Post

I doubt HDMI audio will be available using the adapter, since DVI only carries video. I believe ATi made some special adapters modified such that they could carry sound, but I'm not sure about this one.

HDMI and DVI have the same pinout (excluding the analog side). You can send audio through a DVI cable. Whether the motherboard has that capability or not is entirely another question.
Reply
Reply
post #885 of 2308
5/20/08 at 11:07am
Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

GIGABYTE's GA-M78SM-S2H appeared in its website. But it's not the one everyone wants.

Is there another Giga-byte 8200 board coming out? Why is this not the one everyone wants?
I noticed the drivers are dated May 16th version 18.11. Maybe those of you with ASUS or ECS boards could try the drivers off Giga-byte's site.
Reply
Reply
post #886 of 2308
5/20/08 at 11:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

This is not actually a big problem at all (unless your display device has only one HDMI in). Connect:

- GeForce 9600 GT (or any GeForce card) -> HDMI IN 1 of your display
- AVR -> HDMI IN 2 of your display

When you use another player, just select HDMI IN 2 in the display and you are done. (I tested this configuration too and it worked just fine.)

But I agree that Hybrid SLI is a preferable method and more GeForce cards supporting Hybrid SLI will be released in future. Until then a GeForce discrete card (or GeForce 8200 mGPU when the driver matures) with GeForce 8200 HDMI is perhaps the best HTPC solution.

Yes, that's a huge problem. Again, that defeats the whole purpose of an AVR, which is to switch Audio and Video. There are very good reasons you want all this done through a single AVR/pre-pro.

For most HT's, this is an unacceptable setup (except to beta test).

One simple example is video processing. And there are tons others.
Reply
Reply
post #887 of 2308
5/20/08 at 11:24am
From the Gigabyte GA-M78SM-S2H manual:

Quote:


Please note the HDMI audio output only supports AC3, DTS and 8-channel-LPCM
formats (up to 192 KHz for Windows Vista) (AC3 and DTS require the use of an external
decoder for decoding.)

no mention of 5.1 lpcm.

though it's easy to believe this is only a temporary driver limitation.

edit: Ingore that, doesn't actually say anything, because 2 channels lpcm aren't mentioned either, but, as we know, supported.
Reply
Reply
post #888 of 2308
5/20/08 at 11:29am
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbMagFab View Post

Yes, that's a huge problem. Again, that defeats the whole purpose of an AVR, which is to switch Audio and Video. There are very good reasons you want all this done through a single AVR/pre-pro.

For most HT's, this is an unacceptable setup (except to beta test).

One simple example is video processing. And there are tons others.

I'd like to hear some of the other reasons to use the AVR for switching video other than convenience. Video processing is generally not a strong capability of an AVR, it's just a feature thrown in these days. I personally only use it for convenience, if my display had more than 1 HDMI input I'd be using directly, why would I want something processing the 1080p feed out of my htpc?
Reply
Reply
post #889 of 2308
5/20/08 at 11:29am
Quote:
Originally Posted by cghebert View Post

Regardless of what exact platform they are based on, they all seem to have HD audio support. See Gary Key's article here.

"On the audio side, the HDMI interface offers support for 8-channel LPCM, provided you install the necessary NVIDIA driver set. Our driver support disks had this driver installation tucked away from the normal chipset installation, so be sure to load it if you want multi-channel LPCM. This feature matches Intel's G35 chipset and is a far better alternative to the AMD 780G that sports 2-channel LPCM for the HTPC audience."

Gary Key also adds this is in a comment:

"I personally believe the 750a would make an excellent HTPC system if you utilize a ATX case design, might plan on using it for gaming with a discreet video card, and can afford it. The GF8300 board that just arrived is a better solution at first glance (if a uATX design and not having SLI capability is important) and compares favorably to the 780G from a price to performance viewpoint, more so than the GF8200. We will have an update on it next week.
We received the 175.16 drivers right after the article went live and will have some post-processing comparisons (174.14s did not handle this right) this weekend between the two chipsets. Right now, it is a toss up in my opinion, and due to that fact, I would go NV for the multi-channel LPCM."

I would be surprised (though happy) if this were true. Did he test it? I have never seen anyone claim the MCP72 had that capability in it before, nor has nvidia marketed that. It will be interesting to see someone get one and try and make it work.
Reply
Reply
post #890 of 2308
5/20/08 at 11:43am
This 750/780, 8200/8300, 780G crap is making my head spin.

I am lost...
Reply
Reply
post #891 of 2308
5/20/08 at 11:52am
Quote:
Originally Posted by cybrsage View Post

This 750/780, 8200/8300, 780G crap is making my head spin.

I am lost...

LOL..........and I thought that I was alone
Reply
Reply
post #892 of 2308
5/20/08 at 12:17pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AbMagFab View Post

One simple example is video processing. And there are tons others.

Perhaps I am ignorant. What kind of video processing do you want for 1080p from GeForce 9600 GT? I hardly see reasons why the video signal from the GeForce card must be processed by the receiver.

What else that defeats the "whole purpose" of AV receiver? Tons? Will you show me just ten important reasons why the graphics card should not be connected to the display directly?
Reply
Reply
post #893 of 2308
5/20/08 at 12:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

Perhaps I am ignorant. What kind of video processing do you want for 1080p from GeForce 9600 GT? I hardly see reasons why the video signal from the GeForce card must be processed by the receiver.

What else that defeats the "whole purpose" of AV receiver? Tons?

One of the primary purposes of the AVR is to be an audio and video switch. That way I can have one cable to my TV and have all the other cables running into the AVR.

It allows me to upconvert the component input from my Wii and send it out the HDMI cable to the TV.

That said, I have 4 HDMI inputs and only 1 in use. I can use 2 if need be and still have 2 left over.
Reply
Reply
post #894 of 2308
5/20/08 at 12:43pm
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cybrsage View Post

One of the primary purposes of the AVR is to be an audio and video switch. That way I can have one cable to my TV and have all the other cables running into the AVR.

It allows me to upconvert the component input from my Wii and send it out the HDMI cable to the TV.

Well actually pressing only another button is necessary to switch the video signal. Yeah, it's a kind of ugly and inconvenient for some people and may be a good reason for dismissing this otherwise excellent solution ... (Edited: use a universal remote )

Video signals from all the other sources can be processed by the receiver. My question is what process by the receiver is critical for 1080p from the GeForce card.


LL
Reply
Reply
post #895 of 2308
5/20/08 at 12:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeSM View Post

I would be surprised (though happy) if this were true. Did he test it? I have never seen anyone claim the MCP72 had that capability in it before, nor has nvidia marketed that. It will be interesting to see someone get one and try and make it work.

They're all the same silicon, NVIDIA isn't going to tape out an IGP that's slightly different. That defeats the purpose; NVIDIA's strategy is to have an IGP in all chipsets for a baseline of video performance right out of the box. Using a replicable IGP core that can be 'carbon copied' from one chipset to another is the only logical way. So if the GeForce 8200 supports 8-channel audio, so would the other chipsets that use the same IGP silicon.

Also I've never seen NVIDIA make any claims about any IGP with regards to 8-channel support over HDMI. It's always been reviewers with early samples, etc.
Reply
Reply
post #896 of 2308
5/20/08 at 12:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by cybrsage View Post

This 750/780, 8200/8300, 780G crap is making my head spin.

I am lost...

The GeForce 8200 and 8300 are the tradtional lower-end and/or Media Center PC oriented platforms. One PCIe x16 slot, no SLI.

The nForce 780a, 750a are numbered (and named) to stay in line with NVIDIA's already established discrete chipsets. The difference is that now NVIDIA has decided to integrate an IGP into all chipsets. However, these 780/750a are aimed at the same market segment that the previous nForce were: people with dedicated graphics cards and with the ability to go SLI, etc.

The 780G is an ATI/AMD chipset and not related to the NVIDIA products, though annoyingly both AMD and NVIDIA now have product names that sound almost exactly the same, making it critical to be sure you get the same exactly right when discussing things.
Reply
Reply
post #897 of 2308
5/20/08 at 12:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpHeRe31459 View Post

The GeForce 8200 and 8300 are the tradtional lower-end and/or Media Center PC oriented platforms. One PCIe x16 slot, no SLI.

The nForce 780a, 750a are numbered (and named) to stay in line with NVIDIA's already established discrete chipsets. The difference is that now NVIDIA has decided to integrate an IGP into all chipsets. However, these 780/750a are aimed at the same market segment that the previous nForce were: people with dedicated graphics cards and with the ability to go SLI, etc.

The 780G is an ATI/AMD chipset and not related to the NVIDIA products, though annoyingly both AMD and NVIDIA now have product names that sound almost exactly the same, making it critical to be sure you get the same exactly right when discussing things.

So what's the conclusion ??? Which one is better for HTPC purpose ?
Reply
Reply
post #898 of 2308
5/20/08 at 1:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by ajamils View Post

So what's the conclusion ??? Which one is better for HTPC purpose ?

OK, so the nForce versions are going to be full ATX motherboards with extra slots for SLI, etc. HDMI ports may be skipped on these due to the emphasis on the integrated video being secondary to the uses normal power users have.

The 8200 is going to more simple designs and typically microATX and will tend to have HDMI ports given their target segment.

In theory though the IGP is the same so any of the chipsets should work the same for HTPC uses.
Reply
Reply
post #899 of 2308
5/20/08 at 1:39pm
I'm going to purchase another Geforce 8200/8300 with a 9800GTX to replace my aging P965/8800 GTX combo really soon.

Unless of course the 9900GTX comes out soon...
Reply
Reply
post #900 of 2308
5/20/08 at 1:52pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

Well actually pressing only another button is necessary to switch the video signal.

Press another button? I'd imagine most HTPC users have a universal remote. Actually, there's the argument NOT to use your AVR for 1080p sources. There's the school of thought that the least amount of processing the better, especially for a 1080p/24 source. A good quality AVR will pass the source unmolested through, added processing is the last thing you want on pristine source material. I merely use it because I only have 1 hdmi input on my display and I want HD audio via hdmi.
Reply
Reply
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Home Theater Computers

AVS Top Picks

AVS › AVS Forum › Video Components › Home Theater Computers › GeForce 8200 - 8 Channel LPCM Output Fully Supported!!