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Yamaha 661 or 663 - TrueHD ?

post #1 of 23
2/22/08 at 12:36pm
Thread Starter 
I'm trying to decide if I should return my Yamaha 661 and wait for the 663. My system consists of the 661, klipsch synergy F3, C2, S2, and a 12 inch sub. I have a PS3 that I use for a BluRay player. Will I really be able to tell a difference with the TrueHd produced by the 663 or is there really that much difference?

Please let me know I only have a few days to return the 661. Thanks in advance for any help.
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post #2 of 23
2/22/08 at 12:54pm
The PS3 will have to send TrueHD as PCM with either receiver, it can't send a bitstream for the 663 to decode. Keep the 661 unless you like the other features the 663 offers (mainly HDMI transcoding).
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post #3 of 23
2/22/08 at 1:01pm
Thread Starter 
I'm sorry for being stupid but what is HDMI transcoding?
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post #4 of 23
2/22/08 at 1:03pm
Thread Starter 
Also does that mean if I set the PS3 up to output as PCM instead of bitstream I'm getting TrueHD with the 661?
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post #5 of 23
2/22/08 at 1:08pm
Quote:


I'm sorry for being stupid but what is HDMI transcoding?

Not stupid at all. It means it will take all the analog video inputs (composite, S-, component) and output them over a single HDMI cable to your display. The 661 can't send anything other than HDMI inputs out over HDMI. This is just a convenience feature.

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Also does that mean if I set the PS3 up to output as PCM instead of bitstream I'm getting TrueHD with the 661?

Yup! Not sure of the exact settings, but the PS3 does the decoding for you for full lossless audio.
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post #6 of 23
2/22/08 at 1:18pm
The 663 also has an improved night mode(Dynamic DRC). However, that is only useful if you have a wife and kids!
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post #7 of 23
2/22/08 at 1:26pm
Keep the 661 unless you need HDMI upconversion (transcoding.)

As far as I know the 663 should support TrueHD from your PS3 if you connect it up with an HDMI cable and select PCM output.
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post #8 of 23
2/22/08 at 1:30pm
Thread Starter 
Thanks so much for your help everyone I really appreciate your quick responses. I think I will just keep the 661 as it's already set up.
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post #9 of 23
2/22/08 at 3:41pm
I was looking at this thread in terms of a 661 versus 663 argument, and it appears that the 661 is probably still a better way to go for PS3 users. But.... and this is a big but...


But, ... what if the PS3 never gets DTS-MA abilities? Then, you would never be able to hear DTS-MA if you have a Yamaha 661. But if you had the 663, you could always buy another Blu Ray player that can send the info to the 663, and then the 663 could process the DTS-MA HD right? Or am I missing something?

Cause otherwise, the 661 appears to be the better value.
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post #10 of 23
2/22/08 at 3:58pm
100% true statement Anthony.

The manufacturers/Blu-ray association/film industry haven't done us consumers a bit of good by these actions -
* Making DTS-HD Master Audio optional (I think even core support may be optional)
* In spite of DTS-HD being optional, putting out discs where it's your only option for lossless audio

You can make them all happy and vindicate their decision making by spending more money on gear
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post #11 of 23
2/22/08 at 4:09pm
If you can still return your 661, there is no point keeping it knowing there a better 663 at the same price coming a few weeks.
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post #12 of 23
2/22/08 at 4:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony1 View Post


Cause otherwise, the 661 appears to be the better value.

Not sure I'd go so far as to call it a better "value" since I've not seen a lower price than has been quoted on the 663 and it doesn't seem to have any performance advantages.
Now, if they started blowing 'em out soon that'd be another story...
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post #13 of 23
2/22/08 at 6:13pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Gilvey View Post

Not sure I'd go so far as to call it a better "value" since I've not seen a lower price than has been quoted on the 663 and it doesn't seem to have any performance advantages.
Now, if they started blowing 'em out soon that'd be another story...

But the 663 only has two optical inputs, which I think is pretty dumb. Doesn't the 661 have three opticals? I don't have much of anything with a digital coaxial output, but I have tons of stuff with optical output.

Do both receivers have the same number of HDMI inputs?

Also, I think the 661 can be found for $50 cheaper than what people are getting the 663. Although $50 isn't that big of a deal.
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post #14 of 23
2/22/08 at 6:36pm
Dang - I'm currently in the same boat. OK, I'm in AVR hell experiencing severe angst. Can anyone tell me exactly when the V663 is going to start shipping? I could absolutely care less about transcoding. Sources are Comcast HD via HDMI at 1080i - if you can call most of the upconverted/compressed crap they pump through your coax "high definition", PS3 via HDMI and a Toshiba A30. It is no big deal to run the Comcast HD DVR/cablebox through component & optical digital out since you're not going to get anything other than 1080i and 5.1 best case scenario. That leaves me HDMI for the two true 1080p sources available (display is a Sony KDS 55-A2000). I thought long & hard about the Onkyo 605/705/805 but the heat & size issues aren't going to work in my scenario (dang TV stand only allows me 7.5" of total room for the AVR and it better not be cooking anything at 125 degrees F from what I've read on the Onkyo threads). I'm following the axiom of "blow most of your money on speakers" and springing for a SVS Sound SBS-01 7.1 setup. I have no clue where I'm going to put that sub nor what it's own zip code will end up being . Nor do I care - as a bassist, there's no choice for me but to have a solid bottom end (girlfriend, bass, etc.) Sorry for the novel - appreciate any feedback!
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post #15 of 23
2/22/08 at 7:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by volsfan0911 View Post

Dang - I'm currently in the same boat. OK, I'm in AVR hell experiencing severe angst. Can anyone tell me exactly when the V663 is going to start shipping? I could absolutely care less about transcoding. Sources are Comcast HD via HDMI at 1080i - if you can call most of the upconverted/compressed crap they pump through your coax "high definition", PS3 via HDMI and a Toshiba A30. It is no big deal to run the Comcast HD DVR/cablebox through component & optical digital out since you're not going to get anything other than 1080i and 5.1 best case scenario. That leaves me HDMI for the two true 1080p sources available (display is a Sony KDS 55-A2000). I thought long & hard about the Onkyo 605/705/805 but the heat & size issues aren't going to work in my scenario (dang TV stand only allows me 7.5" of total room for the AVR and it better not be cooking anything at 125 degrees F from what I've read on the Onkyo threads). I'm following the axiom of "blow most of your money on speakers" and springing for a SVS Sound SBS-01 7.1 setup. I have no clue where I'm going to put that sub nor what it's own zip code will end up being . Nor do I care - as a bassist, there's no choice for me but to have a solid bottom end (girlfriend, bass, etc.) Sorry for the novel - appreciate any feedback!

I would spend most of the money on speakers too. You should try to find used speakers on Craigslist or Ebay, you can save a fortune when buying used speakers as long as they are still working fine. Find some speakers that are 7 to 10 years old, but were top of the line when purchased, and you can get them for at least half off their original retail prices.

As for the receiver, the 661 runs hot too, so I would expect the 663 to run hot as well. It seems that if you aren't going with a digital path receiver, then you have to be concerned with heat. Those little computer type fans that people talk about are the way to go. Right now I have a Panny XR-55 which is digital path, so no heat problems whatsoever, but when I get either a 805, or maybe a 663 or 661, I'm going to have to get some fans for it. That's just the way it goes.
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post #16 of 23
2/22/08 at 8:57pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony1 View Post

But the 663 only has two optical inputs, which I think is pretty dumb. Doesn't the 661 have three opticals? I don't have much of anything with a digital coaxial output, but I have tons of stuff with optical output.

I don't think I've ever owned an A/V component that had optical S/PDIF but not coaxial....
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post #17 of 23
2/22/08 at 9:56pm
Thread Starter 
I picked up my 661 for $400.00 new so I think I got a pretty good deal. The dealer I purchased the 661 from told me to expect to pay around $150.00 more for the 663. I guess with everything I've heard it probably isn't worth taking it back, waiting a couple weeks, and paying $150.00 more for a few features I won't use.

Anthony1 what is DTS-MA, and why wouldn't the PS3 get it? Is this differen't then TrueHD? Sorry I'm just trying to grasp all these terms. Last time I bought a system it was Dolby Digital 5.1 and that was it, and before that it was Dolby Pro Logic.
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post #18 of 23
2/23/08 at 4:08am
Quote:


But the 663 only has two optical inputs, which I think is pretty dumb. Doesn't the 661 have three opticals?

If your main source are optical, I think there are receivers with more than either of these. I admit I hadn't considered the extra optical in my "performance advantages" statement. It does have three, actually, if you count the one on the front. The 661 has four total.

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Do both receivers have the same number of HDMI inputs?

Yes...HDMI would be the main reason to upgrade to either.

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Also, I think the 661 can be found for $50 cheaper than what people are getting the 663. Although $50 isn't that big of a deal.

Agreed.

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Can anyone tell me exactly when the V663 is going to start shipping?

No.

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I'm following the axiom of "blow most of your money on speakers" and springing for a SVS Sound SBS-01 7.1 setup.

Awesome!

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I picked up my 661 for $400.00 new so I think I got a pretty good deal. The dealer I purchased the 661 from told me to expect to pay around $150.00 more for the 663.

You should both check out this thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=995796
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post #19 of 23
2/23/08 at 7:00pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DonoMan View Post

I don't think I've ever owned an A/V component that had optical S/PDIF but not coaxial....

I've owned quite a few:

Playstation 2 - no coaxial

Xbox 1 - no coaxial

Xbox 360 - no coaxial

Playstation 3 - no coaxial

Panasonic RP56 DVD player - no coaxial

Mitsubishi SR-HD5 Direct TV HDTV set top box - no coaxial

RCA DTC-100 Direct TV HDTV set top box - no coaxial


Those are just a few I could think of off the top of my head. All have optical but no coaxial. The PS3 does have HDMI as an option, and depending on which version of the Xbox 360 you get, you can also get that with HDMI as an option.
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post #20 of 23
2/23/08 at 7:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony1 View Post

But, ... what if the PS3 never gets DTS-MA abilities? Then, you would never be able to hear DTS-MA if you have a Yamaha 661.

Actually, all you would need is a player that internally decodes DTS HD MA and sends over HDMI as MPCM. Like the BD50 that will be out shortly.
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post #21 of 23
2/25/08 at 8:19am
Most devices these days don't have both coax and optical, usually only optical.
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post #22 of 23
2/25/08 at 8:40am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JOHNnDENVER View Post

Most video game consoles these days don't have both coax and optical, usually only optical.

fixed
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post #23 of 23
2/25/08 at 8:48am
Quote:
Originally Posted by walkerwde View Post

I picked up my 661 for $400.00 new so I think I got a pretty good deal.

You should really, really, really call JR.com if you think that was a great deal!
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