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The Official Pioneer 9G non-Elite KURO Owner's Discussion Thread

2M views 15K replies 2K participants last post by  John Hooper 
#1 ·
#12,021 ·
KCinWhitby said:
Quote:
I have no idea what you are seeing. I tend to agree that it is not simply image retention. I hate to say it but you probably know why the TV was returned in the first place.


If you have time before your expriy date to return it, try that running the Video Pattern a few times and see if it makes it better. Run that break in DVD for a few days too to see. But if I were you I'd return it. I understand you may not find another one but I would never accept something that flawed.

Of all the reply’s I got, this one is the most useful. I returned the TV yesterday... actually I exchanged it for a new in the box 5020! (Totally worth the $300 difference for the peace of mind!)


It will be at the store for me to pick up on Wednesday! Can't wait!!!!





I have some questions regarding the new TV. If these questions have all been answered before please direct me to the appropriate thread/page.


1) As soon as I get the TV I will be running Evangelo2's Break-in DVD for the recommended 150 hours. I think I downloaded and burned the disc properly, but just to make sure: all it is is a screen alternating between solid white and a solid color (i.e. white, pink, white, blue, white, green, etc.) [The white screens last longer than the color screens.] And that just loops indefinitely . Does that sound right?


2) I then want to get the "Movie" setting whites on the TV to true white (not yellow), I believe this is what you all call adjusting the “grayscale”. Is “ControlCal” the way to do this without hiring someone to do a professional calibration? I have seen D-Nice’s recommended settings with ControlCal, but I don’t know what that means. How do I get ControlCal? I imagine it being downloaded software, and some inexpensive hardware. Is that right? Is there anywhere that gives step by step instructions on how to acquire and use ControlCal?


2b) In addition to getting the whites right, will ControlCal also make the colors more accurate to ISF specifications?


2c) What do the D-Nice "Service Menu" settings below do? Make the whites right? Make the colors right? Both?

Quote:
R-High: -13

G-High: 0

B-High: +49

R-Low: 0

G-Low: 0

B-Low: 0

3) Finally, at the risk of opening a can of worms, I'd like to leave my Pioneer set to “Advance” PC mode as a ‘set-it-and-forget-it’ mode. What are the implications for ControlCal calibration? I want my TV to be calibrated beautifully regardless of whether it is running at 60 or 72 Hz. Can I do it with ControlCal?



I know that most of this has been discussed already over the last year or two so again, I welcome references to other threads/page numbers if it would be redundant to type these answers again.




Thank you all for your past and future feedback!


Maglor
 
#12,022 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by CircaKuro /forum/post/16849390


But, why is it that watching blue ray content never had any of those problem? Is it just when the TV tries to upconvert?

I don't know, but it is clear that sparkles are associated with poor digital signals, and that the HDMI connections are very touchy. There is even a short female to male HDMI cable that is used to overcome bad connections caused by stiff cables. That's why I replace all my cables with inexpensive thin flexible ones. Short runs make that possible.
 
#12,023 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by CircaKuro /forum/post/16849390


Thanks for your reply, htwaits. I don't have another HDMI cable sitting around, but I did try another port (now it's on input 5, before was on input 4) After about 30 minutes of going through PS3 XMB and some tasks that normally would produce flashing pixels, I don't see any. So, it seems that the flashing pixels are gone.


But, why is it that watching blue ray content never had any of those problem? Is it just when the TV tries to upconvert?


I will report back when I have another HDMI cable to try on the same port.


Thank you.

Sounds to me that the cable or connector may not have been making the best connection in input 4 since it seems to be working fine in input 5. I'd suggest moving the cable back to 4 just to see if the problem went away. Also, move the connector in and out a few times to help clean both parts of the connection.
 
#12,024 ·
i'm not a part of these ongoing discussions and i'm not going to read every page of this thread to catch up, i just wanted to chime in with one tangential note:


i just bought a krp-500m after years of refusing to own anything but tube TV's because of my obsession with quality black levels/contrast. i was making the switch from a calibrated sony xbr960, which was not unlike watching everything on a studio monitor.


i just wanted to say that this is my first plasma, this is my first pioneer display, and this is obviously my first kuro, and after a few days of watching it with d-nice's settings, holy crap, are these things everything they're cracked up to be and more. i've never seen a more accurate, exact, transparent-to-the-source display. the picture on this thing just blows my f'ing mind every time i turn it on, and i have no idea how anyone will produce a display even on par with these things anytime in the near future. we should all be thankful we got in on this before they ran out. i know i am.
 
#12,025 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrGonk /forum/post/16850742


i just bought a krp-500m after years of refusing to own anything but tube TV's because of my obsession with quality black levels/contrast.


~


i just wanted to say that this is my first plasma, this is my first pioneer display, and this is obviously my first kuro, and after a few days of watching it with d-nice's settings, holy crap, are these things everything they're cracked up to be and more. i've never seen a more accurate, exact, transparent-to-the-source display. the picture on this thing just blows my f'ing mind every time i turn it on, and i have no idea how anyone will produce a display even on par with these things anytime in the near future. we should all be thankful we got in on this before they ran out. i know i am.
 
#12,026 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrGonk /forum/post/16850742


i'm not a part of these ongoing discussions and i'm not going to read every page of this thread to catch up, i just wanted to chime in with one tangential note:


i just bought a krp-500m after years of refusing to own anything but tube TV's because of my obsession with quality black levels/contrast. i was making the switch from a calibrated sony xbr960, which was not unlike watching everything on a studio monitor.


i just wanted to say that this is my first plasma, this is my first pioneer display, and this is obviously my first kuro, and after a few days of watching it with d-nice's settings, holy crap, are these things everything they're cracked up to be and more. i've never seen a more accurate, exact, transparent-to-the-source display. the picture on this thing just blows my f'ing mind every time i turn it on, and i have no idea how anyone will produce a display even on par with these things anytime in the near future. we should all be thankful we got in on this before they ran out. i know i am.

I am a tube freak as well, but after a demo of a Kuro I knew I had to have that bad boy in my house. Congrats and enjoy.
 
#12,027 ·
Any help is appreciated - When I plug in any peripheral like a video camera or anything for audio/video only the video comes through. I have my other 2 inputs as optical digital and there isn't any problems with those, but I can't figure out why any sound won't come through the TV when I have something plugged into the side of the TV in Input 3. Again, the video is fine, its just the audio that is not coming out. Can anyone give me any advice as what could be the problem.
 
#12,028 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by NICRAMS /forum/post/16852432


Any help is appreciated - When I plug in any peripheral like a video camera or anything for audio/video only the video comes through. I have my other 2 inputs as optical digital and there isn't any problems with those, but I can't figure out why any sound won't come through the TV when I have something plugged into the side of the TV in Input 3. Again, the video is fine, its just the audio that is not coming out. Can anyone give me any advice as what could be the problem.

What Kuro do you have a monitor or TV? If you have a monitor is should have come with 2 speaker wire cables to hook up speakers of your choice. Can you elaborate more on your Kuro model? Someone should be able to help.
 
#12,030 ·

1) As soon as I get the TV I will be running Evangelo2's Break-in DVD for the recommended 150 hours. I think I downloaded and burned the disc properly, but just to make sure: all it is is a screen alternating between solid white and a solid color (i.e. white, pink, white, blue, white, green, etc.) [The white screens last longer than the color screens.] And that just loops indefinitely . Does that sound right?


2) I then want to get the "Movie" setting whites on the TV to true white (not yellow), I believe this is what you all call adjusting the grayscale. Is ControlCal the way to do this without hiring someone to do a professional calibration? I have seen D-Nice's recommended settings with ControlCal, but I don't know what that means. How do I get ControlCal? I imagine it being downloaded software, and some inexpensive hardware. Is that right? Is there anywhere that gives step by step instructions on how to acquire and use ControlCal?


2b) In addition to getting the whites right, will ControlCal also make the colors more accurate to ISF specifications?


2c) What do the D-Nice "Service Menu" settings below do? Make the whites right? Make the colors right? Both?




3) Finally, at the risk of opening a can of worms, I'd like to leave my Pioneer set to Advance PC mode as a set-it-and-forget-it' mode. What are the implications for ControlCal calibration? I want my TV to be calibrated beautifully regardless of whether it is running at 60 or 72 Hz. Can I do it with ControlCal?


I hope these answers help:


1) Sounds right but you may have to set your DVD player to keep replaying it. Mine did it on it's own.


2) ControlCal is used when inputting someone elses settings. It is also used for Professional Calibrations. D-NICE offsets are an estimate of where most of his calibrations ended up, and are an excellent way to get a better picture and save money on a professional calibration. Here is a link to how ot use ControlCal.

http://www.controlcal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=78


At the bottom of POST 2 is a WORD document I started for a more detailed step by step approach for people like me. It is for an older version and ControlCal has been updated since, but it will give you a good idea and TURBE will be able to run you through the rest.


2b) For myself, and it seems many others, ControlCal with D-Nice offsets really gave me whiter whites and it took the pinkish tint out of caucasion faces.


2c) See 2b and the step by step will explain it.


3) ControlCal can now calibrate 60hz and 72hz. I personally use Standard as my "set it and forget it" since advanced will try to give you 60hz for HD contant that is not 24fps, and 72hz for blu-ray (my understanding). I can't really tell the difference in motion flow but I have never really checked scenes to compare.


So you know I started with D-NICE offsets and they looked great. I kept feeling like I was missing something and a short time ago had mine professionally calibrated. It was more than worth it as it has given me an even better picture as well as fantastic spot on colors.


One thing that some people are doing and I think I should have done was to have two different modes calibrated. As an example you could have MOVIE mode calibrated for 72hz and Pure Cinema: Advanced. If you use one INPUT for your Blu-Ray player, you could set it and every time you change it over it is properly set up.


The other mode could be GAME mode with Pure Cinema: OFF. You could calibrate it to a higher temp setting instead of 6500 and get a picture that you may enjoy better for viewing cable television. I find most HD channels to be fantastic in MOVIE at 6500k but for Standard Definition, I prefer something a bit brighter (bluer)


Personally, I calibrated MOVIE in both 60hz and 72hz and I have not had a reason to get out of MOVIE except when viewing SPORTS. I use SPORT mode (which is very blue) for watching Hockey.


You probably won't fully understand ControlCal until you hook it up to your television and follow the instructions. It is really easy once you know how.


Good Luck
 
#12,031 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by maglor64 /forum/post/16849524


Here is a link to how ot use ControlCal.

http://www.controlcal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=78


At the bottom of POST 2 is a WORD document I started for a more detailed step by step approach for people like me. It is for an older version and ControlCal has been updated since, but it will give you a good idea and TURBE will be able to run you through the rest.


..................

One thing that some people are doing and I think I should have done was to have two different modes calibrated. As an example you could have MOVIE mode calibrated for 72hz and Pure Cinema: Advanced. If you use one INPUT for your Blu-Ray player, you could set it and every time you change it over it is properly set up.


The other mode could be GAME mode with Pure Cinema: OFF. You could calibrate it to a higher temp setting instead of 6500 and get a picture that you may enjoy better for viewing cable television. I find most HD channels to be fantastic in MOVIE at 6500k but for Standard Definition, I prefer something a bit brighter (bluer)


Personally, I calibrated MOVIE in both 60hz and 72hz and I have not had a reason to get out of MOVIE except when viewing SPORTS. I use SPORT mode (which is very blue) for watching Hockey.


You probably won't fully understand ControlCal until you hook it up to your television and follow the instructions. It is really easy once you know how.


Good Luck

Very helpful post KCinWhitby, links, instructions and all.



I would add that there is a pretty useful alternate way to approach the calibration of the Non-Elite's 2 Video Mode grayscales of 72Hz and 60Hz ( as opposed to the HDMI PC modes ). That would be to calibrate both refresh rates to 6500K but use different A/V modes as the basis of the calibration.

I describe that a little here .


What I like about that approach is it gives you very distinct looks for flexibility but both calibrated. Using the grayscale calibrated for Movie Mode will still leave with high temp "blue" settings on all your A/V modes.


Using a grayscale calibrated for Standard A/V mode on the other hand will bring the temperature down and much closer to accurate for all the other A/V modes.


A grayscale calibrated for Standard/Performance can also give you a significantly brighter mode than movie mode that is still calibrated. Personally with this setting I no longer feel I'm missing much from not having ISF modes like the Elite models.


For one set and forget mode though I agree, it has to be movie mode and it still looks quite good with almost any source content I can throw at it.
 
#12,032 ·
Had my 5020 calibrated on Friday by Doug Weil. Just wanted to say that I am totally stoked at his work. He is very thorough and was very patient with all my stupid questions. He comes highly recommended. His user name is DroptheRemote
 
#12,033 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by gtmorgan23 /forum/post/16857573


Had my 5020 calibrated on Friday by Doug Weil.

I've added your report to the flat panel(Post#2) list that's linked at the bottom of my post.


Does Doug Weil have a user name at AVS? If so, use the edit button to add it to your post.
 
#12,034 ·
I had Chad from hdtvbychadb.com calibrate my 6020 last Friday, and he did a great job! Plus, he got my audio to sound alot better. Do not look down upon calibrating a non-Elite, it is worth it. One thing I want to mention is the necessity of having backlighting. I purchased the Ideal Lume Pro from Cinemaquestinc.com, and it was worth every penny. Even if you go with a cheaper backlight from Cinemaquestinc.com, you can't go wrong. I used to think it was no big deal watching tv in the dark, but the backlighting really makes the picture look so much better. My father was impressed, and he usually doesn't pay much attention to the picture on a tv. Finally, I continue to use Purosol to clean my plasma and no problems at all.


Mark
 
#12,035 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by opensesame /forum/post/16858211


I had Chad from hdtvbychadb.com calibrate my 6020 last Friday, and he did a great job!

Thanks for your calibration report. I've included it in the flat panel (Post#2) list that's linked at the bottom of my post.
 
#12,036 ·
Thank you KCinWhitby and Dahlsim, including all the links, you have given me a treasure trove of information!



KCinWhitby:
Quote:
1) Sounds right but you may have to set your DVD player to keep replaying it. Mine did it on it's own.

My Ps3 also did it on it's own, but don't like that it is running harder that usual (fan). I may buy a cheap DVD player just to burn on the 150 Hr continuous break-in.

Quote:
2) ControlCal is used when inputting someone elses settings. It is also used for Professional Calibrations. D-NICE offsets are an estimate of where most of his calibrations ended up, and are an excellent way to get a better picture and save money on a professional calibration. Here is a link to how ot use ControlCal.

http://www.controlcal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=78


At the bottom of POST 2 is a WORD document I started for a more detailed step by step approach for people like me. It is for an older version and ControlCal has been updated since, but it will give you a good idea and TURBE will be able to run you through the rest.

The Word document you refer too looks very helpful, but again I want to calibrate my TV in "Advance" [no "d" at the end of this word] mode, not "Off". What exactly do I have to do different than the Word doc. to accomplish this?


Who is TURBE and when and how will he be 'running me through the rest?'






One proble I may have is that I don't own a laptop, and I don't think I'm willing to move my PC to the living room... that means I have to find a frien who will lend me a laptop right?



Anyhoo, thanks again, but right now my head is spinning, from info overload!






P.S. My TV arrives in 2 days!!!!!!!!
 
#12,037 ·
What do you guys use to clean your Kuro?


I am specifically looking for the same kind of micro fiber cloth that Pioneer provided with the set. I'm afraid to get any other micro-fiber cloth because of the potential the manufacturers might have chemicals in it to "help" you clean what you want to clean or the cloth might have a terrible texture that isn't viable for cleaning the TV.


I'm looking to have two or three micro-fiber cloths. I plan on using one and dipping it in distilled water, wringing it out, and cleaning the screen. The screen was in a warehouse for about a year so there is some what I believe gunk on the screen. I then plan on using the other cloths to dry the screen.


Anyone know of any good place to get cloths like the ones pioneer provides?
 
#12,039 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trojita /forum/post/16860032


What do you guys use to clean your Kuro?


I am specifically looking for the same kind of micro fiber cloth that Pioneer provided with the set. I'm afraid to get any other micro-fiber cloth because of the potential the manufacturers might have chemicals in it to "help" you clean what you want to clean or the cloth might have a terrible texture that isn't viable for cleaning the TV.


I'm looking to have two or three micro-fiber cloths. I plan on using one and dipping it in distilled water, wringing it out, and cleaning the screen. The screen was in a warehouse for about a year so there is some what I believe gunk on the screen. I then plan on using the other cloths to dry the screen.


Anyone know of any good place to get cloths like the ones pioneer provides?

you can check a local camera shop or a web store like photodon.com for good quality micro fiber cloths
 
#12,040 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by maglor64 /forum/post/16860104


Thought of something unrelated that I need to ask.


Does anyone have the dimensions for the Pio 5020 Box?


(i.e. Hight, Width, Depth.) I need it to fit in a mini van and I want to keep the box upright.

did you check online at pioneers website. i think they have the box dimensions as part of the documents or online sales brochures
 
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