Magnavox 557, 537, 535, 533, 515, 513, 2160A, 2160, 2080 & Philips 3576, 3575 - Page 54 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1591 of 27983 Old 09-04-2008, 11:09 AM - Thread Starter
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FYI: Added ANOTHER erroneous national review to that subject:

Channel numbers have to be entered manually.
Well, here's another one of those that makes you laugh, then cry! One reviewer on Sams Club website said: "One issue is in selecting a DTV channel, the quick timeout value means that you have to quickly enter the number, which is very hard to do one handed. I am not sure of why they don't allow the use of the up/down left/right buttons when watching the TV, such as to select the channel. I suspect that they could have reduced the buttons if they had planned it better." More observant users will probably notice, right away, that it has a long, dedicated rocker button with a "CH" between + and - symbols which should be obvious it has something to do with CHannels... like maybe scroll thru them up and down!? Oh, wait, I suppose some people COULD think the "CH" is for ordering "CHinese" food, but even then you'd think they'd just HAVE TO try the button and see if a takeout menu pops up on screen?
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post #1592 of 27983 Old 09-04-2008, 11:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GPZ4189 View Post

Just hooked my 3576 up this weekend. I was wondering if there's a way to delete some digital virtual channels without deleting the main channel itself?

I am using an OTA antenna and the digital auto scan finds channel 8.1, 8.2, 8.3 and 8.4. I want to delete 8.4 as it is nothing more that pictures and music. When I try to delete it, I lose all 8.1 - 8.3 as well.

I hope there is a way as some of the other channel also have connecting weather channels that I want to delete as well.

Thanks for the help. I'm sure I'll have more questions once I start playing with around a little more.

I've had the same problem, and suspect this may be an oversight where the design is concerned.

I tried to remove a "-04" channel myself, and also lost the other channels in its "family".

Apparently with the 3576 this just isn't possible.

Pretty odd, tho'. I have one of those digital-to-analog converter boxes, and I can delete any sub-channel I want.

Not with the fancy recorder tho'.
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post #1593 of 27983 Old 09-05-2008, 04:41 AM
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Hey wajo, I'm considering visiting my local Sam's Club to check out their stock of 3576 recorders.

Are there any build dates that I should look for? In other words, are the recorders built before or after a certain date been shown to be better than others?

Similarly, are there any serial numbers that have been shown to be better than others?

Thanks for your help.

RG
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post #1594 of 27983 Old 09-05-2008, 06:16 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rgazzara View Post

Hey wajo, I'm considering visiting my local Sam's Club to check out their stock of 3576 recorders.

Are there any build dates that I should look for? In other words, are the recorders built before or after a certain date been shown to be better than others?

Similarly, are there any serial numbers that have been shown to be better than others?

Thanks for your help.

Not with the 3576. I'd just look on the short end of the box for a "Pack Date" and get the newest one (assuming the 3576 box is marked the same way as the 3575).
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post #1595 of 27983 Old 09-05-2008, 07:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rammitinski View Post

No, neither. As far as the workings of those models, that was about the only thing that I really didn't like. It's not something you can't live with, but (especially being Chicago) we do have a ton of useless and redundant subchannels here (mirrors, ethnic, religious, way more weather ones than any human being could possibly ever need, etc.).

Yeah, if you are just using the units for recording and playback it's not really an issue at all since you can just use the keypad to directly input the channel in a timer event. If however you are using the units to view TV through their tuners -- to take advantage of the live buffer or use the unit as a DVR/STB for an old analog TV -- it becomes a pain to have to surf through a bunch of useless subchannels. Both my CECB's and my 2 TV's with digital tuners have selective channel editing which I use liberally. In the Philly area there is absolutely nothing of any interest to me on any of the sub-channels so I have them all blocked out. Perhaps that is what the quoted reviewer above was referring to; perhaps he was using the keypad to directly tune the major channels, in order to avoid surfing through the sub-channels, and thus his displeasure with the timeout length. His notion of using the L/R/U/D buttons for channel selection is rather intriguing: why not use the U/D buttons for transitioning between the major channels and the L/R buttons to navigate laterally between the subs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rammitinski View Post

I believe you can do that with the Panny recorders, though (damn, I wish they would just give in and put hard drives back in those things ).

I hear you, but that train has left the station and ripped up the tracks in it's wake.

- kelson h

The bitterness of poor quality lasts long after the sweetness of the low price is forgotten . . . life is too short to drink bad wine

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post #1596 of 27983 Old 09-05-2008, 07:46 AM
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Well if I get the 3576, it won't be to channel surf, so I'm not concerned.

I'm interested in the 3576 to record the digital QAM channels I get over Comcast cable. I use my Panasonic EZ28 now to record the WS digital programs (and it does a good job), but I am tired of having to change discs after every 2 hours, and it eliminates the possibility of recording these programs while I'm out of town.

I figure with the 3576 I can record these WS digital programs, while I record other analog programs on my Panasonic or Pioneer HDD recorders. I will miss the TVGOS that I have on my E-500, and the DVD-RAM dubbing on the Panasonic and Pioneer recorders, but I figure I can make do with DVD-RW instead.

-- Wajo, does the 3576 play nice with DVD-RW, or does it prefer DVD+RW? Is there any difference between the two? Thanks.

RG
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post #1597 of 27983 Old 09-05-2008, 08:11 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rgazzara View Post

-- Wajo, does the 3576 play nice with DVD-RW, or does it prefer DVD+RW? Is there any difference between the two? Thanks.

I use only DVD-RW. On first inserting a new DVD-RW, it formats it for the Philips +VR std then use as normal after that.

In fact, the 3576 can Finalize the -RW for playing in your other equipment, then it can be UNfinalized... pretty neat feature I use a LOT when I just want to delete a title or two (which needs an unfinalized disc), or make a high-speed Disc Backup on my Pio 640 (which needs a finalized disc).

I'm using Maxell 2X from Walmart, in the larger case, w/no problems so far after LOTS of tests... media code TDK502sakuM3.
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post #1598 of 27983 Old 09-05-2008, 09:53 AM - Thread Starter
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FYI: I've added this to the "Playback..." help file:

IF YOU HAVE LOTS OF TITLES ON A DVD DISC ON SEVERAL PAGES, you can move from page to page quickly by pressing left and right arrow buttons (right-arrow only on page 1, see below), rather than having to scroll up/dn as I did for awhile.

Left arrow on page 1 brings up a status screen showing:
  • Disc type.
  • Total Titles.
  • Disc Space Used.
  • Disc Protect status.
  • Finalize status.
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post #1599 of 27983 Old 09-05-2008, 09:53 AM
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Can a DVD (RW or R / blank or not) be left in the DVDR 3576 without hurting anything like the lasor/motor...etc.?
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post #1600 of 27983 Old 09-05-2008, 09:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gce View Post

Can a DVD (RW or R / blank or not) be left in the DVDR 3576 without hurting anything like the lasor/motor...etc.?

Shouldn't be a problem except maybe a little longer startup... not even sure about that, tho.

If it's a blank disc, every DVDR will test the disc and write a small amt of data to the inner test-data storage area as part of every "Loading" procedure. That space will eventually fill up, making the disc unrecordable, but that would take thousands of tests or machine start cycles. I'm not sure, but if someone wants to leave a disc in for other "special" reasons (like a 3455 users does to prevent a problem I don't remember), I'd use a Finalized disc (just a short test video on it) so the machine won't run the tests every time. Leaving a commercial movie in the tray would do the same.
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post #1601 of 27983 Old 09-05-2008, 10:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo View Post

I'm not sure, but if someone wants to leave a disc in for other "special" reasons (like a 3455 user does to prevent a problem I don't remember), I'd use a Finalized disc (just a short test video on it) so the machine won't run the tests every time.

Mainly what I do is dub a show on a RW from the HD so I can take it elsewhere for viewing. It's just kinda handy to already have the RW in n' ready to go.

But with a test going on every time I start up maybe I shouldn't be so lazy and just load one when I need it!

Thanks wajo!
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post #1602 of 27983 Old 09-05-2008, 10:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gce View Post

But with a test going on every time I start up maybe I shouldn't be so lazy and just load one when I need it!

The ONLY bad effect from a HDD recorder... we get LAZY... but then, that's my middle name!
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post #1603 of 27983 Old 09-05-2008, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gastrof View Post

Pretty odd, tho'. I have one of those digital-to-analog converter boxes, and I can delete any sub-channel I want.

Not with the fancy recorder tho'.

Unfortunately, just as they were with the later analog VCR's and DVD recorders, the tuners in these things are basically afterthoughts.

They're made in Asia where they are mostly concerned with eking out every last penny of profit they can.
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post #1604 of 27983 Old 09-05-2008, 02:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Heat/EMI/RF/MW Can Cause False Copy Protection and Other "Weird" Stuff!

If you suspect "false" CP or experience some other "weird" problems (even HDD failure), first check for sources of EMI, RF or MW (microwave) near your system, like an old CRT TV, plasma TV (esp. Panasonic), satellite receiver, or microwave oven, AND MOVE THEM OR THE DVDR! See if the problem clears up before investing lots of time on other troubleshooting. See examples below.

HEAT

One European Union (EU) user bought a Philips DVDR and had problems with stuttering and lockups after some moderate usage time. Turns out he crammed his unit into a narrow space, with NO air flow from the intake vents on the side of the unit to the fan on the back, which overheated the circuitry and HDD. He bought another unit and placed it on top of an old CRT, which cleared the old problem, but caused another problem: false copy protection (CP) from stray RF/EMI interference, as described in the next subject.

 

These DVDRs do NOT get hot from use, but they CAN be affected by outside heat sources, as described here.

Heat is the laser diode's worst enemy, and the HDD isn't too fond of it either and esp. doesn't like EMI! Many "odd" problems can occur if your DVDR gets too hot. This DVDR's intake air vents are on the top right side (facing unit), and the fan is on the back. Allow ample space for airflow.

 

  • Don't block right side or cram into narrow space.
  • Don't place unit on top of other hot components.
  • Don't use in a fully-enclosed entertainment center.
  • Don't place your DVDR on top of old CRT TV or even close... keep max. distance between them.


EMI, RF, MW


Since CP works by "disrupting" the video stream, and EMI and RF can do the same thing, some people might just be CP'ing themselves with stray EMI or RF, like our intrepid EU user mentioned above!?

He bought a 2nd new DVDR but, unfortunately, placed it on top of an old CRT TV which was apparently emitting strong electromagnetic interference (EMI). He was CP'ing himself! Click here for details on a test by orsetto that duplicated the stated problems when he placed a U.S. 3575 on top of an old CRT TV.

Even a Plasma TV can send EMI/RF signals throughout your house, as described in this thread on a ham radio operators forum where the OP tested it with his equipment... verrry interrresting discussion (and not too long)! The OP's tests showed that the Plasma TV didn't even have to be CLOSE to other equipment! Another ham operator says in that thread, in response to recommendations for moving or shielding the TV: "Are you kidding....I am trying to figure out how to hook an antenna to the screen and key it. I think it would out do my AL-1500. The big screen Plasma Panasonic TV is a prolific RF generator."

Here's another article on EMI/RFI (4th section up from bottom) with tests in 2010 on Panasonic Viera plasma HDTVs, with videos clearly showing lots of RFI from the TV. He even mentions COUNTRIES involved in getting rid of the RFI and Panasonic replacing TVs for excessive RFI.

In another instance, a U.S. 2160 user had some weird problems that couldn't be explained or remedied by all normal troubleshooting. In working the problem, he happened to move his DirecTV R10 receiver from on top of the 2160, which cleared all his prior problems, as he explains here.

One person reported losing a weak TV channel 12 from interference caused by a pair of amplified speakers.

One user set a DVDR on top of his MICROWAVE oven and the HDD was rendered useless... wiped drive, couldn't reformat, unrecoverable... had to order a new HDD.

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post #1605 of 27983 Old 09-05-2008, 09:57 PM - Thread Starter
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One difference between the 3575/3576 and the H2160 cropped up...

When the 2160's Progressive Scan in ON in the Video menu, NO VIDEO will be output via the Video or S-Video outputs.

To use Composite or S-Video output from the 2160, set Progressive Scan Off in the Video menu... HDMI doesn't need it anyway since IT sends its own formats under a separate control/button. If you ALSO want to use Component output, in addition to Composite or S-Video, you'll get an interlaced Component signal to the TV with the Progressive set to OFF.

In this regard, the 3575/3576 sends the interlaced video signal thru its Composite and S-Video outputs regardless of the Progressive setting, as described in this "Settings..." help file.
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post #1606 of 27983 Old 09-05-2008, 10:54 PM
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I've tried several times to record a program from my Philips 3576H to a DVD and it will play on the Philips as well as my computer but I can't seem to get the recorded DVD tp play on my Optoma DV 10, Home Cinema projector. The sound plays on the projector but no video. The projector has a built in DVD player.
I've used DVD+R, DVD+RW and most recently a Maxell DVD-RW with the same result.
Does any kind soul have any idea what I might do to fix this?

Stressbox
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post #1607 of 27983 Old 09-05-2008, 10:56 PM - Thread Starter
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What rec mode... some players don't like 1-hr-HQ?

All -R/+R/-RW DVDs Finalized, of course?

Also, did you play with the DVD player OUTPUT settings?
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post #1608 of 27983 Old 09-06-2008, 10:29 AM
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wajo

Thanks for the reply.
Yes I did finalize all except the DVD+RW which the manual says doesn't require finalizing. I don't think the 3546 allows you to finalize that type.
I recorded the Maxell in HQ mode.
Not sure what you mean by the "outputs" of the DVD player which is built into the DV10. I did play with the set up menu with formats but couldn't seem to fix the problem. It's odd that the sound plays while the video doesn't. I used to have a Panasonic DVD recorder which produced disks which worked on the DV10.
On my first attempt to record on the Philips had a long movie on the HDD which didn't allow HQ recording so it was recorded in real time. That didn't work either.
Would hate to have to buy another projector--there aren't many with the convenient built in DVD player and speakers.
stressbox
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post #1609 of 27983 Old 09-06-2008, 10:44 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stressbox View Post

wajo

Thanks for the reply.
Yes I did finalize all except the DVD+RW which the manual says doesn't require finalizing. I don't think the 3546 allows you to finalize that type.
I recorded the Maxell in HQ mode.
Not sure what you mean by the "outputs" of the DVD player which is built into the DV10. I did play with the set up menu with formats but couldn't seem to fix the problem. It's odd that the sound plays while the video doesn't. I used to have a Panasonic DVD recorder which produced disks which worked on the DV10.
On my first attempt to record on the Philips had a long movie on the HDD which didn't allow HQ recording so it was recorded in real time. That didn't work either.
Would hate to have to buy another projector--there aren't many with the convenient built in DVD player and speakers.
stressbox

I've read of some DVD players that apparently don't like the high bit-rate of 1-HR-HQ or XP and, since yours plays the audio, which is no big task, it really sounded to me like it just didn't like the densely packed video data.

You apparently tried a dub recorded in something other than HQ, so that proves it's NOT the densely packed HQ data on the disc.

First thing I'd do is check the media ID with your DVDR's disc utility, using SKIP-1-2-3 as described at the bottom of this page. That'll eliminate "bad media" maybe.

You could try several short, manual, test recordings to a -RW disc at several diff. rec modes, with Chapter Marking OFF, some on digital WS channel with 16:9 Wide setting in Video menu and others on analog channel with 4:3 LB setting. After Finalizing, try to play all titles in the DV10 (hopefully it has a title skip button or such in case you don't see video?). That might provide a clue as to which, if any, of those recorder settings the DV10 might not "like"???

My comment on the player's setup menus comes from reading a review of the DV10 and it mentioned it comes with factory settings for projector portion and separate settings for DVD playback... thinking there might be something there? Here's the ProjectorCentral review section on that:

"The DVD player's Setup menu has its own set of basic image adjustments (brightness, contrast, color, tint, sharpness) that are factory optimized for the projector, in addition to the adjustments in the projector menu. However, some users may have their own preference for DVD playback that differs from their preferences for other sources, so Optoma left the option open to adjust the DVD player's output settings as well."
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post #1610 of 27983 Old 09-06-2008, 01:44 PM
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Is it possible to combine 2 titles together? I see the option to divide them but I'd like to put them back together without re-dubbing.
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post #1611 of 27983 Old 09-06-2008, 01:49 PM - Thread Starter
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post #1612 of 27983 Old 09-06-2008, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wajo View Post

I've read of some DVD players that apparently don't like the high bit-rate of 1-HR-HQ or XP and, since yours plays the audio, which is no big task, it really sounded to me like it just didn't like the densely packed video data.

You apparently tried a dub recorded in something other than HQ, so that proves it's NOT the densely packed HQ data on the disc.

First thing I'd do is check the media ID with your DVDR's disc utility, using SKIP-1-2-3 as described at the bottom of this page. That'll eliminate "bad media" maybe.

You could try several short, manual, test recordings to a -RW disc at several diff. rec modes, with Chapter Marking OFF, some on digital WS channel with 16:9 Wide setting in Video menu and others on analog channel with 4:3 LB setting. After Finalizing, try to play all titles in the DV10 (hopefully it has a title skip button or such in case you don't see video?). That might provide a clue as to which, if any, of those recorder settings the DV10 might not "like"???

My comment on the player's setup menus comes from reading a review of the DV10 and it mentioned it comes with factory settings for projector portion and separate settings for DVD playback... thinking there might be something there? Here's the ProjectorCentral review section on that:

"The DVD player's Setup menu has its own set of basic image adjustments (brightness, contrast, color, tint, sharpness) that are factory optimized for the projector, in addition to the adjustments in the projector menu. However, some users may have their own preference for DVD playback that differs from their preferences for other sources, so Optoma left the option open to adjust the DVD player's output settings as well."

wajo I used a Maxell DVD-RW and dubbed a short recording of a movie in each of the modes SPP, LP and EP and finalized. Also used a TDK DVD+RW in LP not finalized.
They all played sound on the DV 10 but no video. I tried 16:9, 4:3 and LBX; also set the projector on NTSC, PAL and Auto. Doesn't help. Just in case my projector was not working right I put a commercial DVD in it and it worked fine. A bit frustrating.
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post #1613 of 27983 Old 09-06-2008, 05:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stressbox View Post

wajo I used a Maxell DVD-RW and dubbed a short recording of a movie in each of the modes SPP, LP and EP and finalized. Also used a TDK DVD+RW in LP not finalized.
They all played sound on the DV 10 but no video. I tried 16:9, 4:3 and LBX; also set the projector on NTSC, PAL and Auto. Doesn't help. Just in case my projector was not working right I put a commercial DVD in it and it worked fine. A bit frustrating.
Stressbox

More than a bit... very strange!

Dumb question... the DVDs do play video in the Philips?

If you can spare a -R disc, at least give that a try since now we're grasping at straws? Maybe also record a short segment directly to a -RW rather than dub to eliminate the dub process as the culprit?
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post #1614 of 27983 Old 09-06-2008, 05:36 PM
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Maybe try a DVD+R disc too...
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post #1615 of 27983 Old 09-06-2008, 06:05 PM
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Yes , the Philips does play the recorded discs as well as commercial discs.
I'll try the other ideas and see,
Thanks.
Stressbox
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post #1616 of 27983 Old 09-06-2008, 07:11 PM
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Just recorded a part of the ballgame direct to a Sony DVD-R and finalized it. It doesn't play on the DV 10 -- and there is no sound.
I tried it on the computer and it plays fine.
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post #1617 of 27983 Old 09-06-2008, 08:23 PM - Thread Starter
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This one's a SWAG (Scientific Wild Ass Guess):

Your comment that the -R "didn't play" jogged a cog and I'm wondering if the DV10 has a setting like the 3576 does for "Parental Lock" or similar. With that lock, a DVD isn't supposed to play.

Normally, discs have to be "set" with lock level codes the player can respond to, but I'm wondering if the DV10 might be accidentally set for some sort of "lock" or "V-chip" feature, which all the other discs that work didn't have, of course, but it does see something in the disc from the 3576 it interprets as a "lock." If it did have a lock or V-chip set, turning that OFF is the ticket.
* * * * ** * * * * *

Failing that, one thing that might be interesting to try.

There's a SKIP code that does a "Manufacturer's Adjustment" for -R and +R discs. I've run it several times and it appears to be "harmless" but it just might do something for your situation. I can't guarantee anything but my tests showed no apparent harm to MY DVDR.

AFAIK, I'm the only one who's used this procedure on a 3575.

If you want to try it, the simple procedure is here, SKIP-9-8-7.

On your 3576, if anything looks different than as described in the procedure, I wouldn't proceed... should be the same for a 3575 or 3576, tho.
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post #1618 of 27983 Old 09-06-2008, 09:39 PM
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Have to say you're never at a loss for ideas. Checked the set up menu of the DV 10 and it has a "rating" setting and it is set at "view all" -- the alternatives are not "clickable".

I'll try the skip thing but I'm out of plus discs so I'll have to borrow one from my neighbor. When doing this do you press" "skip" and the numbers in order or do you have dashes in between? Then press "ok"?
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post #1619 of 27983 Old 09-06-2008, 10:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Just the SKIP then each number in "rapid" sequence, no OK.

Assuming that proceeds normally, then dub something to one of the discs, Finalize and try again.
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post #1620 of 27983 Old 09-07-2008, 09:11 AM
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Well, I made the trip to Sam's Club and picked up the 3576. It has a May 19, 2008 build date.

Here is the "skip 123" info:

Model name: E2H40UD
DTV-S version: 0x90
FE Version: R40_026_000
BE Version: HD4P3374EH1E
TT Version" T4015RDU
DV Unique ID: 00903E4C 53E26945
LD Adjustment: OK
Disc Adjustment: OK

Right off the bat, after I hooked it up in my system, I had problems. After a channel scan, with it set for cable analog and digital, it failed to pick up most of the QAM digital channels that I can get on my Mits TV and my Panasonic EZ28 DVD recorder. I have Comcast extended basic cable, and both my Mits TV and my Panasonic EZ28 pick up a slew of local and cable only digital channels.

OK, since I had the signal split, but with with an in-line signal amplifier, I figured that the signal strength might be to low for the Philips to pick up the digital channels. So I reconfigured the hook up and took the splitter out of the circuit. I connected the Philips first after the signal amp, and the Mits TV after the Philips. This should give the Philips the highest possible signal strength.

Short answer -- the philips still did not pick up more than a couple of digital channels. In fact it did not pick up channels that it did after the first channel scan.

OK, any ideas out there? It looks that the digital tuner on this Philips is defective. The question is whether the digital tuner in THIS recorder is defective, or whether it is faulty on the entire recorder line.

The way I see it, I have 2 choices: (1) return the recorder as defective and get a replacement, or (2) give up on the philips and return the recorder for a refund.

Do I have a chance of getting a recorder with a functional digital tuner if I opt for a replacement, or is this a hopeless task and I should just get my money back?

What say ye?

Thanks.

RG
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