Magnavox 557, 537, 535, 533, 515, 513, 2160A, 2160, 2080 & Philips 3576, 3575 - Page 934 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #27991 of 28014 Old 11-02-2019, 11:12 PM
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Its very interesting people keep discovering these old recorders as late as 2019.

Some perspective though.

Verbatim just sold all its DVD and Blu-ray assets to CMC and CMC is practically the "last" maker of any DVD media in the world now. All of the brands are belong to them. Re-labeling the same media under the old brand names to sell the same media at different price tiers is common practice now. The legacy media being cleaned out at Newegg and through eBay will not last more than a few years.. and then its all gone. Except whatever CMS produces for the PC market. Even Blu-ray is on the way out.. its just too darned small for todays data.

I've been thinking long and hard and it looks like near term HDD will be the bridge media until something else comes along.. and it generally doesn't do well sitting static on a shelf. You have to turn it over.. or copy it from one drive to another.. like we used to do with tapes.. grandfather son style. People don't like to do that.. they want a magical unicorn to keep all their data safe.. with promises they will last 100 years.. even though that has been thoroughly debunked over and over again. Its more like less than 10 years.. likely less than 5 even under optimum conditions.. but people never do a thorough inventory. With error correction however even a rotted DVD can still playback.. and it will degrade slower than VHS tape overall.

Something else to watch out for is Electrolytic caps in the power supplies were never projected to last longer than 5-7 years tops.. so even in the relatively new Magnavox's their expiration date is fast approaching.. then their power supplies will need to be re-built or re-capped.. or the units will be dead. We've a lot of experience with this in other brands. And its unrelated to the big "Cap Scandal" of 2004-2005.. caps simply wear out.. even (and especially) sitting on a shelf unused.. or in the back of the closet. Its their nature. Un-powered they de-polarize.. or forget their polarity and pop when they are re-energized after a long slumber.

And not to get all doomy and gloomy here.. but when the media goes single source and the drive makers exit the market.. the time is ripe for the format to be retired. All that burned media on DVDs will become unreadable if the Optical drives are no longer made.. as unreadable as a VHS tape without a VCR. I think that time is very near.. if you have a favorite brand of optical drive.. consider buying a few extra. They aren't going to be coming out with Blu-ray 2.0 for the PC anytime soon. In fact most PC cases don't even have 5.25 drive bays anymore.. those used to be for 5.25 Floppy drives.. if optical drives go away.. there is no need for them. And manufacturers are already removing those drive bays. Optical media to them is already dead.
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post #27992 of 28014 Old 11-03-2019, 05:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigTanks View Post
Sorry couldnt find the edit:
"One of these players" = Its the H2160MW9A, E2S00UD, BE version: HD6A269704H1E
Post 6927, https://www.avsforum.com/forum/106-d...l#post17340385 has links to all firmware. 727V was the last I think.
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post #27993 of 28014 Old 11-03-2019, 08:11 AM
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"vBulletin Message
Invalid Attachment specified. If you followed a valid link, please notify the administrator"

I went thru and clicked almost every link, looks like 1 works but its not the 727v super FW and whatever the file attached at the end of the post is works too. Everything else still gives the above message.
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post #27994 of 28014 Old 11-03-2019, 08:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwillis84 View Post
Its very interesting people keep discovering these old recorders as late as 2019.

Some perspective though.

Verbatim just sold all its DVD and Blu-ray assets to CMC and CMC is practically the "last" maker of any DVD media in the world now. All of the brands are belong to them. Re-labeling the same media under the old brand names to sell the same media at different price tiers is common practice now. The legacy media being cleaned out at Newegg and through eBay will not last more than a few years.. and then its all gone. Except whatever CMS produces for the PC market. Even Blu-ray is on the way out.. its just too darned small for todays data.

I've been thinking long and hard and it looks like near term HDD will be the bridge media until something else comes along.. and it generally doesn't do well sitting static on a shelf. You have to turn it over.. or copy it from one drive to another.. like we used to do with tapes.. grandfather son style. People don't like to do that.. they want a magical unicorn to keep all their data safe.. with promises they will last 100 years.. even though that has been thoroughly debunked over and over again. Its more like less than 10 years.. likely less than 5 even under optimum conditions.. but people never do a thorough inventory. With error correction however even a rotted DVD can still playback.. and it will degrade slower than VHS tape overall.

Something else to watch out for is Electrolytic caps in the power supplies were never projected to last longer than 5-7 years tops.. so even in the relatively new Magnavox's their expiration date is fast approaching.. then their power supplies will need to be re-built or re-capped.. or the units will be dead. We've a lot of experience with this in other brands. And its unrelated to the big "Cap Scandal" of 2004-2005.. caps simply wear out.. even (and especially) sitting on a shelf unused.. or in the back of the closet. Its their nature. Un-powered they de-polarize.. or forget their polarity and pop when they are re-energized after a long slumber.

And not to get all doomy and gloomy here.. but when the media goes single source and the drive makers exit the market.. the time is ripe for the format to be retired. All that burned media on DVDs will become unreadable if the Optical drives are no longer made.. as unreadable as a VHS tape without a VCR. I think that time is very near.. if you have a favorite brand of optical drive.. consider buying a few extra. They aren't going to be coming out with Blu-ray 2.0 for the PC anytime soon. In fact most PC cases don't even have 5.25 drive bays anymore.. those used to be for 5.25 Floppy drives.. if optical drives go away.. there is no need for them. And manufacturers are already removing those drive bays. Optical media to them is already dead.
Its even worse now though man, everything is built with "artificial" obsolescence in mind. I have a relative who goes through a blu ray player every few months (heat) but its beyond a joke they dont build stuff to last beyond warranty periods anymore.
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post #27995 of 28014 Old 11-03-2019, 08:51 AM
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The electrical grid may have a lot to do with that.

Its like the road system, only built long before the 1960's. Unless you live where there there is Hydroelectric power to smooth out the grid its highly variable. And even then the transmission lines are getting much worse... so much they are shutting them off in CA to prevent fires.. but I guess that's old news now.

Surge protectors and power conditioners and ups backups can help.. but they still need to get their power from the same old grid. Its bad.. and getting worse. You could go totally solar and battery.. but most people won't invest in that. Heck the power company investors are pulling as much value out of the grid system as possible and not putting anything back in for the long term. Everyone is an island these days.

Anyhoo.. the built-in obsolescence.. may have a lot more to do with our crumbling infrastructure than the devices we risk attaching to the mains.
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post #27996 of 28014 Old 11-03-2019, 11:16 AM
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I just tried to upload SuperFW 727V HD6A269727V1E.zip, but the uploader claims its 3662846 bytes exceeds the 976.6KB limit for file type .zip.

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post #27997 of 28014 Old 11-09-2019, 06:45 AM
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I bought a H2160MW9A in May 2018 (I still have a 535 that I bought new in 2012). I dug around at that time, and did find a working link for the SuperFW update. The link still works! See below!

I also installed a 500 GB hard drive that I bought used on ebay for around $10. This site has been a great resource for me and factored in to my original purchase in 2012.

Edit - I do not have any posts (you need 5 post to do so), so I can't post the actual link. I had to chop off the first part of the link.

funaiservice.com/Information/firmware/H2160MW9A
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post #27998 of 28014 Old 11-09-2019, 07:05 AM
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Please note the link I just posted is for 727V HD6A269727H1E.zip , not the V1E file. Still, it makes a 2160A work like a 513 and adds the skip function to the timer recordings.
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post #27999 of 28014 Old 11-09-2019, 07:12 AM
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Well, I learned something today! I got the 727V HD6A269727V1E link to work by guessing on the name of the correct folder. I guess have some updating to do to my firmware.

funaiservice.com/Information/firmware/MDR515H_F7/
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post #28000 of 28014 Old 01-08-2020, 08:09 PM
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SEAGATE PIPELINE 500gb errors

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Originally Posted by mickinct View Post
SEAGATE PIPELINE 2TB works well in my mdr-537.
I have a "500gb HDD farm" for my 513, and just tried adding 2 brand new Seagate Pipeline 500GB drives based on the above positive compatibility post from 04-11-2019. But neither of the two seems to be working out. Could a drive be compatible with the 537 but not with the 513? Or could the 2TB be OK but not the 500GB? The Pipeline is described as optimized for constant-on video, which is ideal for our machines. Anyway, here are my symptoms:

Skip 079 Self-check results are all OK, and I press OK to Format. I restart the machine and try to record, but get the dreaded E48 error screen "Can not record on this HDD".

Then I run a Skip 013 Factory check, and get the following:
HDD MEDIA READ VERIFY CHECK : NG
SYSTEM AREA CHECK : NG
HDD FORMAT : NG
HDD HEAD CHECK  NG: E22 (or sometimes E27) 
HDD HEAD ESCAPE : OK
RESULT : NG

I tried several resets with both drives and interestingly I was able to get a short recording going on one of them, but then everything froze up when trying to play back the recording, and it's back to the NG cycle all over again.
BTW just to be sure, I swapped in one of my current full HDDs and it works OK.
Any ideas would be appreciated.
Thanks.

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post #28001 of 28014 Old 01-08-2020, 10:16 PM
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FWIW, I have a ST3500414CS Pipeline 500G made in made in 2013, purchased for $18 as a "refurb" in 2017. It arrived with 26k power-on hours. According to my records, I tested it OK in my 515, too long ago to remember any details.

Which firmware does your 513 have? If not 727V, possibly you need it to support 500G. Whether this is so might be here or somewhere it links to. If you need it but can't find a working download link, PM me your email address and I'll make my copy available to you. Only slightly up thread I posted that the forum wouldn't accept my upload of it due to its size.

Do your new Seagates have firmware upgrades available?

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post #28002 of 28014 Old 01-12-2020, 02:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmazda View Post
FWIW, I have a ST3500414CS Pipeline 500G made in made in 2013... I tested it OK in my 515, too long ago to remember any details.

...Which firmware does your 513 have? If not 727V, possibly you need it to support 500G...

...Do your new Seagates have firmware upgrades available?
Thanks, mrmazda. My Pipeline 500GB models are ST3500312CS (smaller cache than yours, but also 5900RPM). They're new, made in 2013 and 2015. No firmware upgrades available from Seagate. My 513s have indeed been upgraded to 727V and running a bunch of 500GB drives with no problems. I would be curious to know if your Pipeline 500GB actually filled up successfully with recordings or merely formated OK, because mine are behaving weirdly. Since my previous post I managed to format both drives just by being persistent and trying several times, BUT one drive suddenly stopped recording in the middle of the fourth title, froze the machine, and un-formated itself! The second drive is also strange: It records and plays fine but causes delays of 10 to 30 seconds in ALL hardware functions, including stop, start, forward, title list, power off. To be sure, I swapped in a couple of my existing drives and the machine operates perfectly.

I'm hesitant now to take a chance on these Pipelines. Has anyone had similar hardware issues with a particular HDD?
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post #28003 of 28014 Old 01-12-2020, 02:46 PM
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I only tested my ST3500414CS Pipeline 500GB in my 515 after the OEM WD5000AVDS died. Now it has a Hitachi HCS5C1050CLA382 500GB purchased October 2015.

Other deaths in my Funais: AV-GP WD3200AVVS-98L2B0 & AV-GP WD3200AVVS-63L2B0.

What I have working now are one WD5000AUDX AV-GP 500GB, The above Hitachi, 2 HCS5C1032CLA382 320GB Hitachis, and an OEM 160GB Hitachi. Of the five, not counting power outages or fan cleaning or fan or HD replacements or PS recapping, only the 160GB has not been powered up 24/7 since acquisition.

Next time I have a failure I'll probably put in a 512GB SSD.
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post #28004 of 28014 Old 01-12-2020, 04:25 PM
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I've been having some success with these $19 m.2 sata SSDs (240 GB) from Kingston in DVRs recently. There are lots of other brands, some even cheaper.. but I've only been trying the Kingstons so far.

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post #28005 of 28014 Old 01-13-2020, 11:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwillis84 View Post
I've been having some success with these $19 m.2 sata SSDs (240 GB) from Kingston in DVRs recently. There are lots of other brands, some even cheaper.. but I've only been trying the Kingstons so far.
Do these SSDs need a special adapter to fit into a 513?
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post #28006 of 28014 Old 01-13-2020, 11:18 AM
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To connect electrically, no. Physically, a standard 2.5" to 3.5" bay adapter suffices unless your HD is already 2.5" and using one.

edit
Oops! Wasn't paying attention. jwillis84 is right. M.2 to SATA adapter is certainly required. I just ordered another this AM (for other reasons). It was "on sale" at Newegg. This is the one I was actually using as I wrote this message originally.

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Last edited by mrmazda; 01-13-2020 at 12:55 PM. Reason: oversight
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post #28007 of 28014 Old 01-13-2020, 12:34 PM
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An m.2 needs an m.2 to 2.5 or 3.5 adapter. They cost about $10 but its a one time cost. As said.. if your DVR already uses 2.5 drives its no big deal. If your DVR uses a 3.5 drive, you (may) want to get a step up bracket as well.. or secure it using screws on one side of the m.2 to 2.5 adapter.
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Do they make a M.2 to IDE connector? Just thinking ahead for my old Philips.
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post #28009 of 28014 Old 01-13-2020, 09:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctorM View Post
Do they make a M.2 to IDE connector? Just thinking ahead for my old Philips.
You mean like these?


https://www.ebay.ca/itm/High-Quality...wAAOSwdOxeDXCh



https://www.amazon.com/44pin-Convert.../dp/B06XC36V63
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post #28010 of 28014 Old 01-13-2020, 09:48 PM
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Ooohh .. I'd warn you off about those.

I tried those exact models first.

Two problems:

1) They make an mSATA version that looks just like the m.2 sata and will ship you the wrong one by accident.. and either they are very fragile where static discharge is concerned or just arrived D.O.A.

2) They are 'cute' as in they look like a traditional SSD cover.. and offer some protection.. but learn from my mistakes.. they coop up the heat and don't dissapate it well. The trapped air and plastic cover tend to cook the m.2 chip.

I moved on to the Icydock vented plastic version.. and then on to the solid aluminum open air frame.

Inside the case open air is better as the air flow is 360 degrees above and underneath.

And its a rigid frame that is ever bit as strong as the steel frame the hard drive is mounted to inside the case.

I've been iterating.. trying different things for several weeks.. and personally made a lot of mistakes.

The tech is solid.. (use a Marvell adapter.. not a JMicron.. the JMicron are easy to find and sell for pennies.. but don't work.. thank the Tivo Community for figuring that out..)

It also depends on (how far) you want to go.

A simple m.2 to 2.5 SATA from fenlink costs about $10.. if you have a Maganavox 557 that may be all you need, in addition to the m.2 chip drive

A 3.5 to 2.5 SATA plus the m.2 to 2.5 SATA will total about $20.. if you have a modern DVR that needs a 3.5 SATA that is all you need, in addition to the m.2 chip drive.

A full IDE to 3.5 SATA adapter plus 3.5 to 2.5 SATA plus m.2 to 2.5 SATA will add up to about $36 (if you have an older DVR that needs a IDE 3.5 drive) in addition to the m.2 chip drive

The pics are of the last one I described.. but its the most flexible.. and the m.2 chip drives are physically interchangeable between all the above and fairly easy to extract from the DVR when they fill up so you can read them with a USB adapter to extract video to a PC.

I'm not even sure if bringing the 240 GB drive outside the cover of the DVR is a good idea. Its safer to leave them inside and it will take many hours of recording to even come close to filling one up.

Opening the case once a year to empty the drive is one approach.

Another thought is.. this is an experiment.. I have not been doing this long.

People have told me it would be insanely costly. But, $10 for 120 GB or $20 for 240 GB (today) is not bad in my opinion.. especially when you can't be sure if a spinning HDD will be damaged in shipping.. or be sure its not a refurb sold as a new drive.. when trying to get such a small drive.

It may be these m.2 will fail quicker.. but I seriously have my doubts about that.

I plan to audit the m.2 drives after installing a few and checking their wear life left after a month or two. m.2 has a finite write cycle lifespan and will report that if queried outside the case in a PC.

Life left is not an unknown thing for m.2.. they know precisely how many times each cell has been used.. and how much reallocation space is left. Spinning drives come from a time when precise lifespan was more of a guess.. Back then hardware rarely checked SMART statistics or warned the end user.

Its a different world now.

Helping the Isobuster test his program.. I have accumulated a number of DVRs.. I still have them and plan to try this in each. It will take some time.. maybe not so long for this thread.. which is primarily about the Magnavoxes.. but for Toshiba, Pioneer.. Panasonic.. it will take longer.

So your personal mileage with this idea.. may vary.
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post #28011 of 28014 Old 01-13-2020, 10:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DoctorM View Post
Do they make a M.2 to IDE connector? Just thinking ahead for my old Philips.
I wish they did.. but no.. not that I've been able to find.

I've veered all over the supplier map.. and come back to the Fenvi and Fenlink bracket adapters. They are passive and adapt the form factor the best.

And they weigh a ton, compared to a plastic or thin steel bracket. They are rigid and stay put, and have precise threaded holes.. plus they come with screw sets.. a real class act.

I really like their solid, rigid m.2 to 2.5 sata adapter.

But for the step from SATA to IDE.. you will need a Marvell IDE to SATA adapter.

It would be very nice if Fenlink or Fenvi would offer an "all in one".. but I don't know much about their company.. and they might prefer to stay in the "passive" circuit component space.

.. perhaps someone should suggest it to them?

One IDE to m.2 converter adapter - all in one -
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post #28012 of 28014 Old 02-05-2020, 09:41 AM
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Seagate drives

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Originally Posted by mrmazda View Post
I only tested my ST3500414CS Pipeline 500GB in my 515 after the OEM WD5000AVDS died. Now it has a Hitachi HCS5C1050CLA382 500GB purchased October 2015.

Other deaths in my Funais: AV-GP WD3200AVVS-98L2B0 & AV-GP WD3200AVVS-63L2B0.

What I have working now are one WD5000AUDX AV-GP 500GB, The above Hitachi, 2 HCS5C1032CLA382 320GB Hitachis, and an OEM 160GB Hitachi. Of the five, not counting power outages or fan cleaning or fan or HD replacements or PS recapping, only the 160GB has not been powered up 24/7 since acquisition.

Next time I have a failure I'll probably put in a 512GB SSD.
After many hours of frustration and false hope, I can report that neither of the Seagate ST3500312CS 500GB drives worked for me. Using the Seatools utility (similar to Western Digital's Data Lifeguard) I was able to briefly resuscitate the drives, but they failed again. Following mrmazda's lead I picked up a SanDisk 512GB SATA SSD at a local Best Buy ($65-- though I could have shaved off a few dollars online) and the Maggie is purring along as if turbocharged. Response time to all operations on the remote feel instantaneous, not to mention totally silent.
It didn't seem worthwhile to bother with the m.2+adapter for the price differential, especially at the 500GB size. I tend to fill up my drives with SP recordings. I'll be on the lookout for refurbs and perhaps also clone my HDDs to SSDs as the prices drop.
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post #28013 of 28014 Old 03-21-2020, 01:52 PM
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Blank media for Magnavox 535

I need to buy some more blank DVDs for my Maggie 535. I've only used +R, but I'm thinking of trying Falcons, and I think they only make -R. Will I have problems burning to -R?

Also, what speed media should I look for? Right now I'm using 16x Verbatim +R, and I do occasionally get coasters (the old Can Not Record on This Disk or whatever the message is). I have no idea if the disk speed is a factor.

TIA.
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post #28014 of 28014 Old 03-21-2020, 04:13 PM
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16X +R Verbatim is what I have now. Few have failed to burn, but how many "few" amounts to I can't hazard a guess. I also buy 8X -R to use with one of my Pioneers. Last ones are Maxell DVD-RSS. I can't recall where I got them, but it could have been Newegg. Making any coasters out of them in any of my Funais I also can't recall.

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