The Official Silver Fire V.2 Thread. - Page 94 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #2791 of 2814 Old 04-22-2020, 07:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post
NEI
(not enough information)


Embarrassment aside, not knowing what your dealing with makes it pretty much futile to advise you of a valid and workable solution.


But going a bit further into the problematical Rabbit Hole...........
  • Is the now painted surface completely free of "tactile texture"?
  • Was this a "Wall Sized" effort or a confined Screen area? (...seems such...)


With any area the appears significantly darker that the rest of a screen (...but has no texture or defect...) them a light sanding....very light, followed by Primer is the most assured way to correct such a visual issue. Trouble is I don't know how large the area involved is...although some clue is given with "The whole painted area is now messed up".


If the latter is in fact true, then sanding, Priming, and a Re-Do of the Silver Fire is called for.


I PM'd you a contact number if you wish to speak directly to elaborate on what happened and the end result you wound up with. Glad to help...as long as you return to share with everyone your final results.
Thank you so much for the quick reply. I have attached pictures of my current screen. One is just the ceiling lights on with projector off and the other one is all the lights off with projector beaming pure white to the screen. As you can see the imperfections on the screen now. Can this fixed with light sanding and the spraying it again?
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post #2792 of 2814 Old 04-22-2020, 11:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Tell me exactly what you think you did to cause those streak-ish patches?


Then I can tell you whassup.....and what you can or should do.

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post #2793 of 2814 Old 04-22-2020, 02:47 PM
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Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post
Tell me exactly what you think you did to cause those streak-ish patches?


Then I can tell you whassup.....and what you can or should do.
Okay... I was stupid enough to get a super smooth foam roller and thought I can go over the dark areas with what I had remaining of the silver fire with it and it got worst and worst and I kept putting more and and more on with the roller trying to smooth it out. When it was wet... it looked super smooth and perfect but as it dried... well... the picture speaks for itself.
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post #2794 of 2814 Old 04-23-2020, 10:16 AM
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Oh well... I decided painting is not for me and just ordered STR-235138 Silver Ticket 2.35:1 which is 138" scope screen in white. I was debating between the white and grey and from what I have currently which is Silver Fire with 2oz colorant and is too dark for my taste anyway.

I regret going this route... wasted money and time... time mostly though since paint was pretty cheap but still it was good experience and lesson learned for me. If anyone else is on the fence about painting and you need a blemish free perfect screen, painting is not the way. I'm sure MM can do a perfect job... I was not qualified.

For some reason if I am not happy with the Silver Ticket, I can always spray Silver Fire on it but I will pay someone to do it. MM, how much you charge? J/K
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post #2795 of 2814 Old 04-23-2020, 12:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cky2354 View Post
Oh well... I decided painting is not for me and just ordered STR-235138 Silver Ticket 2.35:1 which is 138" scope screen in white. I was debating between the white and grey and from what I have currently which is Silver Fire with 2oz colorant and is too dark for my taste anyway.

I regret going this route... wasted money and time... time mostly though since paint was pretty cheap but still it was good experience and lesson learned for me. If anyone else is on the fence about painting and you need a blemish free perfect screen, painting is not the way. I'm sure MM can do a perfect job... I was not qualified.

For some reason if I am not happy with the Silver Ticket, I can always spray Silver Fire on it but I will pay someone to do it. MM, how much you charge? J/K
This post is all over the place. And extremely disappointing.

First and foremost it is nether right nor correct for you to venture to tell others they cannot get a blemish free screen based on your own effort and miscue. 100s already have.

Secondly, if you were going to redo the paint, simply omitting the Colorant would have brought it more in line with your "Taste" and still provided FAR more ALR ability and a much more dynamic image than a ST screen could ever hope to!.

And Thirdly....you didn't even give me the time or opportunity to respond to tell you that you could...indeed...simply paint over the issues I got to see combined with your explanation of what you did. So you go out and spend to assuage your feelings instead? It should be a knife twisting in a wound to find out I just yesterday took care of a situation virtually exactly like yours (...a bit smaller but the same...) where the Owner tried to use a Foam Brush to cover a very minor blemish and instead created a slicked bright area that looked terribly more obvious. And what did it take to solver it? 3- 10 second coats dusted directly over the area. About 3 oz of paint.

Now he says it looks perfect. I was planning on relating such to you, but you jumped of a cliff before I could get back to you.

Over the years, I have helped many...but only a very few take the bent to dismiss the entire application over their own failings. I can almost always help those who screw up recoup....and they are grateful because the end result is always worth it. You will not be remotely as happy with a Matte White Silver Ticket...but if you open it and use it, you'll probably just be stuck with it.


Cancel the damn thing before it ships....and lets get you squared away!
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post #2796 of 2814 Old 04-23-2020, 04:15 PM
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MM - Please help me fix my wall before I succumb to buying a 165" Silver Ticket 16:9 screen. I would say my wall is 95% there but I want it perfect. Which means I need to patch and fill in these outlets and cable box holes at the bottom and also skim the wall to make it perfectly smooth. I did a great spray job I just didn't prep as well as I could and you can see a slight shimmer and texture from my MLP which is about 13 feet away from the wall.

I'm also fairly certain this texture was on the wall already prior to me spraying 4 coats of silver fire.





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post #2797 of 2814 Old 04-23-2020, 07:42 PM - Thread Starter
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The paint looks to be applied too heavily (per coat)


Coverage in 4 coats is at least 3 coats shy of what it takes if the coats are going up as true Dusters. No way you should / would ever see that sort of sheen, even with a light shining directly from the side.


And going on so thick will create texture....although you seem to have avoided the dreaded Orange Peal.


Solution. "Lightly" sand the wall with a Fine / Medium Grit Sanding Sponge. The BIG one...3" x 9" x1" that you'll find in the Drywall Tools section at Home Depot. Either 3M or Norton. Can't mistake it...it's a big arse Sponge!


You do NOT want to scrub the Wall...Holding the Sponge sideways against your Palm, just lightly wipe the surface in long continuous Vertical strokes (...the limit of your reach...) of about 3 repetitions then moving over to the side the "length of the Sponge" and repeat, just barely overlapping the leading edge of the prior Row. You can go sideways across up top along the Molding....but just one row, then switch to Vertical passes.


The object being not so much to remove material but to smooth out the texture. And smoothing accomplished is better than naught. Just be gentle....light sweeping strokes won't "scratch" the paint.


Now here's the good part....if you do a good and thorough job of sanding,all it should take is 3 "LIGHT" Dusters with the 60-70% Horizontal Row Overlap. The finer Mist will go on much more "Matte-ly" and take care of that sheen-induced Shimmer.


So now then...fess up...describe how you applied those 4 Coats. Any SF left?



And I gotta say....your last image...if I didn't know you had issues to deal with, I'd be telling you how good a job you did! It looks quite nice.
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post #2798 of 2814 Old 04-23-2020, 08:28 PM
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Thanks for the compliments and thanks for the sanding tips. It actually does look quite nice and no one except for me and my videophile neighbor notices the texture/slight shimmer.

I used two batches of this on the wall.

2 oz of colorant +
16 oz Rustoleum's Ultimate Polyurethane Matte Finish (water based) +
24 oz distilled water for thinning +
32 oz Rustoleum Metallic Accents – White Pearl +
10 oz Rustoleum Metallic Accents - Sterling Silver +
16 oz Home Depot PPG Diamond Flat

I have enough paint leftover to make another 2 batches of this.

I sprayed the mix with this Husky HVLP gun with a 1.8 tip.





However, I do have this other Wagner HVLP gun and pressure pot, but it uses a .8mm which I think may be too small for the viscosity of this mix which is why I didn't try using it the first time around. However, I can certainly try it this time around.



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post #2799 of 2814 Old 04-24-2020, 06:27 AM - Thread Starter
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Yeah...the 1.8 mm tip is a big part of the problem. It allows you to put up too much paint per pass. One can try compensating somewhat by increasing the speed by which they move across the surface, as well as the distance one shoots from (going out to 14"-16"), but there are other things to consider trying if you can experiment on a spare surface.


That sort of Gravity Fed / Compressor Fed HVLP has a few adjustments that Electrics do not.
  • Locate the Fluid Control Knob and turn it back at least 2 full rotations
  • Locate the Air Supply Knob and also stop it down slightly, while keeping the air pressure delivered at the Gun at 45 lb psi
I would shy away from trying to use the 0.8 mm Needle. Doing so would require thinning the Mix even more while increasing the air pressure to make certain your Paint mixture is getting fully atomized. It can be a valid method but it would require experimentation before you try to hit the surface.

Recently, because of the size area involved, I painted a 13' wide x 9' tall Wall sized Screen using a 1.5 mm needle on my Earlex / Wagner Hybrid rig. I ran it with the Fluid Supply wide open, but I moved across the surface at a rapid shuffle (4' per sec.), keeping at least 12"-14" away. Even so I could plainly see just how much paint was exiting the Gun compared to when a 1.0 mm needle was employed. So much I hastened to get my Pole Fan going to set / dry the droplets ASAP.

@acribb , I would feel safe to say that you didn't so much see a dispersed pattern of droplets as much as you saw a fairly solid stripe of paint being laid down....having accomplished full coverage in just 4 coats. And yep...I imagine the Screen still looks very good....lot's of extra gain comes off such a surface. But as you already stated, it does have some drawbacks, and such things are not to be tolerated! They don't need to be tolerated! Not when doing is correctly is so very simple to do.

All that said...a "Hit or Miss" or guesswork approach is not something to try. There are real and valid reasons I've stressed repeatedly that a 1.5 mm needle size should be the Maximum considered to be applicable...and that using a 1.0 mm is a way to assure that if anything, one might have to apply 2-3 extra coats to get complete coverage.

One should always live by the mandate:


The Gun giveth...but the Painter cannot taketh away.


@cky2354 's screen above looks to have been done correctly, albeit his attempt to correct a issue before asking was a wrong approach. But in many ways the exact same solution that would have addressed his issue is the one I've recommended to you. You did ask first before proceeding.....so now it's up to you to decide what approach to consider to use.


As for me and my opinion..................


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post #2800 of 2814 Old 04-24-2020, 04:19 PM
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That Husky gravity gun also came with a 1.4 needle set as well!! Good to go although I'm not sure when I'll tackle this project. Some day in the Stay at Home future.

Thanks again for the tips MM.
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post #2801 of 2814 Old 05-15-2020, 08:12 PM
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amazon shopping list

That's my amazon shopping list with all the paints needed, available online, plus the paint tools I'm getting.


amazon dot com/hz/wishlist/ls/6RD1F71TJSGR
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post #2802 of 2814 Old 05-15-2020, 08:53 PM
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Yo MM,





I can't get it on lowes either. I can prob get the White pearl one on amazon but what do you suggest I do for Sterling Silver?

Liqutex Basis Silver?
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post #2803 of 2814 Old 05-16-2020, 05:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Menards usually ships it's paint everywhere. Your Screen grab looks to be from off Menard's site.(...I cannot fathom why a Water Based Acrylic paint would fall under any restrictions. I regularly have anywhere from 3 qts to multiple Gallons of Screen paint shipped everywhere in the US-Canada, and Overseas (...even to Denmark and Vietnam. And they have draconian Customs regulations!)

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post #2804 of 2814 Old 05-16-2020, 05:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kill_dano View Post
That's my amazon shopping list with all the paints needed, available online, plus the paint tools I'm getting.


amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls/6RD1F71TJSGR

I looked at your list.


The Filters and the Stir Wand are not the kind that work well...at all.


Mixing Wand: https://www.amazon.com/Marshalltown-PM798-Cyclone-Paint-Mixer/dp/B00NJYB3SM/

The Wand above is on the order of a magnitude more effective...especially when broken down to the quart-sized single piece when mixing the Colorant. I see that your List shows it was just ordered yesterday? Cancel it if possible...or arrange a return. The other Mixing tool is very ineffective except when paints are MUCH thicker.


Strainer Bags: https://www.amazon.com/Trimaco-LLC-2-Pack-Paint-Strainer/dp/B00K09BI0W/

Hmmm...it seems that 1 gallon Strainer Bags are getting harder to find in smaller quantities.
Paper Cone Filters do not work well when pouring in non-viscous paint...they do not have enough surface area, and the rate of observed drain-through of a larger Bag is used to estimate the thinness of the paint.


Here are some other choices. (I just bought the 1st one below to try myself...I'll report back on it's effectiveness...)

https://www.amazon.com/Sr-Denoff-Reusable-Strainer-Automotive/dp/B07MN5KDPB/



https://www.amazon.com/Strainer-Extra-Juicing-Recipe-eBook/dp/B00A7N4MCW/


https://www.amazon.com/Strainer-Strain-Strainers-Contractors-Handyman/dp/B07SGNVJXD/

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post #2805 of 2814 Old 05-16-2020, 10:52 AM
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Thanks MM, I can still change my order, so I'll do get these items instead.

Yeah that screenshot was Menards. I think they are taking this prop65 thing way too seriously.
I was able to place an order for Sterling Silver at paintstore.com, but unfortunately I had to buy 2 at $34 ea and 10$ shipping.


Was the PPG diamond flat paint on my list correct?

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post #2806 of 2814 Old 05-16-2020, 02:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by kill_dano View Post
Thanks MM, I can still change my order, so I'll do get these items instead.

Cool Beans.



Yes, PPG Diamond Flat is the paint of choice.

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post #2807 of 2814 Old 05-20-2020, 01:55 AM
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Does anyone knows an european substitute for the Rustoleum Metallic Accents and PPG Diamond?
Other than the Liquitex products, I can't find any of the components for SilverFire in Europe.
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post #2808 of 2814 Old 05-20-2020, 06:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by dkol View Post
Does anyone knows an european substitute for the Rustoleum Metallic Accents and PPG Diamond?
Other than the Liquitex products, I can't find any of the components for SilverFire in Europe.

Almost any "good" Acrylic bright white paint (Primer/Paint combos are the best) can replace the PPG Diamond


RustOleum Metallic Accents Silver was a replacement for the same color available and known as Liquitex Silver...the latter being much lighter in it's Silver/Grey hue.


As for the White Pearl, if Folk Art paints are available (...or similar) they can also be substituted.....however be advised that results you obtain will vary somewhat from what can be expected with the Mix made from the normally suggested components. Oh...they will be good results, it's just that the formula was changed so as to improve results, and in some cases to make the acquisition and mixing of everything easier.

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I have everything I need except Silver Sterling. I'm in California. Halp.
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post #2810 of 2814 Old 05-22-2020, 07:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by kill_dano View Post
I have everything I need except Silver Sterling. I'm in California. Halp.

Someone else outside of La La-ville could get it for you and reship it nondescript. USPS.

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How does the following FolkArt Paintmix compares to SF?
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/110-d...-paintmix.html

I am asking because, FolkArt paints are available here.
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post #2812 of 2814 Old 05-23-2020, 08:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by dkol View Post
How does the following FolkArt Paintmix compares to SF?
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/110-d...-paintmix.html

I am asking because, FolkArt paints are available here.

Read this post:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/110-diy-screen-section/2608649-easy-folkart-alr-paintmix.html#post47411521



Silver Fire sorta spawned the "Easy FAGM-ALR Paint" as a easy lower cost alternative, but besides performance the differences lay in two important areas. The Folk Art example gets it's primary ALR performance from the dark Grey tint of the Gunmetal Grey Metallic paint...and a shot of Polyurethane. Gain is maintained due whatever the metallic in the Gunmetal Grey can provide. Silver Fire has more image enhancement capability due to it's pure Silver and Pearl Metallic content combined with the introduction of a Metallic RGBY Tint into the Mix along with a percentage of Ultra Pure White. The two Mixes are completely different animals.



However.............................

With just a bit of a tweak it may work for you in your instance...and it's certainly not so expensive as to make it a hard choice. Now if you can get the Pearl it would be crazy not to add that into the FAGM-ALR.


I'd advise this Ratio:
Scaleable



30% GunMetal-- 43 Ounces

20% Pearl-------- 1 Quart

25% Poly -------- 1 Quart

25% Water ( start with 24 ounces and add until paint flows freely off the mixer Wand...)



You still want to strain the paint and check viscosity....and shoot a few short Duster practice stripes with 60-70 % overlap



Questions or concerns? Ask 1st...squirt 2nd.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by MississippiMan View Post
Read this post:
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/110-diy-screen-section/2608649-easy-folkart-alr-paintmix.html#post47411521



Silver Fire sorta spawned the "Easy FAGM-ALR Paint" as a easy lower cost alternative, but besides performance the differences lay in two important areas. The Folk Art example gets it's primary ALR performance from the dark Grey tint of the Gunmetal Grey Metallic paint...and a shot of Polyurethane. Gain is maintained due whatever the metallic in the Gunmetal Grey can provide. Silver Fire has more image enhancement capability due to it's pure Silver and Pearl Metallic content combined with the introduction of a Metallic RGBY Tint into the Mix along with a percentage of Ultra Pure White. The two Mixes are completely different animals.



However.............................

With just a bit of a tweak it may work for you in your instance...and it's certainly not so expensive as to make it a hard choice. Now if you can get the Pearl it would be crazy not to add that into the FAGM-ALR.


I'd advise this Ratio:
Scaleable



30% GunMetal-- 43 Ounces

20% Pearl-------- 1 Quart

25% Poly -------- 1 Quart

25% Water ( start with 24 ounces and add until paint flows freely off the mixer Wand...)



You still want to strain the paint and check viscosity....and shoot a few short Duster practice stripes with 60-70 % overlap



Questions or concerns? Ask 1st...squirt 2nd.

Thanks a lot MM.

How much of the mixture would you recommend for a 92 Inch Screen?

Last edited by dkol; Yesterday at 05:06 AM.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkol View Post
Thanks a lot MM.

How much of the mixture would you recommend for a 92 Inch Screen?

A mix comprising 2 quarts total would be enough if correctly applied.

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