Grays- Simple one can paints, and one very neutral... - Page 20 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #571 of 615 Old 10-28-2007, 02:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BuGsArEtAsTy View Post

N9 for 229 you mean.

Thanks!
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post #572 of 615 Old 10-28-2007, 03:01 PM
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i suppose it's easier to keep on ignoring this post? https://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...7#post12000117

who cares about getting close when there are 9 available colors that are either dead on or only one point off from being completely neutral?

lowes can accurately make all of those colors, sherwin williams can make a bunch of them as can porter paints and mccormick. home depot has some of them available.

that said i would like to know what the RGB values are for the glidden paints because i like to paint with glidden a lot more than behr.
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post #573 of 615 Old 10-28-2007, 04:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gbrnole View Post

i suppose it's easier to keep on ignoring this post? https://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...7#post12000117

who cares about getting close when there are 9 available colors that are either dead on or only one point off from being completely neutral?

lowes can accurately make all of those colors, sherwin williams can make a bunch of them as can porter paints and mccormick. home depot has some of them available.

that said i would like to know what the RGB values are for the glidden paints because i like to paint with glidden a lot more than behr.

I don't think anyone is ignoring that post. In fact I have superceded the original EasyFlex tints with the Xrite N7 tint for UPW and painted my own screen with it. The problem is that this thread is no longer being kept up-to-date and therefore posts just get lost in the crowd. Maybe you should start a new thread with a name like "In Search of Neutral Gray Wall Paints".

Unfortunately the most commonly available wall paints are Behr and Glidden (CIL) but there is no data in the Easy RGB Database. I think you know someone with a spectrometer that could make measurements if you care to make up samples of the Glidden neutral colors. It would also be very good to get measurements of the white base as well. Some people are looking for a good white screen paint.

As far as what I have posted goes, if I don't post anything relevant to EasyRGB then I get criticized for ignoring it. If I go through and compile a list of all the grays that are within a reasonable tolerance, then it is either too tight or too loose. If I don't compile a list from all the manufacturers then I am not being thorough. If I compile a list from all the manufacturers then I am overwhelming people with too much information. If I only compile a list from one or two brands then I am being partial. No matter what I do there will be someone criticizing.

I am well aware that Lowes can make up any of these tints in their paints. I am also aware that True value has several very near neutral tints. If I was willing to travel south of the border then I would certainly take advantage of that. Not everyone here on AVS lives in the USA. I have more of a "world view" on the topic of screen painting so I am trying to present information that will help a wider audience.

It may well be that one of the compiled tints will be more acceptable to someone's wife as a wall paint. Neutral gray isn't much help if the boss ain't going to let you put it on the wall.
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post #574 of 615 Old 10-29-2007, 12:48 PM
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I finished repainting. I am happy enough with the results.

Basically I used
2 quarts of winter mist
1/2 a quart of behr poly
3 oz of metallic pearl white

2 coats. It's like Winter Mist with a gain kick and a slightly more pleasing picture. I will try to get a screenshot.
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post #575 of 615 Old 10-31-2007, 06:21 AM
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OK guys.
This is my first post here, but I've spent a few days reading all your wonderful posts about paint tints and the search for the "holy grail" of gray paint. I think I have decided to use TrueValue Winter Mountain as it is very close to N8 and is D65 neutral. I have a True Value store near me, but no Home Depot. I do have a Lowes if there's a better alternative there.

Here's the skinny, and I'm open to your recommendations:
BenQ 8220 PJ, a few years old. We had it up with a 124" wide screen (you do the diagonal, it's meaningless to me at that size). We're building a new house, and the throw will be about 18', so the image will be about the same size. The previous setup was on the ever-popular Behr UPW. It washed out very easily, and we don't want that again...hence the gray.
Screen is on the north side of the room, there are 2 windows on the west side, one near the screen wall, one at the back of the room. A door near the screen wall on the East side, and one at the back of the room, also on the east side. The windows will be able to be covered with blackout cloth or some other light blocking material, so they're not a concern...but the doors are not able to close, they're just cased doorways. There are 3 more windows on the south side of the room, about 30' from the screen wall.
The boss likes to have "a little" light on while watching TV, hence the N8 choice. That "little" light will be provided by extremely controllable pot lights (9 zones in the room).

The questions:
1) Should I paint the whole wall the same color? It's 11' high and 20' wide. The screen will be dead center on the wall.

2) What about the ceiling? I will NOT get away with painting it black. Probably not even gray, but I thought I would ask.

3) What about the other walls in the room? I wouldn't be opposed to painting the entire thing a neutral shade of gray...perhaps an N7, but the family who will visit will complain about having such a big room and painting it "like a cave." We don't want to live with that.

4) I don't think I want to put a border around the screen. I thought I'd get some feedback from you folks and see what you think. Here's my reasoning: Aspect ratios. We watch 4:3, 16:9, and whatever else the media supports (widest aspect available in the disc). The pj is also used from time to time to show pictures or other computer content, so we're not prepared to be dedicated to a widescreen only. The borderless screen appeals to me because there will be only the edge of the projected image to act as a border and my eye won't be distracted by the 4:3 screen lines while watching a widescreen image. Thoughts?

5) What about my color choice? TV Winter Mountain. What base should I use? Interior or Exterior? Sheen? (I know...as flat as possible)

Thanks in advance for your advice!
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post #576 of 615 Old 11-07-2007, 09:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScooterMcBean View Post

OK guys.
This is my first post here, but I've spent a few days reading all your wonderful posts about paint tints and the search for the "holy grail" of gray paint. I think I have decided to use TrueValue Winter Mountain as it is very close to N8 and is D65 neutral. I have a True Value store near me, but no Home Depot. I do have a Lowes if there's a better alternative there.

Here's the skinny, and I'm open to your recommendations:
BenQ 8220 PJ, a few years old. We had it up with a 124" wide screen (you do the diagonal, it's meaningless to me at that size). We're building a new house, and the throw will be about 18', so the image will be about the same size. The previous setup was on the ever-popular Behr UPW. It washed out very easily, and we don't want that again...hence the gray.
Screen is on the north side of the room, there are 2 windows on the west side, one near the screen wall, one at the back of the room. A door near the screen wall on the East side, and one at the back of the room, also on the east side. The windows will be able to be covered with blackout cloth or some other light blocking material, so they're not a concern...but the doors are not able to close, they're just cased doorways. There are 3 more windows on the south side of the room, about 30' from the screen wall.
The boss likes to have "a little" light on while watching TV, hence the N8 choice. That "little" light will be provided by extremely controllable pot lights (9 zones in the room).

The questions:
1) Should I paint the whole wall the same color? It's 11' high and 20' wide. The screen will be dead center on the wall.

2) What about the ceiling? I will NOT get away with painting it black. Probably not even gray, but I thought I would ask.

3) What about the other walls in the room? I wouldn't be opposed to painting the entire thing a neutral shade of gray...perhaps an N7, but the family who will visit will complain about having such a big room and painting it "like a cave." We don't want to live with that.

4) I don't think I want to put a border around the screen. I thought I'd get some feedback from you folks and see what you think. Here's my reasoning: Aspect ratios. We watch 4:3, 16:9, and whatever else the media supports (widest aspect available in the disc). The pj is also used from time to time to show pictures or other computer content, so we're not prepared to be dedicated to a widescreen only. The borderless screen appeals to me because there will be only the edge of the projected image to act as a border and my eye won't be distracted by the 4:3 screen lines while watching a widescreen image. Thoughts?

5) What about my color choice? TV Winter Mountain. What base should I use? Interior or Exterior? Sheen? (I know...as flat as possible)

Thanks in advance for your advice!

Sorry ScooterMcBean! I missed this post and your questions.

First let me say welcome to the DIY Screen forum!

With regards to the shade of gray, I would be careful not to go too dark. N8 is great for a bright presentation projector but may not be so great for the 8220 with a lot of hours on the bulb. You may want to compromise between an N8 and an N9. here are some True Value tints that are in that range:


200 201 201 - 1982 WINTER MOUNTAIN
216 218 216 - 1991 MIDTOWN GRAY
220 220 220 - 1983 WINTER MIST
217 220 219 - 2007 QUIET GRAY
221 222 222 - 1999 PEARL GRAY
220 224 222 - 1695 WINTER FROST
225 228 227 - 1984 CULTURED GRAY
1. You could paint the whole wall but a darker border does enhance the look of the image. You could make a border or do something artistic using the room colors:



By not having any border the screen does disappear when not in use. It is however replaced by a large empty area on the wall. You could do something artistic with lighting in that area to make it more attractive when the projector is off. here is a very simplistic example:




2. While is is ideal to have a blcak ceiling, at least in the area directly in front of the screen, it is often not something the boss will agree to. You can be creative though. Either paint the ceiling a lighter gray or slate blue, or possibly implement concentric half circles of lighter shades of one of the room colors radiating out from the screen.

3. I have seen many theater rooms painted mid to dark blue, burgundy, brown, etc. Anything darker than white is an improvement. The light from the screen will reflect off the side wall and then the back wall. If the side walls are matte they will reflect light back as well. I would suggest you paint the opposite wall a very dark accent color with a matte finish. The side walls can be lighter but use an eggshell or even semi-gloss to keep that light moving away from the screen.

4. While I do recognize the reasons for a border I tend to agree with you. If you are not going to implement some form of masking then just leave the border off. Paint the whole wall.

5. As I said earlier N8 may be a bit dark. It is a large screen and an older projector. I think I would be leaning towards Winter Mist or maybe the PEARL GRAY. As far as sheen goes, if you have no plans to top coat in any way then I would stick to a flat washable finish. The EZ Kare Flat is said to be scrub able. I am leaning towards the exteriors paints for their durability and UV resistance. The Prestige and NEW! WeatherAll®
Aluminum & Vinyl Siding Paint paints are interesting to me but I have not heard of anyone using them.

You may want to investigate the paints available at Lowes. There may be better quality paints (Valspar?) in a scrubable flat-enamel. The Lowes people are supposed to be able to enter many other color codes from different brands and the computer will make up the correct tint.

You have a lot of windows! You will need to find a way to block them off. If the windows are set in a box then roller blind s can work very well and allow for other more decorative window dressing.
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post #577 of 615 Old 11-29-2007, 11:44 AM
 
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Just a bump to keep alive the history of neutral grays!

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post #578 of 615 Old 12-21-2007, 10:21 AM
 
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Another bump. Gbrnole - pm me!

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post #579 of 615 Old 12-22-2007, 12:46 PM
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I just painted two coats my 8' wide anamorphic screen with 10 oz. of satin UPW 4 oz silver metalic ,and 1 oz on pearlizing. My projector is a Z4 and my players is hd-dvd and blu-ray.

tony4k
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post #580 of 615 Old 01-09-2008, 04:39 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gbrnole View Post

if we could analyze grays at say:

175 - xrite behr formula
202 - true value winter mountain (201)
206 - coronado X36-1 sanderling (207 208 208)
210 - dunn edwards porpoise (211)
215 - McCormick Paint 4-4001P (215 216 215)
220 - true value winter mist *and* martin senour 80-4 plum lustre (219)
224 - McCormick Paint 4-3901P
229 - color trend ambiance white lilac (228)

find out if each one of them has a nice flat spectral reflectance curve and where each of them could be accurately color matched (lowes for the most part though porter and sherwin williams should be up to the task as well) that would provide a nice band of grays to suit most anyones needs?

If anyone has purchased any of these I'd love a sample! I do not need Winter Mist or Mountain. Those have been sampled.

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post #581 of 615 Old 01-10-2008, 04:48 AM
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I would also like to request that anyone who has purchased any of the neutral or near neutral gray paint tints identified by EasyRGB.com, please post the tint formula here.

For those of us interested in actually understanding how a neutral tint is created this information is invaluable. Thanks.
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post #582 of 615 Old 02-15-2008, 02:37 PM
 
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One of the most important threads here! And it needs a bump!

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post #583 of 615 Old 02-15-2008, 04:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mech View Post

One of the most important threads here! And it needs a bump!

mech

I'll second those comments. Wbassett laid the ground work for the neutral gray off-the-shelf paints that we are all getting the benefits of now. Today's bright projectors and a neutral gray tint in a good matte base is a winning combination. We all owe Bill (wbassett) a big thank you for bringing easyRGB and the available neutral gray tints to the attention of the DIY Screen community.
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post #584 of 615 Old 02-15-2008, 06:28 PM
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Perhaps this post doesn't belong here since it isn't a screen paint as it comes from the can (it's too dark), but I just had a Munsell N5 paint custom mixed at an Ace hardware store by having them color match a known N5 artist's paint. This paint comes in at RGB 117-117-118 on my spectro, but it's accuracy may not be right on the money (but it seems darn close).

Add the following tints to one quart of Ace flat white base.

B - 1 oz + 21/48 oz + 1/96 oz
C - 0 oz + 12/48 oz
F - 0 oz + 3/48 oz

B = Lamp Black
C = Yellow Oxide
F = Red Oxide

This dark gray paint could be added to other neutral grays to darken them without shifting the neutrality of the mix. At least that's the theory. Also, for the photographers out there, this mix is the same "color" as the Kodak 18% Neutral Gray card.
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post #585 of 615 Old 03-01-2008, 09:02 PM
 
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With all the talk of N8's and what not, let's not forget where it began! And whom it began with....

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post #586 of 615 Old 05-26-2008, 05:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mech View Post

With all the talk of N8's and what not, let's not forget where it began! And whom it began with....

mech

I agree!

I would also like to add that one of the nicest paints that I have tried rolling is the Valspar Ultra Premium 100% Acrylic Latex Interior Flat Enamel. It rolls and levels like a fine quality oil base paint. The smoothest surfaces are possible with this paint.

I was also quite impressed with the Valspar Duramax® Exterior Flat House Paint (self-priming) paint. While exterior paints are not recommended for painting large areas of the interior of one's home, they do lend themselves to painting retractable screen surfaces.

The Valspar paints are available at Lowes and the icing on the cake is that Lowes can tint these fine Valspar paints to any of the more commonly known neutral gray shades such as the True Value "Winter Mountain" and "Winter Mist". In addition they can also tint the Valspar paints the ICI/Glidden neutral shades "Snowfield", "Universal Gray", and "Veil".

Both the Valspar Interior Flat Enamel and the Exterior Duramax have a low gloss that really enhances the white levels and produces much better images than a basic flat latex.

Pros: Easy to apply and levels to a smooth finish. Easy to get at Lowes. Can be tinted to any number of neutral gray shades. Very inexpensive.

Cons: Only available in the larger cities in Canada.
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post #587 of 615 Old 05-26-2008, 09:05 AM
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Haven't I seen this exact same post before?

Pretty sure I'm right. Right down to the "I agree."

Which BTW, I do as well, as far as the Valspar paints being a smooth roll and thereby also being well suited to thinning for spraying.

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post #588 of 615 Old 05-26-2008, 10:59 AM
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I guess you would rather read a post that just says "Bump".
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post #589 of 615 Old 05-27-2008, 04:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tiddler View Post

I guess you would rather read a post that just says "Bump".

Well you know, a "Bump" is what it is. Such a "Bump" carries those with interest back to where you/one thinks someone should go. A new post is "new input". Reposting a missive already posted in the same thread just to use it for "Bumping" reasons is repetitious and adds nothing new, yet leads others to "think" it might be new info. That is why posting the same info repeatedly across several threads is also frowned upon. (...and I've seen that happen as well. ..)



Finding a way to resurrect a Thread beyond "bumping" entails contributing something additional, and that benefits everyone more than mere regurgitation.

...otherwise, a "Bump" is a bump, and serves it's purpose with distinction.

Don't be "" or "", it was a comment.....not a assault.

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post #590 of 615 Old 05-27-2008, 09:21 AM
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Point taken and it was not thought to be an assault.
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post #591 of 615 Old 07-17-2008, 10:20 AM - Thread Starter
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A bump is a bump... but I thought I'd give this thread a bit of a loving bump since a few other's have been brought back too.

One thing I'd like to say about this thread is it demonstrated that what was trying to be achieved by mixing was already out there all along. We just needed to know how to look for it is all.

When it comes to gray screens, I stand behind D65 neutral all the way. It just makes sense. I've also seen quite a few comments about using flat paints lately. Matte has always been the desired screen finish as far as sheen... both in DIY as well as commercial screens. Sheen as far as I recall has never been the ultimate DIY solution and the guys that have been doing this for years have tried it and don't recommend lots of sheen or poly with too much sheen.

The problem is it can get out of control too fast and cause its own set of issues.

How does that relate to this thread? Well flats have always been the defacto standard because an offical matte finish house paint isn't that common, but they are out there.

Valspar is an outstanding paint and they have a signature series that comes in a matte finish. As a recap, that's a sheen that's between flat and eggshell. Lowes can also color match all the grays mentioned in this thread, so it's a great one stop place. If you go to Lowes, make sure you also have the paint code/number for them to look up. Walking in and asking for Winter Mountain, or Gray Screen could result in a match to a different company, therefore a different color. So for Winter Mountain for example, ask for True Value's TruColor, Winter Mountain 1982 and they should be able to pull it right up!

OTS neutral grays made with Valspar Signature Series in the matte finish... that's a simple OTS match made in heaven!

"Make everything as simple as possible, but no simpler." - Albert Einstein
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post #592 of 615 Old 07-18-2008, 07:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wbassett View Post

A bump is a bump... but I thought I'd give this thread a bit of a loving bump since a few other's have been brought back too.

One thing I'd like to say about this thread is it demonstrated that what was trying to be achieved by mixing was already out there all along. We just needed to know how to look for it is all.

When it comes to gray screens, I stand behind D65 neutral all the way. It just makes sense. I've also seen quite a few comments about using flat paints lately. Matte has always been the desired screen finish as far as sheen... both in DIY as well as commercial screens. Sheen as far as I recall has never been the ultimate DIY solution and the guys that have been doing this for years have tried it and don't recommend lots of sheen or poly with too much sheen.

The problem is it can get out of control too fast and cause its own set of issues.

How does that relate to this thread? Well flats have always been the defacto standard because an offical matte finish house paint isn't that common, but they are out there.

Valspar is an outstanding paint and they have a signature series that comes in a matte finish. As a recap, that's a sheen that's between flat and eggshell. Lowes can also color match all the grays mentioned in this thread, so it's a great one stop place. If you go to Lowes, make sure you also have the paint code/number for them to look up. Walking in and asking for Winter Mountain, or Gray Screen could result in a match to a different company, therefore a different color. So for Winter Mountain for example, ask for True Value's TruColor, Winter Mountain 1982 and they should be able to pull it right up!

OTS neutral grays made with Valspar Signature Series in the matte finish... that's a simple OTS match made in heaven!

Has a sample panel of the Valspar Signature Series Matte finish been prepared and compared to a sample panel of the Valspar Ultra Premium Flat Enamel? If so, I would be very interested in seeing the comparison photos and texture macro comparisons if you have any presentation material for the work.
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post #593 of 615 Old 07-18-2008, 11:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Of course!
The price difference is really pretty insignificant between the two though.

"Make everything as simple as possible, but no simpler." - Albert Einstein
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post #594 of 615 Old 07-19-2008, 05:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wbassett View Post

Of course!
The price difference is really pretty insignificant between the two though.

Great! I am looking forward to seeing the photos. I have seen you recommend the Signature matte a couple of times but I am not familiar with it.

I am only including paint bases, enhancing ingredients, and techniques in the DIY Screen Painting Quick Reference that I have some first hand experience with or that has been tried and demonstrated by others.

Unfortunately I did not try the Signature Matte, so I have no first hand experience testing it. If you are able to demonstrate the leveling and screen performance of the Signature Matte is comparable or better than the Valspar Flat Enamel, then I would love to include another Lowes base paint option in the Quick Reference. Especially an interior paint for those warry of exterior paints.

The cost is irrelevant. In fact, what makes a wall paint superior, and of course more expensive usually makes it the poorer DIY screen paint. Wall paint manufacturers often tout their top line products as covering in one coat, looking as nice as a flat paint, but having the durability and scrubability of a semi-gloss. They often brag that it will dry faster too.

A good screen paint is almost the exact opposite. Less opaque and thinner. While identified as flat or a flat enamel it actually has some gloss. It does not dry quickly and therefore has more time to level out. A longer drying time also allows the user to work it a bit more to back roll and remove any roller marks.

P.S. If you don't enable you PM I can't respond to your personal/private comments privately.
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post #595 of 615 Old 07-19-2008, 09:34 AM - Thread Starter
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I think cost and quality are a lot like neutral and gloss/sheen. There is a point where it's money spent for no extra gain in performance. However there is a happy medium too... ColorPlace is absolutely horrible paint, and I'll even say so is TruColors brand. That's one reason why we stopped telling people to get Winter Mist and Winter Mountain at True Value and have Lowes mix it up. Also, the Lowes paint staff in my experience are a lot more knowledgeable than the True Value staff.

Plus lower grade paints have more clays and fillers in them.

"Make everything as simple as possible, but no simpler." - Albert Einstein
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post #596 of 615 Old 07-19-2008, 10:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wbassett View Post

I think cost and quality are a lot like neutral and gloss/sheen. There is a point where it's money spent for no extra gain in performance. However there is a happy medium too... ColorPlace is absolutely horrible paint, and I'll even say so is TruColors brand. That's one reason why we stopped telling people to get Winter Mist and Winter Mountain at True Value and have Lowes mix it up. Also, the Lowes paint staff in my experience are a lot more knowledgeable than the True Value staff.

Plus lower grade paints have more clays and fillers in them.

I think you may have misunderstood my point. Within the Valspar product line the Signature Matte may be a better wall paint than the Flat Enamel but that does not necessarily make it a better screen paint.

I have had an opportunity to use the Flat Enamel and was quite impressed with it from a screen paint point of view. Now that I am inclined to recommend the Flat Enamel the Signature Matte is being suggested by you. If indeed it is as good or demonstrates better performance than the VFE as an OTS screen paint, I would like to have a chance to see that and then be able to recommend it also or instead of the VFE in the Quick Reference I am working on.

That is if there are any photos from the testing that you or your team have done. If there are no comparison photos then I will stick to recommending what I am familiar with and can demonstrate myself.
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post #597 of 615 Old 07-19-2008, 11:38 AM
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I should mention that within a brand and certainly across brands the terms "Flat", "Flat Enamel", "Matte", and "Ultra Matte" have been seen to mean quite a variety of things. Therefore it is difficult to know exactly what level of sheen or gloss you will get without comparing one sample panel to another.

I have also noticed that you cannot really judge how a paint will perform without making up fairly big samples and putting them in front of a projector.

So please don't read any lack of trust in you into my request. It is more a lack of trust in the nomenclature employed in the consumer wall paint industry and the knowledge that DIY Screen paint and wall paint goals tend to be at cross purposes.
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post #598 of 615 Old 10-14-2009, 06:25 PM
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Hi,

This is a great thread... lots of good info. But can someone clarity something for me? Are you guys talking about paint for your screen... or just paint for the surrounding walls? (or is that the same?)

I am looking for some nice neutral gray paint for my walls (I already have a screen) and am having trouble getting that neutral paint. I would love something similar to Munsell N7 or N6 (I like a darker room).

thanks,
Peter
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post #599 of 615 Old 10-14-2009, 11:49 PM - Thread Starter
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This thread is about paint for your screen. OTS- Off The Shelf.

This is an option that often gets overlooked and buried in the dust because the mindset is it has to be complicated and complex to be good. To be frank, some of these OTS grays dusted off $2,000 plus commercial screens and more than held their own against more complex DIY options. Of course there are people that will swear this isn't true, but it is.

OTS is a very viable option and is also the best way for a person to determine whether they are a white screen or gray screen person. From there you have to decide if you are a deep dark inky black person or a white as white can be person.

There is no one screen for all... but there is a screen option out there for everyone.

"Make everything as simple as possible, but no simpler." - Albert Einstein
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post #600 of 615 Old 01-14-2012, 06:06 PM
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This is a sort of bump, and a, "Where do I go from here?" post.

I spent a lot of hours reading through this thread (many thanks to wbasset and other pioneers for all you've done here), only to get to the end and find nothing's been posted for over 2 years? I was ready to go out and get a can of SW Grey Screen or TV Winter Mist, but now I'm wondering if this thread is outdated and better things have been found than these neutral OTS solutions, or if wbasset and others ended up continuing their research in another thread that I should pick up on in order to find the ultimate conclusions they've come to. If so, any recommended threads for me to start on? I'd like to know what conclusions have been drawn at this point...

It sounded like wbassett had tried laminates, but found these neutral grey paints to be better. Any difinitive word on laminate's vs. paints?

I know much depends on my setup. I have a Epson 8500UB, long throw of 22', low but still there ambient light, and like my image big, like 176" diagonal at 2.35:1 (willing to go smaller, if laminate turns out the best route for example, given standard sheet size).

Thanks again for all you guys' research, time, and effort.

Joe
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