Technical Reviews/Comments on SACD/DVD-A - Page 7 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #181 of 256 Old 08-31-2011, 03:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by streetsmart88 View Post
Bluray concert

Format: DTS-HD MA and Lossless Stereo

Genre: Classical-Pop fusion. In the similar style of Il Divo and Andrea Bocelli

MCH layer Sound Quality (Transparency, Detail and Dynamics): 3 to 4

This will be my reference recording for the near-bottom of recording quality.
I might need to buy your two extremes just to hear your yardstick.

Jeff

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post #182 of 256 Old 09-02-2011, 02:25 AM
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Format: SACD Multi-Ch / Stereo

Genre: Jazz

MCH layer Sound Quality (Transparency, Detail and Dynamics): 8
I very much wanted to give this a higher rating because I like listening to it. However, after carefully listening, I think that an 8 may be generous. Firstly, there is audible compression. A lot of high frequency detail is lost. More importantly, the vocals are treated in a very strange way -- you have almost equal vocals coming from the LCR speakers. The same material coming from 3 different speakers produces something quite strange - it's a stereo hybrid, meaning that you need to sit right at the sweet spot. A foot to the right or left and the image of the voice is messed up.

Stereo layer Sound Quality (Transparency, Detail and Dynamics): Not rated

Vocals: As previously stated, equally from the LCR speakers.

System Info
Player: Oppo 80
AVR: Denon 4311
Audyssey MultEQ XT32 and Pro utilized, but not Dynamic EQ or DSX

Main Amplification: 3 x Emotiva XPA-1

Speakers (only 5 main channels used for the review, although system can do 11 channels)
FR/FL: Focal Maestro Utopia
Center: Focal Viva Utopia
Surrounds: Focal Profile 908
Surround angle from CC: 110°

Sub(s): 2 x SVS PB-13 Ultra and 2 x Paradigm Servo-15 v2

The room is well treated.

Mark
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post #183 of 256 Old 09-02-2011, 06:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Added to listing post, Mark. I really think your description is frank and addresses a subject which roiled this thread some days ago - personal feelings for the music affecting the assessment of sound quality. Nice job!

Looks like you and Marcus have a thing for Claire.

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post #184 of 256 Old 09-02-2011, 09:46 PM
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Jeff, I see nothing wrong with the beauty of the artist influencing our judgment of the technical quality of the music! LOL.

Marcus


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Originally Posted by pepar View Post

Added to listing post, Mark. I really think your description is frank and addresses a subject which roiled this thread some days ago - personal feelings for the music affecting the assessment of sound quality. Nice job!

Looks like you and Marcus have a thing for Claire.

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post #185 of 256 Old 09-03-2011, 01:13 AM - Thread Starter
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I must admit that I feel the same about Diana Krall. .

"The future is already here, it's just not evenly distributed." W. Gibson

"I like the future, I'm in it." F. Theater
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post #186 of 256 Old 09-03-2011, 11:40 PM
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Title: Reptile

Format: DVD-Audio Multi-Ch / Stereo

Genre: Blues

MCH layer Sound Quality (Transparency, Detail and Dynamics): 9

Lead vocals are solidly anchored at the center channel. The back-up vocals are at the LR speakers and have a wider image.

As is typical of Clapton, there are quite a lot of instruments, including 3 guitars, bass, drums, piano, organ, percussion and harmonica. The recording excels in separating the instruments from each other.

There is a lot of detail, my favorite being the plucking of a steel acoustic guitar - almost real. There is also a lot of beautiful high frequency detail, especially with percussion.

As is proper for a good blues concert, the bass and drums provide a good thump, almost compelling your head to bob with the beat.

The main problem lies with the surrounds, where the mixer put the reflections of some instruments, including the drums and cymbals. In some tracks, you can hear a faint cymbal sound from the left surround and that is so wrong. Initially, I actually thought there was something wrong with my speakers. Without this weakness, the disc should have gotten a near perfect score.

Stereo layer Sound Quality (Transparency, Detail and Dynamics): Not rated

System Info
Player: Oppo 80
AVR: Denon 4311
Audyssey MultEQ XT32 and Pro utilized, but not Dynamic EQ or DSX

Main Amplification: 3 x Emotiva XPA-1

Speakers (only 5 main channels used for the review, although system can do 11 channels)
FR/FL: Focal Maestro Utopia
Center: Focal Viva Utopia
Surrounds: Focal Profile 908
Surround angle from CC: 110°

Sub(s): 2 x SVS PB-13 Ultra and 2 x Paradigm Servo-15 v2

The room is well treated.

Mark
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post #187 of 256 Old 09-05-2011, 04:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Mark,

Would you say that this is mixed with an "in the audience" perspective with the surrounds used mainly for ambiance, or are the "reflections" you mention attempts to "thicken" the subject instrument or perhaps image it between a front left (or right) channel and the corresponding surround?

Jeff

Quote:
Originally Posted by streetsmart88 View Post

The main problem lies with the surrounds, where the mixer put the “reflections” of some instruments, including the drums and cymbals. In some tracks, you can hear a faint cymbal sound from the left surround and that is so wrong. Initially, I actually thought there was something wrong with my speakers. Without this weakness, the disc should have gotten a near perfect score.

Mark


"The future is already here, it's just not evenly distributed." W. Gibson

"I like the future, I'm in it." F. Theater
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post #188 of 256 Old 09-05-2011, 10:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

Mark,

Would you say that this is mixed with an "in the audience" perspective with the surrounds used mainly for ambiance, or are the "reflections" you mention attempts to "thicken" the subject instrument or perhaps image it between a front left (or right) channel and the corresponding surround?

Jeff

Jeff,

Yes, this is an "in the audience" perspective. The surrounds are mainly for ambience, not to create an image between the fronts and surrounds ... if that had been the intention, it doesn't work at all.

Regarding the voice anchored in the center channel -- a few months ago, I bought a new center speaker so I looked for concerts with the vocals solely (or mainly) in the center. To my surprise, I did not find many. I think most people don't realize this and automatically think that in multi-channel music, the vocals are always in the center.

Mark
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post #189 of 256 Old 09-06-2011, 05:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks, Mark. The center channel is a development that came from the movie industry, and they have the only standards/common practices in place that call for dialog to be in that channel. Dialog may be "shouldered" in the left and right front channels, but if the person speaking in nearly anywhere on the screen, their voice is predominantly in the CC.

With music, CC usage varies from engineer to engineer ... as you have observed.

Jeff

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post #190 of 256 Old 09-06-2011, 03:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post


With music, CC usage varies from engineer to engineer ... as you have observed.

Jeff

Technically, isn't that wrong to have the same signal coming from 3 different speakers? As I've observed, this results in a quasi-stereo system wherein the listener has to anchor himself in the sweet spot. On the other hand, when you have a MCh system with the vocals in the center channel, you can literally sit anywhere and you don't lose the correct image of the singer at the center.

My guess is that some sound engineers mix the MCh tracks for stereo and then just add content to the other channels. This would result in the vocals in the LR channels and then the engineer adds the same vocals to the center channel. In this way, the center channel only supports the vocals which are coming mainly from the LR. I think this isn't the right way to do it. There should be a totally different standard for MCh mixing.

Mark
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post #191 of 256 Old 09-18-2011, 05:41 PM
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Title Info: James Horner, A Beautiful Mind

Format: SACD, 5.1 Surround

Genre: Soundtrack

Label: Decca U.S. (October 29, 2002)

Rating (scale 1 - 10): 10

MCH layer Sound Quality (Transparency, Detail and Dynamics): I love soundtracks. When SACD first came out there were several soundtracks produced. Unfortunately, within a couple of years the format was abandoned. Since soundtrack music is engineered for multi channel surround, I don't get why the format failed except for greedy commercial record labels that place $$$ over artistry. I do hope Blu-Ray audio will revive distribution of soundtracks in high resolution multi channel surround. These are modern day symphonies, in my opinion.

James Horner has composed so many great soundtracks over the years. This one is no exception. SACD will give you a rich immersion in to the haunting world of Dr. John Nash. Sample the music for yourself and if you can find the SACD, get a copy. Truly a wonderful listening experience. I play this SACD often!

Stereo layer Sound Quality: Not Rated



System Info
Player: OPPO 93
Pre/pro: Integra 80.2 (Audyssey enabled)
Amplification: Outlaw 755 (5 Channel)
FR/FL: Polk LSi9
Center: Polk LSiC
Surrounds: Polk LSiFx
Surround angle from CC: Behind Listener
Rear surround angle from CC: None
Sub(s): 2 Polk PSW505s
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post #192 of 256 Old 09-18-2011, 06:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for your review. It's in the listing post. My 5508 went back for repair of the IDE cable issue. When it comes back I expect to be back in the listening and reviewing business.

Jeff

"The future is already here, it's just not evenly distributed." W. Gibson

"I like the future, I'm in it." F. Theater
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post #193 of 256 Old 09-29-2011, 10:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brockwilt View Post

Wow! I thought the love album was a fantastic sounding DVD -A. I would rate it higher. At least an 8. Possibly a 9 IMO

I agree. I have WOWed many of my friends with this excellent disc. Some comments from them after listening to the LOVE disc include:
"OMG"
"I have goosebumps."
"I've never heard anything that sounded as good as that."

Of course these comments came from people who haven't heard much in the way of SACD or DVD-A.

I'm reserving my SQ rating until I have a sufficient amount of SACD/DVD-A material to compare it to.
I only have a few...so far.

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post #194 of 256 Old 09-30-2011, 11:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post

Jeff,

Do you wear a mask and a cape? All the 9- and 10- SACDs are packed and ready to go. Where should I ship them.

Bill

Hey, if I get into a debate (Argument) with you guys, can I get you to ship me your SACDs too?

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post #195 of 256 Old 09-30-2011, 12:37 PM - Thread Starter
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I'd ship you my broken cases ... if you won the debate.

Jeff

"The future is already here, it's just not evenly distributed." W. Gibson

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post #196 of 256 Old 10-02-2011, 11:01 AM
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^^^


How do you know who won? Should we take a poll like they do after the presidential debates?

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Do you have a review to contribute?

"The future is already here, it's just not evenly distributed." W. Gibson

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post #198 of 256 Old 10-02-2011, 11:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

Do you have a review to contribute?

Not yet....

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post #199 of 256 Old 10-03-2011, 06:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Nice theater!

"The future is already here, it's just not evenly distributed." W. Gibson

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post #200 of 256 Old 10-11-2011, 12:57 PM
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Sorry if the question is in the wrong thread.

I´m planning to purchase a multichannel player. But not sure about the supported formats.

SACD, DVD-A, DSD, etc.

What is the most current format that is must to have?

Is any of the mentioned formats downloadable and playable on HDD players?

Recommendations about equipment?

Thanks
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post #201 of 256 Old 10-11-2011, 01:30 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charlyz View Post

Sorry if the question is in the wrong thread.

I´m planning to purchase a multichannel player. But not sure about the supported formats.

SACD, DVD-A, DSD, etc.

What is the most current format that is must to have?

Is any of the mentioned formats downloadable and playable on HDD players?

Recommendations about equipment?

Thanks

Direct Stream Digital is the audio "format" os SACD. Meridian Lossless Packing is the audio format on DVD-A. Just look for a player that has all the logos on it. These days, most decent players handle it all. Some will also stream from the internet and/or your local digital storage.

Some companies offer hi definition downloads.

Jeff

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post #202 of 256 Old 10-11-2011, 03:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

Direct Stream Digital is the audio "format" os SACD. Meridian Lossless Packing is the audio format on DVD-A. Just look for a player that has all the logos on it. These days, most decent players handle it all. Some will also stream from the internet and/or your local digital storage.

Some companies offer hi definition downloads.

Jeff

I do not recall any player that can work with SACD and DVD-A images on hard disk/via network. So you are stuck with physical media for these two formats. You always can convert them to multichannel FLAC files. But it is a time consuming process, and again only minority of media players support multichannel FLAC. For physical media currently the best choice is OPPO 93. It plays almost all disks and many media files.
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post #203 of 256 Old 10-11-2011, 03:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ap1 View Post

I do not recall any player that can work with SACD and DVD-A images on hard disk/via network. So you are stuck with physical media for these two formats. You always can convert them to multichannel FLAC files. But it is a time consuming process, and again only minority of media players support multichannel FLAC. For physical media currently the best choice is OPPO 93. It plays almost all disks and many media files.

The Oppo 93 will stream DVD-A ISO's from USB storage.

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post #204 of 256 Old 10-12-2011, 05:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post


The Oppo 93 will stream DVD-A ISO's from USB storage.

Now they need to add SACD ISO support to make it THE ultimate player.
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post #205 of 256 Old 10-12-2011, 08:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ap1 View Post

Now they need to add SACD ISO support to make it THE ultimate player.

I don't look for that to happen. I'm not even sure that networked media players support that.

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post #206 of 256 Old 10-12-2011, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

I don't look for that to happen. I'm not even sure that networked media players support that.

OPPO does support playback of SACD copy on DVD-R media. ISO will be the next logical step.
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post #207 of 256 Old 10-12-2011, 03:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ap1 View Post

OPPO does support playback of SACD copy on DVD-R media. ISO will be next logical step.

Wouldn't a copy be bit-for-bit identical to the original? If so, the Oppo wouldn't know. An ISO is identical to the original too, but it still needs to be "mounted" and that makes the difference.

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post #208 of 256 Old 10-12-2011, 07:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

Direct Stream Digital is the audio "format" os SACD. Meridian Lossless Packing is the audio format on DVD-A. Just look for a player that has all the logos on it. These days, most decent players handle it all. Some will also stream from the internet and/or your local digital storage.

Some companies offer hi definition downloads.

Jeff

Ok, thanks for explanation.
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post #209 of 256 Old 10-12-2011, 07:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ap1 View Post

I do not recall any player that can work with SACD and DVD-A images on hard disk/via network. So you are stuck with physical media for these two formats. You always can convert them to multichannel FLAC files. But it is a time consuming process, and again only minority of media players support multichannel FLAC. For physical media currently the best choice is OPPO 93. It plays almost all disks and many media files.

Ok, So, SACD and DVD-A are 2 well established formats?

tks
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post #210 of 256 Old 10-12-2011, 07:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

The Oppo 93 will stream DVD-A ISO's from USB storage.

Great, but.. How can I get those ISO´s???

Are those ISO´s available to purchase online?
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