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post #2941 of 3953 Old 02-23-2019, 11:20 AM
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Chicago
Chicago III

From the Quadio Box Set
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post #2942 of 3953 Old 02-23-2019, 12:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kezug View Post
Thanks, want to sell it also what is DDD?
DDD - Digital recording, Digital mixing, Digital transfer.

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post #2943 of 3953 Old 02-23-2019, 12:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rbrb View Post
DVD-Audio is the equivalent of today's MQA. Both technologies were created by the same guy. They are both essentially DRM schemes.
It don't think it makes any real difference to play DVD-A as regular DVD. It's one of those theoretical differences that only matters to people with OCD.

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post #2944 of 3953 Old 02-23-2019, 03:06 PM
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SO, I received the The Who - Tommy DVD-A. I do not have a dedicated DVD-Audio player nor SACD player, but I do have a DVD player in my computer.

My computer can play this, via VLC via digital optical output TOSLINK cable from my PC to my Receiver. I set the output on my pc to be DTS Interactive (5.1 Sound) and voila, I have DTS showing up on my Receiver and I do hear all my channels being active.

Questions:

For true 5.1 playback, during Overture, when vocal begins, what speaks will output the singing (I ask because I hear it 2 different ways depending on playback and I want to be sure I am in the most discrete mode I should be).

Is the 5.1 output the same as what a dedicated DVD-Audio player can do or is this way not considered discrete and a dedicated player is much much better???

If I played this on a dedicated player will DTS show on my player or will PCM show?

Is this the same thing as getting a dedicated DVD Player that can play DVD-Audio?


Hmm, a comparison of VLC playback vs DVD Audio Extractor playback (nothing ripped just regular playback) is that DVDAE seems to output discrete 5.1 as Tommy sounds more separated. VLC is outputted 5.1 but it is not as spacial (if that makes sense)


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post #2945 of 3953 Old 02-23-2019, 03:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drh3b View Post
According to Crutchfield, it doesn't.
Do you have a computer hooked up to your system, and do you play music files? If so, you can buy an inexpensive program that will rip DVD Audio to Flac. It is free to try. I've been using it for a year or two, very useful for someone like me who plays almost all music from my HTPC.
http://www.dvdae.com
Here is a list of DVD Audio players.
http://dvd-a.net/universal_blu-ray_disc_players.html
Make sure you double check, unfortunately information on the internet isn't always reliable.
I'd look for the Yamaha ones on ebay. They will probably be more reliable than the Pioneer ones. Most of the others will probably be too expensive
That being said, check your PM.
Once you rip to FLAC, then what software do you use to play the 5.1 audio?
How is this different that just using VLC to play the actual DVD>output to TOSLINK cable via DTS 5.1?

I checked my PM and replied, but I cant see your PM anymore.
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post #2946 of 3953 Old 02-23-2019, 04:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kezug View Post
Once you rip to FLAC, then what software do you use to play the 5.1 audio?
How is this different that just using VLC to play the actual DVD>output to TOSLINK cable via DTS 5.1?

I checked my PM and replied, but I cant see your PM anymore.
I use either Jriver or Media Monkey via WASAPI through HDMI to play files . I'm not sure of exactly the way you are doing it works, tbh. I plan on making sure the Pioneer player is working tomorrow(Sunday) and will get back to you on that.

I actually rip all my SACD and DVD-A to files, and play them as above.

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post #2947 of 3953 Old 02-23-2019, 04:09 PM
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Originally Posted by drh3b View Post
I use either Jriver or Media Monkey via WASAPI through HDMI to play files . I'm not sure of exactly the way you are doing it works, tbh. I plan on making sure the Pioneer player is working tomorrow(Sunday) and will get back to you on that.

I actually rip all my SACD and DVD-A to files, and play them as above.

Thanks. I really think playing from DVD Audio Extractor the channels are discrete, but playback using DVDAE sometimes does odd pauses, unsure why. Playback of the OGG files are without any pause, but the sound isnt as discrete but all 5 speakers are engaged. Unsure which way is right!
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post #2948 of 3953 Old 02-23-2019, 07:02 PM
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Thanks, want to sell it
It's still in print actually, only $17 or so on Amazon! I just checked my order history and I got it for $19 on Amazon back in 2007, so it's even cheaper now. Amazing.

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post #2949 of 3953 Old 02-23-2019, 09:09 PM
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No need to bother with the Primus Willy Wonka album. The 5.1 mix is great but musically, it is borderline unlistenable. I never thought the music in Willy Wonka was that good, and Primus does it as a bad impression of the Residents. They make some interesting sounds, but it's wrapped around no real idea at all.
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post #2950 of 3953 Old 02-24-2019, 12:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sworth View Post
It don't think it makes any real difference to play DVD-A as regular DVD. It's one of those theoretical differences that only matters to people with OCD.
OCD ? I must be OCD as I much prefer playing DVD-As on a DVD-A player for the hi-res audio. So to you lossless compared to lossy is "theoretical"? Do you find there's no real difference in SQ with music audio titles on DVD in Dolby Digital compared to Blu-rays in DTS-HD MA?

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post #2951 of 3953 Old 02-24-2019, 08:08 AM
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Chicago
Chicago V

From the Quadio Box Set
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post #2952 of 3953 Old 02-24-2019, 08:52 AM
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Chicago
Chicago VI

From the Quadio Box Set
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post #2953 of 3953 Old 02-24-2019, 02:47 PM
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I've done controlled level matched, direct A/B switched blind comparisons with high bitrate lossy, 16/44.1 and 24/96 and there is a point where the bitrate is sufficient to reproduce the sound with audible transparency. You can up the bitrate to get a lower noise floor and up the sampling rate to include super-audible frequencies, but for the purposes of listening to music in the home at reasonable volume levels, it all sounds the same to human ears. There are scientific studies conducted by members of the AES that have found the same thing. The point of audible transparency varies from person to person, but I've never found anyone who can consistently identify AAC256 or MP3 LAME 320 from anything higher. Varying the bit rate can make it even more forgiving. I think the rush towards higher and higher data rates is basically a marketing ploy based on branding of little logos on covers of discs. It appeals to the fear in consumers and encourages them to spend more because there might be some potential sound they are missing, even if they can't hear the difference at all in the real world.

If you're interested in how lossy codecs perform, I have a listening test that includes samples of three different codecs (AAC, MP3 LAME, Fraunhofer MP3) at three different data rates (192, 256, 320 CBR), along with a lossless sample. Ten samples in all randomly distributed in a lossless wrapper. If anyone wants to try it and see where their threshold lies for normal listening to music in their home, just let me know and I'll set you up. It involves ranking the ten samples from best to worst. It takes a little while to take the test, but it is very informative and a bit humbling, especially if you have only depended on abstract numbers on a spec sheet in the past.

A lot of the general knowledge you find in audiophile forums just plain isn't true. It's basically sales pitch cribbed from marketing tear sheets repeated so many times by people who haven't bothered to check for themselves, everyone just assumes it's true. The best way to know what matters and what doesn't is to do some homework to try to understand how digital audio works, and to perform simple controlled tests yourself to understand what the dBs and Hz's you're reading about relate to in real world sound that you can hear with your ears.

I recommend these two videos from a seminar by Ethan Winer at an Audio Engineering Society conference...

AES Audio Myths Seminar https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x59xvic
AES Damn Lies Seminar

...and this article which provides a lot of good information about the impact of higher data rates on audible sound fidelity.

CD Sound Is All You Need https://xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html

Hope you find it useful! (sorry, the forum automatically embeds youtube videos)
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post #2954 of 3953 Old 02-24-2019, 03:33 PM
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Guys, if you want to discuss codecs and 5.1 computer hookups, maybe you should start a new thread on it. You’re interrupting all the people listening to Chicago albums.
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post #2955 of 3953 Old 02-24-2019, 03:35 PM
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Grateful Dead - American Beauty (DVD-A)
Grateful Dead - Workingman's Dead (DVD-A)
Donald Fagen - Morph The Cat (DVD-A) - This has to be one of the best sounding surround albums ever made.
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post #2956 of 3953 Old 02-24-2019, 03:57 PM
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Guys, if you want to discuss codecs and 5.1 computer hookups, maybe you should start a new thread on it. You’re interrupting all the people listening to Chicago albums.
All I have to say is everyone better be listening to the Quadio box set in numerical order ! If not then their "OCD Audiophile" membership will be revoked !

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post #2957 of 3953 Old 02-24-2019, 04:19 PM
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All I have to say is everyone better be listening to the Quadio box set in numerical order ! If not then then their "OCD Audiophile" membership will be revoked !

Bill
I'm in compliance....
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post #2958 of 3953 Old 02-24-2019, 04:21 PM
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The Doors
Strange Days

From Infinite Box Set
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post #2959 of 3953 Old 02-24-2019, 05:52 PM
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Guys, if you want to discuss codecs and 5.1 computer hookups, maybe you should start a new thread on it. You’re interrupting all the people listening to Chicago albums.
Hahahaha!!!

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post #2960 of 3953 Old 02-24-2019, 08:45 PM
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Been busy testing a Pioneer multiplayer to make sure it's saleable. If the sale doesn't happen, I'll put it up on ebay, as I'll never use it again myself, and I've been meaning to do that for a year or two anyway. In any case, I've played an SACD, DVD-Audio, selections from a Blu Ray Audio, and currently listening to the DTS 96/24 track of a DVD. So far it's worked great! I've had multi channel music for 15 years, but until I replaced my speakers 3 years ago, I never got into it. Now, I've replaced them again(the last time, at least for the foreseeable future) and am really enjoying it.





Selections from(Blu Ray Audio):



I loved this when it came out, played to death, still like it. DTS 96/24 DVD.



And for good measure, my favorite track off my favorite DTS CD, "Nineteen Hundred And Eighty Five", one of the best uses of multi channel out there, imo, and one that I discovered thanks to this thread.



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post #2961 of 3953 Old 02-25-2019, 09:38 AM
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DVD-Audio is the equivalent of today's MQA. Both technologies were created by the same guy. They are both essentially DRM schemes.
Not true.
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post #2962 of 3953 Old 02-25-2019, 03:54 PM
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All I have to say is everyone better be listening to the Quadio box set in numerical order ! If not then their "OCD Audiophile" membership will be revoked !

Bill
I only have the Quadio CTA but have serious OCD. Does that mean I have to listen to CTA over and over again?
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post #2963 of 3953 Old 02-25-2019, 03:58 PM
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King Crimson - Meltdown Live in Mexico

A real nice immersion mix, not the usual crowd and hall ambiance in the rears that too many live albums suffer from. And it wasn’t mixed by Jakko.
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post #2964 of 3953 Old 02-25-2019, 05:41 PM
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I only have the Quadio CTA but have serious OCD. Does that mean I have to listen to CTA over and over again?
No you're good .

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post #2965 of 3953 Old 02-26-2019, 01:24 AM
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Originally Posted by ti-triodes View Post
King Crimson - Meltdown Live in Mexico

A real nice immersion mix, not the usual crowd and hall ambiance in the rears that too many live albums suffer from. And it wasn’t mixed by Jakko.
The video on Meltdown is a completely different (and inferior) mix to the audio only one. I made the mistake of watching the video before listening to the audio one.
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post #2966 of 3953 Old 02-26-2019, 03:55 PM
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The video on Meltdown is a completely different (and inferior) mix to the audio only one. I made the mistake of watching the video before listening to the audio one.
Interesting. For some reason I only listened to the video concert in stereo and the audio in surround. The stereo sounded very similar. If I get a chance I’ll give them a comparison in 5.1.
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post #2967 of 3953 Old 02-26-2019, 06:34 PM
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Interesting. For some reason I only listened to the video concert in stereo and the audio in surround. The stereo sounded very similar. If I get a chance I’ll give them a comparison in 5.1.
It sounded to me like they did some redubbing and sweetening to the audio only track. I think it's a much more finessed mix than the one on the video. I'm pretty sure it isn't the same track branched.
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Another Vocalion. The mix is very lush and discrete. The music is mostly OK, by my tastes.


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post #2969 of 3953 Old 02-27-2019, 05:43 PM
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Tom Petty And The Heartbreakers
Damn The Torpedoes
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. . . . . . . . . . . . . . .THE
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . .LOOK
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . .OF
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . .LOVE

diana krall



(SACD Multi-Channel)
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Regards, Ken (Retired)
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