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post #31 of 46 Old 03-08-2019, 11:59 AM
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Originally Posted by captainbrent View Post
I have these and although I'm not at home to verify, I'm pretty sure that these are not DVD-A's but are DVD-V's. I do have them with me on a HD and I have them labeled as DVD's, not DVD-A's.
Captain, you are correct. My bad! I even have Tusk and I didn't check before posting. My meager defense is that I've been working on taxes for the K-kids, Mrs K, and me. When I'm done, I need to chill out with some great surround tunes.

I'll correct my post.

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post #32 of 46 Old 03-08-2019, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by kokishin View Post
Captain, you are correct. My bad! I even have Tusk and I didn't check before posting. My meager defense is that I've been working on taxes for the K-kids, Mrs K, and me. When I'm done, I need to chill out with some great surround tunes.

I'll correct my post.

hahaha, no worries, glad to be able to clarify...enjoy the chill time and tunes!
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post #33 of 46 Old 03-08-2019, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by impetigo View Post
I don't know the specs for DVD-V vs DVD-A for audio parameters, but would be interested to know if it is clear based just on what is available on the DVD. I found a review online that says it is a DVD-A but of course he could be wrong too.

https://www.hiresedition.com/review/...-the-moon.html



Discogs shows (but doesn't specify DVD-A or DVD-V):

https://www.discogs.com/Pink-Floyd-T...elease/3137117



Anyone know for certain if the MC DVD in the Immersion box set is a DVD-A or DVD-V? Unfortunately, my used box set I got on ebay didn't even have it as the seller supposedly didn't realize it was missing. I kept it anyway since the price was quite low (~$50).



Thanks, will have to look into those as well. Shame that DVDs with primarily audio were made as DVD-V and not DVD-A. Seems bizarre.
DVD-Video discs have a Video_TS folder with .VOB files (and other files) which contain the video and audio content. DVD-Audio discs have an Audio_TS folder with .AOB files (and other files) which contain audio content only. A DVD-Video disc does not contain an Audio_TS folder but a DVD-Audio disc can have a Video_TS folder. DVD-Video disc players or Blu-ray disc players can play a DVD-Video disc but it takes a more unique disc player designed to play a DVD-Audio disc.

For example, I have an older Panasonic Blu-ray disc player which can only play CD's, DVD-Video (and possibly the Video_TS folder but not the Audio_TS folder on a DVD-Audio disc) and Blu-ray discs. I have very old Pioneer DV-58AV disc player which will play CD's, DVD-Video and DVD-Audio discs as well as SACD discs but no Blu-ray discs. I have an Oppo 203 which play CD, DVD-Video, DVD-Audio, Blu-ray (HD & UHD), and SACD discs.

Confusion derives from the fact that some folks and reviewers will use the term "audio DVD" for a DVD-Video disc that is primary designed to play audio using Video_TS folder files.

You can dive into more DVD-Audio details here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD-Audio

Back to taxes.
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post #34 of 46 Old 03-08-2019, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by impetigo View Post
Thanks, will have to look into those as well. Shame that DVDs with primarily audio were made as DVD-V and not DVD-A. Seems bizarre.

Agreed but these discs still sound excellent, imo...I'm glad that I have them.
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post #35 of 46 Old 03-08-2019, 03:07 PM
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The DVDs in the Pink Floyd Immersion sets are DVD-V and not DVD-A. I know that as fact as I own all of the sets.

I wouldn't discount the DVDs from Fleetwood Mac deluxe box sets. They're all excellent and have great 5.1 mixes IMO. The one that is a bit puzzling is the 1975 S/T album in that there is no DTS audio just DD. Same can be said for the for the DVDs from the Jethro Tull deluxe book sets. The 4.0 and 5.1 mixes were done by Steven Wilson and are excellent. I would have preferred that the Fleetwood Mac and Jethro Tull DVDs were Blu-rays but it is what it is. I'm glad I didn't pass on these sets due to the fact they were DVDs.

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post #36 of 46 Old 03-08-2019, 03:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Well, I guess I'll add an asterisk next to those DVDs that are technically DVD-V but content is primarily music. So any others aside from the PF Immersion and the two Fleetwood Mac box set DVDs? Will add the Jethro Tull box sets too, although which ones have MC DVDs in them? I only found one.

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post #37 of 46 Old 03-08-2019, 04:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by impetigo View Post
Well, I guess I'll add an asterisk next to those DVDs that are technically DVD-V but content is primarily music. So any others aside from the PF Immersion and the two Fleetwood Mac box set DVDs? Will add the Jethro Tull box sets too.
I'm not sure how many DVD-V audio only titles are out there. But one set that comes to mind is Donald Fagan's Nighfly Trilogy box set. The interesting part is the DVDs are referred to as MVIs. I bought this set before I was able to find all of the Donald Fagen DVD-As. It's an excellent box set with bonus audio and video tracks. I believe some of the stereo layers are in hi-res. But I'm positive about that as I only played the multichannel mixes.

https://www.discogs.com/Donald-Fagen...elease/1492971

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post #38 of 46 Old 03-09-2019, 05:41 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Bill Mac View Post
I'm not sure how many DVD-V audio only titles are out there. But one set that comes to mind is Donald Fagan's Nighfly Trilogy box set. The interesting part is the DVDs are referred to as MVIs. I bought this set before I was able to find all of the Donald Fagen DVD-As. It's an excellent box set with bonus audio and video tracks. I believe some of the stereo layers are in hi-res. But I'm positive about that as I only played the multichannel mixes.

https://www.discogs.com/Donald-Fagen...elease/1492971

Bill
Ah, interesting... looks like it's available as a stand alone DVD-A and as a DVD-V in the box set. If a title's available as a stand alone DVD-A and a box set, I'll just list the stand alone version in the list.

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post #39 of 46 Old 03-09-2019, 09:30 AM
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The discs in Donald Fagen's Nightfly Trilogy are all standard DVDs with Dolby and DTS tracks. The box was part of the Music Video Interactive (MVI) experiment from some years ago, which didn't really pan out. The set is worth having for all the bonus materials, but if you want high-res audio all three albums have been available as standalone DVD-Audio discs (Morph the Cat was a two-disc set with a regular CD included). The box includes CDs for all the albums, along with a fourth disc of the bonus materials found on each of the DVDs.
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post #40 of 46 Old 03-09-2019, 11:59 PM
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The quality of DVD-Vs improved dramatically about 7 or 8 years ago. Most of the time, I can't tell the difference. Even the video quality made a huge leap with anamorphic discs.
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post #41 of 46 Old 03-31-2019, 06:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HomerJau View Post
Try these:

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/dvdalist.htm

Or the HiRes Poll, add a search/filter of: [D] to filter only DVDA releases
https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/TabbedPollChart.htm


The Beatles Love is still available I think and worth a listen.
The Quad site is the place for all things surround. You will get good deals on old stuff OOP stuff dvd audio. Then they moved the loss less format that dvd audio used right to Blu Ray. Tons of music coming up on BD.
Meridian Lossless Processing.

piss off then
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post #42 of 46 Old 05-17-2019, 03:08 PM
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Bought an Acura RDX 2013 a couple years back with the Tech Package which included a head unit that supported DVD-A. Never even knew DVD-A was a thing until recently after my purchase. It did come with a demo disc with quite a few tracks. First couple tracks they played a song in regular all channel stereo then again with the same song in true discrete surround sound. I was pretty blown away with the quality and the separation of the musical instruments.


This started me down the rabbit hole of trying to find more available music and there just wasn't really a large selection. I almost feel it was such a waste on Acura's part to include it but man... I just wish there were more titles. Unfortunately for me, I don't really listen to rock/band type music. I mainly listen to hip hop/r&b, some top 40 stuff etc. So correct me if I'm wrong, it's not like Kanye or Jay-Z has a DVD-A album right? Lol.
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post #43 of 46 Old 05-17-2019, 09:24 PM - Thread Starter
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So correct me if I'm wrong, it's not like Kanye or Jay-Z has a DVD-A album right? Lol.
There's a few multichannel hip-hop but not a lot. There are single album DVD-As by Ludacris and Outkast and a few more SACDs, like Destiny's Child (a few), Beyonce, Kelly Rowland, and Ginuwine. Sadly, can't think of much more than that.

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post #44 of 46 Old 05-18-2019, 01:37 PM
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Originally Posted by impetigo View Post
I don't know the specs for DVD-V vs DVD-A for audio parameters, but would be interested to know if it is clear based just on what is available on the DVD. I found a review online that says it is a DVD-A but of course he could be wrong too.
https://www.hiresedition.com/review/...-the-moon.html

Discogs shows (but doesn't specify DVD-A or DVD-V):
https://www.discogs.com/Pink-Floyd-T...elease/3137117
When something is labeled "DVD" or "DVD-Video" then it "typically" contains a Stereo PCM Track [up to [email protected], slightly better than CD with [email protected]] plus an optional DD5.1 type Track (aka "AC3", typically 448 kbps Compressed Composite Data Rate for ALL Channels) but may also be lower rate DD2.0 Stereo...or DTS5.1/6.1 embedded within the DD5.1 "Header" (typically 768 kbps Composite):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD-Video
https://www.maketecheasier.com/dts-vs-dolby-digital

BTW: DD5.1 on Blu-Ray can have a Composite Rate as high as 640 kbps...and DTS5.1/6.1 as high as 1.5 Mbps...which explains why they MAY sound better despite the very Lossy Data Compression.

Fol. info from Discogs shows that Disc 3 DVD (Audio Only) contains two DD5.1 Tracks at 448 kbps, one Stereo PCM Track and two DD5.1 Tracks at 640 kbps. And Disc 4 DVD: Audio-Visual Material is just what it says...a Standard DVD:

Disc 3 - DVD (Audio Only): The Dark Side Of The Moon Multi-Channel Audio Mixes 3-1 5.1 Surround Mix (2003), 448kbps
3-2 4.0 Quad Mix (1973), 448kbps
3-3 LPCM Stereo Mix (1973), Remastered In 2011
3-4 5.1 Surround Mix (2003), 640kbps
3-5 4.0 Quad Mix (1973), 640kbps

Disc 4 - DVD: Audio-Visual Material 4-1 Careful With That Axe, Eugene (Live In Brighton, 1972) 7:43 4-2 Set The Controls For The Heart Of The Sun (Live In Brighton, 1972) 9:13 4-3 The Dark Side Of The Moon 2003 Documentary 25:30 4-4 Concert Screen Films In LPCM Stereo And 5.1 Surround Mixes: British Tour 1974, French Tour 1974, North American Tour 1975

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post #45 of 46 Old 05-18-2019, 02:06 PM
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The "DVD-A" label SHOULD ONLY be used when that is what is contained within...which includes LOTS of alternative formats, incl. standard DVD Audio/Video format, Super Hi-Rez Stereo up to [email protected] PCM (for EACH of 2 channels) and also High-Rez Surround, each channel being up to [email protected] PCM (for EACH of 6 channels, so Max Total = 13.8 Mbps)....which then undergo the Meridian MLP Loss-Less Data Compression [typically only 1.5:1 reduction so perhaps 9 Mbps Max], which explains why the Video Content is typically much less than on a standard DVD, making room for Superb LOSS-LESS COMPRESSED, DISCRETE Surround Sound....ahhhhh, finally, Audio Nirvana....and "should" be SAME, [indistinguishable] AUDIO OUTPUT WAVEFORM as later Hi-Rez, Discrete Audio Formats using Loss-Less Compression (e.g. Dolby True HD and DTS-HD) to reduce the Data Rate and hence increase Disc Capacity:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD-Audio
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meridian_Lossless_Packing

Fol. are Digital Audio Format Details for FRAGILE-YES DVD-A. For each Audio Track you have your CHOICE of either Discrete Surround Sound OR Stereo. And when playing back the standard DVD-Video Tracks, it's available in either DD5.1 or DTS5.1: [PS: Not all Discogs listing for DVD-A's provides full Audio Details.]

DVD-Audio:
Advanced Resolution Surround Sound (96kHz/24-bit)
Advanced Resolution Stereo (96kHz/24-bit)

DVD-Video:
Dolby Digital & DTS 5.1 Surround Sound

DVD:
Photo Gallery
Lyrics
Animated Yes Timeline

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post #46 of 46 Old 05-18-2019, 02:47 PM
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^^^\
FWIW, the limitation of the DVD format isn't how much you can put on a disc, but the maximum possible bit rate when reading it. Generally limited to ~12Mb/sec for DVD-V and DVD-A. This limitation is due to the "1x" read speed mandated by the formats.
Apart from stereo audio, everything on a DVD-A is compressed using Dolby's MLP compression which is similar to FLAC.

Now, you can also use DVD for high res audio files making it a DVD-ROM, which can be spun as fast as needed and avoids the above 12Mb/sec limitation. Obviously that depends on a playback device that supports it. Very few of this type disc were ever sold, Chesky sold them before DVD-A was developed.

There is no industry standard for "what is DVD-A". All that's really common to them all is the use of lossless MLP compression for 5.1 content. (and the use of the "AUDIO_TS" folder structure). There are DVD-A discs out there with no visual content or menus of any kind that just play like a CD. There are DVD-A discs that have menus and audio selection but no DVD-V content at all. There are DVD-V discs with no video and high-res stereo audio too, usually called "HDAD" or the like.
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