Dolby and Universal Music Group are releasing thousands of songs in Dolby Atmos - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 26 Old 05-24-2019, 05:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Dolby and Universal Music Group are releasing thousands of songs in Dolby Atmos

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Dolby and Universal Music Group announced today that the pair will release ‘thousands of songs’ from the music label in the Dolby Atmos Music format.

The new, remastered versions of these songs will include “a diverse list of artists across a wide range of genres, from hip-hop, pop, and rock through jazz and classical music”. In an email to TechRadar, a Dolby representative explicitly mentioned “What’s Goin On” by Marvin Gaye, “7th heaven” by Beck, “Drive” by R.E.M. and “Mama said Knock You Out” by LL Cool J.
https://www.techradar.com/news/dolby...in-dolby-atmos

And the press release from Dolby:

https://news.dolby.com/en-WW/173266-...e-never-before
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post #2 of 26 Old 05-24-2019, 08:52 AM
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Songs? Not whole albums? How is this going to be distributed, like the Capitol "Inside the Music" series on discs organized by genre or something? Multichannel is based in physical media and physical media isn't built on songs like streaming and portable digital music is. It sounds like they're just picking a few odds and ends to prime the pump.
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post #3 of 26 Old 05-24-2019, 08:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sworth View Post
Songs? Not whole albums? How is this going to be distributed, like the Capitol "Inside the Music" series on discs organized by genre or something? Multichannel is based in physical media and physical media isn't built on songs like streaming and portable digital music is.
They're not saying yet, but movies and television can be streamed in multichannel, including in Dolby Atmos, so there's no reason multichannel music cannot be streamed. They'll definitely need support from a streaming service, though.
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post #4 of 26 Old 05-24-2019, 12:30 PM
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LOL. "Mama Said Knock You Out" in Atmos? "What's Goin' On" indeed.
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post #5 of 26 Old 05-26-2019, 11:14 AM
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Really looking forward to a LOT of immersive audio recording moving forward. It is quite the game changer, just need more of it out there.
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post #6 of 26 Old 05-29-2019, 01:38 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sworth View Post
Songs? Not whole albums? How is this going to be distributed, like the Capitol "Inside the Music" series on discs organized by genre or something? Multichannel is based in physical media and physical media isn't built on songs like streaming and portable digital music is. It sounds like they're just picking a few odds and ends to prime the pump.
The distribution will be made by music streaming services:

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Dolby's Atmos system, popular with high-end TVs and movie theaters for bringing multi-dimensional sound to the cinema, said Thursday it's adding music to its portfolio, and the company hopes to begin releasing tracks for streaming this year. Dolby says the technology lifts "songs with space, clarity and depth as never before."
https://eu.usatoday.com/story/tech/t...ic/1198076001/

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post #7 of 26 Old 05-30-2019, 10:23 AM
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Sounds pretty cool. I like the streaming part since it means we don't need to upgrade our SACD/blu-ray/DVD-A players. Also like that they're focusing on individual songs rather than albums, which would be more time consuming and limit the amount of releases (which these days seems to be limited to SDE). Too bad it's for Atmos, but hopefully they will have decent downmixing to 5.1 channels.

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post #8 of 26 Old 05-30-2019, 11:05 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by impetigo View Post
Too bad it's for Atmos, but hopefully they will have decent downmixing to 5.1 channels.
You do realize that Atmos has a core 5.1/7.1 track that is used if the player does not support Atmos, no?
No need for separate downmixing, it's "included" already.
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post #9 of 26 Old 05-30-2019, 01:00 PM
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I wonder how much of this will be new mixes off multitrack masters and how much will be unmixed from 2 channel sources.
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post #10 of 26 Old 05-31-2019, 12:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sworth View Post
I wonder how much of this will be new mixes off multitrack masters and how much will be unmixed from 2 channel sources.
In an interview with an engineer working on these Atmos mixes it mentions multitracks and more specifically that they won’t do Atmos remixing for older songs as there’s not enough tracks (Atmos for home can use 16 objects so pointless to try and spread a 4 track recording over 16 objects). He also mentioned he likes to place a mic on each drum in the drum kit and spread that around the room in Atmos. Anyway I’m pretty sure these will be discrete mixers from multitracks.

EDIT:
BTW The engineer (Steve Genewick) also mentions they’ve already completed ‘hundreds’ of songs
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post #11 of 26 Old 05-31-2019, 01:14 AM
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Originally Posted by impetigo View Post
... I like the streaming part ...
I see a few problems with streaming Atmos:

1. If this music format fails in a few years (like Quad LPs and Tapes, DVDA, SACD, BDA...) the server will be switched off, all your lovely Atmos music will be lost (unlike your DVDAs and other disc etc)

2. It’s likely due to licensing Universal USA will not stream to Europe, Australia and other countries.

3. A true HD 24 bit Atmos song is going to need good bandwidth (5000kbps). It’s not mp3 at 128kbps or 256. This may mean we’ll get 16bit lossy Atmos songs. Many Audiophiles will puke on that.

4. What app or equipment will be needed to stream Atmos? How does my BD player login to a new internet service and play my Atmos songs?

Personally I’d rather buy tracks and download. I can then keep my purchases permanently, I don’t need to worry about bandwidth or having a live internet connection to play. I can play the files on Existing equipment - my current BD players, media players, burn to disc etc.
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post #12 of 26 Old 05-31-2019, 01:34 AM
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Originally Posted by HomerJau View Post
I see a few problems with streaming Atmos:
Good points. I would prefer downloadable (physical seems unlikely).

Curious where my post that you quoted went, as it seems to be missing. Not sure why it would be removed, if that's what happened.
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post #13 of 26 Old 05-31-2019, 04:38 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by impetigo View Post
Curious where my post that you quoted went, as it seems to be missing. Not sure why it would be removed, if that's what happened.
Not removed, just a few posts back - link = https://www.avsforum.com/forum/112-s...l#post58118452

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post #14 of 26 Old 05-31-2019, 05:43 AM
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Originally Posted by HomerJau View Post
4. What app or equipment will be needed to stream Atmos? How does my BD player login to a new internet service and play my Atmos songs?
I guess any dedicated Atmos audio streaming service would function in much the same way as Netflix and Amazon do now.

Meaning, the receiving device (TV, UHD player or dedicated streamer) could send a lossy or lossless audio bit-stream via HDMI to your AVR.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HomerJau View Post
A true HD 24 bit Atmos song is going to need good bandwidth (5000kbps). It’s not mp3 at 128kbps or 256. This may mean we’ll get 16bit lossy Atmos songs.
Atmos movie soundtracks have been streaming using lossy Dolby Digital Plus that can have bitrates as low as 384kbps, though I don't know what's been the typical bitrate. Remains to be seen what bitrate will be used for streaming Atmos music.
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Many Audiophiles will puke on that.
Like they were going to listen to music in Atmos in the first place.
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post #16 of 26 Old 05-31-2019, 09:00 AM
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Like they were going to listen to music in Atmos in the first place.
So true...

My receiver will upmix 2 channel music into several surround options and most of them provide a very pleasing sound envelopment.

Background/secondary vocals/audio are more prominent from the rear and sides, high notes slightly more prominent overhead etc.
One song has birds in the beginning and they are definitely overhead.

The algorithms used must be fairly complex and yet subtle enough for a good soundfeild.

Most of the music files I have work very well for these modes, but there are a few that sound like carp(sic). I am sure a properly mixed surround with atmos would sound even better.
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post #17 of 26 Old 05-31-2019, 09:15 AM
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Originally Posted by dfa973 View Post
Not removed, just a few posts back - link = https://www.avsforum.com/forum/112-s...l#post58118452
Oh whoops, thanks. I thought I had posted another reply after that but apparently not.

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Originally Posted by SeeMoreDigital View Post
I guess any dedicated Atmos audio streaming service would function in much the same way as Netflix and Amazon do now.

Meaning, the receiving device (TV, UHD player or dedicated streamer) could send a lossy or lossless audio bit-stream via HDMI to your AVR.
But that’s not the way I want to listen to music (with my TV on). How long before our devices get the Atmos app? My current high end disc player (Oppo) doesn’t have an Android system, so no app for that. I’d need to hope my TV gets the app. Looks like new equipment = no streaming Atmos songs for me.

If it were downloads I’d buy a heap. I could put them on my music server (NAS) and play them as I play all my music now. With play lists or a remote app from my iPad. No TV if I don’t want one. Also I can play my favourite songs in any order, example: a song from a DVDA, then one from a BDA. If I’m using a dedicated Atmos app I’d need to switch devices, inputs, apps to play a song. That’s not the user experience I want.

I hope Universal realise this and offer These Atmos songs on disc or download otherwise many will reject this new system
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But that’s not the way I want to listen to music (with my TV on). How long before our devices get the Atmos app?
Or for something like Chromecast to support Atmos so you could stream from your phone.

Most music streaming is done with the algorithm picking the songs and assembling the playlist based on the user's taste. Maybe this will be designed to random shuffle like that.
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Like they were going to listen to music in Atmos in the first place.
There’s a huge number of music lovers that want high resolution lossless surround music. Many will only purchase lossless and will not buy lossy formats.
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post #21 of 26 Old 05-31-2019, 03:39 PM
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There’s a huge number of music lovers that want high resolution lossless surround music. Many will only purchase lossless and will not buy lossy formats.
Fewer and fewer people like that every day. I think they are aiming to make it more like Spotify.
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post #22 of 26 Old 06-01-2019, 03:44 AM
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But that’s not the way I want to listen to music (with my TV on).
It's not my favourite option either but it would be the easiest way for Dolby/Universal to get the service out in the wild. And for people with HDMI eARC televisions there's an option for a lossless audio service...

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How long before our devices get the Atmos app? My current high end disc player (Oppo) doesn’t have an Android system, so no app for that. I’d need to hope my TV gets the app. Looks like new equipment = no streaming Atmos songs for me.
Indeed... It's a great shame OPPO has pulled out of the media player/equipment market altogether. They might have developed an excellent media streamer.

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Why would anyone who loves music (audiophile or not) NOT be interested in hearing well-mixed immersive music?

The way I see it, Atmos brings several major benefits to music delivery and reproduction channels:

1- A means of delivering immersive, 3D audio mixes to a venue

2- Abstraction from the actual reproduction configuration, i.e it does not require specific speaker counts in specific locations to work
2.1 This is major, as the bane of all fixed-channel mapped systems was tight placement requirements that many deployments could (or would) not meet
2.2 Again, this akin to fixed pixel resolution jpg images vs. Vector drawings that are scaled at rendering time to the actual resolution of the output devices
3- Scalable encapsulation of the elements needed for reproduction of the format
3.1 As deployed on BluRay via Dolby TrueHD it is a lossless encode/decode path for all elements, from base 5.1 channels + up-to 128 positional objects
3.2 As deployed in streaming video services using DolbyDigital+ it uses lossy compression for the elements which reduces the required data rate but still delivers separation of base channels and objects to be dynamically rendered at playback.
4- The playback device, or Atmos renderer, is set up to map out the actual in-room deployment of speakers, then uses that information to render the objects in real-time to whatever is present. Which is why you can play the same track on a Trinnov powered 17.4.8 system as on a 5.1.4 and still hear the intended 3D audio reproduction. Just that the Trinnov rig will resolve more detail with possibly cleaner transitions from overheads to base-level.

I for one, am really happy to see this format be applied to music and to be supported in more and more gear, from $600 sound-bars to $100K+ Trinnov-powered home-theater / music rooms.

As for streaming vs purchased physical media, I think that discussion and associated preferences is orthogonal to the point about the format itself. And I tend to favor physical media myself, but value the option for streaming. For example, while I enjoy some electronica (which is quite suited for 3D audio), much of it is of not of long-term repeat-play interest to me, so streaming an immersive version from a subscription service I already pay for would be great.
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post #24 of 26 Old 06-01-2019, 09:50 AM
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Data rate shouldn't be an issue. If they can stream HD video with multichannel sound, they can certainly stream just the sound in good quality. As for having your TV on while you listen to music... the day is coming when a computer controls everything. The computer screen will be on all the time for you to control the TV and stereo.
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post #25 of 26 Old 06-03-2019, 05:04 AM
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Why would anyone who loves music (audiophile or not) NOT be interested in hearing well-mixed immersive music?
emphasize "well mixed" , and I would as the MCH+ upmix is rather poor via DSU IMO. Every potent MCH mix albums I own sounds worse via DSU vs 5.1, so a native Atmos mix might change that.

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post #26 of 26 Old 06-19-2019, 04:17 AM
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emphasize "well mixed" , and I would as the MCH+ upmix is rather poor via DSU IMO. Every potent MCH mix albums I own sounds worse via DSU vs 5.1, so a native Atmos mix might change that.
I recently setup my Home Theater and still evaluating the different ways of listening Stereo Music and 5.1 music with the different up-mixers. I have setup canonical Atmos Speakers positions and also canonical Auro-3D speaker positions. Reconfiguring via speaker switches.

Found that I like Multichannel 5.1 music up-mixed via Auro-3D Auromatic more than up-mixed with DSU. (Neural:X being an strange and different one).

This is, of course, track/original mix dependent. Some voices effects (Chorus) in some tracks are better positioned, for my listening taste, on top via VOG/TS from Auro-3D or perhaps the Height speakers imaging, than when listening via DSU upmix.

Hope Dolby or others restriction to cross upmixers will not be too much implemented in future.

On the other hand, the few Auro-3D native mixes are oriented to capturing real reverberation live soundstage, more than playing with effects panning around the different speakers. But the Atmos native music that I have listened is emphasizing much more in the effects of sounds or instruments panning around overhead.

So, I have much expectation on what will be released in Atmos native music.
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