Abbey Road Anniversary in Atmos - Page 3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #61 of 121 Old 10-02-2019, 01:37 PM
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Originally Posted by SeeMoreDigital View Post
Does anybody know what the actual technical specs of the Dolby TrueHD "Atmos" mix are? Is it say: 5.1.2, 5.1.4, 7.1.2, 7.1.4, etc...


Cheers
Curious about that myself.....
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post #62 of 121 Old 10-02-2019, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeeMoreDigital View Post
Does anybody know what the actual technical specs of the Dolby TrueHD "Atmos" mix are? Is it say: 5.1.2, 5.1.4, 7.1.2, 7.1.4, etc...


Cheers
I have a 5.1.4 Atmos system.

My Oppo 203 can only see/pass the Dolby TrueHD track which contains the Atmos metadata which my Denon 6200 decodes as Atmos.

According to the 203, it reports the Dolby TrueHD track as 7.1 at 48kHz.

The 203 reports the DTS-HD MA track is 5.1 at 96kHz.

I also tried checking the BD in my Win 10 Pro desktop using some software tools. Couldn't determine anything worth reporting. Cyberlink and VLC could not play the m2ts files most likely because of DRM. I didn't try ripping with mkv.

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post #63 of 121 Old 10-02-2019, 03:29 PM
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DISC INFO:

Disc Title: The Beatles - Abbey Road
Disc Label: THE BEATLES ABBEY ROAD 2019
Disc Size: 17,184,648,125 bytes
Protection: AACS
BDInfo: 0.7.5.5

PLAYLIST REPORT:

Name: 00001.MPLS
Length: 0: 47: 30.097 (h: m: s.ms)
Size: 15,889,938,432 bytes
Total Bitrate: 44.60 Mbps

VIDEO:

Codec Bitrate Description
----- ------- -----------
MPEG-4 AVC Video 15000 kbps 1080p / 23.976 fps / 16: 9 / High Profile 4.1

AUDIO:

Codec Language Bitrate Description
----- -------- ------- -----------
LPCM Audio English 4608 kbps 2.0 / 96 kHz / 4608 kbps / 24- bit
DTS-HD Master Audio English 7525 kbps 5.1 / 96 kHz / 7525 kbps / 24-bit (DTS Core: 5.1 / 48 kHz / 1509 kbps / 24-bit)
Dolby TrueHD / Atmos Audio English 14109 kbps 7.1 / 48 kHz / 13469 kbps / 24-bit (AC3 Embedded: 5.1 / 48 kHz / 640 kbps / DN -31dB)

Dolby Atmos (for home theaters) contains a TrueHD (or DD+) 7.1 track. And then it contains a substream of Dolby Atmos object metadata that can only be detected by Dolby Atmos enabled receivers.

When it's played on a regular home theater, the TrueHD 7.1 track will be played. When played on a Dolby Atmos receiver, the object metadata will cancel out the ones found in the 7.1 "bed", and dynamically reposition it depending on your speaker configuration.

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post #64 of 121 Old 10-02-2019, 03:34 PM
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Abbey Road is the audio equivalent of Star Wars. I've rebought them so many times over the years. Just take my money.
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post #65 of 121 Old 10-02-2019, 04:03 PM
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What’s the problem with the BD? It’s not playing at all on some OPPO’s or is it freezing during playback?
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post #66 of 121 Old 10-02-2019, 04:46 PM
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Originally Posted by ti-triodes View Post
What’s the problem with the BD? It’s not playing at all on some OPPO’s or is it freezing during playback?
No problem on my Oppo 203.
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post #67 of 121 Old 10-03-2019, 01:46 PM
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Fantastic mix/recording - very spacious and lots of weight in instruments but what is so nice about this atmos recording - not hearing any compression -
What a treat to be able to rip a recording - only limited by your equipment and playback threshold -
usually listen at pretty moderate levels but somethings fun to go to "home " concert 🍺🍺🍺🍺🍺🍺

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post #68 of 121 Old 10-03-2019, 03:48 PM
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No problem on my Oppo 203.
Thanks. I had no problems on an OPPO 205 and Cambridge CXU. I was just wondering if the problem was accessing the TOC or it was during playback.
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post #69 of 121 Old 10-03-2019, 08:46 PM
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People keep posting about "reports of playback problems" but so far not one actual report of playback problems has been posted here or at Blue-Ray.com. Ain't the internet great?
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post #70 of 121 Old 10-03-2019, 10:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GZAP1 View Post
No problem on my Oppo 203.
On my 203 it played well the first play through, but after some 15 minutes idle I tried to play it again but the cursor wouldn't even move and I had to restart the machine and then it worked. Haven't listened to it since to see if it's a recurrent problem... hopefully not!

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post #71 of 121 Old 10-04-2019, 07:56 AM
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Works perfect on the 203 and 205, Prob not on their DVD players lol
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post #72 of 121 Old 10-04-2019, 10:27 AM
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Last night I played the Abbey Road 5.1 mix, and it's clear that with a 5.1 system, this is better than the Atmos. The Atmos mix played in 5.1 had different instruments in each speaker. I didn't care for it at all. The 5.1 mix made a nice clear soundstage across the front. This is a less adventurous multichannel mix than the previous Beatles ones, and whenever there was a song that was also on Love, I preferred the Love mix, but overall it was good.

The lead vocals are always isolated in the center channel. This can tend to make them sound thin, and it appears that they tried to overcome that by boosting the level of the center a bit. Unfortunately, on my system, that messed up the relative balance of the lead and harmony vocals on Because and Sun King. To get the Beach Boys inspired vocal sounds they were aiming for, the balances have to be just right. I found that a -2dB correction on the center channel fixed it perfectly. Likewise, the rears were a little bit low, like in Sgt Pepper, but it seems that they split the difference. Instead of needing a +6dB boost to the rears, it only needed a +3dB correction. Once I got the levels right, the handoff from speaker to speaker is perfect. Her Majesty moves around the room with perfectly even volume.

This isn't my favorite Beatles album, but it's probably the one I've heard the most times. Every inch of it is burned into my brain from repeated playings over the years. It seems that they've decided to move away from exactly following the original mix like they did on Sgt Pepper and the White Album. I noticed several places that sounded quite different from the way I'm used to hear it, mostly in crescendos. She's So Heavy is all at a single level, without any slow build. The hammer hits in Maxwell weren't as clear as on the original album. And the vocals throughout the album sounded dryer and were presented exactly the same in each song, more like what I hear in Steven Wilson mixes, not like the way vocals used to be mixed with each song having is own sound envelope.

Overall it was a fairly conservative and functional multichannel mix, similar to the Elton John SACDs. The front soundstage was clear, the lead vocals completely isolated in the center, and if something was in the rear, it came from the corners. No attempt to create a front/back soundscape, or to try to place things in the phantom center between the rears. (Her Majesty deliberately avoided that.) There was nothing like Strawberry Fields where the sound swirls around in the middle of the room. This should help the mix sound better in less than optimal speaker installations and avoid the problems they had with consistency of presentation they had with Sgt Pepper.

I rank this one right between Sgt Pepper and the White Album. A good bread and butter multichannel mix. Glad I got it.
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post #73 of 121 Old 10-04-2019, 04:20 PM
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On my 5.2.4 ATMOS Setup the ATMOS Mix is much more dynamic and clear. The BASS and Drums pack more of a punch and the vocals are crystal clear. I switched back and forth and the DTS-HD-MA sounded flat by comparison. I had the same result when listening to the INXS Kick disc.
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post #74 of 121 Old 10-04-2019, 07:14 PM
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I think the different mixes are optimized for different systems. I don't think upscaling 5.1 to Atmos or folding down Atmos to 5.1 works as well as a dedicated mix designed for the system you're playing it on. I do know that level calibration seems to be a problem with these Beatles multichannel discs. All three have had different balances on my system, which is weird because just about everything else I have works fine at my default calibration. It could be that the LFE channel on the 5.1 might need a little boost too.

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post #75 of 121 Old 10-05-2019, 09:51 AM
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The Beatles' Abbey Road returns to number one 50 years on

"The Beatles' Abbey Road has returned to number one in the UK, 50 years after it first topped the album charts.
The Fab Four reclaimed the top spot with an expanded anniversary edition.
The feat also sees the album set a record - the gap of 49 years and 252 days since its initial chart-topping run ended in early 1970 is the longest gap before returning to number one."


etc. here.
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post #76 of 121 Old 10-07-2019, 04:20 PM
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Originally Posted by rdgrimes View Post
People keep posting about "reports of playback problems" but so far not one actual report of playback problems has been posted here or at Blue-Ray.com. Ain't the internet great?
There’s a large thread over at Hoffman. The problems are all over the place. Some discs won’t load at all, while some freeze during playback. Some people with problems have noted there is a visible blemish around 1 cm from the outside of the disc. It’s not only OPPO’s that are having problems. Universal is supposedly aware of the problems but has offered no solutions as of yet.
It should be noted there was a poll and the vast majority have no problems.

Still, there are way too many discs with authoring errors. The long term prospect of these things is a bit unsettling.
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post #77 of 121 Old 10-08-2019, 07:23 AM
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I had to clean all my discs before they would rip successfully, but once cleaned they seemed OK. There were a few retries, but everything seems OK in the end.

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post #78 of 121 Old 10-08-2019, 10:22 AM
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Plays fine in my Oppo. It must not be the mastering. Has to be funky manufacturing QC. They should just return it for exchange.
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post #79 of 121 Old 10-10-2019, 09:35 PM
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I listened to the Atmos mix finally yesterday and although I didn't listen to the DTS-HD MA 5.1 right after, I did think that it sounded better. Surround use was more prominent. Just really love the job Giles did with Abbey Road, it's already in my top 10, maybe top 5 soon, of best surround mixes. If only he would go back and re-mix Sgt Peppers and the White Album now...

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post #80 of 121 Old 10-11-2019, 10:05 AM
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On this disc it's pretty easy to switch back and forth and directly compare. The vocals are too hot in the center channel on both mixes though.
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post #81 of 121 Old 10-11-2019, 11:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by impetigo View Post
I listened to the Atmos mix finally yesterday and although I didn't listen to the DTS-HD MA 5.1 right after, I did think that it sounded better. Surround use was more prominent. Just really love the job Giles did with Abbey Road, it's already in my top 10, maybe top 5 soon, of best surround mixes. If only he would go back and re-mix Sgt Peppers and the White Album now...
He did an ATMOS Mix of Pepper but they did not let us have it. I guess a $117 wasn't enough! The White Album Mix is much better than Pepper's but I wouldn't mind an ATMOS of that as well.
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post #82 of 121 Old 10-11-2019, 02:56 PM
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He did an ATMOS Mix of Pepper but they did not let us have it. I guess a $117 wasn't enough! The White Album Mix is much better than Pepper's but I wouldn't mind an ATMOS of that as well.
I actually don't have an Atmos setup but found the 5.1 mix in the Atmos track to be better than the DTS-HD MA 5.1. Just wish Giles hadn't cut his teeth (what else can explain the results) on Sgt Pepper and White Album before finally figuring it out! Would love to hear the 5.1 of the Sgt Pepper Atmos mix because frankly it couldn't be more disappointing...

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post #83 of 121 Old 10-11-2019, 03:31 PM
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Quote:
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I actually don't have an Atmos setup but found the 5.1 mix in the Atmos track to be better than the DTS-HD MA 5.1. Just wish Giles hadn't cut his teeth (what else can explain the results) on Sgt Pepper and White Album before finally figuring it out! Would love to hear the 5.1 of the Sgt Pepper Atmos mix because frankly it couldn't be more disappointing...
Apparently people are not aware of the considerable differences in the available masters for the different albums. Martin has discussed this in a couple videos about the mastering. Short version is that he had a lot more to work with for Abbey Road, more tracks IOW.
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post #84 of 121 Old 10-11-2019, 04:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sworth View Post
The lead vocals are always isolated in the center channel. This can tend to make them sound thin, and it appears that they tried to overcome that by boosting the level of the center a bit. Unfortunately, on my system, that messed up the relative balance of the lead and harmony vocals on Because and Sun King. To get the Beach Boys inspired vocal sounds they were aiming for, the balances have to be just right. I found that a -2dB correction on the center channel fixed it perfectly. Likewise, the rears were a little bit low, like in Sgt Pepper, but it seems that they split the difference. Instead of needing a +6dB boost to the rears, it only needed a +3dB correction. Once I got the levels right, the handoff from speaker to speaker is perfect. Her Majesty moves around the room with perfectly even volume
Quote:
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The vocals are too hot in the center channel on both mixes though.
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I do know that level calibration seems to be a problem with these Beatles multichannel discs. All three have had different balances on my system, which is weird because just about everything else I have works fine at my default calibration. It could be that the LFE channel on the 5.1 might need a little boost too.
I didn't find the center channel to hot, nor did I have to do any level adjusting. Level calibration seems to be a problem on your system for some reason. If these Beatles disc's were really a problem you would have countless other members complaining about having to adjust their levels. I don't see this being the case.
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post #85 of 121 Old 10-11-2019, 04:44 PM
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My system is calibrated. But different recordings can vary. I always look for clean handoffs from front to rear, like the fox hunt that crosses diagonally across the room in Good Morning. In this one, I adjusted the levels with Her Majesty at the end of the album. The vocals go from channel to channel in a horseshoe around the room. Without a level correction it started out quieter in the right rear, got louder at the right front, got even louder in the center, then quieter to the left front and quieter again to left rear. When I attenuated the center -2db and boosted the rears +3db, the vocals maintained the same volume level handoff to handoff.

It could be that my room is larger than most people's and the speaker distances are causing differences. However, I do think that a lot of people with multichannel systems are afraid of changing their settings because they don't fully understand how the settings work. They are happy to take it as it is given to them. I'm a pretty picky about levels and balances. I find that 90% or more of recordings have proper balances. But engineers make mistakes. (I've worked with enough of them to know that!)

The levels on all three of the Beatles albums have been different. 2 to 3dB is a lot closer than 6dB like on Sgt Pepper. The average person could easily live with a 2 or 3 db difference... in fact, they do all the time. The manufacturing tolerances of good headphones are usually in the range of 3dB, so even with the same make and model, you can have that much variance.

My advice is, if you aren't afraid to touch your settings, give it a try. If you don't like it fine... but at least you'll hear what I'm hearing. You might find that it doesn't make any difference to you at all because it's too small a correction.

By the way, the recent Tangerine Dream set and the Kraftwerk Catalogue disc are really good to check balances with. They have a lot of stuff that flies from speaker to speaker, and since everything is plugged in, not acoustic, the volume level shouldn't shift at all as it does that. I find that both of those sets are spot on with my normal calibration.
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post #86 of 121 Old 10-11-2019, 05:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JJHXBR View Post
I didn't find the center channel to hot, nor did I have to do any level adjusting. Level calibration seems to be a problem on your system for some reason. If these Beatles disc's were really a problem you would have countless other members complaining about having to adjust their levels. I don't see this being the case.
Well said! The member that you quoted has for some reason or another had similar complaints on a number of different releases. I would say the issue is with his system and lack of proper calibration.

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post #87 of 121 Old 10-11-2019, 06:14 PM
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First off I want to say this is an observation I've noticed over time and not a personal attack. If this was the first time I had heard about levels being off, I would most likely dismiss it as someone's personal perference. But there has been a number of releases that have had some issue(s) requiring level adjusting/correction or just don't sound right. Again this is not a problem with our other members who have multichannel systems. In fact some of our members have some pretty nice systems I might add, and are certainly not novices. This is why I think something is wrong with his system and possibly a lack of proper calibration. Personally I think I would give up listening to multichannel music if I had to jack with level correction everytime I played something.
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post #88 of 121 Old 10-12-2019, 10:53 AM
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That's exactly what I was saying... some people resist changing the settings. That's fine. I just like to make things sound right to me. And I know how to get back to calibrated when I go to play the 90% of multichannel music that actually is calibrated properly. If you aren't afraid to make adjustments try the settings and listen to the album and see what you think. You might prefer it that way too.

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post #89 of 121 Old 10-12-2019, 12:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sworth View Post
That's exactly what I was saying... some people resist changing the settings. That's fine. I just like to make things sound right to me. And I know how to get back to calibrated when I go to play the 90% of multichannel music that actually is calibrated properly. If you aren't afraid to make adjustments try the settings and listen to the album and see what you think. You might prefer it that way too.
I don't think it's a matter of people resisting to change their settings at all. If we (The people) really thought there was a problem with these recordings we would (A.) Complain about it. or (B.) Try changing the levels. Here again you are the one with the level issues trying to convince us (The people) that we should try your adjusted levels. Personally if these settings you come up with float your boat and make you happy, Great! Just don't try and convince us that these recordings are the problem and your adjusted settings sound better than what the recording engineers did. Just try to enjoy the music.
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post #90 of 121 Old 10-12-2019, 05:49 PM
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I'm not trying to convince anyone. I'm offering a suggestion for people who want to try to see if they can improve the sound. There have been other people here before who pointed out the same level imbalances in the same handful of titles as I am talking about. They get shouted down too. I'm not the one making a big deal about this. I'm just reporting what I hear.

I really don't care if people think that they have to listen to every album at a calibration that has been delivered to Moses on stone tablets. That is perfectly fine for them. I like to hear things sounding better if I can. I'll add DSPs if the recordings are dry and lack presence, I'll adjust EQ if a recording is too shrill or boomy, I'll add noise reduction if a recording is buried under noise, and I'll adjust levels if a channel is too weak or too loud. What's the point of having signal processing controls if you don't use them? I remember when every amp had tone controls. Now there are lots of them that don't because god forbid, adjusting the tone controls might "destroy" the sound. Next they'll decide that a certain volume is "correct" and they'll eliminate the volume pot too. If someone doesn't want to try to improve the sound, fine. Let me make my suggestion and they can feel free to cheerfully ignore it and we'll all move on. But I will say this... If you think every recording you buy is perfectly calibrated, you aren't listening. Most of them are, but there are exceptions.

There's an annoying tendency among audiophiles to resort to arguments like "you must be deaf or there is something wrong with your equipment" whenever anyone has a different opinion. I find that the people who use that argument rarely know what they are talking about. They're simply parroting the opinions from "common knowledge" in internet forums full of armchair experts. Stuff like this isn't the proper thing to invest one's ego in. It's lame to do that. Someone who really does know what they're talking about tries to understand and isn't afraid to experiment. I'm talking for their benefit, not those who want to argue with me about this.
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Last edited by sworth; 10-12-2019 at 05:58 PM.
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