Official Rythmik Audio Subwoofer thread - Page 1315 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #39421 of 40480 Old 07-13-2019, 07:44 PM
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@gadgtfreek , how do you like your current Klipsch speakers? IIRC, you had the rf7ii, then the psa 210. How are your current RPs compared to those you had? The RPs are much cheaper right? I can feel how your single fv15 pressurizes your tiny room. Nice and clean set up.
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post #39422 of 40480 Old 07-13-2019, 08:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darthray View Post
Nice room, with a nice little bar with lots of options
But where is the beer fridge


Darth
LOL. A bar is getting built for the adjoining room, wont be a far walk.

Quote:
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I did you try stacking them first?
I did not.

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post #39423 of 40480 Old 07-13-2019, 08:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Soulburner View Post
No doubt, I really enjoy having my system in a room that's not the living room. Have you done any measurements yet? You may have a convenient peak at a certain frequency due to corner loading. If you get used to it, you'll be chasing it forever in the next setup...it will sound odd with music, though.
I have not. Next time Chad B comes into cal both my OLEDs, I will have him use REW and see what is going on.

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post #39424 of 40480 Old 07-13-2019, 08:45 PM
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Originally Posted by tvuong View Post
@gadgtfreek , how do you like your current Klipsch speakers? IIRC, you had the rf7ii, then the psa 210. How are your current RPs compared to those you had? The RPs are much cheaper right? I can feel how your single fv15 pressurizes your tiny room. Nice and clean set up.
Thanks!

Yeah, when I went from the 7II's and 64II to the PSA monitors, it was because the horns were starting to get to me. I guess old age. The PSA's are so much more warm, I loved them. When I wanted to setup this 5.1, the PSA 210C is too large, so I went with the new Reference Premiere line, reading that they were mellow. I can say for a fact they are 180 degrees from harsh, and sound great. Real happy with the choice, plus now I have a true 5.1 system.

XBR65A9G / XBR65A8F / 55R615
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post #39425 of 40480 Old 07-14-2019, 12:08 AM
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You could also just build a frame around the center out of some sort of 3/4” or thicker plywood as fancy grade as you wanted. That could be the load bearing surface. Could paint it black, duratex, stain.... probably make it blend right in.
That's what I did to get my Center Ultra up off the bottom shelf closer to the LR speaker height. The height was set to just raise the bottom of the TV enough to be even with the top of the Center speaker. The distance between the end legs is wide enough to allow the Center to slid back close to the TV and about even with the front edge of the stand.

After I had it assembled I decided to add an angle on the inside edges to somewhat resemble the angle on the Ultra speakers. I used 3/4 oak and black spray paint.

It can be a bit difficult to see with all the black on black. If I wasn't so lazy I'd set up some better lighting for a clearer picture
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post #39426 of 40480 Old 07-14-2019, 12:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt2026 View Post
That's what I did to get my Center Ultra up off the bottom shelf closer to the LR speaker height. The height was set to just raise the bottom of the TV enough to be even with the top of the Center speaker. The distance between the end legs is wide enough to allow the Center to slid back close to the TV and about even with the front edge of the stand.

After I had it assembled I decided to add an angle on the inside edges to somewhat resemble the angle on the Ultra speakers. I used 3/4 oak and black spray paint.

It can be a bit difficult to see with all the black on black. If I wasn't so lazy I'd set up some better lighting for a clearer picture
Nice woodworking - I wish I could do that, but I would not use a closed back. Now you have a mild version of the "cupping your hands around your mouth while talking" effect. It's like putting a speaker in a cabinet or bookshelf.

I think just some bracing along the frame would be enough, and would keep it "open".

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post #39427 of 40480 Old 07-14-2019, 02:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Soulburner View Post
Nice woodworking - I wish I could do that, but I would not use a closed back. Now you have a mild version of the "cupping your hands around your mouth while talking" effect. It's like putting a speaker in a cabinet or bookshelf.

I think just some bracing along the frame would be enough, and would keep it "open".
Not a problem with a closed-back speaker (is it?) and front flush.

"After silence, that which best expresses the inexpressible, is music" - Aldous Huxley
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post #39428 of 40480 Old 07-14-2019, 05:37 PM
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Not a problem with a closed-back speaker (is it?) and front flush.
There is a 1.7" port behind each woofer. From the back of the speaker it is about 8" to the riser. There is open vertical space in front of and behind the screen so is not sitting in a tight box.The gap on either side of the speaker is ~4" to the riser legs. The gap from the back edge of the speaker is ~3" to the center of the curved TV screen. The front is even with the edge of the stand but 2" higher on angled foam wedges, points right at my head.

It sounds just fine to me

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post #39429 of 40480 Old 07-14-2019, 10:14 PM
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Not a problem with a closed-back speaker (is it?) and front flush.
Speakers emanate sound in all directions - and there are reflections abound, just like standing and yelling at the mouth of a cave. He does have the face in the clear, which isn't as bad as center speakers put at the back of a cabinet.

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post #39430 of 40480 Old 07-15-2019, 04:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Soulburner View Post
Speakers emanate sound in all directions - and there are reflections abound, just like standing and yelling at the mouth of a cave. He does have the face in the clear, which isn't as bad as center speakers put at the back of a cabinet.
Their dispersion pattern moves to point sources at lower frequencies, but as you move higher driver directivity comes to play, along with baffle effects and all that jazz, so they radiate more and more to the front. But "emit" is debatable; again, a rear port is an emitter, but otherwise the back of the cabinet is not (or should not be) a direct emitter.

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post #39431 of 40480 Old 07-18-2019, 10:08 AM
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Looking for some guidance...

1 year ago I installed a new home theater system included 2x FV18's... I've always had issues with the bass in this room, so I went with the dual FV18's to 'fix the bass issues'... initially, movies were awesome, but I was underwhelmed with the sound for music... I spent a lot of time learning how to use Audyssey and manually adjust the FV18's and made a lot of improvements, but still, I feel like there's room for a lot of improvement... so, after much research and daily reading here in the forums, I decided to learn how to use REW and purchased a MiniDSP 2x4 HD... I've been making notes and collecting links regarding using REW & MiniDSP to calibrate the subs & my system.

Unfortunately, we had a drain pipe leak into that room so I've had that room torn up since April ... I just got the room put back together last night, and am ready to calibrate the subs & system.

I've spent the last hour sorting through my notes and links and am having a hard time trying to figure out how best to go about doing this... I'd like to start by gain matching my subs, but really don't know where to start... the link I saved talked about moving each sub to the middle of the room and using the MIC to gain match them... I also have a note that says the subs can be gain matched in position, without moving them to the center of the room... but... how exactly do I do that? I'm now realizing that as a newb, I'm not sure how to do the simple things that I should already know...

Enrico has a great document in his signature that covers most of the basics... but, with regards to Gain Matching the subs, the link he includes isn't helping me... or I'm not finding the right posts... Does anyone have a link to a document or post that steps through the process (in beginner terms) of how to gain-match subs?

Thanks in advance for your help!!!

Home Theater: RBH Signature Reference Speakers 7.1.4 Dolby Atmos | Rythmik FV-18 Subs (x2)
LG 65" OLED C7 | Marantz AV7703 | Outlaw 7700 & 5000 | OPPO UPD-203 | XBOX One X
Front Room: RBH 61-SE/r | RBH SX-1010/r Sub | Vizio M602i-B3 | Marantz SR7009 | Denon DVD-1930CI
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post #39432 of 40480 Old 07-18-2019, 10:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darrob104 View Post
Looking for some guidance...

1 year ago I installed a new home theater system included 2x FV18's... I've always had issues with the bass in this room, so I went with the dual FV18's to 'fix the bass issues'... initially, movies were awesome, but I was underwhelmed with the sound for music... I spent a lot of time learning how to use Audyssey and manually adjust the FV18's and made a lot of improvements, but still, I feel like there's room for a lot of improvement... so, after much research and daily reading here in the forums, I decided to learn how to use REW and purchased a MiniDSP 2x4 HD... I've been making notes and collecting links regarding using REW & MiniDSP to calibrate the subs & my system.

Unfortunately, we had a drain pipe leak into that room so I've had that room torn up since April ... I just got the room put back together last night, and am ready to calibrate the subs & system.

I've spent the last hour sorting through my notes and links and am having a hard time trying to figure out how best to go about doing this... I'd like to start by gain matching my subs, but really don't know where to start... the link I saved talked about moving each sub to the middle of the room and using the MIC to gain match them... I also have a note that says the subs can be gain matched in position, without moving them to the center of the room... but... how exactly do I do that? I'm now realizing that as a newb, I'm not sure how to do the simple things that I should already know...

Enrico has a great document in his signature that covers most of the basics... but, with regards to Gain Matching the subs, the link he includes isn't helping me... or I'm not finding the right posts... Does anyone have a link to a document or post that steps through the process (in beginner terms) of how to gain-match subs?

Thanks in advance for your help!!!
Check on Page 4 of "Using MiniDSP 2x4 to Time-Align Multiple Subs on One Channel before Room Correction" Guide.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/w7jmpozner...%20Version.pdf
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Media Room: Sierra Towers w/RAAL, Horizon w/RAAL, Sierra 2s & Lunas | Rythmik F12SE(x2) + FV25HP | Denon X6500H | Panny 820 + ATV 4K | Bluesound Node 2 | Sony 77A9G OLED |
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post #39433 of 40480 Old 07-18-2019, 11:38 AM
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This document states it's for multiple subs on the same channel... I have my subs on separate channels (Marantz AV7703), so do I need to put them on the same channel? Skip the gain-mayching step? Or is there a different set of instructions?

Thanks again!

Home Theater: RBH Signature Reference Speakers 7.1.4 Dolby Atmos | Rythmik FV-18 Subs (x2)
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post #39434 of 40480 Old 07-18-2019, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by darrob104 View Post
This document states it's for multiple subs on the same channel... I have my subs on separate channels (Marantz AV7703), so do I need to put them on the same channel? Skip the gain-mayching step? Or is there a different set of instructions?

Thanks again!
If you are using SubEQ HT and the subwoofers are at the same distance from main listening position, then do level matching and let Audyssey set the levels during calibration. If the subwoofers are at different distance from main listening position then gain match them. You can still use the two subwoofer outs from the 7703. Just turn ON only the subwoofer you are measuring, set the level on the subwoofer volume to whatever dB value you want, then turn it off and measure the second subwoofer adjusting the volume on the subwoofer volume knob to the same dB value of the first subwoofer. that would be gain matching in layman terms. Then you can run Audyssey again.
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Media Room: Sierra Towers w/RAAL, Horizon w/RAAL, Sierra 2s & Lunas | Rythmik F12SE(x2) + FV25HP | Denon X6500H | Panny 820 + ATV 4K | Bluesound Node 2 | Sony 77A9G OLED |
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post #39435 of 40480 Old 07-18-2019, 12:00 PM
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Oh wait, sorry. I just saw that you have a miniDSP 2x4 HD. Forget about using both subwoofer outs on the 7703. Use only one subwoofer output on the 7703, gain match the subwoofers and time align the subwoofers using the miniDSP 2x4 HD. Then show the two subwoofers to Audyssey as one. Basically follow the miniDSP guide I posted above.
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Media Room: Sierra Towers w/RAAL, Horizon w/RAAL, Sierra 2s & Lunas | Rythmik F12SE(x2) + FV25HP | Denon X6500H | Panny 820 + ATV 4K | Bluesound Node 2 | Sony 77A9G OLED |
Desktop: Dynaudio BM5 mkIII | Rythmik L22 | Apogee Quartet | 27" iMac| Bedroom: B&W 685 S2 | Rythmik LVX12 | Marantz SR6013 | Sony X700 + ATV 4K | Sony XBR-65Z9D |
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post #39436 of 40480 Old 07-18-2019, 07:43 PM
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Originally Posted by enricoclaudio View Post
You can still use the two subwoofer outs from the 7703. Just turn ON only the subwoofer you are measuring, set the level on the subwoofer volume to whatever dB value you want, then turn it off and measure the second subwoofer adjusting the volume on the subwoofer volume knob to the same dB value of the first subwoofer. that would be gain matching in layman terms. Then you can run Audyssey again.
That's basically what Audyssey does. It level matches each sub individually, before continuing.
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post #39437 of 40480 Old 07-19-2019, 06:53 AM
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Had a dream that I got a pair of FV18s. Then I woke up, sans FV18s, and I had to get ready for work.
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post #39438 of 40480 Old 07-19-2019, 07:13 AM
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Had a dream that I got a pair of FV18s. Then I woke up, sans FV18s, and I had to get ready for work.
Bummer dude. There is always tomorrow!

Subwoofers: Dual Rythmik FV18
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post #39439 of 40480 Old 07-19-2019, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Soulburner View Post
Had a dream that I got a pair of FV18s. Then I woke up, sans FV18s, and I had to get ready for work.
someone is selling a pair here on the classified section for $1800, 1 alone for $1k. they're down in florida though, would love to have one for my living room setup which i've been using a lot more these days.


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post #39440 of 40480 Old 07-19-2019, 01:10 PM
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someone is selling a pair here on the classified section for $1800, 1 alone for $1k. they're down in florida though, would love to have one for my living room setup which i've been using a lot more these days.

you blown up your theater? it was too nice to be w/out subs this long....

Power: Marantz sr7008, NAD C 275Bee x 2, Video: Oppo 103, Samsung 75un6300
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post #39441 of 40480 Old 07-19-2019, 02:09 PM
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you blown up your theater? it was too nice to be w/out subs this long....
haha, no. have just been watching a lot of tv shows lately and that's more suited for tv & comfy sectional seating upstairs, plus can eat food & multi-task. the room downstairs is a little too hardcore for that, really purpose built for consuming films only. plus with the lack of subwooferage currently it feels like i murdered the room
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post #39442 of 40480 Old 07-19-2019, 02:16 PM
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I hear ya, I have a full basement thats just storage/nephew living quarters cause honestly I hate steps and like someone living for free in my space.

Power: Marantz sr7008, NAD C 275Bee x 2, Video: Oppo 103, Samsung 75un6300
Speakers: Focal aria 948, Focal cc900, Klipsch synergy KSF 10.5, Magnepan LRS
Subs: Rythmik FV25HP, Rythmik FV15HP
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post #39443 of 40480 Old 07-19-2019, 02:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt2026 View Post
That's what I did to get my Center Ultra up off the bottom shelf closer to the LR speaker height. The height was set to just raise the bottom of the TV enough to be even with the top of the Center speaker. The distance between the end legs is wide enough to allow the Center to slid back close to the TV and about even with the front edge of the stand.

After I had it assembled I decided to add an angle on the inside edges to somewhat resemble the angle on the Ultra speakers. I used 3/4 oak and black spray paint.

It can be a bit difficult to see with all the black on black. If I wasn't so lazy I'd set up some better lighting for a clearer picture
This is definitely a great idea but because I'm too OCD, I ended up ordering today a Salamander Synergy Twin 30 Core Module with Center Speaker custom made opening (12" high) with maple sides, maple drawers and heavy duty casters to match my current Salamander Synergy AV Rack. It should be delivered in about 2 weeks.
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Media Room: Sierra Towers w/RAAL, Horizon w/RAAL, Sierra 2s & Lunas | Rythmik F12SE(x2) + FV25HP | Denon X6500H | Panny 820 + ATV 4K | Bluesound Node 2 | Sony 77A9G OLED |
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post #39444 of 40480 Old 07-19-2019, 02:36 PM
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Originally Posted by serith View Post
haha, no. have just been watching a lot of tv shows lately and that's more suited for tv & comfy sectional seating upstairs, plus can eat food & multi-task. the room downstairs is a little too hardcore for that, really purpose built for consuming films only. plus with the lack of subwooferage currently it feels like i murdered the room
Do you ever listen to music down there? Seems like a good place to hang out in the dark with some chill bass heavy tracks. Maybe while drunk/high?
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post #39445 of 40480 Old 07-19-2019, 02:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enricoclaudio View Post
This is definitely a great idea but because I'm too OCD, I ended up ordering today a Salamander Synergy Twin 30 Core Module with Center Speaker custom made opening (12" high) with maple sides, maple drawers and heavy duty casters to match my current Salamander Synergy AV Rack. It should be delivered in about 2 weeks.

I never really paid attention to salamander av storage til I scored a cabinet. its built like a tank, real wood, heavy as heck, and been a happy purchase. I got my piece off amazon at closeout price/free shipping....so just overall happy a few yrs later


think attached pic shows cherry finish halfway ok. old model...
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post #39446 of 40480 Old 07-19-2019, 03:12 PM
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Originally Posted by ianrozzano View Post
Do you ever listen to music down there? Seems like a good place to hang out in the dark with some chill bass heavy tracks. Maybe while drunk/high?
very rarely. honestly the psa speakers just aren't that great for music playback (my opinion of course). the best analogy i can give you to help explain what they sound like is, would you sit in a movie theater and listen to music there? probably not, there's just a "cinema sound" that comes with horn speakers and while they excel for watching movies (especially the center channel with dialogue) they're not that enjoyable for 2 channel music consumption. of course i play around with them sometimes though--more so when i had the fv25's in the room, but it was more to mess around with the subs than it was for any audiophile jam-session. both the in-wall micca m-8's i use in my living room & my (very old) logitech z5500's i use in my home office sound better for music than the psa speakers. the psa's are clear, sharp, and extremely efficient. i just prefer a warmer sound signature for music i guess. however for their given application the psa's are perfect (for me).

speaking of the sub-less room...

for anyone following what's going on with my setup (either from here or if you watch my youtube videos), i was pretty underwhelmed by the diy creation that i borrowed from dad recently. it was nice to hear & feel the room pressurized again but there was just an emptiness that's hard to explain what's missing exactly. i didn't use rew but i did use an old-school physical equalizer with it & crossed the sub over similarly to what i had the rythmik's at. i'm glad i tried it though, was good fun.

for anyone curious the cabinet dimension was similar to an fv25 or jtr2400ulf, but a little larger. single 18" dayton, tuned somewhere into the teens with ~1000 watts of power. i was thinking of trying the new tv36 but anyone following the psa sub thread knows where that ended up (also not a fan of the ports not facing the same direction as the driver--i like to feel the port wind!). if only there were other subwoofers that challenge the cap4000 to consider

here are a couple of pictures of the single vented 18 dad built that i tried the other week:



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post #39447 of 40480 Old 07-19-2019, 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by serith View Post
very rarely. honestly the psa speakers just aren't that great for music playback (my opinion of course). the best analogy i can give you to help explain what they sound like is, would you sit in a movie theater and listen to music there? probably not, there's just a "cinema sound" that comes with horn speakers and while they excel for watching movies (especially the center channel with dialogue) they're not that enjoyable for 2 channel music consumption. of course i play around with them sometimes though--more so when i had the fv25's in the room, but it was more to mess around with the subs than it was for any audiophile jam-session. both the in-wall micca m-8's i use in my living room & my (very old) logitech z5500's i use in my home office sound better for music than the psa speakers. the psa's are clear, sharp, and extremely efficient. i just prefer a warmer sound signature for music i guess. however for their given application the psa's are perfect (for me).

speaking of the sub-less room...

for anyone following what's going on with my setup (either from here or if you watch my youtube videos), i was pretty underwhelmed by the diy creation that i borrowed from dad recently. it was nice to hear & feel the room pressurized again but there was just an emptiness that's hard to explain what's missing exactly. i didn't use rew but i did use an old-school physical equalizer with it & crossed the sub over similarly to what i had the rythmik's at. i'm glad i tried it though, was good fun.

for anyone curious the cabinet dimension was similar to an fv25 or jtr2400ulf, but a little larger. single 18" dayton, tuned somewhere into the teens with ~1000 watts of power. i was thinking of trying the new tv36 but anyone following the psa sub thread knows where that ended up (also not a fan of the ports not facing the same direction as the driver--i like to feel the port wind!). if only there were other subwoofers that challenge the cap4000 to consider

here are a couple of pictures of the single vented 18 dad built that i tried the other week:



Have you considered a couple of DSS Mariana 24s?
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post #39448 of 40480 Old 07-19-2019, 05:44 PM
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Originally Posted by enricoclaudio View Post
If you are using SubEQ HT and the subwoofers are at the same distance from main listening position, then do level matching and let Audyssey set the levels during calibration. If the subwoofers are at different distance from main listening position then gain match them. You can still use the two subwoofer outs from the 7703. Just turn ON only the subwoofer you are measuring, set the level on the subwoofer volume to whatever dB value you want, then turn it off and measure the second subwoofer adjusting the volume on the subwoofer volume knob to the same dB value of the first subwoofer. that would be gain matching in layman terms. Then you can run Audyssey again.
As @Soulburner said, there is no need to do that with the Audyssey.

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That's basically what Audyssey does. It level matches each sub individually, before continuing.
+1

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Originally Posted by darrob104 View Post
This document states it's for multiple subs on the same channel... I have my subs on separate channels (Marantz AV7703), so do I need to put them on the same channel? Skip the gain-mayching step? Or is there a different set of instructions?

Thanks again!
With your AV7703, using the two sub outputs will do the following during the Audyssey calibration. On the first run, it will send separated measurement for each sub. To adjust the time delay and volume of each sub. Then do the calibration as one sub, and sending one signal to both subs. Since there is only one bass channel on any recording. This result both subs work as one unit, but are adjust to the proper level and delay for each other.

Once Audyssey is done, you can use your miniDSP 2x4 HD for tweaking.


Darth

Last edited by darthray; 07-19-2019 at 06:00 PM.
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post #39449 of 40480 Old 07-19-2019, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by torii View Post
I never really paid attention to salamander av storage til I scored a cabinet. its built like a tank, real wood, heavy as heck, and been a happy purchase. I got my piece off amazon at closeout price/free shipping....so just overall happy a few yrs later


think attached pic shows cherry finish halfway ok. old model...
I love the Lab photobomb. LOL!

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post #39450 of 40480 Old 07-19-2019, 05:56 PM
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Update...

I've installed the MiniDSP, wi-DG wireless adapter and the app on my laptop and am working through the documentation... Unfortunately, I have zero bass output when I go into my Marantz and send test tones to each channel...

I'll get back into it Sunday to see where I may have a setup issue... I just need the family to leave for a couple days so I can focus on this?!?!?? 🙂

Home Theater: RBH Signature Reference Speakers 7.1.4 Dolby Atmos | Rythmik FV-18 Subs (x2)
LG 65" OLED C7 | Marantz AV7703 | Outlaw 7700 & 5000 | OPPO UPD-203 | XBOX One X
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