Official Power Sound Audio Subwoofer Thread - Page 1029 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #30841 of 52964 Old 01-07-2017, 05:28 PM
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Originally Posted by newc33 View Post
I know! I need to get it under control before my room turns into a rats nest
I just changed out my Denon 3808ci for the x4300. Since I didn't label any of the cables, I had to organize a bird's nest and basically took everything out of the cabinet. Then I had to reprogram everything into my Harmony One.

Next, I'll set up my new Ascend Sierra-2 and patiently wait for the S3601 to come out. On a bright note, I was able to play SACD's for the first time through a digital connection and it sounds even better than I thought was possible.
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post #30842 of 52964 Old 01-07-2017, 07:12 PM
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Originally Posted by ss nimrod View Post
THANK YOU!!!!

Just got done watching this, powerful, verrrrrrry well done, I'll watch this again and again, best concert movie I've ever seen EXCELLENT!
I need to get that!
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post #30843 of 52964 Old 01-07-2017, 10:32 PM
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Originally Posted by tokerblue View Post
I just changed out my Denon 3808ci for the x4300. Since I didn't label any of the cables, I had to organize a bird's nest and basically took everything out of the cabinet. Then I had to reprogram everything into my Harmony One.

Next, I'll set up my new Ascend Sierra-2 and patiently wait for the S3601 to come out. On a bright note, I was able to play SACD's for the first time through a digital connection and it sounds even better than I thought was possible.
Ya iv been there several times with a birds nest of wires myself. I've probably taken this system apart at least 10 times, and by taken apart I mean disconnect everything from the receiver and move it. You would think by now i would have better wire management skills lol

Let me know how you like the 4300. I have an x4100 and love it for the most part. Just wish It had the hdcp 2.2 to watch blu rays. Not a big deal being I can buy a HD fury and bypass it but still...

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post #30844 of 52964 Old 01-07-2017, 10:35 PM
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Originally Posted by ss nimrod View Post
THANK YOU!!!!

Just got done watching this, powerful, verrrrrrry well done, I'll watch this again and again, best concert movie I've ever seen EXCELLENT!
I might have to check this out myself!
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post #30845 of 52964 Old 01-08-2017, 06:54 AM
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Originally Posted by newc33 View Post
I might have to check this out myself!
It'll be money well spent.

I grew up will that album, wore out the grooves on more than one copy of the wall and I was lucky enough to see the Pink Floyd tour supporting the album release. So I'm very familiar with it.

After watching (the wall) (through a Denon 4300) I came upstairs, speaking to my wife and son raving about it, telling them they have to watch.

Usually these concert movies hold my attention for 20/30 minutes, not the case with The Wall. Held my attention the whole time

The kids dancing, people crying, very emotional. The light show was jaw dropping, the theatrical aspect was incredible.
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post #30846 of 52964 Old 01-08-2017, 07:43 AM
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Well I guess I am going to take the plunge and get in on the 3601 presale. I will be replacing 2 elemental designs a5-350 (2 15's ported with 500 watts each) with the dual 18's. Hope the 18's blow the 15's out of the water.

Anyone know if the full card amount is charged up front?
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post #30847 of 52964 Old 01-08-2017, 08:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ss nimrod View Post
I grew up will that album, wore out the grooves on more than one copy of the wall and I was lucky enough to see the Pink Floyd tour supporting the album release. So I'm very familiar with it.
They only performed "The Wall" in 5 cities, I was also lucky enough to see it live (Feb. 9 1980 in LA). It was probably the best concert I have ever attended.
I may need to pick this one up as well.

And now the question...
Pink Floyd The Wall or Roger Waters The Wall?

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Last edited by ceh383; 01-08-2017 at 08:35 AM.
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post #30848 of 52964 Old 01-08-2017, 09:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slammin86 View Post
Well I guess I am going to take the plunge and get in on the 3601 presale. I will be replacing 2 elemental designs a5-350 (2 15's ported with 500 watts each) with the dual 18's. Hope the 18's blow the 15's out of the water.

Anyone know if the full card amount is charged up front?
Talk with Tom, he'll be able to explain the way they do it. Just pop into a chat with him or give him a call.
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post #30849 of 52964 Old 01-08-2017, 10:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slammin86 View Post
Well I guess I am going to take the plunge and get in on the 3601 presale. I will be replacing 2 elemental designs a5-350 (2 15's ported with 500 watts each) with the dual 18's. Hope the 18's blow the 15's out of the water.

Anyone know if the full card amount is charged up front?

As noted by Hop it is best to check with Tom if there is a concern. I pre ordered the V1801 and it showed up right away as pending. Then after 4 or 5 days it disappeared. I assume in my case it will show again when shipped. YMMV
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Spoiler!
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post #30850 of 52964 Old 01-08-2017, 10:50 AM
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Originally Posted by zeuspaul View Post
As noted by Hop it is best to check with Tom if there is a concern. I pre ordered the V1801 and it showed up right away as pending. Then after 4 or 5 days it disappeared. I assume in my case it will show again when shipped. YMMV
Interesting. PSA likely puts a preliminary hold just to make sure they are OK to reserve one of the cabinets for the buyer then reverse the hold so it doesnt actually charge. If the hold is declined, then they need to confirm other payment options to hold a spot?

Just a theory that Tom would have to answer.
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post #30851 of 52964 Old 01-08-2017, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by ceh383 View Post
They only performed "The Wall" in 5 cities, I was also lucky enough to see it live (Feb. 9 1980 in LA). It was probably the best concert I have ever attended.
I may need to pick this one up as well.

And now the question...
Pink Floyd The Wall or Roger Waters The Wall?
Being only 17 at the time, I couldnt get to NYC for the performances there. But I did see the Roger Waters version a few years ago in Boston. That show lived up to the hype
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post #30852 of 52964 Old 01-08-2017, 11:00 AM
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Being only 17 at the time, I couldnt get to NYC for the performances there. But I did see the Roger Waters version a few years ago in Boston. That show lived up to the hype
I was 19 at the time, I wish I could have seen the Roger Waters version, I'm sure it was awesome.

The question remains about the disc...

Pink Floyd The Wall or Roger Waters The Wall?

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post #30853 of 52964 Old 01-08-2017, 11:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Hopinater View Post
Talk with Tom, he'll be able to explain the way they do it. Just pop into a chat with him or give him a call.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gbreda View Post
Interesting. PSA likely puts a preliminary hold just to make sure they are OK to reserve one of the cabinets for the buyer then reverse the hold so it doesnt actually charge. If the hold is declined, then they need to confirm other payment options to hold a spot?
Give Tom a call. I don't think their system has a way to charge you when the sub ships automatically. But he'll make it work. He's doing that for the S3601 sub pre-order that I put in.
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post #30854 of 52964 Old 01-08-2017, 01:02 PM
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Originally Posted by ceh383 View Post
I was 19 at the time, I wish I could have seen the Roger Waters version, I'm sure it was awesome.

The question remains about the disc...

Pink Floyd The Wall or Roger Waters The Wall?
Roger Waters The Wall

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post #30855 of 52964 Old 01-08-2017, 01:15 PM
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http://www.blu-ray.com/movies/Roger-.../12873/#Review

Going to get this from Amazon.

Craig
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post #30856 of 52964 Old 01-08-2017, 02:59 PM
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I might have to check this out myself!
It is a masterpiece....IMO.
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post #30857 of 52964 Old 01-08-2017, 03:44 PM
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Originally Posted by ceh383 View Post
They only performed "The Wall" in 5 cities, I was also lucky enough to see it live (Feb. 9 1980 in LA). It was probably the best concert I have ever attended.
I may need to pick this one up as well.

And now the question...
Pink Floyd The Wall or Roger Waters The Wall?
Roger Waters The Wall

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post #30858 of 52964 Old 01-08-2017, 09:33 PM
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Originally Posted by slammin86 View Post
Well I guess I am going to take the plunge and get in on the 3601 presale. I will be replacing 2 elemental designs a5-350 (2 15's ported with 500 watts each) with the dual 18's. Hope the 18's blow the 15's out of the water.

Anyone know if the full card amount is charged up front?
Yes as far as I know the full amount is charged and they will blow the 15s out for sure..........
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post #30859 of 52964 Old 01-09-2017, 04:31 AM
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To antimode or not to antimode...that is the question...!
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post #30860 of 52964 Old 01-09-2017, 06:40 AM
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To antimode or not to antimode...that is the question...!
Whats your current sound setup/needs?

I'd say for 2 or fewer subs, either model antimode does a fantastic job pulling down peaks and smoothing your bass response. On the more basic 8033S-ii, the PEQ for a house curve at 25 or 35Hz is just right for extra oomph. The antimode dual core 2.0 has a lot of extra customization options available and can separately time align and sum two subs. These devices simplify your subwoofer setup to nearly one button push.

That said, I have a hard time justifying the cost of the premium dual core model when a bit of extra time and effort can net similar results, and you could literally buy all the equipment (including a laptop) needed to measure and tweak your setup for the same cost. I will say I felt the antimode did a better job in my room (when I only had 2 subs) than Audyssey XT32; however, this was before I bought all my own measuring equipment, integrated a miniDSP, added a third sub, and MBMs. It all comes down to convenience and how much that's worth to you.

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post #30861 of 52964 Old 01-09-2017, 06:49 AM
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To antimode or not to antimode...that is the question...!
Depends on what you have currently for a AVR.
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post #30862 of 52964 Old 01-09-2017, 06:51 AM
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To antimode or not to antimode...that is the question...!
I've used both Anti-Modes that PSA offers and have been happy with the investment. The 8033S-II did everything I needed until I added a couple more subs and had to move up to the DC for more flexibility. Of course I also have a troublesome room. You might be able to handle everything with REW and a MiniDSP for less, but I haven't regretted getting the AMs to make sure I was getting the most of out my subs.

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post #30863 of 52964 Old 01-09-2017, 05:48 PM
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Has anyone in the PSA club, come from a servo controlled sub? I am currently running a pair of older 10" vented servo subs and am thinking of upgrading to a single V1801. I can't help but fear that it will be like some of the flapping noiseboxes I've seen in electronics stores. I'm sure PSA quality is better than what is in the local stores but I think I'm addicted to the tight (fast), accurate servo design.

How tight and accurate is the V1800 (I assume the V1801 will follow suit in that area)? Should I be looking at Rythmik, Velodyn or a sealed PSA instead of the vented to get quick, tight and accurate?
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post #30864 of 52964 Old 01-09-2017, 07:55 PM
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Hi

Just want to know if the upcoming v1801s have better output than a Rythmik Fv15 HP?. I have an opportunity to pick up a used Rythmik so just checking a few things.

Also what is the driver upgrade going to do over the current subs. I think I read that it will be 3dB louder- but not sure at what frequencies. Sorry feeling lazy and not reading the back posts if this has already been answered clearly.😀

Ron
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post #30865 of 52964 Old 01-09-2017, 08:01 PM
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Originally Posted by schwaggs View Post
Has anyone in the PSA club, come from a servo controlled sub? I am currently running a pair of older 10" vented servo subs and am thinking of upgrading to a single V1801. I can't help but fear that it will be like some of the flapping noiseboxes I've seen in electronics stores. I'm sure PSA quality is better than what is in the local stores but I think I'm addicted to the tight (fast), accurate servo design.

How tight and accurate is the V1800 (I assume the V1801 will follow suit in that area)? Should I be looking at Rythmik, Velodyn or a sealed PSA instead of the vented to get quick, tight and accurate?
Forgive me but when I hear terms like fast, tight and accurate and I can't help but fear that PSA subs (V1801) will be like some the flapping noise boxes in electronic stores that I've seen.

This makes me cringe, especially fast and tight, tell me what these terms mean and I'll tell you if you should stay away from PSA subs. There's nothing fast or quick about a sub's performance, if you mean the difference isn’t in how quickly a sub’s woofer cone gets moving, but in how quickly it stops. In low-Q subs, the cone tends to stop almost instantly at the end of a bass tone. In high-Q subs, the cone tends to “ring,” or continue moving back and forth after it was supposed to have stopped.

Now if that's what you mean about quick and fast, yes a V1801 will do that in spades. As the saying goes "as long as they play loud with minimal distortion and have enough low-frequency content to shake your couch" that's a good subwoofer, these are your flapping noise boxes, one note wonders. My 1800s will dig deep with authority when asked too and at the same time if you put on a recording in which the low bass has specific, deliberately chosen pitches, maybe a tune with a melodic bass line with subtle nuances, you should start to hear some differences between subwoofers.

The larger driver PSA subs 15-18", to use your terms are just as quick, tight and accurate as your smaller 10" servo controlled subs, have greater dynamics with controlled accuracy whether being played loud or soft and do this at extreme output levels without breaking a sweat. Two myths are busted here, sealed subs sound better for music and larger drivers aren't as fast or quick as smaller ones. Just to put the icing on the cake all PSA subs use the ICE amp modules with precise DSP'd controlled front ends. Take one out for a test drive and I'll bet you never go back to the big box stores again having to deal with flapping noise boxes again.

Nothing against servo subs but if you like them so much why wouldn't you just upgrade to another or duals since you seemed to have acquired a taste for their sound, just curious, I can't comment on Rythmik or Velodyn as I've never heard either one but I can share my experience with almost every PSA sub out there and ones that will be out there. I hope I didn't come off too strong here but when you said you fear that a PSA sub would sound like the flapping noise boxes, that just ruffled my feathers a bit..................No, my last name is not Farina or Vodhanel...........

Cheers Jeffrey Nordi
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post #30866 of 52964 Old 01-09-2017, 08:11 PM
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Originally Posted by rsmt2000 View Post
Hi

Just want to know if the upcoming v1801s have better output than a Rythmik Fv15 HP?. I have an opportunity to pick up a used Rythmik so just checking a few things.

Also what is the driver upgrade going to do over the current subs. I think I read that it will be 3dB louder- but not sure at what frequencies. Sorry feeling lazy and not reading the back posts if this has already been answered clearly.😀

Ron
New driver in a new tuned box with 2-3dB more output from 30Hz down, same price as the originals during the pre-order period. I won't comment on the used Rythmik, I'll leave that to my fellow Family members............Edit: it's not all about output anyway......... Forgot to mention, 5 year bumper to bumper warranty made in the USA............

Cheers Jeffrey
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post #30867 of 52964 Old 01-09-2017, 08:28 PM
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post #30868 of 52964 Old 01-09-2017, 08:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahblaza View Post
Forgive me but when I hear terms like fast, tight and accurate and I can't help but fear that PSA subs (V1801) will be like some the flapping noise boxes in electronic stores that I've seen.

This makes me cringe, especially fast and tight, tell me what these terms mean and I'll tell you if you should stay away from PSA subs. There's nothing fast or quick about a sub's performance, if you mean the difference isn’t in how quickly a sub’s woofer cone gets moving, but in how quickly it stops. In low-Q subs, the cone tends to stop almost instantly at the end of a bass tone. In high-Q subs, the cone tends to “ring,” or continue moving back and forth after it was supposed to have stopped.

Now if that's what you mean about quick and fast, yes a V1801 will do that in spades. As the saying goes "as long as they play loud with minimal distortion and have enough low-frequency content to shake your couch" that's a good subwoofer, these are your flapping noise boxes, one note wonders. My 1800s will dig deep with authority when asked too and at the same time if you put on a recording in which the low bass has specific, deliberately chosen pitches, maybe a tune with a melodic bass line with subtle nuances, you should start to hear some differences between subwoofers.

The larger driver PSA subs 15-18", to use your terms are just as quick, tight and accurate as your smaller 10" servo controlled subs, have greater dynamics with controlled accuracy whether being played loud or soft and do this at extreme output levels without breaking a sweat. Two myths are busted here, sealed subs sound better for music and larger drivers aren't as fast or quick as smaller ones. Just to put the icing on the cake all PSA subs use the ICE amp modules with precise DSP'd controlled front ends. Take one out for a test drive and I'll bet you never go back to the big box stores again having to deal with flapping noise boxes again.

Nothing against servo subs but if you like them so much why wouldn't you just upgrade to another or duals since you seemed to have acquired a taste for their sound, just curious, I can't comment on Rythmik or Velodyn as I've never heard either one but I can share my experience with almost every PSA sub out there and ones that will be out there. I hope I didn't come off too strong here but when you said you fear that a PSA sub would sound like the flapping noise boxes, that just ruffled my feathers a bit..................No, my last name is not Farina or Vodhanel...........

Cheers Jeffrey Nordi
Sorry, my intention was not to ruffle any feathers. I have never seen or heard a PSA sub and from all the rave reviews and information I have found, I was not expecting them to be flappy noise boxes (FNB). That being said, some people are buying FNBs (or they wouldn't be making them) and to your point, its hard to tell from words what will sound good or if the sound they think is awesome will be awesome to you. I just know that I'm not looking for a FNBs based on what I have seen/heard.

From your response, I just did some quick research on low Q vs high Q and indeed, I think I am looking for a sub with moderate to high damping. How can I evaluate the PSA vented subs as it relates to this aspect?

Last edited by schwaggs; 01-09-2017 at 09:19 PM.
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post #30869 of 52964 Old 01-09-2017, 10:39 PM
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I can just about guarantee any PSA sub will be a substantial improvement over your 10" servo sub. I have experience with a Kenwood sigma servo 10" sub and it's fine for what it is, but its nothing like my 15v's....not by a long shot on all metrics.
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post #30870 of 52964 Old 01-10-2017, 07:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwaggs View Post
Sorry, my intention was not to ruffle any feathers. I have never seen or heard a PSA sub and from all the rave reviews and information I have found, I was not expecting them to be flappy noise boxes (FNB). That being said, some people are buying FNBs (or they wouldn't be making them) and to your point, its hard to tell from words what will sound good or if the sound they think is awesome will be awesome to you. I just know that I'm not looking for a FNBs based on what I have seen/heard.

From your response, I just did some quick research on low Q vs high Q and indeed, I think I am looking for a sub with moderate to high damping. How can I evaluate the PSA vented subs as it relates to this aspect?
Hi schwaggs!

Like the saying goes, "If you build it, they will come." This includes crappy one-note wonder "subwoofers" that you can purchase in any brick and mortar store or a NewEgg special. To be totally honest, your best bet would be to tip your toe in the waters and order up a 15V or V1500 and see how a ported PSA sounds in your home during the 60 day trial period. Hell, why not try a V1801 and test it in a few weeks! It will trump anyone's reply here since testing them yourself will truly dictate what sounds good in your home and, more importantly, to your ears. Everyone has their own feeling of how a song or movie should sound. I consider myself "picky" when it comes to music so I feel like I can mildly relate to your desire for dampening controls and going for that response you like. I have personally listened to the V3600, but I did prefer the S3000 for music. However, a good music buddy of mine likes the V3600 more and says he likes the smoother response of vented for his Jazz collection. I've come to realize it really is just a preference when you're talking subwoofers of this caliber, no matter the brand. We have played the V3600 to levels in his home that I would never reach in mine, but I can assure you that there was no port chuffing. Ever. At all, during any music or movie test at any volume. I am talking making the wall hangings in adjacent rooms dance sort of loud!!!

That said, I do have a pair of S1801 on pre-order because I do not need crazy amounts of output to satisfy my bass needs, but I'm more confident they will make my collections sound "the way I know my music" and deviate less than a vented option to my ears and brain. A lot of these guys here are true bass-heads and they would most definitely let Tom and Jim (PSA owners) know if their gear made excessively-audible chuffing sounds at high volumes.

You need not worry! Try one out, I double-dog dare ya.

Travis
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