Official Power Sound Audio Subwoofer Thread - Page 828 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #24811 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 06:30 AM
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Originally Posted by jjmcmann View Post
Question for the REW savvy here...

Looks like CSL is out of the UMIKs for a while, I guess they are taking pre-orders now, possibly shipping in another week but who knows for sure. I can order right now direct from minidsp, but is there an appreciable difference that makes waiting on the CSL mic (plus the extra $25) worthwhile? I know it's probably a relative question with no definitive answer, just looking for opinions. Thanks all.
I may have one for sale that I bought right before Xmas. Decided against using REW and will use Omnimic instead. I don't think you can send PM's, but you can email me at my username here on AVS @ver izon.net if you are interested. Was actually thinking of returning it, but I am not sure if they accept returns.
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post #24812 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 06:43 AM
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post #24813 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 06:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjmcmann View Post
Question for the REW savvy here...

Looks like CSL is out of the UMIKs for a while, I guess they are taking pre-orders now, possibly shipping in another week but who knows for sure. I can order right now direct from minidsp, but is there an appreciable difference that makes waiting on the CSL mic (plus the extra $25) worthwhile? I know it's probably a relative question with no definitive answer, just looking for opinions. Thanks all.
As far as I know, the mics from CSL are individually calibrated, where the ones from miniDSP have a generic calibration file that is for a batch of mics. The ones from CSL will be more accurate, how much of a difference it would make, I don't know.

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post #24814 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 07:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Anodynic View Post
New T18HT in place. Bubba approves. Well, as much as he approves of anything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JT78681 View Post
Crank it up and I bet Bubba runs for cover.
I bet Bubba has a violent bowel movement !

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post #24815 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 07:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Anodynic View Post
New T18HT in place. Bubba approves. Well, as much as he approves of anything.
What are your impressions? Also, is a 3-way cab design like that also inert like a dual-opposed S3000i?

Travis
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post #24816 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 07:17 AM
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Well I have finally taken the leap. I just put in an order for my T18HT with Anti-Mode 8033. Can't wait to hook that monster up and see what it can do.

For the past year and a half I have been planning on doing a 4x18" IB DIY build and then the wife finally put her foot down...no holes in her ceiling. So Now I'm going the next best route, a monstrous 3x18" setup in the room Surprised I got her blessing for that.

This is will actually be my first true high quality subwoofer I have ever owned. The only other subs I have had were only 8", one Definite Technology with the Cinema 600 setup, and one Klipsch my brother gave me after he upgraded to a 10". I am sure I will be in for a treat with this.
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post #24817 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 07:52 AM
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Originally Posted by CURX8 View Post
Well I have finally taken the leap. I just put in an order for my T18HT with Anti-Mode 8033. Can't wait to hook that monster up and see what it can do.

For the past year and a half I have been planning on doing a 4x18" IB DIY build and then the wife finally put her foot down...no holes in her ceiling. So Now I'm going the next best route, a monstrous 3x18" setup in the room Surprised I got her blessing for that.

This is will actually be my first true high quality subwoofer I have ever owned. The only other subs I have had were only 8", one Definite Technology with the Cinema 600 setup, and one Klipsch my brother gave me after he upgraded to a 10". I am sure I will be in for a treat with this.
Hahaha, I had to chuckle at "first true high quality subwoofer". First of all, you chose very wisely, so good job! Outside of some pretty crazy and intense DIY'ers, there really isn't much of an upgrade path that I know of. Second, I would try and not let her see the sub in its packaging or on the pallet it ships with; it may sway her decision if she was on the fence about it. When I helped a friend move his V3600 into his house, his wife looked sick in the face when she saw that it filled most of my truck bed in my F150. I lost count of how many times she said to him, "You are #!*$ing nuts!"

Please be sure to stop back and let us know your thoughts and impressions! That is one of the coveted subs from PSA I have yet to audition.

Travis
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post #24818 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 08:08 AM
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Originally Posted by k1n3t1k View Post
Also, is a 3-way cab design like that also inert like a dual-opposed S3000i?

Travis
Of course it is.
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post #24819 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 08:23 AM
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Originally Posted by basshead81 View Post
Why Omni-mic over REW?
Frustration with REW.

Every time I use REW I have to spend at least 30 minutes to get everything working in order to take a measurement. I have never been able to get the asio drivers working to allow me to pick a channel to graph, I only have 2 channels available so I have to turn Amos on/off or unplug speakers. The last 3 times I have tried and am not able to get any audio out of my laptop to the receiver.

Last week was the final draw, spent an hour going over everything in AustinJerrys guide and could get no output from the laptop (even though playing a blu Ray disc produced audio). Dropped about 50 F bombs, a couple C bombs, almost punched my laptop screen and yelled at my daughter when she came down to ask me to play Disney infinity with me. Even tried on another laptop with no success. Was trying to do the sub distance tweak. Gave up on REW and tried Omnimic and had the sub distance tweak done in 10 minutes.

I am sure I am doing something wrong in REW but just don't have the time/patience/knowledge to fix it.

I can gets sweeps/graphs running in Omnimic in under a minute and it just works every time.
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post #24820 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by powerdubs View Post
Here is what I managed tonight, first time trying all this and no idea what I am actually doing.

Let me know if this is actually any better than yesterday or not.

I moved the sub around the room and took lots of measurements. I then picked the spot with the least nulls and then ran the antimode. This is what I ended up with-
Much better! Great job!!

However, a couple things:

This is obviously a sub only measurement (you either used CH4 out of REW or you bypassed the soundbar somehow). We need to see the sub+soundbar to see the interaction between the two, especially over the crossover point.

You should have 5dB steps on the left hand side of the graph. If your monitor's resolution isn't high enough to provide that at the recommended (55-105dB) limits, reduce them until you get 5dB steps. This just makes it easier to compare graphs.

You must have a fairly large room judging by the sharp drop under 20hz, is this correct? If so, why a sealed sub??

You have an Antimode with a soundbar??
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post #24821 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 09:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anodynic View Post
New T18HT in place. Bubba approves. Well, as much as he approves of anything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JT78681 View Post
Crank it up and I bet Bubba runs for cover.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeriouslyBass View Post
I bet Bubba has a violent bowel movement !
Back when I used to have XS15s, my dog used to lay beside the sub just like Bubba there....since I got my T-18s she does indeed "run for cover". She hides in the bedroom, panting and trembling...I actually feel bad for her, but I'm sorry dog, I'm not toning it down any time soon.
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post #24822 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 09:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
Much better! Great job!!



However, a couple things:



This is obviously a sub only measurement (you either used CH4 out of REW or you bypassed the soundbar somehow). We need to see the sub+soundbar to see the interaction between the two, especially over the crossover point.



You should have 5dB steps on the left hand side of the graph. If your monitor's resolution isn't high enough to provide that at the recommended (55-105dB) limits, reduce them until you get 5dB steps. This just makes it easier to compare graphs.



You must have a fairly large room judging by the sharp drop under 20hz, is this correct? If so, why a sealed sub??



You have an Antimode with a soundbar??

Yup, that is just the sub right now. Playing with that first before I mix in the bar.

In that chart, I am using a lift function at 25hz which unfortunately forces an infrasonic filter at 15hz and chops the lower end.

Yes big room, yes antimode on just the sub off soundbar.

You are going to laugh- I just bought a antimode dualcore to bring the bar into correction as well. It opens up a lot of options- PEQ, lift, tilt, etc. Should help balance the bar to the sub better than I can do alone.
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post #24823 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 09:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjmcmann View Post
Question for the REW savvy here...

Looks like CSL is out of the UMIKs for a while, I guess they are taking pre-orders now, possibly shipping in another week but who knows for sure. I can order right now direct from minidsp, but is there an appreciable difference that makes waiting on the CSL mic (plus the extra $25) worthwhile? I know it's probably a relative question with no definitive answer, just looking for opinions. Thanks all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ceh383 View Post
As far as I know, the mics from CSL are individually calibrated, where the ones from miniDSP have a generic calibration file that is for a batch of mics. The ones from CSL will be more accurate, how much of a difference it would make, I don't know.
The CSL mics are calibrated down to 5hz (I believe), and don't forget that if you order direct from MiniDSP they ship from Hong Kong.
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post #24824 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by powerdubs View Post
Yup, that is just the sub right now. Playing with that first before I mix in the bar.

In that chart, I am using a lift function at 25hz which unfortunately forces an infrasonic filter at 15hz and chops the lower end.

Yes big room, yes antimode on just the sub off soundbar.

You are going to laugh- I just bought a antimode dualcore to bring the bar into correction as well. It opens up a lot of options- PEQ, lift, tilt, etc. Should help balance the bar to the sub better than I can do alone.
Do you realize that the Antimode only works with the sub? You can't use it to EQ your soundbar AFAIK.
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post #24825 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 09:33 AM
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On the 8033-SII that is correct, because it is mono. The dual core is stereo and will correct up to 500hz and can be used on full range speakers.
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post #24826 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 09:54 AM
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I finally got the V3600 in place and ran Audyssey. All I can say, is WOW! This sub blows my Ultra out of the water, and laughs at it the whole time. My entire couch felt like it was being lifted off the floor when I demo'd the plane scene in The Dark Knight Rises. I'm amazed at how much headroom I still have available, whereas, the Ultra had very little left to play with once it was set for my room. Amazing! Here are some pics of the new setup. My wife even likes it.
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post #24827 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 09:56 AM
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On the 8033-SII that is correct, because it is mono. The dual core is stereo and will correct up to 500hz and can be used on full range speakers.
You can correct a 2.1 system with the Dual Core, but I assumed that your soundbar had L/C/R speakers in it, that would be 3.1. Is your soundbar mono only?? I can't imagine it is.
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post #24828 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 10:48 AM
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You can correct a 2.1 system with the Dual Core, but I assumed that your soundbar had L/C/R speakers in it, that would be 3.1. Is your soundbar mono only?? I can't imagine it is.
I believe the plan is to go from source L/R to AM LR(input) AM L/R(output) to L/R inputs on soundbar. And then let the soundbar derive as many channels as needed(3.1?).

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post #24829 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 10:59 AM
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I believe the plan is to go from source L/R to AM LR(input) AM L/R(output) to L/R inputs on soundbar. And then let the soundbar derive as many channels as needed(3.1?).

Tom V.
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Ahhh...that would work, not ideal but it would work.

Still curious as to why the guy is using a soundbar...I'm guessing WAF.
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post #24830 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 11:06 AM
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With the 15S and 15V shipping where are all of the user reviews?
We're just about sold out on the 15V, have one brand new unit with a small blemish we'll likely outlet-center at $899. Still afew 15S left. Plenty more of both will be arriving in a few weeks though.

One thing to remember about ID starts-up and their relationship with specific forums is that initially the forum participates may represent a large percentage of customer sales. I bet in the first 6 months of Power Sound Audio 2/3rd of sales could be connected to an online forums and active members. But as a company matures and becomes more established throughout the consumer world this percentage is going to drop accordingly. For the LAST 6 months? 15% would be my guess...+/- 5%.

I'm sure we'll see some feedback sooner rather than later but I wouldn't expect 20 out of 25 new owners to suddenly pop up or anything..

The 15S is really the S1500 with the down firing form factor. Same amp, same driver, same performance. At $899, we expect it to be very difficult to keep in stock.

The 15V is the new XV15se with several key improvements. 1)The 15V extension is much deeper. At 16hz for example the 15V is about 10(!)dB stronger. 2) The ICE power up offers more power, better overall build quality, a custom DSP frontend that is much more flexible and allows us more system refinement during the engineering process. 3) The room size control allows a level of user system/room integration not available on the XV15se. At $949, I'm sure we'll have stretches being completely sold out(like right now).

Tom V.
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post #24831 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 11:19 AM
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Originally Posted by jjmcmann View Post
Question for the REW savvy here...

Looks like CSL is out of the UMIKs for a while, I guess they are taking pre-orders now, possibly shipping in another week but who knows for sure.
When I ordered one their Website stated there was a delay and it ended up shipping the next day or so... might want to email them if you haven't.

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post #24832 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 12:00 PM
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My wife even likes it.
Wife her!...er, well, wife her again! Props to you, good sir - so many seem to be against big sound and/or hung up on aesthetics.

At first, I was going to say that seems like such a small room for said beast. Then I saw the last picture and realized it was much, much more space. Definitely a fitting purchase!

Travis
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New T18HT in place. Bubba approves. Well, as much as he approves of anything.


Better move Bubba's bed.... ha
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I finally got the V3600 in place and ran Audyssey. All I can say, is WOW! This sub blows my Ultra out of the water, and laughs at it the whole time. My entire couch felt like it was being lifted off the floor when I demo'd the plane scene in The Dark Knight Rises. I'm amazed at how much headroom I still have available, whereas, the Ultra had very little left to play with once it was set for my room. Amazing! Here are some pics of the new setup. My wife even likes it.
Are your pictures dancing around yet on the tables and walls?

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post #24835 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 01:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Vodhanel View Post
We're just about sold out on the 15V, have one brand new unit with a small blemish we'll likely outlet-center at $899. Still afew 15S left. Plenty more of both will be arriving in a few weeks though.

One thing to remember about ID starts-up and their relationship with specific forums is that initially the forum participates may represent a large percentage of customer sales. I bet in the first 6 months of Power Sound Audio 2/3rd of sales could be connected to an online forums and active members. But as a company matures and becomes more established throughout the consumer world this percentage is going to drop accordingly. For the LAST 6 months? 15% would be my guess...+/- 5%.

I'm sure we'll see some feedback sooner rather than later but I wouldn't expect 20 out of 25 new owners to suddenly pop up or anything..

The 15S is really the S1500 with the down firing form factor. Same amp, same driver, same performance. At $899, we expect it to be very difficult to keep in stock.

The 15V is the new XV15se with several key improvements. 1)The 15V extension is much deeper. At 16hz for example the 15V is about 10(!)dB stronger. 2) The ICE power up offers more power, better overall build quality, a custom DSP frontend that is much more flexible and allows us more system refinement during the engineering process. 3) The room size control allows a level of user system/room integration not available on the XV15se. At $949, I'm sure we'll have stretches being completely sold out(like right now).

Tom V.
Power Sound Audio
How much would it cost us XV/XS15 owners to upgrade to the ICE amp?
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post #24836 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 01:12 PM
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How much would it cost us XV/XS15 owners to upgrade to the ICE amp?
We haven't really crunched the numbers on that but it wouldn't take me long. Pop into chat when time allows and I'll whip out the abacus. It won't be cheap, the ICE stuff is a bit on the pricey side..

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Power Sound Audio
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post #24837 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by ceh383 View Post
As far as I know, the mics from CSL are individually calibrated, where the ones from miniDSP have a generic calibration file that is for a batch of mics. The ones from CSL will be more accurate, how much of a difference it would make, I don't know.
Direct ones from Minidsp are individually calibrated also.
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post #24838 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 01:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Riddle View Post
I finally got the V3600 in place and ran Audyssey. All I can say, is WOW! This sub blows my Ultra out of the water, and laughs at it the whole time. My entire couch felt like it was being lifted off the floor when I demo'd the plane scene in The Dark Knight Rises. I'm amazed at how much headroom I still have available, whereas, the Ultra had very little left to play with once it was set for my room. Amazing! Here are some pics of the new setup. My wife even likes it.
Its kind of weird seeing my speakers in someone else house, lol. Looks great Mr. Riddle! It is one remarkable sub, your room looks great, and I'm sure it sounds even better!

Speakers: Klipsch RF-7 II, RC-64 II, RS-62 II, RB-81 II, PSA v3600i
Audio: Denon 4520ci with B&K Reference 200.7
Video: Samsung PN648500
Misc: PlayStation 4, Xbox One, Wii U, Apple TV, Chromecast
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post #24839 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 03:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Vodhanel View Post
I believe the plan is to go from source L/R to AM LR(input) AM L/R(output) to L/R inputs on soundbar. And then let the soundbar derive as many channels as needed(3.1?).

Correct.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
Ahhh...that would work, not ideal but it would work.

Still curious as to why the guy is using a soundbar...I'm guessing WAF.

Well, the wife will let me have whatever I want, but the house won't allow it. Due to unique area- the only place I have for a TV is stuffed in a corner on a tower stand- so the sound bar is below the suspended TV and the S1500 sub is sitting under the bar. I tried the sub in other areas next to the love seat and next to the couch, but they all had more dips in the curves than right where it is now. So, unless I am wrong and the curves change based on the sub size.. where the S1500 is now is probably as good as it is going to get.

I measured to see if I could lay a 3600 on its side, but it is too deep and hits the stand tower in the back well before it is flush. I can just barely squeeze another S1500 under there side by side, or a single S3000..which is 'rated' at 2 of the S1500 so not sure what difference I would get.. something would have to be different on the 3600 I think since one of the speakers would be firing directly into the stand / corner and then reflecting all over the place back into the pulses from the front. Sounds like a recipe for a mess to me. Thoughts Tom?
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post #24840 of 52376 Old 01-08-2016, 03:49 PM
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I just got an s3000i. I know it has been talked about but it is quite a nice subwoofer.

Sounds good in my room, which is about 2300 cubic feet. A little bit glitchy w initial turn on periodically with the auto feature compared to my old svs pb10 (e.g. Doesn't always turn on fast enough when I initially turn on audyssey). I calibrated with audyssey in a room w room treatments. But I haven't taken any measurements. Biggest difference is the power in the lower bass frequencies. Also a little more punch higher in the bass spectrum but that's more subtle. I haven't done too much listening yet. Planning on watching a movie this evening. Probably need to verify placement in the room is best as well. I used the crawl technique w the pb 10 and put the s3000i there.
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