The "Official" Crowson Tactile Motion Actuators Thread. - Page 64 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1891 of 2274 Old 02-15-2019, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by PioManiac View Post
I'm pretty sure the D-501 instructions read no more than 4 MA's

Did you wire them in series or parallel?


Correction: I have 4, I had originally planned for 6, but haven’t yet acquired them. I’m not over driving 4 of them, something else is going on.


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post #1892 of 2274 Old 02-15-2019, 04:16 PM
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Thanks for your thoughts. I’m using 6 actuators and I formerly had them running out of a MiniDSP HD, until I tripped on the USB cord and ripped out the RCA connector. When using the MiniDSP, there was far more output, hence my puzzlement.


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Probably a long shot but here goes....You said you tripped on the usb cable and ripped out the rca connection, are you using the same rca cable that was attached to the mini-dip? If so, that cable may be damaged, I would try some new cables if you have not done so yet.
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post #1893 of 2274 Old 02-15-2019, 04:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Bunga99 View Post
Probably a long shot but here goes....You said you tripped on the usb cable and ripped out the rca connection, are you using the same rca cable that was attached to the mini-dip? If so, that cable may be damaged, I would try some new cables if you have not done so yet.


Appreciate the suggestion, but that cable was bent beyond repair and is now in a landfill somewhere. I need to spend some time troubleshooting this, and I do value everyone’s thoughts on this.


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post #1894 of 2274 Old 02-18-2019, 10:46 AM
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Do any of you guys know if you can calibrate with only one subout active and then post Audy turn on subout 2 in addition, and if so if it just duplicates to subout 2 as what Audy did to subout 1 on the Denons?

On my Onkyo 5010, I could do this and would work fine. It would just duplicate to subout 2 what Audy did to subout 1 when you enabled subout 2 (ie, distance, PEQ etc).

I haven't tried it yet but will soon. If I can put all my subs on one subout, then I can get more negative delay on my MA's and BKs by putting them on a subout of their own (since I'm restricted to 15' in the miniDSP 10x10HD to be able to add back in to keep time alignment on subs on subout 1). I should be able to get about 20ms negative delay (firing before) from the MAs/BKs to my VNFs that way, opposed to 15-16ms with Denons restrictions as well as the 10x10HDs. Not a lot more, but I'll take what I can get. Also I'm just needing to go back to 1 subout for all subs anyway for different reasons.

I guess another way I can do it too, is just run a Y splitter from AVR subout 1 & 2 into input 1 of the mini so that 2 subouts on the AVR are active and just run Audy. Then post Audy, take out the Y splitter and just proceed as normal ...one cable from AVR to input 1 of mini for subs and one cable from subout 2 of AVR into input 2 of mine for the MAs/BKs. Then undo whatever Audy did (should be very minimum for me know with more subs) on subout 2 for the MAs/BKs. If I'm thinking correctly this should work just fine. Maybe not though we'll see.

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post #1895 of 2274 Old 02-18-2019, 11:38 AM
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Do any of you guys know if you can calibrate with only one subout active and then post Audy turn on subout 2 in addition, and if so if it just duplicates to subout 2 as what Audy did to subout 1 on the Denons?
As soon as you turn on the second sub out, Audyssey will deactivate.

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post #1896 of 2274 Old 02-18-2019, 12:12 PM
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As soon as you turn on the second sub out, Audyssey will deactivate.
Ah, I kind of figured it might but was hopeful. Even with using the Editors App I would imagine. In the app post audy, it wont let you change the number of subouts, but it will in the AVR, so was hopeful if wouldn't disengage Audy unlike the Onkyo. I do miss that AVR sometimes, but no Atmos on it.

BUT, even if it doesn't work with the app (which I'm sure it probably wont with what you said), I did just try using the Y splitter way for keeping two subouts active, and hot damn ....it WORKED!! So I guess I'm in business

Makes me so happy because I was already starting to dread what I was gonna have to do if either of these two ways didn't work and would most infidelity cut down on my negative delay amount as well.
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post #1897 of 2274 Old 02-18-2019, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by SBuger View Post
If I can put all my subs on one subout, then I can get more negative delay on my MA's and BKs by putting them on a subout of their own (since I'm restricted to 15' in the miniDSP 10x10HD to be able to add back in to keep time alignment on subs on subout 1). I should be able to get about 20ms negative delay (firing before) from the MAs/BKs to my VNFs that way, opposed to 15-16ms with Denons restrictions as well as the 10x10HDs. Not a lot more, but I'll take what I can get. Also I'm just needing to go back to 1 subout for all subs anyway for different reasons.
I don‘t follow ? As the farfield subs is the ones with 0 delay, you won’t gain anything. Remember the Denon limitation isn’t between sub1 and sub2 it is between the furthest and closest speakers.

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I guess another way I can do it too, is just run a Y splitter from AVR subout 1 & 2 into input 1 of the mini so that 2 subouts on the AVR are active and just run Audy. Then post Audy, take out the Y splitter and just proceed as normal ...one cable from AVR to input 1 of mini for subs and one cable from subout 2 of AVR into input 2 of mine for the MAs/BKs. Then undo whatever Audy did (should be very minimum for me know with more subs) on subout 2 for the MAs/BKs. If I'm thinking correctly this should work just fine. Maybe not though we'll see.
No need to reconnect anything, just route the two sub inputs to your Mindsp to the same outputs(subs). Ie. Input 1 and 2 to output 1. And then change back after aud.
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post #1898 of 2274 Old 02-18-2019, 12:58 PM
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Does anyone have any links they can reference to testing of the rubber isolation feet?

I opted for the softer ones, but have used the regular ones (even other random cheaper rubber ones from PE) in the last and couldn't tell a difference.

I know there is some math involved in regards to hitting resonance points with softer rubber, but really interested in seeing if the measurable differences between softer (more expensive) and harder (cheap) rubber can be subjectively felt. As an example, I can't subjectively tell if a box is tuned to 19Hz vs 20Hz all other things being equal...and this seems like a similar situation.

Also, the isolation feet seem even LESS important if one has more than one actuator per chair, etc...

Thoughts from the pros?
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post #1899 of 2274 Old 02-18-2019, 01:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Nalleh View Post
I don‘t follow ? As the farfield subs is the ones with 0 delay, you won’t gain anything. Remember the Denon limitation isn’t between sub1 and sub2 it is between the furthest and closest speakers.



No need to reconnect anything, just route the two sub inputs to your Mindsp to the same outputs(subs). Ie. Input 1 and 2 to output 1. And then change back after aud.
For negative delay (firing first) to happen, which is the farthest sub compared to closer subs, it needs to be the farthest distance in the AVR. So for me, that farthest sub is 12.2', then NFs on side walls at 6.6', then VNFs at 5.2'. This means for negative delay to happen on the MAs and BK's, it needs to be farther (in the AVR distance) than all these subs including the farthest sub (which is now only at 12.2' for the subs post Audy). If I do this on one subout, I'm limited (well more limited) because of my 15' max allowment in the miniDSP 10x10HD (which I'll need to put back in the minidsp for each sub to make up the difference once I up AVR distance to make the MAs and BK's the farthest to fire first (Acting like the farthest sub now). I can only put 24' tops for my sub distance for the MAs negative delay because of what Denon allows (only 20' past the closest speaker, which for me is 4'). Freakin Denon AVR, pisses me off!

Now that I have the subout 2 free of any subs (by using the Y splitter like I mentioned in my above post to trick Audy), I can put in 24' for this subout (my max with the Denon restriction to shortest distance speaker at 4'). This will give me 19.8' negative delay to the VNF subs since my VNFs ar at 5.2' (yes on the other subout but doesnt matter), which the VNFs give me most of my TR from subs and is most important for the MA's to be aligned with).

By using the second subout out subout 2, I wont have to mess with entering back in the distance in the miniDSP for each sub on subout 1 to keep all the subs time aligned with each other and the speakers. I don't have enough available distance in the 10x10HD to get 19.8ms negative delay to the VNFs. I do using this other method. Follow?

That's why I need to reconnect two cables in place of the Y from the AVR into one input on the mini to two (instead of routing input to output 1 & 2 like you say). I had to do this to trick Audy into giving me two subouts active, but really only using one for the subs. This way I get two subouts from the AVR with separate distance control for each subout. I NEED that other subout free and active in the AVR so I can set it to my max distance, which is 24' on my system with the Denon restriction of 20' past the shortest speaker distance. This way I can get the MOST negative delay I can. Its not a ton more, but still some. About 4-5ms more doing it this way.

I know all that is confusing, but is the way it works. Have you ever used only one subout for all your subs? It has to be done this way. Enter in the farthest sub distance into the AVR, then in the MiniDSP, you have to enter in the difference in distance to that next closet sub to the farthest sub, and so on for each sub that is closer (with VNFs being the closest). This keeps them all time aligned with each other and the speakers. BUT now we want the MAs/BKs to be the farthest and to fire first. A second subout just makes it way easier (for me anyway) and allows more distance since I don't have enough distance capability in the 10x10HD mini to put back in to get to use my max of 24' (max distance with my closet speaker being 4' away).

Hope all that made sense lol Maybe it's my thinking that is off here, but should work like a charm a think and as described. I've been wrong before though Basically you just have to think of the MAs as another sub, and in this case the farthest sub in your system to get negative delay (firing before all your subs, and as much as we can get since we are not as lucky as the guys with Yamahas).

EDIT: Ok I miss figured the negative delay amount a little and also my AVR set my farthest sub to 8.9'instead of 12.2' (actually just the distance in the avr for subout 1 ..they are all on subout 1 and set up in the mini with appropriate distance added back in to the closer subs to time align them all to each other and the speakers). So doing it with two subouts and taking into account the restrictions of the 10x10HD and Denon's 20' max restriction past shortest distance speaker I'm only gaining 3.8' more of negative delay on the MAs/BKs by using two subouts (with MAs and BKs on the the subout 2 and All subs on subout 1) vs only using one subout (All subs plus MAs and BKes together on subout 1).

From the MAs/BKs I'll be getting 18.8ms negative delay to the VNFs, 17.4ms to the NFs, and 15.1ms on the FF

Versus

15ms, 13.6ms and 11.3

So not a ton more, less than I had originally thought, but hey 3.8ms firing faster just means timing and constructive combing will be that much better with the Subs and MAs/BKs. How much better, IDK, but I'll take it (for now anyway). I know that no negative delay was terrible and got cancellation out the wazzu for the really low stuff under 20hz and just continued to get better down super low to up higher the more ND I could add when I tested it not too long ago.
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post #1900 of 2274 Old 02-18-2019, 04:31 PM
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^^ Ahh, ok so you have been using just the one subout until now then? Then it makes sense. I have used both subouts since day one, LOL.
So yes that will gain max negative delay.


But routing TWO INputs to ONE OUTput can accomplish the same as using a splitter, only easier I use it when i run audyssey, both subouts are routed to output1, which is one of my sonos, and i end up with both subouts audyssey’ed, and after that i can do what i want with them

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post #1901 of 2274 Old 02-18-2019, 04:55 PM
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Awesome on your method of Two inputs to one output instead of using the Y adapter from AVR then taking it back out. THANKS for the tip!!! Dont know why I didnt think of that LOL. Yep will be easier and better. I'll do it next time because I need to run a cal one more time for a final after all this tinkering and trying to figure it all out.

Also I was just fixing to go back and edit my post one more time before you reply'd so I'll just go ahead and post it here. Also I used to use 2 subouts for all subs (FF on one and VNF on the other), but now to make this work I'm gonna only use 1 subout for all subs and then subout 2 for just the MA's and BKs. It'll should make sense down below.

EDIT was gonna be for post above LOL ....tricky stuff, I miscalculated again and would be getting even less Negative Delay on the MAs/BKs if I only use 1 subout for all subs and MAs than I had originally thought, making two subouts even better for more ND. Because I setup the mini DSP already for time alignment for all subs before I ran Audy and used 7' out of 15' available in the mini 10x10HD for the VNFs (and a little less for the NFs) to keep timing of all subs right. That means I can only increase 8' more in the AVR subtrim to on subout 1 to not go over 15' in the mini 10x10HD giving me a max of 17' in the AVR for distance on the MAs/BKs vs 24' if I use subout 2 for the MAs. So about a difference of 7ms in favor of using two subouts.

Sheesh ....the Denon restriction plus the 10x10HD 15' max distance restriction really does make getting Negative Deley tough, or a least a lot of ND anyway. A mini2x4HD with a 75' available would def make it easier, but I love this 10x10HD.

Plus I set up my subs manually for 12.2' away for the farthest sub (with the offset feet put back in the mini to keep all subs timed) to get a real nice FR manually and then Audy sets the distance to 8.9' to fine tune it. So what that is doing is adding more delay to the subs (not negative delay) that what I had set it for to keep in line with the speakers better. Which does work in favor here as well for getting more ND on the MAs/BKs,with either 1 subout or 2 subouts. It puts ND for MAs/BK's to VNFs at about 21.8ms when using 2 subouts and abut 15ms when using one subout with all one subs and MAs on it.

So I guess it keeps getting a little better at least with distance of 24' in the AVR for MAs and BKs on subout 2 LOL I started this whole process of getting only about 15-16ms ND max to the VNFs by using both subouts for two banks of subs (FF and VNF) and tying in on the NFs (not the VNFs) for the MAs/BKs. Now with this method I should be gaining about 7ms more Negative Delay for close to 22' to VNFs which is totally worth it I think

Confusing crap but I think I got it all straight now LOL
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post #1902 of 2274 Old 02-18-2019, 05:45 PM
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^^^ I do kind of the same, but with a twist: i have my FF and MA on subout1 set to max distance in AVR(22.3ft, as my shortest speaker distance is 2.3ft), and delay added back in the minidsp FF channel 8ms, for correct FF delay.

Subout2 goes to my NF’s with correct distance in AVR 4.4ft.

I accomplishe the same and with the added bonus of individual level control of FF and NF via >option>channel level menu.
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post #1903 of 2274 Old 02-18-2019, 06:07 PM
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^^ Nice, your getting a good 18ms negative delay to your VNFs then form our MAs/BKs, and yep trim controls for FF and VNF is always nice. I'll have to use the mini now for that or gain on the amps if I want to change them. Its ok though since I've got subs all around the room now though with VNFs, NFs and FF. I'm just happy to be able to get a little more ND, kind of bugs that we can't get more with our Denons though.
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post #1904 of 2274 Old 02-19-2019, 07:28 AM
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Originally Posted by popalock View Post

I know there is some math involved in regards to hitting resonance points with softer rubber, but really interested in seeing if the measurable differences between softer (more expensive) and harder (cheap) rubber can be subjectively felt. As an example, I can't subjectively tell if a box is tuned to 19Hz vs 20Hz all other things being equal...and this seems like a similar situation.



Also, the isolation feet seem even LESS important if one has more than one actuator per chair, etc...



Thoughts from the pros?

I’ve seen Mark Seaton I believe post a few things on this regarding optimal compression for isolators, but I can’t recall where.

I’m using a combo of the hard PE feet and the older model soft Crowson feet, and no complaints here. I feel I got lucky with my setup, as the plywood base under the seating distributes the TR from the MA’s extremely well and fairly even regardless of location.

I agree on the isolation feet seeming less important to the overall experience, but I don’t have a lot of different experiences to speak of.
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post #1905 of 2274 Old 02-19-2019, 07:37 AM
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I’ve seen a few of the bassheads here blow MA’s over the years, and was wondering how much power you run and if you leave any headroom? I’ve never felt them lacking in any way.

Today I bumped up my headroom about +2dB on the Crowson’s, ~300 watts more for a total of 800wrms into a 4 ohm load, which is how mine are wired in parallel. I’ve always ran them a little conservative with only 500wrms (which is their rating for 8ohm), and I’ve loved ever bit of TR they add.

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post #1906 of 2274 Old 02-19-2019, 09:08 AM
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So I got the 6 new sorbothane isolators in. I haven't checked them out yet under the seats, but just smashing them down with my fingers, they are quite a bit stiffer than the previous sorbos before he reworked them (I have two of these that I haven't used yet as well). I don't think they are as firm as the normal ones (grey color), but I'm sure some motion will be lost in the ULF TR compared to the previous version of the really squishy ones, although they wont come apart as easy I'm sure like he said. Have you tried the reworked ones yet compared to your previous sorbo's @Nalleh ?

How are the new sorbothane isolators performing. Please can you check and report your findings. I read that the earlier one's easily disintegrated and less durable?. Thank you.

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post #1907 of 2274 Old 02-19-2019, 05:21 PM
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Aura Bass Shakers vs Crowson Tactile Motion

Hi

I currently have a row of three theater seats with Aura Bass Shakers that came with the seats and are located in the seat backs.

In the near future I will be doing some renovations in my theater room in regards to more speakers, upgrade HDMI and I am considering new theater chairs.

While ours are nice we have look at another brand which is much more comfortable to sit in and they offer the option of Crowson Tactile Motion.

I have not been able to demo the Crowson product in these seats which I would really like to do this if possible before I made the decision to make the change in seats as it will not be a cheap.

In the meantime perhaps people that have used Crowson can provide me with their thoughts on how they work and also vs a bass shaker.

In the new set up there would be 4 actuators run by one D501 amp.

Thanks for any help.
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post #1908 of 2274 Old 02-19-2019, 07:55 PM
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Originally Posted by MMC57 View Post

In the meantime perhaps people that have used Crowson can provide me with their thoughts on how they work and also vs a bass shaker.



In the new set up there would be 4 actuators run by one D501 amp.



Thanks for any help.

Crowson’s are in a completely different league than aura bass shakers. Without demoing them, I can’t fully describe the differences with your seating and setup, but it would be a drastic improvement in accuracy and reproduction of the content without any lag, overhang, or sloppiness to the tactile bass. They are also capable of digging lower than nearly all shakers on the market without any adverse noises, bottoming out, etc.

I’ve tried ButtKickers after already owning Crowson’s for a year and was not a fan, but some people do implement both in their systems. I was never able to dial the BK’s in to get the amount of TR I preferred without them bottoming out during heavy content. There are ways to eliminate this with a steeper HPF and run them in a higher frequency range, but with Crowson’s there’s no need to worry.

Absolutely get four Crowson’s, but four per amplifier is pushing the amp to its limits. It is rated for four MA’s, but a few users have blown fuses and had power issues when driving them hard with four on just one D501 amp. You might be fine though depending on listening habits.

Don’t forget to mention the 10% off when ordering for AVS members!
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post #1909 of 2274 Old 02-19-2019, 09:46 PM
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Originally Posted by avtvhdbass View Post
How are the new sorbothane isolators performing. Please can you check and report your findings. I read that the earlier one's easily disintegrated and less durable?. Thank you.
Well I've just now got my system calibrated and running again with the new sub additions, 3rd seat and more MAs, so haven't really messed with them much at all yet except for a brief trial run last week. Will try to put it through the paces over the next couple of days to really see what I think of it, and the new isolators.

I did try them last week while waiting for some duratex to come in for the subs. I tried the older version sorbothane isolators since I already had two of them and feel a little squishier compared to the newer version which is what I was really wanting. So I put them on the middle seat MLP. I only had two seats in the room at the time, I hadn't got the new 3rd seat in the room yet. So for a test I just used 2 MAs and 2 BKs only on the middle seat by itself (not connected to the other seat). 2 Isolators on the front and MAs and BKs in the back (with no isolators on the back). I was also testing a new way of mounting the BKs. Tried the new way with the old non-sorbothane isolators like I have always used to get a feel for the new mounting of BKs. Then changed to the older version sorbos. I did like them better and seemed to give better ULF wobble on a couple ULF tracks I'm real familiar with. So far, even though it was brief, I'm a fan of them.

I did not however check out the newer version sorbothane isolators yet, but do have all 3 seats setup now with 6 MAs (2 per seat) plus the 4 BK's that cover all three seats as well. Will only be using 4 isolators up front (on under each 4 armrest upfront), at least that's what I'm gonna try first, hopefully tomorrow.

As far as the new version of the sorbothane isolators being more durable, IDK yet. They do seem a little firmer when they are put together compared to the older version and are not glued together like the older version. You can pull them apart pretty easily and put them back together. The caps do seems more durable too than the older ones. I don't foresee having any problems with them, but we'll see over time I guess, with both versions.

The main problem Mr. Crowson told me was that some folks tend to drag their seats into place once the isolators are screwed on to the bottom of the chair and would start the problems I guess. If you do that with the new ones, they just come apart and you re position the bottom part to the top part again and all is good.

Sorry I don't have more of a definite answer yet on the new isolators, but I think they're gonna be real good
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post #1910 of 2274 Old 02-20-2019, 08:44 AM
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A little teaser about what’s up in Norway

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nalleh View Post
A little teaser about what’s up in Norway





That looks like some mad scientist double stacking with a riser?! I guess it was you I read that was planning on stacking them, but I wasn’t sure what you meant. That’s going to be crazy!
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post #1912 of 2274 Old 02-20-2019, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sekosche View Post

That looks like some mad scientist double stacking with a riser?! I guess it was you I read that was planning on stacking them, but I wasn’t sure what you meant. That’s going to be crazy!
It is a plattform that the left, center and right couch sections are bolted to. And MA’s and isolators under it. This is the underside:



This is what the man himself said when i asked about stacking:

Quote:
That is a very interesting concept. In that configuration you will get the same force output (peak acceleration) but you will move 2x the distance. The result will be better performance below 10Hz. That would be a fun experiment.

Best,
Randolph J. Crowson
So instead of 4 MA’s in 1 layer, i will test 3 MA’s in 2 layers.
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post #1913 of 2274 Old 02-20-2019, 12:07 PM
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I like how he thought about the possibilities of such an idea instead of poo-pooing it like I think a lot of owners would if asked about something that involved using their products in a non-conventional way.

My impressions from the few conversations with him is that he is a very nice and smart guy.
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post #1914 of 2274 Old 02-20-2019, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carp View Post
I like how he thought about the possibilities of such an idea instead of poo-pooing it like I think a lot of owners would if asked about something that involved using their products in a non-conventional way.

My impressions from the few conversations with him is that he is a very nice and smart guy.
Indeed and agreed. His positivity to the project was what sealed the deal for me
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post #1915 of 2274 Old 02-20-2019, 12:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Nalleh View Post
Indeed and agreed. His positivity to the project was what sealed the deal for me

When I initially asked Randolph about positioning the MA’s under the couch feet, he’s the one that suggested I use a wood base for better distribution and to keep the magnet away from the couch frame. Glad I did, because the results have been amazing. I haven’t ever ran them any other way though so no comparison.

This is a very creative use of MA’s. I bet you’ll get something like D-Box vertical movement now.
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post #1916 of 2274 Old 02-20-2019, 12:37 PM
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^ Yeah, this is a poor man’s DBox

The Crowsons have a Xmax of 6mm, so stacking would give up to 12mm. Or running them at half power for similar as single mount. Either way, you should have more than enough capacity
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post #1917 of 2274 Old 02-20-2019, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nalleh View Post
^ Yeah, this is a poor man’s DBox



The Crowsons have a Xmax of 6mm, so stacking would give up to 12mm. Or running them at half power for similar as single mount. Either way, you should have more than enough capacity

That’s pretty awesome, a 1/2” of vertical movement sounds like a heck of a lot under the seating. Sometimes I feel like the energy transmitted into my armrest and seat cushions has them bouncing that much, but it probably just feels that way with few points of reference to measure.

With just two Crowson’s and the nearfield subs TR, a lot of people tell me they feel like they’re on an amusement park ride, some love it and some don’t. I’m obviously a fan.
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post #1918 of 2274 Old 02-20-2019, 01:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nalleh View Post
A little teaser about what’s up in Norway

Hell yeah, I've been waiting to see this happen from you ever since you told us about it a few weeks ago!! I think you need to be labeled the king of TR around here!!!

I may give ya a good run for your money, but I think you may have me beat now hahaha

Either way though, I did get to try out 2 more MAs added to my 4 today for 6 MAs total, plus the 4 BK LFE's mounted the new way with leveraged behind all four armrests (3 seats) plus the new style isolators, and Oh man, it put a pretty big grin on my face. Couple that with the now 3 VNF 18's behind me and YEAH Buddy! hehehehehe

Your gonna love 6 MAs Nalleh even if not stacked, but I think you new stacking approach is gonna kick MAJOR BUTT!!! Can't wait to see and hear about it!!!

And yeah I agree, very cool that Mr. Crowon didnt poo poo it like carp said and was supportive about it! Sounds like he thought it might be great too from what he said in the email. Awesome!!
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post #1919 of 2274 Old 02-21-2019, 02:29 AM
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^^ Awsome on your upgrades, Bug. I bet it was a notable improvement

I am thinking i can do a compare between the old rubber iso’s, gen1 of the sorbo’s and then the gen2 sorbo with Vibsensor, but yeah as has been said before, the sorbos are moar efficient in the ULF area(softer) while the rubber is more in the LF and up area(firmer). And i like woobly
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post #1920 of 2274 Old 02-21-2019, 03:06 AM
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If the new Sorbothane isolators are stiffer than the original versions that they replace than they must be pretty close to the rubber Penn Elcom's which have a little give to them. If that is accurate than I question the benefit vs. cost.

Also, I am curious if the SVS SoundPath isolation system would work well.

https://www.svsound.com/products/sou...olation-system

They are a 1/2 inch taller but $50 for 4 as opposed to $35 each for the Crownson's, they may be a better and more viable alternative.
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