The "Official" Crowson Tactile Motion Actuators Thread. - Page 85 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #2521 of 2537 Old 01-08-2020, 04:33 PM
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Originally Posted by SBuger View Post
@Matt Fowler - I would think one of three things are happening.

1. Audyssey …but I agree with Alan, that’s probably not it. But turn Audy off and see what happens when playing that 10hz tone for a totally untouched signal to the MAs.

2. There is some sort of HPF/low cutoff set in the miniDSP or Amp not allowing 10hz to be fed a strong enough signal to produce any TR movement from the MAs. Not familiar though with that amp and its settings for this, plus you said that no HPF is set in the miniDSP. Double check to make sure and didn’t get set to on in the crossover section.

3. This may or may not be the case, BUT if you were really pushing the MAs at high levels for very long with those tones, they may have got too hot and went into protect mode and completely shut down for a while by the time you played that 10hz tone. Don’t ask me how I know this LOL. This was a long time ago and I try not to go that far these days with tones if and when I use them.

Yep, the MAs should give you movement all the way down to 1hz, especially if your amp will allow it with not too much rolloff.

Check all of that. Hope this helps because 10hz and below are one of the best things about Crowsons
I am starting to think its a lack of amp power then. I touched them and they didn't seem hot, I didn't run the test tones for a long period of time. I don't have any crossovers set.

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post #2522 of 2537 Old 01-08-2020, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by MOberhardt View Post
How specifically do you have it all connected? What is going to what? Both on the AVR side and the crowson amp to the crowsons? And as I was asking before what is the amp showing? If on auto, is it staying in standby / Amber LED? Or do you see it go to active (blue) which it does when it detects a signal to it. If it stays red it means it isn't getting a signal

What is the level set to on the Crowson amp, the volume? The default 30?

Do you have two actuators connected to each amp output, like the manual? Or are you trying to run one off of each croswon amp output? (I'm not even sure that works as impedance wrong)

How is the avr output connected to the amp? Do you have it connected to the crowson amp OUTPUT. If it is the subwoofer feed, connect it to the Red terminal, the second one across, not the one closest to the edge.

Did you check out the manual? http://crowsontech.com/_CrowsonTech/...ners_Guide.pdf
The light is blue.

The level is 50/80.

I have one actuator connected to output 1 and one to output 2. Wait are we saying that I should be daisy chaining the run I have going from the 1st actuator to the 2nd?


My AVR setup is to Mini DSP
Input 1 to Crowson and Right Sub
Input 2 to Left Sub
Output 1 is Crowson, 2 Right sub, 3 Left sub

I have the minidsp connection running to LFE

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post #2523 of 2537 Old 01-08-2020, 05:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Matt Fowler View Post
The light is blue.

The level is 50/80.

I have one actuator connected to output 1 and one to output 2. Wait are we saying that I should be daisy chaining the run I have going from the 1st actuator to the 2nd?


My AVR setup is to Mini DSP
Input 1 to Crowson and Right Sub
Input 2 to Left Sub
Output 1 is Crowson, 2 Right sub, 3 Left sub

I have the minidsp connection running to LFE
Yes both actuators should be in parallel from one output. This might be your problem.

There is a picture in the manual

nd you definitely have the minidsp output the the right red input on the rear of the crowson amp (should be if the light is blue)
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post #2524 of 2537 Old 01-08-2020, 05:11 PM
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Guys, I am really sorry for wasting everyones time. All Youtube 10hz test tones are not created equally. I tried 3 videos with nothing, the 4th one I got plenty of 10hz TR. The weird part is for the 3 videos that didn't work there was woofer movement.

Similarly from the same author I used 8 and 5 hz tones and got TR from all of them.

Thank you for all your advice!
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post #2525 of 2537 Old 01-08-2020, 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Matt Fowler View Post
Guys, I am really sorry for wasting everyones time. All Youtube 10hz test tones are not created equally. I tried 3 videos with nothing, the 4th one I got plenty of 10hz TR. The weird part is for the 3 videos that didn't work there was woofer movement.

Similarly from the same author I used 8 and 5 hz tones and got TR from all of them.

Thank you for all your advice!
No need to apologize! We are all here to help.

So it works OK when each actuator is on a separate Crowson Amp output? That is good to know. I wonder if I did that on mine it would mean it would have to drive it all less (less power requirements), or the opposite?
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post #2526 of 2537 Old 01-08-2020, 05:45 PM
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Originally Posted by MOberhardt View Post
No need to apologize! We are all here to help.

So it works OK when each actuator is on a separate Crowson Amp output? That is good to know. I wonder if I did that on mine it would mean it would have to drive it all less (less power requirements), or the opposite?
I actually emailed Randall about this a long time ago. He replied:

"The SC-602 amplifier has two separate amplifier boards. It is best to have one actuator on each one. To do this you must run a separate wire from the amp to the MA".

If you look closely at the manual in a 4 MA setup you can see MA 1 notated on left out, MA 2 on right out, MA 3 on left out daisy chain, MA 4 on right out daisy chain.
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post #2527 of 2537 Old 01-08-2020, 05:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Matt Fowler View Post
I actually emailed Randall about this a long time ago. He replied:

"The SC-602 amplifier has two separate amplifier boards. It is best to have one actuator on each one. To do this you must run a separate wire from the amp to the MA".

If you look closely at the manual in a 4 MA setup you can see MA 1 notated on left out, MA 2 on right out, MA 3 on left out daisy chain, MA 4 on right out daisy chain.
Argh. I wonder if that is the same as their newer amp, the one I have?

I actually had mine wired that way before I powered t up, but got nervous about it, thinking I might have caused an impedance issue. I think I could change it back to that way. but I'd need to clean up a bit of cabling.
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post #2528 of 2537 Old 01-08-2020, 06:24 PM
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Originally Posted by MOberhardt View Post
Argh. I wonder if that is the same as their newer amp, the one I have?

I actually had mine wired that way before I powered t up, but got nervous about it, thinking I might have caused an impedance issue. I think I could change it back to that way. but I'd need to clean up a bit of cabling.
Since either output can support 2 at a time you are probably fine but maybe you would get more headroom trying it the other way?

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post #2529 of 2537 Old 01-08-2020, 06:37 PM
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It likely won't be a huge difference because when you connect 2 MAs to one channel of the amp you are wiring them in parallel and thus cutting impedance in half vs. wiring them on each channel. I would expect the main benefit to putting one on each channel will be that each channel (amplifier board) has its own power supply and/or capacitors so it should be able to push a bit more when you're maxing it out.
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post #2530 of 2537 Old 01-08-2020, 08:31 PM
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Ah thats good to know. I'm not running mine hard. I think the level I have on it on the crowson amp (the 501) is only 20, the default.

Honestly I'm not actually sure how high you can wind it up without the actuators maxing on a loud (say -10dB signal) before the amp might clip and damage something. But running on setting 20 with my normal listening levels is still very noticable, and pretty terrifying in some film sequences like that Jack the Giant Slayer beanstalk sprouting...
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post #2531 of 2537 Old 01-08-2020, 09:54 PM
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Originally Posted by MOberhardt View Post
Ah thats good to know. I'm not running mine hard. I think the level I have on it on the crowson amp (the 501) is only 20, the default.

Honestly I'm not actually sure how high you can wind it up without the actuators maxing on a loud (say -10dB signal) before the amp might clip and damage something. But running on setting 20 with my normal listening levels is still very noticable, and pretty terrifying in some film sequences like that Jack the Giant Slayer beanstalk sprouting...
Looks like that amp goes to 32. So default is like 62 percent gain? Thats actually how I landed on 50/80 intensity, 62 percent gain, comparing to those with newer amps. Maybe the gain structure is different between the amps so its not apples to apples. I've wondered at times if I'm overdriving mine as well as they can get during something like MM FR (which is about as hard on the crowsons as it gets). In addition they get the Audyssey trims from my right LFE output which has a -7.5db trim, I suppose this makes the real gain more like 42/80.

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post #2532 of 2537 Old 01-09-2020, 01:57 AM
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^^ The older 602 Crowson amp is a dual channel/stereo amp, while the new 501 is a mono amp.
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post #2533 of 2537 Old 01-14-2020, 07:36 PM
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I’m planning to receive my brand new Crowsons tomorrow Pretty stoked. Question I have is getting tr to both my loveseat & armrests to the floor. There are 2 connecting metal tabs between the loveseat and armrests but they’re somewhat wobbly and just look dinky. It’s as if a lot of the tr from the two Crowsons, one under each armrest, will be lost because of the less than rigid metal tabs themselves to the center loveseats. So to rectify this I’m planning to use one large 1/2” plywood sheet underneath armrests and loveseat so the dinky metal tabs aren’t the weak link. Is this the best way to go in getting maximum Tr, using one large plywood underneath loveseat and armrests? Also, what type of 1/2” plywood do you all recommend for strength, firmness, etc.? I’ve attached pics for reference.

TIA!
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post #2534 of 2537 Old 01-15-2020, 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted by leehan76 View Post
I’m planning to receive my brand new Crowsons tomorrow Pretty stoked. Question I have is getting tr to both my loveseat & armrests to the floor. There are 2 connecting metal tabs between the loveseat and armrests but they’re somewhat wobbly and just look dinky. It’s as if a lot of the tr from the two Crowsons, one under each armrest, will be lost because of the less than rigid metal tabs themselves to the center loveseats. So to rectify this I’m planning to use one large 1/2” plywood sheet underneath armrests and loveseat so the dinky metal tabs aren’t the weak link. Is this the best way to go in getting maximum Tr, using one large plywood underneath loveseat and armrests? Also, what type of 1/2” plywood do you all recommend for strength, firmness, etc.? I’ve attached pics for reference.

TIA!
1/2 inch plywood isn't enough thickness in my opinion and will probably sag over time with your heavy seats. 3/4 inch is minimum and 1 inch is even better. Plywood is flimsy in general so that's why you want it thicker and to keep actuators away from metal frame. MDF is also another option.

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post #2535 of 2537 Old 01-15-2020, 09:58 AM
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Originally Posted by leehan76 View Post
I’m planning to receive my brand new Crowsons tomorrow Pretty stoked. Question I have is getting tr to both my loveseat & armrests to the floor. There are 2 connecting metal tabs between the loveseat and armrests but they’re somewhat wobbly and just look dinky. It’s as if a lot of the tr from the two Crowsons, one under each armrest, will be lost because of the less than rigid metal tabs themselves to the center loveseats. So to rectify this I’m planning to use one large 1/2” plywood sheet underneath armrests and loveseat so the dinky metal tabs aren’t the weak link. Is this the best way to go in getting maximum Tr, using one large plywood underneath loveseat and armrests? Also, what type of 1/2” plywood do you all recommend for strength, firmness, etc.? I’ve attached pics for reference.

TIA!
I believe most in this thread are using 3/4" plywood for the added rigidity (as am I), but if you plan to attach the plywood to the seating with bolts, 1/2" should be just fine.

As far as type of plywood, I think it was birch that was recommended, but you could search the thread to make sure.
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post #2536 of 2537 Old 01-15-2020, 09:33 PM
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Originally Posted by ereed View Post
1/2 inch plywood isn't enough thickness in my opinion and will probably sag over time with your heavy seats. 3/4 inch is minimum and 1 inch is even better. Plywood is flimsy in general so that's why you want it thicker and to keep actuators away from metal frame. MDF is also another option.
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I believe most in this thread are using 3/4" plywood for the added rigidity (as am I), but if you plan to attach the plywood to the seating with bolts, 1/2" should be just fine.

As far as type of plywood, I think it was birch that was recommended, but you could search the thread to make sure.
I appreciate the advice! I’m going to pick up 3/4” thick wood tomorrow. Anyone try placing their Crowson amp on top of a subwoofer btw?

Speakers: KEF R300 (R,L), KEF R600C (C), JBL 306p mkII (Surrounds), KEF Ci160QR (In-Ceiling) Subs: JTR Captivator S1 x2 Processor/Amps: Anthem AVM60, ATI AT4003, Rotel RB985 mkII Misc: ATV 4k, Sony PS4, Samsung K8500, MiniDSP 2x4HD, Crowson MAs x2 Video: BenQ HT2050, 100” Screen Room: 2500 cu sq. ft. sealed on suspended floor

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post #2537 of 2537 Old 01-16-2020, 05:08 PM
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I appreciate the advice! I’m going to pick up 3/4” thick wood tomorrow. Anyone try placing their Crowson amp on top of a subwoofer btw?
No,. From a heat persective it'd be OK, but not sure if the vibration from the sub might cause issues.
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