Rythmik FV15HP or PC-13 Ultra - Page 3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #61 of 249 Old 12-06-2013, 07:10 AM
 
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Some rooms have all the luck.
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post #62 of 249 Old 12-06-2013, 07:13 AM
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Dangit! Does that mean I have to wait a extra week for the little BBuster 300 then? Nice looking graph.

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post #63 of 249 Old 12-06-2013, 08:18 AM
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I would love to know how to make my own graph! That freq response is amazing for having no eq

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post #64 of 249 Old 12-06-2013, 08:25 AM
 
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Have you downloaded a freeware copy of REW? If not, Google REW, download and get a copy up and running.
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post #65 of 249 Old 12-06-2013, 08:47 AM
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I have glanced at the web page and it looks a little over my head ... lol

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post #66 of 249 Old 12-06-2013, 08:50 AM
 
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It actually isn't. It's a bit of a frustrating pain to get up and running, but once up and running, it's all point-n-click.

If you'll allow me, just download REW and start familiarizing yourself with the GUI.

Here's a video to get you started.

You'll probably fuss around with it for a week or two as you wait for measuring microphone and any additional cables you might need but again, once you get through the pain of the learning curve, it's a piece of cake and you too will become a REW convert.
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post #67 of 249 Old 12-20-2013, 10:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Finally, I received FV15HP today. All things equal, this sub fails to impress me. Amp is overwhelming but very intuitive, so, no issues on this. Also, ample headroom, but I've heard better.

Details in a bit. Right now running REW sweeps.

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post #68 of 249 Old 12-20-2013, 11:02 AM
 
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...eek.gif...eek.gif...eek.gif

(i'm shocked at this comment)

In it's price class, what have you heard that has more output and is better sounding than a properly integrated FV15HP? confused.gif
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post #69 of 249 Old 12-20-2013, 11:26 AM - Thread Starter
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So am I. I cant crank the volume right now as its past midnight here but what um hearing right now is far from impressive. My DIY sub sounds better till 22-23Hz. Below FV15HP wins, but that's where I tuned my DIY sub. Anyway I can't say it definitely at this point in time. I will get back with details later when um comprehensively done with it. It's gona take a while though.

Something just doesn't sound right, though there is ample headroom and walls shaking bass.

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post #70 of 249 Old 12-20-2013, 12:11 PM
 
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With our shipment, a setup sheet was provided. Did you receive the setup sheet?

Are you running a single port open or both ports open. We're setup for single port operation. Do you have Audyssey and have you run it yet?

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post #71 of 249 Old 12-20-2013, 12:25 PM
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You probably already know, But placement is key.

I tried 4 different locations and all gave vastly different sounds. Luckily, the last corner loaded position is my favorite and works well for the room layout.

Interesting is how clean the sound is. I was listening to Skillex. I never knew all the different frequency changes he used on his drops till now. The sub is -7.0 db and the louder I played the louder the bass got. It just felt heavier. No mudiness, not boominess. Just bass. It has taken awhile, but the more I listen the more impressed.

I measured my sub with an iMM-6 because I was worried about output. It has a ton, it is just in the frequency intended. Nothing else.
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post #72 of 249 Old 12-20-2013, 01:09 PM - Thread Starter
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With our shipment, a setup sheet was provided. Did you receive the setup sheet?

Are you running a single port open or both ports open. We're setup for single port operation. Do you have Audyssey and have you run it yet?

Yes I did, it's pretty intuitive. Um using 2 ports open/Limiter On/Rumble Filter On/14Hz/Low Damping/LFE Input. I don't use Audyssey; I prefer manual set up. I mean all things equal, this sub just doesn't have that IT factor or may be um expecting a bit too much. The FR is roughly the same between this and DIY sub in the same spot in my room till about 22Hz. But something just doesn't sound right.

It's not the head room or enormous output. It's the SQ that is just not right. If low distortion/clean bass are attributed to this sub, I've heard it in my set up. I fried my iNuke a couple of days back. It should be back from repair shop tomorrow. I'd do an a/b testing with my DIY sub.

I hear this fluttering sound from inside the box during transient peaks. For example, The Conjuring end scene.....there is a very loud sudden burst of low frequency; I hear a lot of fluttering from inside the box. I know it's not the driver bottoming out or cone hitting the magnet. It rather sounds like something is loose in there. May be it's the limiter kicking in or something. Um not sure.

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post #73 of 249 Old 12-20-2013, 01:11 PM - Thread Starter
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You probably already know, But placement is key.

I know what you are saying but all those variables have been taken care of. Even at low volumes this sub just doesn't sound right.

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post #74 of 249 Old 12-20-2013, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by braveheart123 View Post

I hear this fluttering sound from inside the box during transient peaks. For example, The Conjuring end scene.....there is a very loud sudden burst of low frequency; I hear a lot of fluttering from inside the box. I know it's not the driver bottoming out or cone hitting the magnet. It rather sounds like something is loose in there. May be it's the limiter kicking in or something. Um not sure.
something must went wrong during the very long distance shipment. I play WOTW many times at reference with 6db sub hot and never once heard any noise. I was trying to see if I can hear port noise with one port plug but cannot hear ANY noise.
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post #75 of 249 Old 12-20-2013, 01:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Cowboys View Post

something must went wrong during the very long distance shipment. I play WOTW many times at reference with 6db sub hot and never once heard any noise. I was trying to see if I can hear port noise with one port plug but cannot hear ANY noise.

Try the WWZ grenade scene. I'm pretty sure I know what Braveheart is talking about. I get it at the very end of that scene. I can't describe other than a flutter. It almost sounds like the pulse is going in and out of a frequency I can hear.

I get it in both 1 and 2 port mode and at most output levels. Since that is the case I assumed it was how it should sound.
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post #76 of 249 Old 12-20-2013, 01:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by braveheart123 View Post

Yes I did, it's pretty intuitive. Um using 2 ports open/Limiter On/Rumble Filter On/14Hz/Low Damping/LFE Input. I don't use Audyssey; I prefer manual set up. I mean all things equal, this sub just doesn't have that IT factor or may be um expecting a bit too much. The FR is roughly the same between this and DIY sub in the same spot in my room till about 22Hz. But something just doesn't sound right.

It's not the head room or enormous output. It's the SQ that is just not right. If low distortion/clean bass are attributed to this sub, I've heard it in my set up. I fried my iNuke a couple of days back. It should be back from repair shop tomorrow. I'd do an a/b testing with my DIY sub.

I hear this fluttering sound from inside the box during transient peaks. For example, The Conjuring end scene.....there is a very loud sudden burst of low frequency; I hear a lot of fluttering from inside the box. I know it's not the driver bottoming out or cone hitting the magnet. It rather sounds like something is loose in there. May be it's the limiter kicking in or something. Um not sure.

Braveheart...

I would suggest you remove the amp plate and look inside the enclosure for any damping material that could be loose and hitting the ports during high-excursion. Also, it could be the wires going from the amp plate to the driver. If they are a little too long, the wires could be hitting somewhere in the enclosure.

I had a similar issue once with one of my Paradigm Reference Studio floor-stander speakers, I removed the bass driver the wire going to the driver was the culprit (too long and hitting the cabinet...).

I tucked the wire in the insulation material inside the cabinet and viola!... no more noise coming from inside the speaker cabinet.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by braveheart123 View Post

I hear this fluttering sound from inside the box during transient peaks.

Maybe if you open it up (remove the speaker), you'll find some loose insulation has gotten into the port tube or something to that idea. confused.gif

(Luis5150 got to the idea first)
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post #78 of 249 Old 12-20-2013, 02:04 PM
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Bummer! Well lets hope your leads are a little long as you know the reasons why. If you decide to opener up lets see what you have going. After all you have been through in shipping/distance, I truly hope you can get this figured out!

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post #79 of 249 Old 12-20-2013, 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Ozzie Isaac View Post

Try the WWZ grenade scene. I'm pretty sure I know what Braveheart is talking about. I get it at the very end of that scene. I can't describe other than a flutter. It almost sounds like the pulse is going in and out of a frequency I can hear.

I get it in both 1 and 2 port mode and at most output levels. Since that is the case I assumed it was how it should sound.
I play that WWZ many times at reference and did not hear any noise at MLP. I should add that when I was playing WOTW at reference with subs 6dbs hot earlier TODAY, I was sitting on the floor right in front of each sub (one at the time) to see if I can detect port noise. None was heard.
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post #80 of 249 Old 12-20-2013, 04:10 PM
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I get it in both 1 and 2 port mode and at most output levels. Since that is the case I assumed it was how it should sound.
even with 2 ports open? I would not assume or accept it after spending that kind of money. I would call Brian immediately.
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post #81 of 249 Old 12-21-2013, 01:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks guys I think I should call up brian. I just want to confirm if it is the limiter kicking in or not. It should not be the limiter as um way below reference.

Does anybody know how many port plugs come with this sub? I had only one plugged in one of the ports. There is no second plug. Also there is no power cable with it.

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post #82 of 249 Old 12-21-2013, 03:33 AM
 
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Both or our units had a power cord and a single foam plug.
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post #83 of 249 Old 12-21-2013, 04:34 AM - Thread Starter
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Most definitely the DS1510 driver is faulty. I've opened up the amp and found nothing loose inside the cabinet. I'm not running the sub very hot. It's only 2dB hotter than the rest of the speakers.
The fluttering sound comes no matter what; even if Limiter and Rumble filters are on or off. It does flutter in The WWZ grenade explosion scene also. Ive measured with SPL meter. Anything above 105dB and the loud fluttering kicks in. It seems like the driver gives in. Here are the pics;














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post #84 of 249 Old 12-21-2013, 05:07 AM - Thread Starter
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Here is the video. The fluttering happens right at the end of the video. The scene is WWZ grenade explosion. It happens in The Conjuring a lot and also in orphanage explosion scene 20 minutes from the end in The Skyfall.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10151781228390124&set=vb.586075123&type=2&theater

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post #85 of 249 Old 12-21-2013, 05:59 AM
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Mmm I dunno Brave? You might just be experiencing what you’re supposed to?? (I'm not there) That scene at the end is very low, slow pulsating bass that goes under tune. Can you demo some other material and see what you come up with? It could be that you’re used to a higher tune and used to scenes like this being cut off although admittedly this is a extreme example. Not saying you don’t have a problem, but from what you convey, it could be you don’t??

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post #86 of 249 Old 12-21-2013, 06:11 AM
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Please do the following for me. Make sure the sensing coil wires connects to the driver securely. If the sensing coil is disconnected, there will be large fluttering at 20hz and 10hz (for 1 port mode). Please also use a flash light to make sure the thicker wires go to the driver (gold terminals) and the thinner wires go the sensing coil (silver terminals). I don't think we can mak that type of mistake. But just checking. Then put a small white dot sticker on the cone to observe the excursion and let me know when you hear the fluttering. Make sure the LFE is not 10db too hot in your AVR setup (in DTS HD master mode). Putting a white dot sticker and observe the excursion can help us determine that. I don't think it is the driver problem because driver can only have limited failure mode (such as fried coil with scratching rubbing sound). If the fluttering noise is when the driver making large excursion, then we need to investigate why it is making that much excursion.


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post #87 of 249 Old 12-21-2013, 07:08 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Rythmik View Post

Please do the following for me. Make sure the sensing coil wires connects to the driver securely. If the sensing coil is disconnected, there will be large fluttering at 20hz and 10hz (for 1 port mode). Please also use a flash light to make sure the thicker wires go to the driver (gold terminals) and the thinner wires go the sensing coil (silver terminals). I don't think we can mak that type of mistake. But just checking. Then put a small white dot sticker on the cone to observe the excursion and let me know when you hear the fluttering. Make sure the LFE is not 10db too hot in your AVR setup (in DTS HD master mode). Putting a white dot sticker and observe the excursion can help us determine that. I don't think it is the driver problem because driver can only have limited failure mode (such as fried coil with scratching rubbing sound). If the fluttering noise is when the driver making large excursion, then we need to investigate why it is making that much excursion.


-

I just tried Line In input with 80Hz/24 instead of LFE. Even with rumble filter and Limiter OFF, there is no fluttering whatsoever now. This time around I kept the sub 6dB hotter than the rest of the speakers and cranked the volume 5dB louder than my reference loudest volume. I measured The Skyfall orphanage blow up scene, WWZ grenade explosion scene, The Conjuring end scenes. I measured raw SPL at MLP (12 ft away from sub) @ 112.5dB with no fluttering sound whatsoever. I checked both 14Hz and 20Hz tunes with and without Rumble Filter and Limiter off.

Could this LFE input be the culprit? If it is then um afraid all the LFE content between 80Hz and 120Hz will be played back at less than desired SPL as Line In/80Hz24 is low passed at 80Hz

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post #88 of 249 Old 12-21-2013, 07:13 AM - Thread Starter
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LFE is defaulted to 0dB. All my source material is DD/DTS only. No HD source. Both ports are open. Also thick wire is correctly attached to the gold terminals on the driver. Thinner ones go to silver coloured terminals.

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post #89 of 249 Old 12-21-2013, 07:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Here is another video. The Skyfall - Orphanage blow up scene (112.5dB) @ MLP 12ft away. 14Hz tune Limiter and Rumble filter off, low damping, 80Hz24 LPF, Line In input, 2 ports open.......No fluttering now even with the sub 6dB hotter than mains and master volume 5dB louder than my reference loudest volume. I checked on WWZ grenade scene also keep all things equal.........No Fluttering whatsoever even with extreme cone excursion. Distortion in sound in the video is coz of the tiny recording mic on the digital camera and pc speakers.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10151781413365124

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post #90 of 249 Old 12-21-2013, 09:19 AM
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I would recommend set the LFE trim to -10db (not subwoofer trim). You should find the bass sound more natural. Earlier this year I went to Denver to check Woody777's FV15HP. He had a similar problem. He later set to -10db and that solved the problem. Even myself had that problem two month ago when the I got a new player. When you have LFE 10db too hot and on top of that, you have sub trim 5db hotter, you can easily overload the digital to analog converter. So what you hear is the clipping noise of D/A converter. Resolve the LFE trim level first. If you'd like to play sub trim 5db hotter, first level match by setting sub trim @-6db by turning up plate amp volume higher. Then you change the sub trim to -1db to have an equivalent of 5db hotter. This will prevent the signal clipping inside AVR before it send out to FV15HP.
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