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post #4111 of 6445 Old 10-07-2015, 11:55 AM
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Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post
Keep in mind that the PS15/PV15 subs use an amp without a DSP. Not having that would directly affect many of those things because Jeremy wouldn't have the ability to shape the FR like he can with the new amps.
I know. I just want to point out that there are audible differences comparing those graphs. The newer RA sub has much better amp and dsp which allows Jereme fine tuning those graph areas.
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post #4112 of 6445 Old 10-07-2015, 12:11 PM
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Originally Posted by tvuong View Post
I know. I just want to point out that there are audible differences comparing those graphs. The newer RA sub has much better amp and dsp which allows Jereme fine tuning those graph areas.
Yeah it was a bit of a challenge using an "off the shelf" amp and trying to make a sub hang with the big boys. We at least got output levels that were ridiculously high for single driver 15s and decent frequency response considering no dsp and a fixed hpf. The notch filter worked like a charm taming the inductance from the strong motor. I kinda wished we could have re ran a few of those tests with it engaged other than raw response.

On the flip side, Dayton was very responsive to warranty issues and if I needed an extra amp or two quick: I could get it the next day.

Some things I would not have gotten buying a lot from China and what was ultimately a smarter move for us in the first year of operations. Even if someone has a PS 15x that the amp breaks down 8 years from now, it may not be hard to find a replacement.
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post #4113 of 6445 Old 10-07-2015, 01:26 PM
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Hi Jeremy,

Can you check your PM on order 1172?

I'd love to give everyone my thoughts on the Gamma 15 =D, as soon as I receive it.

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post #4114 of 6445 Old 10-07-2015, 02:20 PM
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Originally Posted by chucky7 View Post
Are you talking about between PSA XS15SE and RA PS-15X?

I can see that PS-15X suffers from the inductance hump at 50 Hz, which impacted the spectrogram and water fall.

What about impulse and group delay? This is what Data-bass says about RA PS-15X: "it never even reaches one cycle so there is nothing of audible note in these measurements."

Many thanks in advance.

In the quote above, I was actually talking about between the newer RA and the newer PSA models assuming that the newer PSA subs perform similarly to the older ones tested.
I did not compare psa and RA subs. It was to emphasize the importance of sound quality based on those graphs mentioned in general which is the reason the Gamma sounds better based on Docethic's feedback, the owner of both gamma and px215. I would like to see those graphs of the Gamma and I bet they will look better than those of the past pv/ps series.
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post #4115 of 6445 Old 10-07-2015, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by smellyfungus View Post
Hi Jeremy,

Can you check your PM on order 1172?

I'd love to give everyone my thoughts on the Gamma 15 =D, as soon as I receive it.
Yes sir!

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post #4116 of 6445 Old 10-07-2015, 09:14 PM
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Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post
Two 21's would definitely have more surface area then a single 24, but no matter how you slice it you're not really comparing apples to apples. I think dual Gamma 21's would definitely give a single Mariana 24 a run for its money and you would benefit from getting a smoother bass response from two subs over a single sub.
Why not have both? I may jump in for two 21's for the rear of my room.
@edgebsl - When do you anticipate shipping on these if ordered by the 1 Nov deadline?
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post #4117 of 6445 Old 10-07-2015, 09:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Molon_Labe View Post
Why not have both? I may jump in for two 21's for the rear of my room.
@edgebsl - When do you anticipate shipping on these if ordered by the 1 Nov deadline?
Dual 24's upfront and possibly dual 21's near field in the back of your room!


You're a sick sick man and I love it!....lol
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post #4118 of 6445 Old 10-07-2015, 09:29 PM
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Originally Posted by jbrown15 View Post
Dual 24's upfront and possibly dual 21's near field in the back of your room!


You're a sick sick man and I love it!....lol
Sadly they wouldnt be near field. About 5 feet from the second row but it should smooth out my room response. My wife will kill me but she has too much time and frustration invested to replace me
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post #4119 of 6445 Old 10-07-2015, 09:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Molon_Labe View Post
Sadly they wouldnt be near field. About 5 feet from the second row but it should smooth out my room response. My wife will kill me but she has too much time and frustration invested to replace me
Haha that's funny, and dammmmm I forgot that you now have 7 JBL 4722's! That would be one crazy setup!
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post #4120 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 05:20 AM
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Can someone please let me know where I can find measurements or graph for the Echo15 sub? I am comparing it to Hsu VTF3 sub and see flat-response graphs for VTF3 on Hsu website. But the Echo15 page just specifies the frequency response as 16-200Hz with any +- db??

I would also highly appreciate if owners of Echo15 chime in with their feedback. Thanks!

Def Tech BP8 Front L/R with Def Tech CLR2002 Center
Def Tech SM350 Surrounds L/R , DT6.5R x4 [Dolby Atmos 5.1.4]
Hsu VTF3 MK5 Sub. Powered by Denon x4300H AVR
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post #4121 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 06:48 AM
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Originally Posted by chucky7 View Post
Gamma 15 by Scott Stice https://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-su...l#post37894025

It's here!!!!!!

First impressions its big, heavy, and looks great! It was packaged really well no damage at all. Just took some opening pics and a few of the sub. Unfortunately it's too late to setup and hear since the kid is asleep but tomorrow after work can't come soon enough.


It's a Gamma 18!!

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post #4122 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 06:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Molon_Labe View Post
Why not have both? I may jump in for two 21's for the rear of my room.
@edgebsl - When do you anticipate shipping on these if ordered by the 1 Nov deadline?
Well I guess this is ok for now, but you should consider bigger subs when the budget permits. LOL.
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post #4123 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 07:44 AM
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Originally Posted by tvuong View Post
Be careful, knowing you, you might thinking about upgrade again and again
One day I'll just mount a driver into my ceiling and use the attic as the box. That will be a good day.
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post #4124 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 07:52 AM
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One day I'll just mount a driver into my ceiling and use the attic as the box. That will be a good day.
You may be on to something here, four custom 21's mounted in the ceiling. It should be pretty easy to get WAF as long as the grills don't stick out too much.
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post #4125 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 08:02 AM
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@Scott Stice

Congratulations! Quick question if you don't mind me asking. Are those unfinished areas around the trim ring of the driver? Or pieces of styrofoam stuck around it?
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post #4126 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 09:00 AM
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Reiterating my request:
Can someone please let me know where I can find measurements or graph for the Echo15 sub? I am comparing it to Hsu VTF3 sub and see flat-response graphs for VTF3 on Hsu website. But the Echo15 page just specifies the frequency response as 16-200Hz without any +- db??

I would also highly appreciate if owners of Echo15 chime in with their feedback. Thanks!
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post #4127 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 10:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pmat123 View Post
Reiterating my request:
Can someone please let me know where I can find measurements or graph for the Echo15 sub? I am comparing it to Hsu VTF3 sub and see flat-response graphs for VTF3 on Hsu website. But the Echo15 page just specifies the frequency response as 16-200Hz without any +- db??

I would also highly appreciate if owners of Echo15 chime in with their feedback. Thanks!
I have the vtf3 and it's an awesome sub that blends well with our living room. I don't think it would match the Reaction on output down low (16-20hz) but should be close everywhere else. Depending on your room size though I don't think that the vtf3 would be a bad choice but for the same price as the Echo15 I would be looking at the vtf-15 mk2, you should gain some of that low end output that the vtf3 is down. I have no issues with my single vtf3 in a roughly 2800 cubic foot room.
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post #4128 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by jd10ac View Post
I have the vtf3 and it's an awesome sub that blends well with our living room. I don't think it would match the Reaction on output down low (16-20hz) but should be close everywhere else. Depending on your room size though I don't think that the vtf3 would be a bad choice but for the same price as the Echo15 I would be looking at the vtf-15 mk2, you should gain some of that low end output that the vtf3 is down. I have no issues with my single vtf3 in a roughly 2800 cubic foot room.
I am not looking at VTF-15H MK2 because of the depth - it is 28 inches. You had earlier said that this is the reason why you went with VTF3 instead of VTF-15H.

However, the depth of Echo15 is 2 inches less than VTF 15H - I can go for it if it is comparable to VTF 15H MK2 in quality and output.
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post #4129 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 10:45 AM
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I am not looking at VTF-15H MK2 because of the depth - it is 28 inches. You had earlier said that this is the reason why you went with VTF3 instead of VTF-15H.

However, the depth of Echo15 is 2 inches less than VTF 15H - I can go for it if it is comparable to VTF 15H MK2 in quality and output.
Yes, that depth is the exact reason I have the vtf3, my wife doesn't like to have anything in the living room that big. The vtf3 is honestly on the verge of being too big for out living room. Good luck with your choice, I'm hoping more people start responding on here with reviews of their Reaction subs.
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post #4130 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 11:21 AM
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^^ Is this from RA website? From the graph, its -3db point is definitely not 16hz.
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post #4131 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 11:32 AM
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^^ Is this from RA website? From the graph, its -3db point is definitely not 16hz.
Yes, it is from the last picture here:
http://reaction-audio.myshopify.com/...ant=1107662665
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post #4132 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 11:56 AM
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I just measured and I won't have the width on one side of the room to accommodate the Gamma 21. I am short by 3" due to my AVR equipment being moved to the rear wall. However, I do have room for the Gamma 18. I think I will go that route since they will primarily be for room smoothing. The Mariana's are no where near their capable output in my room, so I don't have to worry about outpacing the 18s in the rear. I am not a sub expert by any means. For those that are more technical on running four subs, is this workable?
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post #4133 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 11:56 AM
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That does look like polyfill that was not completely tucked in when the driver was installed...
Yeah I believe your right just some polyfill that didn't get tucked behind the driver all the way.

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post #4134 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 11:59 AM
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Yeah I believe your right just some polyfill that didn't get tucked behind the driver all the way.

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Looks like you are getting a tiny peak of the rubber gasket which is gray in color peaking around the edge.

No polyfill would be visible around the driver.
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post #4135 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 12:01 PM
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Thanks for the clarification Jeremy! I will always have the grill on so it doesn't bother me at all.

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post #4136 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 12:02 PM
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Originally Posted by tvuong View Post
^^ Is this from RA website? From the graph, its -3db point is definitely not 16hz.
+0 is at ~106dB and -6dB appears to be at ~16Hz (maybe 17Hz).
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post #4137 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by pmat123 View Post
Reiterating my request:
Can someone please let me know where I can find measurements or graph for the Echo15 sub? I am comparing it to Hsu VTF3 sub and see flat-response graphs for VTF3 on Hsu website. But the Echo15 page just specifies the frequency response as 16-200Hz without any +- db??

I would also highly appreciate if owners of Echo15 chime in with their feedback. Thanks!
Quote:
Originally Posted by tvuong View Post
^^ Is this from RA website? From the graph, its -3db point is definitely not 16hz.
An outdoor F3 of 16hz was not the intended goal.
With DSP we can easily flatten the response more but remember the sub will not be listened to outdoors.
We don't want too much of an elevated bottom end as most rooms will have some boundary gain even if it is a large room where that influence would be slight.

The PV-15x had a lower tuning where as the Echo is geared for more 20-25 hz output.

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post #4138 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Molon_Labe View Post
I just measured and I won't have the width on one side of the room to accommodate the Gamma 21. I am short by 3" due to my AVR equipment being moved to the rear wall. However, I do have room for the Gamma 18. I think I will go that route since they will primarily be for room smoothing. The Mariana's are no where near their capable output in my room, so I don't have to worry about outpacing the 18s in the rear. I am not a sub expert by any means. For those that are more technical on running four subs, is this workable?
There should not be any issues blending sealed subs.
the Mariana's definitely will have tons of headroom but if you are well within limits just a matter of level matching.

When you can, PM me your phone and contact info and I can call you or email you to discuss options?

Just a heads up for everyone:
We have a much longer than usual list of emails and callbacks for new orders and info today in addition to some pretty heavy production and shipping.

So please be patient if you are waiting for a response.
I'll be doing a 9 am to midnight day today so most likely everyone will hear from me today!

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post #4139 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Scott Stice View Post
Thanks for the clarification Jeremy! I will always have the grill on so it doesn't bother me at all.

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You can get rid of that pretty easy. I also see a little of the packaging dust on the driver a little too from unboxing.

We could probably hide the edge of the woofer a little easier with all over rubber gaskets. But when we did use them I found they were kind of a PITA and we still had the occasional air leaks. On top of that, we recess the driver 1" for clearance, so it still would not be flush. the driver needs to be sunk in.

With a small throw woofer and not having a big fat surround to contend with we could probably mount it flush/level with the cabinet. But alas, big fat woofer problems eh?

Scott if you need help with that or setup today just let me know and i will give you a hand.
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post #4140 of 6445 Old 10-08-2015, 12:26 PM
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Originally Posted by edgebsl View Post
You can get rid of that pretty easy. I also see a little of the packaging dust on the driver a little too from unboxing.

We could probably hide the edge of the woofer a little easier with all over rubber gaskets. But when we did use them I found they were kind of a PITA and we still had the occasional air leaks. On top of that, we recess the driver 1" for clearance, so it still would not be flush. the driver needs to be sunk in.

With a small throw woofer and not having a big fat surround to contend with we could probably mount it flush/level with the cabinet. But alas, big fat woofer problems eh?

Scott if you need help with that or setup today just let me know and i will give you a hand.
Sounds great I'll give you a call tonight when I'm off work and get this making some noise!

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