How to best recreate commercial theater bass at home? - Page 11 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 299Likes
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
post #301 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 01:03 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Augerhandle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: About 25" away from my computer screen
Posts: 5,163
Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1168 Post(s)
Liked: 1150
Quote:
Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
... However, bass drone completely killed Interstellar on you vid even with a 2 channel CR. This bass drone overpowering the sound track is exactly what i have been talking about on here since my first post.....

Overpowering? I could hear every word spoken by Matthew McConaughey clear as day.

"The wise understand by themselves; fools follow the reports of others"-Tibetan Proverb
_____________________ http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/auger-handle/ ________________________
Augerhandle is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #302 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 01:04 AM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
BassThatHz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Northern Okan range (NW Cascades region)
Posts: 10,647
Mentioned: 222 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3683 Post(s)
Liked: 4182
Quote:
Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
However, bass drone completely killed Interstellar on you vid
That's mic clipping from it being unable to handle the 130db peaks. That isn't there in-person.
and Interstellar also has clipped audio on the disc itself (a big no-no IMO).
Add the two and bam: clip city!

When you isolate just the center channel, the clipping in their mix is clear as day:

Interstellar is not a very well recorded movie, it's like a monkey got a hold of the gain knobs in the studio and cranked them right up to full.
Same thing with godzilla. Compare the roar to the original IMAX version, they turned zilla into a pussy cat on the bluray version, totally neutered it.

Life of PI has good SQ, too bad they can't all be recorded that well.

Last edited by BassThatHz; 05-30-2015 at 01:07 AM.
BassThatHz is offline  
post #303 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 01:12 AM
Advanced Member
 
CinemaAndy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Texas
Posts: 966
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 718 Post(s)
Liked: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by donaldk View Post
Andy came in strong last year, when we first met him on AVS, some thought he was a troll then. He was adamantly against using pro equipment at home, that would even be illegal. And a simple Epson 3LCD HT projector could do anything a big boy's toy projector (like a Barco or Andy's own favorite Christie) could do. You see why we thought he was a trol the first few posts.

But Andy does know his stuff, and by now we even managed to persuade him into considering a small 6P LASER projector, nothing too bright just 19K lumens so you have a little room to up the contrast by filtering the lightpath with irises. For when or if he gets around to building that free standing Art Deco room out in the back yard.
Yes, Christie lightens the world

I think 19FL will lighten up a 25 foot wide screen real nice. And your right, once it starts and i hope soon, if my real job ever returns to normal and predictability and ATMOS and Auro-3D play out, but then DTS:X is making it's run...The audio surround format continues.

Well Donald what is your take on this subject? I was going to ask Peter, but somehow i think he would include screen shakers,not the plug in type, and a wall of paintings hiding Quest speakers and trying to sell me a Barco along with his favorite toy, the Trinnov Ovation.

And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.

Some servers can do non-encrypted playback to an A/V projector, but it's just a ridiculously expensive media player if you don't have a cinema projector.
CinemaAndy is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #304 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 01:15 AM
Advanced Member
 
CinemaAndy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Texas
Posts: 966
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 718 Post(s)
Liked: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Augerhandle View Post
Overpowering? I could hear every word spoken by Matthew McConaughey clear as day.
I could hear him, just not intelligible. Even though a LFE was naturally called for from being sucked into a black hole, the set up is to be able to hear those giving their lines. Like i said, that is a good instrumental/music set up he has.

And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.

Some servers can do non-encrypted playback to an A/V projector, but it's just a ridiculously expensive media player if you don't have a cinema projector.
CinemaAndy is offline  
post #305 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 01:56 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
popalock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: McKinney, TX
Posts: 5,353
Mentioned: 185 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1490 Post(s)
Liked: 2088
Send a message via Skype™ to popalock
Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy Boden View Post
This is epic

I have sat in slack-jawed awe at your responses in this thread.

carry on
^... I laughed out loud when I read this.

@CinemaAndy what part of Texas do you currently reside?
popalock is offline  
post #306 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 02:37 AM
Advanced Member
 
CinemaAndy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Texas
Posts: 966
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 718 Post(s)
Liked: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by popalock View Post
^... I laughed out loud when I read this.

@CinemaAndy what part of Texas do you currently reside?
Southeast Texas. Lately it feels like half the state plus the other three states around Texas.

And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.

Some servers can do non-encrypted playback to an A/V projector, but it's just a ridiculously expensive media player if you don't have a cinema projector.
CinemaAndy is offline  
post #307 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 05:06 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
popalock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: McKinney, TX
Posts: 5,353
Mentioned: 185 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1490 Post(s)
Liked: 2088
Send a message via Skype™ to popalock
Quote:
Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
Southeast Texas. Lately it feels like half the state plus the other three states around Texas.
More specific? I'm originally from Nederland, TX. Not from Beaumont, are you?

I'd recommend you go visit a fellow AVS'er in your area with a high powered / properly setup system, but honestly...the closest person I can think of is @Kevin H in Austin and I don't see him around here all that much.

Regardless, as many others have already said, what may seem to be a COMPLETELY "out of balance" system can be tamed with proper DSP. If that concept is difficult to grasp, the only thing that will convince you otherwise is experiencing it for yourself first hand.

Here is a pic of my old system. Don't know many others that give a more "out of balance" appearance this:

(Source)

Here is what I was able to accomplish with DSP. I was able to build four target curves based on my mood or the content I was watching:

(Source)

Notice the blue curve labeled "2 Flat Curve." Looking at it now, it still appeared to be a bit hot over the rest of the FR, but could be considered "balanced" in the grand scheme of things.

I could have achieved similar results with 2x the subs or 1/2 the subs you see in the pic...

DSP is a beautiful thing...
GIEGAR likes this.
popalock is offline  
post #308 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 05:45 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
wth718's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,082
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 194 Post(s)
Liked: 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
When you start digging below 23hz the drone becomes overpowering, completely annoying below 20 hz. A lot of movie mixes will not even touch 23hz. Two of the most demanding soundtracks ever mastered was for the 5th Element and Star Wars Episode ii Attack of the Clones, both of these movies hit 15-20 hz more than once and really stressed out plenty of equipment.
This about says it all, doesn't it? Lol. 5th Element and AOTC are the most demanding tracks? In what universe?

And to be fair, Interstellar is mixed as one of the most "unbalanced" tracks I've heard. Lots of people (myself included) complained about the audibility of voices in spots. That had nothing to do with the system.


Survey says.....clearly a troll.
notnyt likes this.
wth718 is offline  
post #309 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 06:21 AM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
kbarnes701's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Main Listening Positon
Posts: 27,229
Mentioned: 127 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7738 Post(s)
Liked: 7024
Quote:
Originally Posted by BassThatHz View Post

Interstellar is not a very well recorded movie, it's like a monkey got a hold of the gain knobs in the studio and cranked them right up to full.
Two words: Chris Nolan
BassThatHz likes this.
kbarnes701 is offline  
post #310 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 07:24 AM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
Stereodude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Detroit Metro Area
Posts: 15,265
Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4264 Post(s)
Liked: 2997
Quote:
Originally Posted by donaldk View Post
And a simple Epson 3LCD HT projector could do anything a big boy's toy projector (like a Barco or Andy's own favorite Christie) could do.
It was Optoma, not Epson.

Quote:
But Andy does know his stuff...
I have yet to see any evidence of that in his posts when it comes to audio.
Bill Fitzmaurice and sk373 like this.
Stereodude is online now  
post #311 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 08:07 AM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
MKtheater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: New Hartford, NY
Posts: 18,409
Mentioned: 134 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2387 Post(s)
Liked: 2354
Why would someone say under 23hz drones out vocals and that BTH is an example when the movie itself has under 23hz mixed into it? Same goes for the clipping, it is mixed on the disc. So recording and mixing 5hz on the disc should be filtered out at home and recorded and mixed clipping should be played? Tell me how any of this makes sense. I have been to plenty of Imax theaters where people are plugging their ears because it is to loud and harsh sounding but it is pro cinema, the best of the best. The clip from BTH video sound much better than the Imax I went to and that was a freaking you tube video LOL!

Audio Design Associates/Outlaw
Speakerpower SP1-4000
subs-Re audio XXX 18 IB(LT).
DIY speakers-mktheater-S10/S12s
MKtheater is online now  
post #312 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 08:10 AM
AVS Forum Addicted Member
 
MKtheater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: New Hartford, NY
Posts: 18,409
Mentioned: 134 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2387 Post(s)
Liked: 2354
Here is what is on the disc for Interstellar, under 20hz is supposed to be there!

Audio Design Associates/Outlaw
Speakerpower SP1-4000
subs-Re audio XXX 18 IB(LT).
DIY speakers-mktheater-S10/S12s
MKtheater is online now  
post #313 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 08:41 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
rms8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Northern IL just west of Chitown
Posts: 1,225
Mentioned: 36 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 512 Post(s)
Liked: 357
Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post
Here is what is on the disc for Interstellar, under 20hz is supposed to be there!

Oppo FlagWUT ?

rms8 is offline  
post #314 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 09:29 AM
 
tubetwister's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: The Outer Limits....Don't trust any air I can't see ☺
Posts: 5,008
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1384 Post(s)
Liked: 623
Quote:
Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
Like i posted in another reply, i have been in my fair share of private theatres, and Home Theatres. No they are not in the same ball park.

To get my point across, how much room would the average HT have, with pro gear in it? Pro gear is big and loud for a reason. It pains and irritates me to read or hear where it is only called pro because it is meant to play a long time and my Sony bookshelf speakers are better than anything in the entire JBP pro catalogue.

It is called Pro gear because it is not made cheap and is built to last in a commercial environment and sound the same every time it is fired up.

By averaging things out, i see two 10 inch subs placed, or 1 20 inch sub dead center of the screen in a 14 foot by 14 foot HT room.
As a frame of reference I use Crown amplification up to 1000 wpc rms per ch. in my studio and professional large floor standing 3 way pro monitors ( not home tower speakers ) and med size pro near field monitors not the little 6" jobs (and not Sony bookshelves) and powered pro subs on 20A dedicated circuits not unlike what they use in other small music recording/mixing facilities hardly Sony bookshelf consumer gear hooked up to an AVR.

OTOH my home HT is a modest AVR and 5.1 speakers and 2 15" subs not a THX capable system or dedicated HT prosumer or pro equipped residential HT build . It's unsuitable (as are the living quarters it's in ) as opposed to the dedicated acoustically treated studio for critical music listening and nothing like some of the remarkable dedicated HT builds here just like a suburban multiplex is probably unsuitable for critical music listening . Anybody can make loud in a defined cubic space given enough amplification and speakers ,loud and quality are not always the same thing .

I would agree outside of a phone booth the usual Best Buy Magnolia AVR 5.1/7.1 HT set up isn't THX ....OTOH *some of the prosumer gear (sometimes repackaged pro gear ) out there now presents an entirely different story in a residential space or HT build and the bigger ones around here are using pro Cinema gear anyway it's more a matter of scale than a biased opinion .

Getting the neighbors to complain about noise levels at 1320 ft is rather unremarkable these days when almost any ghetto G ride with a few subs and and and outboard amp or two in the trunk can do that and that won't get you much credibility in these circles nor will incorrectly stating the laws of physics as it relates to audible room acoustics and spl in a confined residential space or dedicated HT build at various scales in general as those would apply in those spaces . i.e. I have a 4800 watt multi sub system in my truck you can hear fine in here (with overwhelming bass) with the windows down half a city block away when it's cranked just a little .

If a system is THX capable at the listener and calibrated as you know correctly 105dB -20dB (from each speaker at full THX bandwidth and thd+n spec ) and 115 dB -20dB for the LFE channels in a given space whatever that may be THX is THX period allowing for weighted spl measurements and you might be surprised to see how many members systems here can do that (properly) and how badly lacking the average suburban multiplex can be in a lot of cases with regards to thd+n and possibly full bandwidth performance . I'll take less than THX spl at quality and low thd+n over poorly implemented THX myself .
kbarnes701 likes this.

Last edited by tubetwister; 05-30-2015 at 10:15 AM.
tubetwister is offline  
post #315 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 10:45 AM
Advanced Member
 
CinemaAndy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Texas
Posts: 966
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 718 Post(s)
Liked: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by popalock View Post
More specific? I'm originally from Nederland, TX. Not from Beaumont, are you?

I'd recommend you go visit a fellow AVS'er in your area with a high powered / properly setup system, but honestly...the closest person I can think of is @Kevin H in Austin and I don't see him around here all that much.

Regardless, as many others have already said, what may seem to be a COMPLETELY "out of balance" system can be tamed with proper DSP. If that concept is difficult to grasp, the only thing that will convince you otherwise is experiencing it for yourself first hand.

Here is a pic of my old system. Don't know many others that give a more "out of balance" appearance this:

(Source)

Here is what I was able to accomplish with DSP. I was able to build four target curves based on my mood or the content I was watching:

(Source)

Notice the blue curve labeled "2 Flat Curve." Looking at it now, it still appeared to be a bit hot over the rest of the FR, but could be considered "balanced" in the grand scheme of things.

I could have achieved similar results with 2x the subs or 1/2 the subs you see in the pic...

DSP is a beautiful thing...
I'm from Galveston, Texas. Since 2004 i have lived about 15 miles west of Brazoria, in a very rural area of Brazoria county. I grew tired of the city and wanted more real estate around me.

If i was going to be listening to Daft Punk,then your old system is what i would pretty much use myself. But, i would not use it for movie watching, unless i could kill the majority of the subs.

Back to my initial point, to many subs and too much LFE will drown out the LCR making for a completely droning experience watching a movie. If you balance the LFE, then you get less than stellar bass response and this comes completely back around to me saying 2 or 3 subs for a average HT.

An as you can see in the pics, one is EQed the other is a mess.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	nc_large.jpg
Views:	66
Size:	177.7 KB
ID:	746273   Click image for larger version

Name:	offbluerta20med.jpg
Views:	96
Size:	132.4 KB
ID:	746281   Click image for larger version

Name:	HARMAN_Cinemaxx.jpg
Views:	81
Size:	211.5 KB
ID:	746289   Click image for larger version

Name:	LW-7505-big_2012.jpg
Views:	66
Size:	27.8 KB
ID:	746297   Click image for larger version

Name:	biema-dual-305mm-12-22-700w-active-line-array-system.png
Views:	235
Size:	279.3 KB
ID:	746305  


And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.

Some servers can do non-encrypted playback to an A/V projector, but it's just a ridiculously expensive media player if you don't have a cinema projector.
CinemaAndy is offline  
post #316 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 10:49 AM
Advanced Member
 
CinemaAndy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Texas
Posts: 966
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 718 Post(s)
Liked: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by wth718 View Post
This about says it all, doesn't it? Lol. 5th Element and AOTC are the most demanding tracks? In what universe?

And to be fair, Interstellar is mixed as one of the most "unbalanced" tracks I've heard. Lots of people (myself included) complained about the audibility of voices in spots. That had nothing to do with the system.


Survey says.....clearly a troll.
Where is your list? Oh wait you got nothing better to do than troll somebody else's list.

And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.

Some servers can do non-encrypted playback to an A/V projector, but it's just a ridiculously expensive media player if you don't have a cinema projector.
CinemaAndy is offline  
post #317 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 10:55 AM
Advanced Member
 
CinemaAndy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Texas
Posts: 966
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 718 Post(s)
Liked: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stereodude View Post
It was Optoma, not Epson.


I have yet to see any evidence of that in his posts when it comes to audio.
Optoma makes a good line of projectors that fit in well in most average HT's. There LED line of projectors have really been advancing HT LED projectors with some impressive brightness levels, not the best on the black reference levels, but what white light projector is good at black level reference.

Reverberation is the collection of reflected sounds from the surfaces in an enclosure like an auditorium. It is a desirable property of auditoriums to the extent that it helps to overcome the inverse square law dropoff of sound intensity in the enclosure.

Audio expert, theatrical sound for cinematic release of movies recreated in a Home Theatre, insulting.

And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.

Some servers can do non-encrypted playback to an A/V projector, but it's just a ridiculously expensive media player if you don't have a cinema projector.
CinemaAndy is offline  
post #318 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 11:08 AM
Advanced Member
 
CinemaAndy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Texas
Posts: 966
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 718 Post(s)
Liked: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post
Why would someone say under 23hz drones out vocals and that BTH is an example when the movie itself has under 23hz mixed into it? Same goes for the clipping, it is mixed on the disc. So recording and mixing 5hz on the disc should be filtered out at home and recorded and mixed clipping should be played? Tell me how any of this makes sense. I have been to plenty of Imax theaters where people are plugging their ears because it is to loud and harsh sounding but it is pro cinema, the best of the best. The clip from BTH video sound much better than the Imax I went to and that was a freaking you tube video LOL!
Where did i say under 23hz drowns out vocals? I did not say that. I said few movies are mixed below 23hz for plenty of reasons. The SBL levels of multiple subwoofers drowns out vocals, rattling walls, furniture, you name it. Droneing.

And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.

Some servers can do non-encrypted playback to an A/V projector, but it's just a ridiculously expensive media player if you don't have a cinema projector.
CinemaAndy is offline  
post #319 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 11:30 AM
Advanced Member
 
CinemaAndy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Texas
Posts: 966
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 718 Post(s)
Liked: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post
Here is what is on the disc for Interstellar, under 20hz is supposed to be there!
Why yes it is, the way Hans Zimmer wanted it to be.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Cinemark-Interstellar-550x737.jpg
Views:	86
Size:	60.5 KB
ID:	746481   Click image for larger version

Name:	11025261_10153127534880149_5022375707309403119_o.jpg
Views:	76
Size:	144.4 KB
ID:	746489   Click image for larger version

Name:	10898259_10153127534755149_6091803743968252092_n.jpg
Views:	70
Size:	164.3 KB
ID:	746497   Click image for larger version

Name:	10418901_10153127534595149_8593761742471678701_n.jpg
Views:	66
Size:	173.2 KB
ID:	746505  

And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.

Some servers can do non-encrypted playback to an A/V projector, but it's just a ridiculously expensive media player if you don't have a cinema projector.
CinemaAndy is offline  
post #320 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 11:44 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
yelnatsch517's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 1,003
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 19 Post(s)
Liked: 26
Quote:
Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
I'm from Galveston, Texas. Since 2004 i have lived about 15 miles west of Brazoria, in a very rural area of Brazoria county. I grew tired of the city and wanted more real estate around me.

If i was going to be listening to Daft Punk,then your old system is what i would pretty much use myself. But, i would not use it for movie watching, unless i could kill the majority of the subs.

Back to my initial point, to many subs and too much LFE will drown out the LCR making for a completely droning experience watching a movie. If you balance the LFE, then you get less than stellar bass response and this comes completely back around to me saying 2 or 3 subs for a average HT.

An as you can see in the pics, one is EQed the other is a mess.
Did you completely ignore his FR graph that he posted?
I hope you realize that subwoofers, like all speakers don't need to be run at 100% all the time. Just because someone has 16 subwoofers doesn't mean it's getting 1000 watts for the entire movie.

What do YOU actually even do when you are setting up cinema audio if you're not tuning the FR flat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
Where is your list? Oh wait you got nothing better to do than troll somebody else's list.
Here is a compiled list: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-su...cy-charts.html

Notice 5th element is only 3 stars.
popalock likes this.
yelnatsch517 is offline  
post #321 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 11:55 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
donaldk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 4,153
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 608 Post(s)
Liked: 174
Quote:
Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
Optoma makes a good line of projectors that fit in well in most average HT's. There LED line of projectors have really been advancing HT LED projectors with some impressive brightness levels, not the best on the black reference levels, but what white light projector is good at black level reference.

Reverberation is the collection of reflected sounds from the surfaces in an enclosure like an auditorium. It is a desirable property of auditoriums to the extent that it helps to overcome the inverse square law dropoff of sound intensity in the enclosure.

Audio expert, theatrical sound for cinematic release of movies recreated in a Home Theatre, insulting.

You mean that 500 lumens jobbies, that cost €3000+. They have been caught on on that liemens;-). I have yet to encounter a bright and somewhat affordable LED projector, only the $120K DPI 3DMD 2000 lumens (spec.) has any brightness. The old Runco dual engine was also nice, with gain 2 screen, and showing cartoons though. The Sim2 Mico 150 lacked brightness, even on a gain Black Diamond screen, tough it was definitely brighter that the 50 and the Delta Engine based units. Even the latest generation DPI that supposedly was over 1000 lumens, clearly wasn't;-). And that was supposed to be a true number, not like the first one that was just the standard Delta platform.

Last edited by donaldk; 05-30-2015 at 12:01 PM.
donaldk is offline  
post #322 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 12:16 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
wth718's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,082
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 194 Post(s)
Liked: 312
Quote:
Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
Good speakers and ample rack attention, close to what i would do. The instrumentation of the first video was good. You definitely have made a concert styled system. However, bass drone completely killed Interstellar on you vid even with a 2 channel CR. This bass drone overpowering the sound track is exactly what i have been talking about on here since my first post. When you start digging below 23hz the drone becomes overpowering, completely annoying below 20 hz. A lot of movie mixes will not even touch 23hz. Two of the most demanding soundtracks ever mastered was for the 5th Element and Star Wars Episode ii Attack of the Clones, both of these movies hit 15-20 hz more than once and really stressed out plenty of equipment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
Where is your list? Oh wait you got nothing better to do than troll somebody else's list.
Olympus Has Fallen, How To Train Your Dragon, War of The worlds, The Incredible Hulk. All have extension to 1 Hz, not 23. Which again proves you have no idea what you're talking about. There are tons more with extension into low single digits.

http://data-bass.ipbhost.com/index.php?/topic/12-the-low-frequency-content-thread-films-games-music-etc/

At least everything 3.75 and above has extension below 23 Hz.
wth718 is offline  
post #323 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 12:37 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Augerhandle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: About 25" away from my computer screen
Posts: 5,163
Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1168 Post(s)
Liked: 1150
Quote:
Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
Where is your list? Oh wait you got nothing better to do than troll somebody else's list.

http://data-bass.ipbhost.com/index.p...mes-music-etc/


You'll find AOTC rated 4 stars and Fifth Element rated only 2.5 out of 5 bass-wise...


Quote:
<li class="group_title"> Moderators <li class="group_icon"> <li class="post_count desc lighter"> 787 posts Posted 20 March 2014 - 03:37 PM
The Fifth Element (5.1 TrueHD)

Level - 2 Stars (106.3dB composite)
Extension - 1 Star (28Hz)
Dynamics - 5 Stars (28.79dB)
Execution - 2 Stars (by poll)

Overall - 2.5 Stars

Recommendation - Buy (by poll)

Notes: I really like the movie, but the bass is almost nonexistent. One of the loudest effects comes as an interesting midbass sweep right near the beginning. Other than that, not much to say.

"The wise understand by themselves; fools follow the reports of others"-Tibetan Proverb
_____________________ http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/auger-handle/ ________________________

Last edited by Augerhandle; 05-30-2015 at 12:46 PM.
Augerhandle is offline  
post #324 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 12:39 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
sk373's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,374
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 710 Post(s)
Liked: 986
Assuming a properly set up system:

More subs = more headroom and less distortion for a given SPL.

More subs != more bass.

Why this seems to be a difficult concept to understand is beyond me.
notnyt likes this.

My humble main system:
Vizio M75-E1; Oppo 203 universal UHD player; Denon 4300H AVR, Dual PSA S1801's; Monitor Audio Silver RX-6 mains, RX center, and RX surrounds; one pair NHT mini Atmos speakers; Home-built HTPC (Xeon E1230, 16gb RAM, Crucial M500 480gb SSD, GeForce 980Ti, Corsair CX600, CoolerMaster mini-ITX case); Roku Premiere+; Amazon 4K Fire TV
sk373 is online now  
post #325 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 12:42 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Augerhandle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: About 25" away from my computer screen
Posts: 5,163
Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1168 Post(s)
Liked: 1150
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Meme 20 hz at home.jpg
Views:	690
Size:	83.3 KB
ID:	746545  
Fatshaft, Stereodude, muzz and 4 others like this.

"The wise understand by themselves; fools follow the reports of others"-Tibetan Proverb
_____________________ http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/auger-handle/ ________________________
Augerhandle is offline  
post #326 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 12:51 PM
Advanced Member
 
CinemaAndy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Texas
Posts: 966
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 718 Post(s)
Liked: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by wth718 View Post
All have extension to 1 Hz, not 23. .
Back that up with a studio mix audio log and i will believe you, until then it's hearsay.

And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.

Some servers can do non-encrypted playback to an A/V projector, but it's just a ridiculously expensive media player if you don't have a cinema projector.
CinemaAndy is offline  
post #327 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 12:54 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Augerhandle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: About 25" away from my computer screen
Posts: 5,163
Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1168 Post(s)
Liked: 1150
Quote:
Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
Back that up with a studio mix audio log and i will believe you, until then it's hearsay.






You have the calibration equipment, measure it yourself. ...oh wait, you don't have a subwoofer capable of reproducing it (therefore it must not exist)!
Stereodude and bombertodd like this.

"The wise understand by themselves; fools follow the reports of others"-Tibetan Proverb
_____________________ http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/auger-handle/ ________________________

Last edited by Augerhandle; 05-30-2015 at 12:58 PM.
Augerhandle is offline  
post #328 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 12:57 PM
Advanced Member
 
CinemaAndy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Texas
Posts: 966
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 718 Post(s)
Liked: 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Augerhandle View Post
http://data-bass.ipbhost.com/index.p...mes-music-etc/


You'll find AOTC rated 4 stars and Fifth Element rated only 2.5 out of 5 bass-wise...
http://www.data-bass.com/data?page=system&id=45 Kind of like running your sub vents towards the attic, without a large box. Who would have thought of that? Oh, it was me.

And the payoff is never certain: Some observers contend that a generation has already been trained to be content with the small screen.

Some servers can do non-encrypted playback to an A/V projector, but it's just a ridiculously expensive media player if you don't have a cinema projector.
CinemaAndy is offline  
post #329 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 01:01 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Augerhandle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: About 25" away from my computer screen
Posts: 5,163
Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1168 Post(s)
Liked: 1150
Quote:
Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
http://www.data-bass.com/data?page=system&id=45 Kind of like running your sub vents towards the attic, without a large box. Who would have thought of that? Oh, it was me.
Nothing at all like it. The GJALLARHORN works.
Stereodude likes this.

"The wise understand by themselves; fools follow the reports of others"-Tibetan Proverb
_____________________ http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/auger-handle/ ________________________
Augerhandle is offline  
post #330 of 381 Old 05-30-2015, 01:01 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
sk373's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,374
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 710 Post(s)
Liked: 986
Quote:
Originally Posted by CinemaAndy View Post
http://www.data-bass.com/data?page=system&id=45 Kind of like running your sub vents towards the attic, without a large box. Who would have thought of that? Oh, it was me.
Clearly, you are just a misunderstood genius of speaker design. A true maverick.
muzz and Billy Boden like this.

My humble main system:
Vizio M75-E1; Oppo 203 universal UHD player; Denon 4300H AVR, Dual PSA S1801's; Monitor Audio Silver RX-6 mains, RX center, and RX surrounds; one pair NHT mini Atmos speakers; Home-built HTPC (Xeon E1230, 16gb RAM, Crucial M500 480gb SSD, GeForce 980Ti, Corsair CX600, CoolerMaster mini-ITX case); Roku Premiere+; Amazon 4K Fire TV

Last edited by sk373; 05-30-2015 at 01:32 PM. Reason: syntax
sk373 is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Closed Thread Subwoofers, Bass, and Transducers

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off