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post #1 of 10 Old 05-17-2016, 02:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Looking for New Sub for 5.1+ System

Hello all,

I've had some great advice from the Speakers forum regarding avenues for upgrading the mains, center, surrounds in my 5.1 system but now I would also like to upgrade from my dinky little PSW10. I've read countless similar posts but feel that I'm not sure where I fit between all of them, hoping for some clarity. Here's the info:

  1. Budget: $800-1000. I am primarily interested in choosing between two $500 subs vs. one $800-1000 sub. I have budgeted ~$2000 for the rest of the system and have been pointed toward Ascend Acoustics' offerings, though I may expand my budget on that end as well. I am interested in Dolby Atmos and there have been a few recent positive impressions of up-firing modules.
  2. Size requirements: Can go up to 12".
  3. Room dimensions: Main HT area is about 12' wide by 12' deep by 8' high, but there are two extra open spaces on either wide side that are about 14' and 8' wide, so effectively the space is 34' wide or so, give or take a few feet.
  4. Primary uses: 50% HT use for movies, 35% gaming, 15% music.
  5. Listening habits: I really am not interested in high volumes, I don't particularly enjoy it and I live in an apartment. I'm interested in achieving a fuller, deeper response at similar SPL as my current system. I know this is a contentious point but I believe there is at least some subset of the population here that sees reason in having a nice sub even at low volumes.
  6. Appearance requirements: Prefer black, finish is unimportant as it will be a bit hidden.
  7. Timeframe: Will like to purchase by the end of the summer, no rush.

I appreciate any advice you can give, and sorry that it's a similar question to many asked before. It just seems a lot of folks in the same boat are interested in reference-level listening. I'm just not that type of guy.
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post #2 of 10 Old 05-17-2016, 03:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Des_Eagle View Post
Hello all,

I've had some great advice from the Speakers forum regarding avenues for upgrading the mains, center, surrounds in my 5.1 system but now I would also like to upgrade from my dinky little PSW10. I've read countless similar posts but feel that I'm not sure where I fit between all of them, hoping for some clarity. Here's the info:

  1. Budget: $800-1000. I am primarily interested in choosing between two $500 subs vs. one $800-1000 sub. I have budgeted ~$2000 for the rest of the system and have been pointed toward Ascend Acoustics' offerings, though I may expand my budget on that end as well. I am interested in Dolby Atmos and there have been a few recent positive impressions of up-firing modules.
  2. Size requirements: Can go up to 12".
  3. Room dimensions: Main HT area is about 12' wide by 12' deep by 8' high, but there are two extra open spaces on either wide side that are about 14' and 8' wide, so effectively the space is 34' wide or so, give or take a few feet.
  4. Primary uses: 50% HT use for movies, 35% gaming, 15% music.
  5. Listening habits: I really am not interested in high volumes, I don't particularly enjoy it and I live in an apartment. I'm interested in achieving a fuller, deeper response at similar SPL as my current system. I know this is a contentious point but I believe there is at least some subset of the population here that sees reason in having a nice sub even at low volumes.
  6. Appearance requirements: Prefer black, finish is unimportant as it will be a bit hidden.
  7. Timeframe: Will like to purchase by the end of the summer, no rush.
I appreciate any advice you can give, and sorry that it's a similar question to many asked before. It just seems a lot of folks in the same boat are interested in reference-level listening. I'm just not that type of guy.
They sell Rythmik subs, not sure which models but a pair or L12s would be right in the ballpark.
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post #3 of 10 Old 05-17-2016, 03:17 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Kini62 View Post
They sell Rythmik subs, not sure which models but a pair or L12s would be right in the ballpark.
Whoa, did not notice that, would be great as I can buy the whole setup through them and take advantage of their trial period policy to give it all a whirl in one go. May then add up-firing modules later on but this would potentially be a great start.
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post #4 of 10 Old 05-17-2016, 11:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Des_Eagle View Post
Whoa, did not notice that, would be great as I can buy the whole setup through them and take advantage of their trial period policy to give it all a whirl in one go. May then add up-firing modules later on but this would potentially be a great start.
I just ordered my 2nd Rythmik sub (LV12R) through Ascend Acoustics yesterday. The subs get shipped directly from Rythmik in Austin, Texas and Ascend has been great to deal with both times . You also get a discount when buying 2 subs at once. Your space by my calculations is around 3,200 cu ft and either 2 sealed L12's or 2 ported LV12R's should work fine for you. I love my LV12R (first one) and can't wait for the second to get here in a few days. Brian's Direct Servo design coupled with his amps 3 position bass extension switch and 12/24db low pass filter slope switch give the user a lot of control over the subs sound and his sub's have this unique sound that has to be heard to be believed.

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post #5 of 10 Old 05-18-2016, 02:54 AM
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Might be worth considering the one good sub (dependant on available options of course) because two subs will certainly mean they don't work as hard, it won't overcome any shortcomings in design. For example, a cheaper sub with say 35hz extension times two means you still get just a 35hz bottom end, a higher end sub may offer something closer to 20hz giving you the impact and character you might really want or offer higher db at the same low end frequency - again offering ultimately better sound. Add a second matching sub at a later date. While response might not be as even in room, I would certainly guide someone towards the best sub they can afford. Ultimate performance is more important than multiples when going from zero subs to 1 sub. Beyond that, numbers do matter...only if you are working with a reasonable quality sub yo begin with.

That was a non specific example here, but see what matches with your performance goals. Maybe that will mean two subs, but likely will result in one more expensive one to start.

IMHO of course ymmv
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post #6 of 10 Old 05-18-2016, 04:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Majister View Post
Might be worth considering the one good sub (dependant on available options of course) because two subs will certainly mean they don't work as hard, it won't overcome any shortcomings in design. For example, a cheaper sub with say 35hz extension times two means you still get just a 35hz bottom end, a higher end sub may offer something closer to 20hz giving you the impact and character you might really want or offer higher db at the same low end frequency - again offering ultimately better sound. Add a second matching sub at a later date. While response might not be as even in room, I would certainly guide someone towards the best sub they can afford. Ultimate performance is more important than multiples when going from zero subs to 1 sub. Beyond that, numbers do matter...only if you are working with a reasonable quality sub yo begin with.

That was a non specific example here, but see what matches with your performance goals. Maybe that will mean two subs, but likely will result in one more expensive one to start.

IMHO of course ymmv
+1,
Better to have one great performing sub, than two subs smaller subs that do not perform as well. Would be best to order one close to top of your budget and demo it. Like the subs above or SVS or PSA. If it doesn't't not work within the 30 + days, send it back.
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post #7 of 10 Old 05-18-2016, 09:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Majister View Post
Might be worth considering the one good sub (dependant on available options of course) because two subs will certainly mean they don't work as hard, it won't overcome any shortcomings in design. For example, a cheaper sub with say 35hz extension times two means you still get just a 35hz bottom end, a higher end sub may offer something closer to 20hz giving you the impact and character you might really want or offer higher db at the same low end frequency - again offering ultimately better sound. Add a second matching sub at a later date. While response might not be as even in room, I would certainly guide someone towards the best sub they can afford. Ultimate performance is more important than multiples when going from zero subs to 1 sub. Beyond that, numbers do matter...only if you are working with a reasonable quality sub yo begin with.

That was a non specific example here, but see what matches with your performance goals. Maybe that will mean two subs, but likely will result in one more expensive one to start.

IMHO of course ymmv
Quote:
Originally Posted by lizrussspike View Post
+1,
Better to have one great performing sub, than two subs smaller subs that do not perform as well. Would be best to order one close to top of your budget and demo it. Like the subs above or SVS or PSA. If it doesn't't not work within the 30 + days, send it back.
Thanks for the input. So let's say for discussion's sake that I am now interested in something like the PSA 15S or Rythmik F12, which are $900 at the moment. Given that I'm not interested in increasing output, am I primarily paying for less distortion? I have no problem going with one better sub so long as it's still reasonable to do so without desiring reference-level listening.
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post #8 of 10 Old 05-18-2016, 09:32 PM
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10 years from now do you plan on living in same spot? 20? get the best you can afford now that fits into your space. later on if you need more, you can add another. i would get a ported model 1st to try out. bigger is usually always better with subs, maybe you could get a 15hp and use as an end table.
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post #9 of 10 Old 05-19-2016, 12:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Des_Eagle View Post
Thanks for the input. So let's say for discussion's sake that I am now interested in something like the PSA 15S or Rythmik F12, which are $900 at the moment. Given that I'm not interested in increasing output, am I primarily paying for less distortion? I have no problem going with one better sub so long as it's still reasonable to do so without desiring reference-level listening.
What you are likely getting in those higher end subs vs a less expensive option is 1) a larger driver 2) more excursion 3) may include an internal dsp to prevent the sub from damaging itself (always a plus) 4) you can set the output to whatever you want, but a higher end sub likely has better bottom end extension and less/later roll-off thus offering a flatter response if set up correctly. Also, when your sub sounds really good and can handle some serious db, you are more likely to push it for some tracks...it's the basshead in all of us. 5) get the better sub to avoid disappointment and more likely attain your personal HT performance goals. Anemic sub syndrome can't be solved with more iron in the diet...just more money. Buying the right sub once is better than buying the wrong sub twice.
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post #10 of 10 Old 05-19-2016, 10:51 AM
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I would look at SVS as it has a good option where if you buy 2 of their subs the SB1000 sealed 12 inch subs or the PB1000 ported 10 inch subs it will be within the range of your budget. Down the road I will be doing just that when I am ready to upgrade my Polks PSW 108s.

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Last edited by ROMEO 1; 05-19-2016 at 01:27 PM. Reason: Add information.
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