Official JTR Speakers Subwoofer Thread - Page 370 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #11071 of 13522 Old 12-10-2018, 12:37 PM
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Originally Posted by ereed View Post
I can't speak for ported jtr subwoofers since I've only heard the sealed versions. I believe the jtr, rythmik, svs, funk, dss….all sealed options will be great for music. To my ears all are tight and fast and play the music notes without issues. The trick is the setup and positioning of the MLP and of course treatments to help remove the decay and resonance will help "one note" bass to be clearer sounding. I think it all depends on how loud you want to hear the sub. If you prefer to listen to music playing 100+ db then the jtr will do better than the smaller svs sb13 due to larger driver. So its just a matter of personal taste, but they all do music well if setup right. Just my opinion of course. Best to demo the subs in your home or visit some local guys and listen for yourself. You won't get idea how it sounds with youtube videos other than just an opinion of the user.

@muscles I know you have had svs and jl audio subs and are into music....what was lacking?
You forgot Seaton.

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post #11072 of 13522 Old 12-10-2018, 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by djreef View Post
You forgot Seaton.

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Yep, Seaton is up there also. Good catch!
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post #11073 of 13522 Old 12-10-2018, 01:25 PM
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Originally Posted by ereed View Post
@muscles I know you have had svs and jl audio subs and are into music....what was lacking?
I didn't like having 4 subs, I was looking to go to 2 subs something that had the same or more output and had better sound quality, if possible. I had originally called Jeff and he said a pair of S2's would be more output and sound as good as the JL's. That was the most expensive option, and they were HUGE! I next checked out the dual opposed PSA's and Tom himself recommended that I call Rythmik based on what I was looking for. It's pretty easy to say that the G25HPs don't have a weakness as a sub. They have considerable depth (size wise), but other than that they are a clear winner in the output and sound quality department. Everyone I demoed the subs for chose the Rythmik's, including people who don't know one brand from another.

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post #11074 of 13522 Old 12-10-2018, 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by muscles View Post
I didn't like having 4 subs, I was looking to go to 2 subs something that had the same or more output and had better sound quality, if possible. I had originally called Jeff and he said a pair of S2's would be more output and sound as good as the JL's. That was the most expensive option, and they were HUGE! I next checked out the dual opposed PSA's and Tom himself recommended that I call Rythmik based on what I was looking for. It's pretty easy to say that the G25HPs don't have a weakness as a sub. They have considerable depth (size wise), but other than that they are a clear winner in the output and sound quality department. Everyone I demoed the subs for chose the Rythmik's, including people who don't know one brand from another.

Greg
The S2 are powerful and should be more than you need. You can stand the S2 upright to save footprint as well. I believe its only 18 inches depth and 21 inches wide. Its hard to beat dual S2s though and would play music as well as movies loud!

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post #11075 of 13522 Old 12-10-2018, 06:47 PM
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Originally Posted by ereed View Post
The S2 are powerful and should be more than you need. You can stand the S2 upright to save footprint as well. I believe its only 18 inches depth and 21 inches wide. Its hard to beat dual S2s though and would play music as well as movies loud!
And its only a $1000 more each compared to the G25HP....

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post #11076 of 13522 Old 12-10-2018, 07:30 PM
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And its only a $1000 more each compared to the G25HP....
Well yes the price is more. Since this is JTR thread it made sense to recommended a JTR product especially powerful sealed version. While its not apples to apples comparison the S2 are dual front firing 18s while the G25hp are dual opposed 15s.

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post #11077 of 13522 Old 12-10-2018, 07:35 PM
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Originally Posted by ereed View Post
Well yes the price is more. Since this is JTR thread it made sense to recommended a JTR product especially powerful sealed version. While its not apples to apples comparison the S2 are dual front firing 18s while the G25hp are dual opposed 15s.
I know, was just messin around, I don't think Greg is looking to change his subs out, based on what he has shared about his listening preferences, the G25HP is right sub for him. I think he is just curious to hear one as well as their speakers.
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post #11078 of 13522 Old 12-10-2018, 07:37 PM
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Well the S2 is the one sub to compare to being sealed. I am not sure why the chart of the 4000 was compared, it should have been the S2 which will have a similar response in room as the Rythmik being sealed.
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post #11079 of 13522 Old 12-10-2018, 08:34 PM
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Originally Posted by imureh View Post
I know, was just messin around, I don't think Greg is looking to change his subs out, based on what he has shared about his listening preferences, the G25HP is right sub for him. I think he is just curious to hear one as well as their speakers.
This is correct. If anything I would add another g25 if I felt that output was lacking. I have already had the police called on me, so I don't think output is a problem at this point. They are a truly amazing product. Very happy.

I will be checking out Chucky7's setup when it is all dialed in. I just love the hobby so much. I would love to just see one of those monsters (ULF4000) in person anyways.


Greg
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post #11080 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 04:04 AM
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Though it is nice to have youtube videos, the quality of the video and audio is unfortunately limited by the quality of recording device used. Most if not all cell phones are just not adequate to properly capture below 50Hz. Cellphones also tend to exacerbate wind noises.


I agree. However it doesn’t have to be this way. I made this video yesterday. Video was with a Sony A7riii, and audio was recorded with a zoom H5. I, for one, would love to see more videos like this if Jtr subs. But if you go to YouTube, there are none to be found. When I was sub searching, I looked all over YouTube for jtr videos, but the few I could find, were old. When done right, they can look, and sound good, and provide some valuable info for people.

[URL][https://youtu.be/PTS4DHul7Vw/URL]
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post #11081 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 06:30 AM
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I agree. However it doesn’t have to be this way. I made this video yesterday. Video was with a Sony A7riii, and audio was recorded with a zoom H5. I, for one, would love to see more videos like this if Jtr subs. But if you go to YouTube, there are none to be found. When I was sub searching, I looked all over YouTube for jtr videos, but the few I could find, were old. When done right, they can look, and sound good, and provide some valuable info for people.

[URL][https://youtu.be/PTS4DHul7Vw/URL]
I was going to ask you how you recorded your demo. I was thinking of doing some myself but didn’t want to use my phone. Now I just have to figure out how to make, edit, and upload the video to YouTube.
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post #11082 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 09:06 AM
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Well, I thought I could take better videos after getting my first cellphone is almost 10 years... Then I found that the audio for the preloaded app is only in AAC and the cellphone mics are not good below 50Hz... As for the video, the preloaded app is barely adequate...

There are a lot involved with videos. Heck, there is a whole industry of it. Those good youtube videos are done with video recorder and audio recorder. The audio is then mixed with the video. Then there is editing...

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post #11083 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 09:25 AM
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Well the S2 is the one sub to compare to being sealed. I am not sure why the chart of the 4000 was compared, it should have been the S2 which will have a similar response in room as the Rythmik being sealed.
In my chart, I used 2 Rythmik G25HP vs the 4000ULF because that's what we each have. I also included the FV25HP because it is the top of the line ported Rythmik. Sure I could have used the S2 like below but muscles is not hearing a JTR S2 soon...


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Subwoofer: JTR Captivator 4000ULF.
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post #11084 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 09:50 AM
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Well the 4000 is just porting the S2 which adds 11 dB at tune. Of course adding size to the cabinet is a must.

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post #11085 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 10:19 AM
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Originally Posted by chucky7 View Post
Well, I thought I could take better videos after getting my first cellphone is almost 10 years... Then I found that the audio for the preloaded app is only in AAC and the cellphone mics are not good below 50Hz... As for the video, the preloaded app is barely adequate...

There are a lot involved with videos. Heck, there is a whole industry of it. Those good youtube videos are done with video recorder and audio recorder. The audio is then mixed with the video. Then there is editing...
Any tips for someone just trying to figure out where to start?
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post #11086 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by ianrozzano View Post
Any tips for someone just trying to figure out where to start?


What do you want to know?


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post #11087 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by chucky7 View Post
In my chart, I used 2 Rythmik G25HP vs the 4000ULF because that's what we each have. I also included the FV25HP because it is the top of the line ported Rythmik. Sure I could have used the S2 like below but muscles is not hearing a JTR S2 soon...

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Originally Posted by MKtheater View Post
Well the 4000 is just porting the S2 which adds 11 dB at tune. Of course adding size to the cabinet is a must.
I'd like to see the g25HP tested by data-bass actually. If their website claims are anything like how the FV25HP ended up, then clearly the cap4000/s2 would best it in basically every scenario. The fv25hp ended up showing compression starting at it's 105dB sweep, albeit very minimal, but by the 115dB sweep, it's really starting to be there.

Rythmic also shows response from 12-200hz on the site for both the g25 and the f25, but doesn't state a +/- with that spec. Tested, the f25 has almost an 11dB rolloff in it's response from 150hz down to 17hz, whereas the cap4000 is +/- 3dB over it's own usable range (10.5hz-125hz). The cap also does this with close to 6dB more headroom in max long term output and CEA bursts over the majority of the usable range.

Bottom line, it would take two f25hp's to get even close to the cap4000, and you'd still be pushing it. If the g25 spec fall in line with the discrepancies of the f25 (not saying necessarily that they do,) the argument is the g25 being sealed would have even MORE rolloff than the ported.

All this being said, I can see why people think the f25, and g25 for that matter rock. A sloping bass response like that sound really awesome for music, and likely pair up well with room gain to create an overall flat response once it's over and one with. This is the exact reason I like how the skhorn sounds so much, it follows much of the same response curve.... but, with 14dB more headroom

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post #11088 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted by ianrozzano View Post
Any tips for someone just trying to figure out where to start?
Assuming you are using your phone as a video recorder,

I would start with a free video editor, just to see if you are ready to invest the time into this...

Then get an affordable audio recorder that has a better S/N ratio and can record below 50Hz, such as a Tascam DR-05...

Then get a video app for your phone that allows better video....

Then get a real video recorder...

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post #11089 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 10:50 AM
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Originally Posted by ianrozzano View Post
Any tips for someone just trying to figure out where to start?


I use a Sony A7RIII camera, with a 24mm F1.4 G Master lenses to record the video. The audio gets recorded with a Zoom H5 recorded on the built in mics, making sure the signal is not clipped during recording. Then. dump it all into Final Cut Pro and sync of the audio with the different camera angles into a multi clip. There is more to it than that, but that’s a good start. Good video, and good audio. There’s tend to be dark, so a full frame camera with a fast lens is going to help a lot. I recommend the zoom h5 for audio. You can get something cheaper, but just be careful of the maximum SPL it can record.


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post #11090 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 11:30 AM
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Thanks both of you for the responses. I was planning on recording with a Nikon D5300 camera.
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post #11091 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 11:37 AM
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Thanks both of you for the responses. I was planning on recording with a Nikon D5300 camera.


That should work. Just get yourself a decent recorder. I recommend zoom h5 or for a little cheaper h4n pro.


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post #11092 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 11:51 AM
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I'd like to see the g25HP tested by data-bass actually. If their website claims are anything like how the FV25HP ended up, then clearly the cap4000/s2 would best it in basically every scenario. The fv25hp ended up showing compression starting at it's 105dB sweep, albeit very minimal, but by the 115dB sweep, it's really starting to be there.

Rythmic also shows response from 12-200hz on the site for both the g25 and the f25, but doesn't state a +/- with that spec. Tested, the f25 has almost an 11dB rolloff in it's response from 150hz down to 17hz, whereas the cap4000 is +/- 3dB over it's own usable range (10.5hz-125hz). The cap also does this with close to 6dB more headroom in max long term output and CEA bursts over the majority of the usable range.

Bottom line, it would take two f25hp's to get even close to the cap4000, and you'd still be pushing it. If the g25 spec fall in line with the discrepancies of the f25 (not saying necessarily that they do,) the argument is the g25 being sealed would have even MORE rolloff than the ported.

All this being said, I can see why people think the f25, and g25 for that matter rock. A sloping bass response like that sound really awesome for music, and likely pair up well with room gain to create an overall flat response once it's over and one with. This is the exact reason I like how the skhorn sounds so much, it follows much of the same response curve.... but, with 14dB more headroom

Trying to be respectful of the fact that this is JTR thread, but comparing a FV25HP to a Cap 4000 is a ridiculous one. Dual 18 inch driver sub with 4K amp power, huge cab costing over $1K more should best the Fv25HP. If you are going to compare the FV25HP compare it to the 2400 ULF which is still more expensive even without shipping. The results from these two on data-bass are more comparable. It has been said that at these levels of subs one cannot go wrong. But come on guys at least compare apples to apples...
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Subwoofers: Dual Rythmik FV18s Rev2 with Paper cone, BOSS Platform mini riser, 2 BK LFE
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post #11093 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 12:17 PM
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Trying to be respectful of the fact that this is JTR thread, but comparing a FV25HP to a Cap 4000 is a ridiculous one. Dual 18 inch driver sub with 4K amp power, huge cab costing over $1K more should best the Fv25HP. If you are going to compare the FV25HP compare it to the 2400 ULF which is still more expensive even without shipping. The results from these two on data-bass are more comparable. It has been said that at these levels of subs one cannot go wrong. But come on guys at least compare apples to apples...
The point of my comparison was not to find the most appropriate model comparison. Instead it was to compare what muscles is planning to hear with the cap4000 when he demos it, compared to what he currently has.

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post #11094 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 12:22 PM
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Come on, take it easy people...

I only posted the table to point out to muscles that he is already there though he said that he doesn't like super loud ULF stuff.

Trust me when I say that I love posting my CEA-2010 tables to compare subs... This is not it.

Muscles is not looking to switch. Like muscles said, it is a hobby and any serious basshead would want to hear what's out there.
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Speakers: L/C/R: JTR Noesis 212HT. Surrounds: Jamo C103, KEF Q100, Polk Audio RTiA3.
Subwoofer: JTR Captivator 4000ULF.
AVR: Denon AVR-X4400H. TV: Samsung UN75NU8000FXZA.

FS: Jamo C103, KEF Q100 and Polk RTiA3

Last edited by chucky7; 12-11-2018 at 12:26 PM.
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post #11095 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by chucky7 View Post
Come on, take it easy people...

I only posted the table to point out to muscles that he is already there though he said that he doesn't like super loud ULF stuff.

Trust me when I say that I love posting my CEA-2010 tables to compare subs... This is not it.

Muscles is not looking to switch. Like muscles said, it is a hobby and any serious basshead would want to hear what's out there.
Sometimes people say they aren't looking to switch until they hear something else they like. lol You just never know! I've been in that position many times.
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post #11096 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post
The point of my comparison was not to find the most appropriate model comparison. Instead it was to compare what muscles is planning to hear with the cap4000 when he demos it, compared to what he currently has.
Why didn't you just say so?.....

Subwoofers: Dual Rythmik FV18s Rev2 with Paper cone, BOSS Platform mini riser, 2 BK LFE
Speakers: PSA MTM-210 L/C/R - Klipsch 250S Surrounds, PSA MT 110sr Rear Surrounds, 4 x SVS Prime Elevation for Atmos
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post #11097 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by ereed View Post
Sometimes people say they aren't looking to switch until they hear something else they like. lol You just never know! I've been in that position many times.
I agree, listening to Todd's Cap 2400 in his room is what started me looking again...though I did not end up with the 2400, it end up with me selling the PSA which I was not looking to do...

Subwoofers: Dual Rythmik FV18s Rev2 with Paper cone, BOSS Platform mini riser, 2 BK LFE
Speakers: PSA MTM-210 L/C/R - Klipsch 250S Surrounds, PSA MT 110sr Rear Surrounds, 4 x SVS Prime Elevation for Atmos
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post #11098 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 01:00 PM
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I agree, listening to Todd's Cap 2400 in his room is what started me looking again...though I did not end up with the 2400, it end up with me selling the PSA which I was not looking to do...
Oh, come on...

I could see you were looking to further your in room extension from a mile away...
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Speakers: L/C/R: JTR Noesis 212HT. Surrounds: Jamo C103, KEF Q100, Polk Audio RTiA3.
Subwoofer: JTR Captivator 4000ULF.
AVR: Denon AVR-X4400H. TV: Samsung UN75NU8000FXZA.

FS: Jamo C103, KEF Q100 and Polk RTiA3
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post #11099 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 01:15 PM
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Comparing output of the 2400/4000ulf and the FV25hp, g25hp in @muscles ’ room at his listening level is really meaningless as he would never reach any where close to the headroom these subs are capable of. Like Chucky said, Muscles wants to listen to jtr stuffs: speakers and sub since he is about 40mins from Chucky. I have listened to many subs and systems and find that Rythmik subs have slightly different sound signature than JTR, Seaton, Hsu, svs, psa, and DIY subs. @Marc Alexander (hope he is okay) agrees with me about Rythmik subs.
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post #11100 of 13522 Old 12-11-2018, 01:26 PM
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I'd like to see the g25HP tested by data-bass actually. If their website claims are anything like how the FV25HP ended up, then clearly the cap4000/s2 would best it in basically every scenario. The fv25hp ended up showing compression starting at it's 105dB sweep, albeit very minimal, but by the 115dB sweep, it's really starting to be there.

Rythmic also shows response from 12-200hz on the site for both the g25 and the f25, but doesn't state a +/- with that spec. Tested, the f25 has almost an 11dB rolloff in it's response from 150hz down to 17hz, whereas the cap4000 is +/- 3dB over it's own usable range (10.5hz-125hz). The cap also does this with close to 6dB more headroom in max long term output and CEA bursts over the majority of the usable range.

Bottom line, it would take two f25hp's to get even close to the cap4000, and you'd still be pushing it. If the g25 spec fall in line with the discrepancies of the f25 (not saying necessarily that they do,) the argument is the g25 being sealed would have even MORE rolloff than the ported.

All this being said, I can see why people think the f25, and g25 for that matter rock. A sloping bass response like that sound really awesome for music, and likely pair up well with room gain to create an overall flat response once it's over and one with. This is the exact reason I like how the skhorn sounds so much, it follows much of the same response curve.... but, with 14dB more headroom
See the bold above, around tune it would take 4.

Building the room, speakers, and subs.
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