Official JTR Speakers Subwoofer Thread - Page 414 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #12391 of 12603 Old 04-14-2019, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by farsider3000 View Post
I have an S1 and S2 and I have never had a problem. Mine we’re ordered a few years ago so it sounds like there have been some changes to the amp components that are causing issues.


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There is definitely an issue with a batch of amps JTR received from Speakerpower. Some may not know that Brian O. (Speakerpower's founder & principal designer) retired which may be contributing.

Axpona was a huge effort (providing concert hall audio as well). Jeff had a decent amount of help and still could have used more. It was snowing and accumulating this morning when I left.

Because Axpona was obviously stressful I chose not to talk shop with Jeff when he had breaks (I didn't spend a large chunk of time at JTR either day). We plan to connect this week after Axpona. Perhaps I will have more info on these amp issues soon (I am also ~25 miles from Speakerpower).
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post #12392 of 12603 Old 04-14-2019, 05:25 PM
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Are there plans of a successor to the 4000ULF and 2400ULF?

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post #12393 of 12603 Old 04-15-2019, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blake18 View Post
Are there plans of a successor to the 4000ULF and 2400ULF?
Curious: What do you think that the "successor" offer that the current designs don't?
I consider both to be "end game" vented sub designs that someone can realistically ship and warranty. You can't get much "better" without getting into DIY and probably the extreme end of the DIY realm (multiple driver, mega-sized cabinets).
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post #12394 of 12603 Old 04-15-2019, 11:02 AM
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^^^

FWIW, I'm really not sure that there is such a thing as an end game vented subwoofer. I thought that the JTR S2 was pretty close to an end game sealed sub, until the PSA S7201 came out. But, it dwarfs the S2 in both size and weight. Now, I understand that PSA plans to introduce a "pull out all the stops" ported sub at the end of the year. I expect it to have dual 21" drivers, in a very large cabinet.

I think that somewhere around 300 pounds or so, may start to represent the higher end of a size/weight limit, but there are some speakers which are much too big for most rooms, and far more expensive than even the most costly subs. When the average subwoofer driver size was in the 12" to 15" range, 18" subs seemed like end game subs.

But now, several sub makers are making 21" and even 24" subs, although so far, most of them are sealed. I don't see any indication of an immediate slowdown in the subwoofer arms race, and I fully expect Jeff to be right in the thick of it.

Regards,
Mike


Just to clarify what I am saying here, I'm not claiming that anyone "needs" a bigger subwoofer than a Cap 4000ULF, for instance. But then again, I'm not really sure that most of us actually need even bigger SUV's or smartphones. But, that doesn't stop competitive companies from making them, and it won't stop some of us from buying them.
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GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
Speaker placements & Room treatments; HT calibration & Room EQ; Room gain; Bass
Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.

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post #12395 of 12603 Old 04-15-2019, 11:50 AM
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The 2400ULFs have certainly ended my game. I'll never endeavor to achieve a deeper tune or a superior appearance. These have completed me. I'm now whole. A 5hz tune won't make me stray. We three will live in a faithful polygamous bliss until I've breathed my last.
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post #12396 of 12603 Old 04-15-2019, 11:59 AM
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Originally Posted by blake18 View Post
Are there plans of a successor to the 4000ULF and 2400ULF?
So you feel like you need more output...perhaps try standing next to one of these

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post #12397 of 12603 Old 04-15-2019, 12:03 PM
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At certain point, one has to decide if more output is needed/wanted. I certainly don’t want a 4000ulf nor a 7201 in my place. What importance is how to squeeze out the best performance possible out of the smallest possible sub size and not just build a biggest sub ever. Of course, bigger sub has advantage but that was not my point.
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post #12398 of 12603 Old 04-15-2019, 12:29 PM
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They are 8 2400s.
In one room no less...OMG I can't wait to hear impressions.......Insanity perfected!!!

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post #12399 of 12603 Old 04-15-2019, 12:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
^^^

FWIW, I'm really not sure that there is such a thing as an end game vented subwoofer. I thought that the JTR S2 was pretty close to an end game sealed sub, until the PSA S7201 came out. But, it dwarfs the S2 in both size and weight. Now, I understand that PSA plans to introduce a "pull out all the stops" ported sub at the end of the year. I expect it to have dual 21" drivers, in a very large cabinet.

I think that somewhere around 300 pounds or so, may start to represent the higher end of a size/weight limit, but there are some speakers which are much too big for most rooms, and far more expensive than even the most costly subs. When the average subwoofer driver size was in the 12" to 15" range, 18" subs seemed like end game subs.

But now, several sub makers are making 21" and even 24" subs, although so far, most of them are sealed. I don't see any indication of an immediate slowdown in the subwoofer arms race, and I fully expect Jeff to be right in the thick of it.

Regards,
Mike


Just to clarify what I am saying here, I'm not claiming that anyone "needs" a bigger subwoofer than a Cap 4000ULF, for instance. But then again, I'm not really sure that most of us actually need even bigger SUV's or smartphones. But, that doesn't stop competitive companies from making them, and it won't stop some of us from buying them.
There is also a practical limit to household electrical power.
Unless you put in a 240v line(s) dedicated to your sub(s), you are pretty much maxing out the current that you can supply to the drivers with the 4000W Speakerpower amp in the 4000ULF.
So, anything significantly more powerful would put larger designs out of reach for all but a vanishingly small group of individuals willing to upgrade their home's electrical power.
Then there is the question of cabinet size. In my mind, something like the 2400ULF is at the upper limit of what most people would be willing to live with for a sub "out in the open" (not hidden behind a screen wall etc).
The 4000ULF is basically a refrigerator which really limits placement options.
It's really easy to draw an even larger cabinet than the 4000ULF in a CAD program and put 4 (or 8) 24" drivers in it.
It's an entirely different matter for a company to actually build it, ship it, and warranty it.
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post #12400 of 12603 Old 04-15-2019, 12:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweet Jimmy View Post
The 2400ULFs have certainly ended my game. I'll never endeavor to achieve a deeper tune or a superior appearance. These have completed me. I'm now whole. A 5hz tune won't make me stray. We three will live in a faithful polygamous bliss until I've breathed my last.


I'm right there with you Sweet Jimmy! Of course, I reserve the right to add 2 more.......should the "need" arise.

Todd
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post #12401 of 12603 Old 04-15-2019, 12:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
There is definitely an issue with a batch of amps JTR received from Speakerpower. Some may not know that Brian O. (Speakerpower's founder & principal designer) retired which may be contributing.

Axpona was a huge effort (providing concert hall audio as well). Jeff had a decent amount of help and still could have used more. It was snowing and accumulating this morning when I left.

Because Axpona was obviously stressful I chose not to talk shop with Jeff when he had breaks (I didn't spend a large chunk of time at JTR either day). We plan to connect this week after Axpona. Perhaps I will have more info on these amp issues soon (I am also ~25 miles from Speakerpower).
We are all waiting for full Axpona impressions and detailed pictures of the final setup!

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post #12402 of 12603 Old 04-15-2019, 02:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DennisPagoulatos View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by blake18 View Post
Are there plans of a successor to the 4000ULF and 2400ULF?
Curious: What do you think that the "successor" offer that the current designs don't?
I consider both to be "end game" vented sub designs that someone can realistically ship and warranty. You can't get much "better" without getting into DIY and probably the extreme end of the DIY realm (multiple driver, mega-sized cabinets).

Yeah, good point. I wonder if they could reduce size while maintaining performance?

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post #12403 of 12603 Old 04-15-2019, 03:28 PM
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Originally Posted by blake18 View Post
Yeah, good point. I wonder if they could reduce size while maintaining performance?
The Cap 2400 is basically a Cap 2400ULF in the Cap 1400's cabinet...

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post #12404 of 12603 Old 04-15-2019, 03:37 PM
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Anyone know how to replace the amp in 4K ulf. Thanks.
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The Cap 2400 is basically a Cap 2400ULF in the Cap 1400's cabinet...


But it’s not maintaining performance. It loses down low to the ULF. His point is maintaining performance while reducing size. There is no free lunch.


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post #12406 of 12603 Old 04-15-2019, 04:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DennisPagoulatos View Post
There is also a practical limit to household electrical power.
Unless you put in a 240v line(s) dedicated to your sub(s), you are pretty much maxing out the current that you can supply to the drivers with the 4000W Speakerpower amp in the 4000ULF.
So, anything significantly more powerful would put larger designs out of reach for all but a vanishingly small group of individuals willing to upgrade their home's electrical power.
if you're looking to spend multiple thousands of dollars on equipment with electrical thirst beyond 120v i can't believe for a second that same person would let something as trifling as upgrading their electrical supply stop them from doing so. it's astounding how many times i read statements like the above and face-palm irl. sure it's a pain for average joe using his living room as his "home theater", but said person probably isn't considering using equipment powerful enough need warranting the above (that's obviously a generalization).

for a dedicated room (which many of us have), who cares? don't let something as trivial as wiring new power outlets & circuit breakers prevent you from having what you need so you can use what you want.


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Anyone know how to replace the amp in 4K ulf. Thanks.
@chucky7 ?
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Anyone know how to replace the amp in 4K ulf. Thanks.
Unscrew it, unplug it, plug new one in, screw it back in. Nothing to fear but fear itself

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Unscrew it, unplug it, plug new one in, screw it back in. Nothing to fear but fear itself


And your fingers


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post #12410 of 12603 Old 04-15-2019, 05:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Alexander View Post
There is definitely an issue with a batch of amps JTR received from Speakerpower. Some may not know that Brian O. (Speakerpower's founder & principal designer) retired which may be contributing.

Axpona was a huge effort (providing concert hall audio as well). Jeff had a decent amount of help and still could have used more. It was snowing and accumulating this morning when I left.

Because Axpona was obviously stressful I chose not to talk shop with Jeff when he had breaks (I didn't spend a large chunk of time at JTR either day). We plan to connect this week after Axpona. Perhaps I will have more info on these amp issues soon (I am also ~25 miles from Speakerpower).

That's a bummer. I don't think Brian and SpeakerPower get enough credit for taking the HT market seriously. It could have been only a Seaton / JTR product. Speaker power and all the companies that uses there amps really pushed the limits of what you could do in ID market in terms of amplifier power.



Otherwise you would have to seek out very expensive custom options.



Hopefully these issues get ironed out.



I'm also interesting in hearing impressions from JTR's Axpona demo room .

ShaunH
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if you're looking to spend multiple thousands of dollars on equipment with electrical thirst beyond 120v i can't believe for a second that same person would let something as trifling as upgrading their electrical supply stop them from doing so. it's astounding how many times i read statements like the above and face-palm irl. sure it's a pain for average joe using his living room as his "home theater", but said person probably isn't considering using equipment powerful enough need warranting the above (that's obviously a generalization).

for a dedicated room (which many of us have), who cares? don't let something as trivial as wiring new power outlets & circuit breakers prevent you from having what you need so you can use what you want.
Hey, my system is in my living room, and I had the house upgraded to 200 amp service just so I could add two dedicated 20 amp outlets for subs and another for the sources and receiver
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post #12412 of 12603 Old 04-15-2019, 08:11 PM
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Hey, my system is in my living room, and I had the house upgraded to 200 amp service just so I could add two dedicated 20 amp outlets for subs and another for the sources and receiver
My system is also in my family room and I also have 1 dedicated 15 amp and 2 dedicated 20 amp circuits for my HT.
But that’s not the point I was making...the point is that we are few and that the market for a commercial subwoofer significantly more powerful than something like the 4000ULF is vanishingly small. And that’s a fact.
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post #12413 of 12603 Old 04-15-2019, 08:16 PM
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Unscrew it, unplug it, plug new one in, screw it back in. Nothing to fear but fear itself
Done
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I just got my replacement amp for my 2400 and the red and black connectors are missing the ones i have to connect to the driver so was I supposed to have disconected them and kept them or did they forget to put them back on I cant connect the amp without them
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post #12415 of 12603 Old 04-16-2019, 07:01 AM
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I just got my replacement amp for my 2400 and the red and black connectors are missing the ones i have to connect to the driver so was I supposed to have disconected them and kept them or did they forget to put them back on I cant connect the amp without them
You were supposed to leave the wires connected to the driver and disconnect from the amp.
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post #12416 of 12603 Old 04-16-2019, 12:03 PM
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You were supposed to leave the wires connected to the driver and disconnect from the amp.
Oops😕how did I miss that part, I hope it wont be too hard to connect the wires back to the driver I spoke to sp they will send me the connectors just alittle more waiting
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post #12417 of 12603 Old 04-16-2019, 03:31 PM
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I see that Jeff has been busy...




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Speakers: L/C/R: JTR Neosis 212HT. Surrounds: Jamo C103, KEF Q100, Polk Audio RTiA3.
Subwoofer: JTR Captivator 4000ULF.
AVR: Denon AVR-X4400H. TV: Samsung UN75NU8000FXZA.

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post #12418 of 12603 Old 04-16-2019, 04:05 PM
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I see that Jeff has been busy...


Only 20” deep?! That’s awesome. What is it?

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post #12419 of 12603 Old 04-16-2019, 04:43 PM
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I'd guess it's just another shape for the 4000, like http://jtrspeakers.com/captivator-4000ulf-lp.html. Maybe designed to go behind a couch or under a screen?
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post #12420 of 12603 Old 04-16-2019, 04:56 PM
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I see that Jeff has been busy...

Where did you see it? FB?
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