Originally Posted by Todeseng3l
My numbers are coming from data-bass. I don't care about max burst, I will never push the sub near that limit. I care about basic response.
As I mentioned the Sub 2 is flat (+/- 2dB) all the way down to 12Hz. The JTR 4000 ULF is -5 dB and the JTR S2 is -10dB at that point. Am I reading that chart wrong?
I want to experience my movies and music the way they are intended to be by the producers, which to my knowledge, is not possible with any of the ID offerings suggested here. When you listen to a mix with 12Hz and 20Hz, the 12Hz will be playing 10dB lower than the 20Hz on the S2! The limitations of the S2 effectively EQ the track negatively from the way it was intended to be listened to. To some that want to laugh with their friends when their jowl's are flapping in the wind with the SPL monsters it may not matter, but I am interested in accuracy and am willing to pay the premium to achieve it.
If I am incorrect in my thinking, please enlighten me; I am here to learn.
Happy Thanksgiving! Cheers.
I do think that there are a couple of areas that some other people may still be trying to clarify for you. We all help each other to understand some of these concepts better. For instance, although all modern subs are intended to be able to play flat quasi-anechoically, they all contain internal DSP to be able to tailor the frequency response to the individual room, because the room will exert both benign and malign influences on the sub's native response. For instance, I expect that you will still get some boundary gain and room gain below about 20Hz. I do, even in a 6000^3 room.
When buying the various top-of-the-line subs, it's really just a question of deciding how much SPL and tactile response you are looking for at very low frequencies, because any of the subs you are considering will be able to play as flat as the room modes, and their specific positioning, will allow them to. Their internal DSP, combined with your implementation of Dirac, will see to that.
Reviewing your posts to date, I wouldn't think that you would need a Cap 4000 ULF. The ULF in the name is deliberate. It is the current low frequency champion, as defined by Data-Bass. But, if you like the idea of having an exceptionally low frequency response, combined with a lot of tactile energy, the Cap 2400 ULF could be a very good option for you. And, it would fit within the dimensions you listed.
Another good option that would fit your space would be the Rythmik FV25HP. It wouldn't produce as much tactile energy as the Cap 2400. And, that is by design. The intent of that sub design is to have the low frequency response of a ported sub, but without quite as much port wind or tactile energy. For an equal mix of music and movies, it might work even better for you than the Cap 2400.
If you want to move to sealed subs, then a Cap S2 would be a very good choice, although it would be a little bigger in one dimension than you had preferred. My personal pick for a sealed sub, with the budget you have listed, would be the Funk Audio FA21.0LX, with the 4800 watt amp. Nathan Funk can tailor the low frequency response for a particular room, since he builds his subs to order anyway. For a combination of superior performance and superior appearance, I don't think that the Funk Audio subs have any equals.
So much has changed in subwoofer technology in the last 10 or 11 years. The Paradigm Sub2 was very advanced for it's time. But, instead of using six 8" woofers (with the concomitant maintenance issue that can arise) subwoofer engineers have learned how to develop larger drivers, with more excursion, and superior DSP, in order to achieve low frequency SPL's that were simply not thought of in 2006. We don't care about that additional low frequency SPL so much for most acoustic music, but we really value it for 5.1 blockbusters and action movies (and for some electronically-enhanced music).
I think that you should buy whatever sub you really want. And, if that is the Sub2, so be it. But, when people start threads like this one, they gain a great opportunity to be exposed to broader points of view about their options. I believe that AVS forum can be a constant education for all of us in this respect. And, when it comes to subwoofers, the industry has moved extremely fast in recent years, much in the way that it has with smartphones and tablets.
There are a lot of good subwoofer choices out there, at a variety of price points. Just take your time to understand what is being said about native response (any of the good subwoofers will have that) and to better define your own goals with respect to low frequencies, tactile response, and any other factors you deem relevant. And, you will be able to make the choice that best serves your individual preferences.