$1000 Budget - Dual SVS PB-1000 or single PB-2000 - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 55Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #31 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 06:16 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
blake18's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,081
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 632 Post(s)
Liked: 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by Falconsfan71 View Post
Brad,

I?ve been down this path. You?ll get a lot of comments, suggestions, opinions, and different experiences on here. The PB-2000 is far superior to the PB-1000. I?ve had 4 or 5 subs not worth mentioning before I discovered SVS, Hsu, and other ID subs. When I first got the PB-2000 I was so blown away especially after coming from smaller, lesser subs. I have a big open space but didn?t want to go over $1,000. I had some nulls in my space with one sub. But to be fair, at the time, I had a ?lesser? AVR also. I decided to try out dual PB-1000?s while still having the PB-2000 (all this within the 45 day trial). Ok so yes, I liked the idea of dual subs and I did have a smoother response in the room. I sent the PB-2000 back and listened & tweaked the PB-1000?s for a month or so. They seemed fine with movies but I listen to a lot of music and realized they didn?t have that punch or mid bass I was ?needing?. I started regretting sending the PB-2000 back.. wished I could?ve tried dual PB-2000?s. Well.. after much thought and research and feedback on here I ordered the Hsu VTF-3 MK5. Mind you, $800 for a PB-2000, $950 for dual PB-1000, and $895 shipped for the Hsu. As soon as I plugged it in and turned it on I was blown away. It got just as low or lower than the PB-2000 but had much more kick. So, I sent the PB-1000?s back and ordered another Hsu. I was getting a 2000w peak 600w rms 15? sub for $95 more than a 12? 1100w peak 500w rms 12? sub with more output and more kick or mid bass. Don?t get wrong, I ?liked? the dual 1000?s and really liked the 2000 but the VTF-3 was the ?wow?. I?ve since bought a better AVR and sold one of the Hsu?s since I got powered towers with built in 12? subs. With those dual 12?s in the front and the 15? in the right corner I have plenty of bass. I really think you should get the biggest, best sub for your budget and if needed or wanted, get another identical sub later on. The PB-2000 is a way better sub than the PB-1000 with more ?oomph? and cleaner lower extension. With the right setup, placement, and settings (tweaking) I just think you?ll be happier with one better sub. Set the fronts to small and try 80hz and maybe even 60hz depending on your front speakers. Just think about this.. do your homework, research, and maybe consider other than SVS. They are a great company with great customer and have the 45 day trial along with the upgrade program which is great.

Note: I do have a PB-1000 (which I won from an SVS online contest ) and use it ?nearfield?. I sit it behind the sofa for movie time. It?s a nice ?starter? sub.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I couldn't possibly agree more!

Lumenlab "Community driven video lab".
blake18 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #32 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 06:17 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 80
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 93 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Falconsfan71 View Post
Brad,

I’ve been down this path. You’ll get a lot of comments, suggestions, opinions, and different experiences on here. The PB-2000 is far superior to the PB-1000. I’ve had 4 or 5 subs not worth mentioning before I discovered SVS, Hsu, and other ID subs. When I first got the PB-2000 I was so blown away especially after coming from smaller, lesser subs. I have a big open space but didn’t want to go over $1,000. I had some nulls in my space with one sub. But to be fair, at the time, I had a “lesser” AVR also. I decided to try out dual PB-1000’s while still having the PB-2000 (all this within the 45 day trial). Ok so yes, I liked the idea of dual subs and I did have a smoother response in the room. I sent the PB-2000 back and listened & tweaked the PB-1000’s for a month or so. They seemed fine with movies but I listen to a lot of music and realized they didn’t have that punch or mid bass I was “needing”. I started regretting sending the PB-2000 back.. wished I could’ve tried dual PB-2000’s. Well.. after much thought and research and feedback on here I ordered the Hsu VTF-3 MK5. Mind you, $800 for a PB-2000, $950 for dual PB-1000, and $895 shipped for the Hsu. As soon as I plugged it in and turned it on I was blown away. It got just as low or lower than the PB-2000 but had much more kick. So, I sent the PB-1000’s back and ordered another Hsu. I was getting a 2000w peak 600w rms 15” sub for $95 more than a 12” 1100w peak 500w rms 12” sub with more output and more kick or mid bass. Don’t get wrong, I “liked” the dual 1000’s and really liked the 2000 but the VTF-3 was the “wow”. I’ve since bought a better AVR and sold one of the Hsu’s since I got powered towers with built in 12” subs. With those dual 12’s in the front and the 15” in the right corner I have plenty of bass. I really think you should get the biggest, best sub for your budget and if needed or wanted, get another identical sub later on. The PB-2000 is a way better sub than the PB-1000 with more “oomph” and cleaner lower extension. With the right setup, placement, and settings (tweaking) I just think you’ll be happier with one better sub. Set the fronts to small and try 80hz and maybe even 60hz depending on your front speakers. Just think about this.. do your homework, research, and maybe consider other than SVS. They are a great company with great customer and have the 45 day trial along with the upgrade program which is great.

Note: I do have a PB-1000 (which I won from an SVS online contest ) and use it “nearfield”. I sit it behind the sofa for movie time. It’s a nice “starter” sub.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Thank you for the really helpful response. I do keep coming back to Hsu you mentioned. The forum always has great ideas - but a LOT of them. It’s like going in for a sore throat and then five doctors coming in all offering subtle variations on the same diagnosis. In the end, it’s still a viral illness :-)

Honestly, my wife is been very understanding with purchases for the nascent home theater that’s far. I can really only support getting one “big“ subwoofer at this point.

Intimidated, is the wrong word but with the Hsu VTF3 MK5 I feel like the customization options are a bit overwhelming since I am a neophyte, and I don’t anticipate using them. Is it still a set it and forget it sub if I use the Audyssey calibration?

Last edited by Brad Sobolewski; 03-04-2018 at 07:01 AM.
Brad Sobolewski is offline  
post #33 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 06:24 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
confinoj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Shaker Heights, OH
Posts: 2,020
Mentioned: 24 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1248 Post(s)
Liked: 1069
Quote:
Originally Posted by blake18 View Post
I'd consider going with quads instead of replacing to get better duals.
Good idea. Will you be providing a reference for a divorce lawyer?

LG OLED65C7P (Chad B Calibrated) | Denon X4300H | HDHomeRun Quatro | Nvidia Shield | ATV 4K | Oppo UDP-203 | 40TB Plex server
5.2.4 | Front Klipsch RP-160M x2 | Center Klipsch RP-450C | Surrounds Klipsch RP-150M x2 | Atmos Klipsch RP-140SA x 4 | Subs SVS PC-4000 x 2
confinoj is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #34 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 06:26 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
blake18's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,081
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 632 Post(s)
Liked: 353
Quote:
Originally Posted by confinoj View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by blake18 View Post
I'd consider going with quads instead of replacing to get better duals.
Good idea. Will you be providing a reference for a divorce lawyer?
Haha, she wouldn't go for it? I managed to get my wife to allow a 5th 15" ported sub in our home theater, she's a keeper! :P
Falconsfan71 likes this.

Lumenlab "Community driven video lab".
blake18 is offline  
post #35 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 06:49 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
confinoj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Shaker Heights, OH
Posts: 2,020
Mentioned: 24 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1248 Post(s)
Liked: 1069
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad Sobolewski View Post
Is it still he set it and forget it sub if I use the Audyssey calibration?
You may have to experiment for preference when first setting a Hsu up but then most seem to leave it. Most seem to prefer max extension mode from what I’ve seen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by blake18 View Post
Haha, she wouldn't go for it? I managed to get my wife to allow a 5th 15" ported sub in our home theater, she's a keeper! :P
It’s our living room so there are limits to what is reasonable. No need for quads anyway. My PC12+s do very well and I don’t listen close to reference. For me the PC-4000 upgrade would be in part for the additional app control and better extension and just having the headroom for the rare occasion I want it. But probably above all it’s just a bad case of upgrsditis. I don’t like having old tech.
Falconsfan71 likes this.

LG OLED65C7P (Chad B Calibrated) | Denon X4300H | HDHomeRun Quatro | Nvidia Shield | ATV 4K | Oppo UDP-203 | 40TB Plex server
5.2.4 | Front Klipsch RP-160M x2 | Center Klipsch RP-450C | Surrounds Klipsch RP-150M x2 | Atmos Klipsch RP-140SA x 4 | Subs SVS PC-4000 x 2
confinoj is online now  
post #36 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 07:18 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Falconsfan71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,242
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1544 Post(s)
Liked: 524
Quote:
Originally Posted by confinoj View Post
Good idea. Will you be providing a reference for a divorce lawyer?





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Denon X4300H * Def Tech BP8080st front L/R * Def Tech CLR2002 center * Def Tech ProMonitor 800 surrounds (x4) * Hsu VTF-3 MK5 HP sub * Outlaw OAW4 wireless sub kit * Vizio 60" 4K HDRtv * Sony UBP-X800 Bluray * PS4 * AC Infinity S9 AVR fan
Falconsfan71 is offline  
post #37 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 07:21 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Falconsfan71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,242
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1544 Post(s)
Liked: 524
$1000 Budget - Dual SVS PB-1000 or single PB-2000

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad Sobolewski View Post
Thank you for the really helpful response. I do keep coming back to Hsu you mentioned. The forum always has great ideas - but a LOT of them. It’s like going in for a sore throat and then five doctors coming in all offering subtle variations on the same diagnosis. In the end, it’s still a viral illness :-)



Honestly, my wife is been very understanding with purchases for the nascent home theater that’s far. I can really only support getting one “big“ subwoofer at this point.



Intimidated, is the wrong word but with the Hsu VTF3 MK5 I feel like the customization options are a bit overwhelming since I am a neophyte, and I don’t anticipate using them. Is it still a set it and forget it sub if I use the Audyssey calibration?

You said it’s mostly movies and you don’t listen at crazy volumes..? That’s me also but I listen to a lot.. A LOT.. of music. I like the lower extension mode. Trust me, it’s simple.. set it and leave it!!! It’s about the same price as the PB-2000, bigger woofer, more output, more punch, weighs 20lbs more, and a much nicer finish!






Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Denon X4300H * Def Tech BP8080st front L/R * Def Tech CLR2002 center * Def Tech ProMonitor 800 surrounds (x4) * Hsu VTF-3 MK5 HP sub * Outlaw OAW4 wireless sub kit * Vizio 60" 4K HDRtv * Sony UBP-X800 Bluray * PS4 * AC Infinity S9 AVR fan

Last edited by Falconsfan71; 03-04-2018 at 07:25 AM.
Falconsfan71 is offline  
post #38 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 07:26 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 80
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 93 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Falconsfan71 View Post
You said it’s mostly movies and you don’t listen at crazy volumes..? That’s me also but I listen to a lot.. A LOT.. of music. I like the lower extension mode. Trust me, it’s simple.. set it and leave it!!! It’s about the same price as the PB-2000, bigger woofer, more output, more punch, weighs 20lbs more, and a much nicer finish!

https://youtu.be/F2--a7U2rGo





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Good point. Plus movies so include music from time to time :-)

Dang it. Maybe I should just get the Hsu!
Brad Sobolewski is offline  
post #39 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 07:31 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Falconsfan71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,242
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1544 Post(s)
Liked: 524
$1000 Budget - Dual SVS PB-1000 or single PB-2000

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad Sobolewski View Post
Good point. Plus movies so include music from time to time :-)



Dang it. Maybe I should just get the Hsu!

Decisions, Decisions...

It’s a lot I know. SVS is great.. the PB-2000 is a great sub.. but I feel like it should be a $599-$699 sub compared to the Hsu honestly. I feel like, along with many others on here, that the VTF-3 MK5 is the best bang for the buck.. best sub for under $900!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Denon X4300H * Def Tech BP8080st front L/R * Def Tech CLR2002 center * Def Tech ProMonitor 800 surrounds (x4) * Hsu VTF-3 MK5 HP sub * Outlaw OAW4 wireless sub kit * Vizio 60" 4K HDRtv * Sony UBP-X800 Bluray * PS4 * AC Infinity S9 AVR fan

Last edited by Falconsfan71; 03-04-2018 at 07:34 AM.
Falconsfan71 is offline  
post #40 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 07:38 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Falconsfan71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,242
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1544 Post(s)
Liked: 524
I really want to hear the SB-16 Ultra. I’ve never listened to a sealed sub. I know an equivalent ported gives more headroom and lower extension. I wonder though how the SB16 compares to the VTF3.5. I listen to a lot of music and have heard sealed is the way to go. But, I can’t justify the $2,000 price tag over what I have now.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Denon X4300H * Def Tech BP8080st front L/R * Def Tech CLR2002 center * Def Tech ProMonitor 800 surrounds (x4) * Hsu VTF-3 MK5 HP sub * Outlaw OAW4 wireless sub kit * Vizio 60" 4K HDRtv * Sony UBP-X800 Bluray * PS4 * AC Infinity S9 AVR fan
Falconsfan71 is offline  
post #41 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 07:41 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Falconsfan71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,242
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1544 Post(s)
Liked: 524
This is before I got my towers. This is the sub I sold...



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Denon X4300H * Def Tech BP8080st front L/R * Def Tech CLR2002 center * Def Tech ProMonitor 800 surrounds (x4) * Hsu VTF-3 MK5 HP sub * Outlaw OAW4 wireless sub kit * Vizio 60" 4K HDRtv * Sony UBP-X800 Bluray * PS4 * AC Infinity S9 AVR fan
Falconsfan71 is offline  
post #42 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 07:43 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Falconsfan71's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,242
Mentioned: 25 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1544 Post(s)
Liked: 524
$1000 Budget - Dual SVS PB-1000 or single PB-2000

Gettin low (no sound).. that last candle was 10 feet away.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
d-rail34 likes this.

Denon X4300H * Def Tech BP8080st front L/R * Def Tech CLR2002 center * Def Tech ProMonitor 800 surrounds (x4) * Hsu VTF-3 MK5 HP sub * Outlaw OAW4 wireless sub kit * Vizio 60" 4K HDRtv * Sony UBP-X800 Bluray * PS4 * AC Infinity S9 AVR fan
Falconsfan71 is offline  
post #43 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 08:05 AM
AVS ***** Member
 
mthomas47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 8,281
Mentioned: 348 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5492 Post(s)
Liked: 10492
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad Sobolewski View Post
Thank you for the really helpful response. I do keep coming back to Hsu you mentioned. The forum always has great ideas - but a LOT of them. It’s like going in for a sore throat and then five doctors coming in all offering subtle variations on the same diagnosis. In the end, it’s still a viral illness :-)

Honestly, my wife is been very understanding with purchases for the nascent home theater that’s far. I can really only support getting one “big“ subwoofer at this point.

Intimidated, is the wrong word but with the Hsu VTF3 MK5 I feel like the customization options are a bit overwhelming since I am a neophyte, and I don’t anticipate using them. Is it still a set it and forget it sub if I use the Audyssey calibration?
Hi,

I have followed your thread for a couple of days without commenting, in part because I know that you have already been getting a lot of different advice and I didn't want to contribute to your confusion. But, there are several points I would like to make.

First, I don't think you should worry about customization options in the HSU. You won't need them with Audyssey. I would just put the subwoofer in the extended, one-port mode, and let Audyssey do the rest. If somewhere down the road you ever want to experiment you can. But, you certainly don't need to in order to have a very successful system.

Second, I absolutely believe that in the circumstances you have described you should get the single most powerful subwoofer that fits your budget. And, that would definitely be a HSU. The one I would recommend, however, is $32 over the $1000 budget you stated in your thread. It is the VTF-15H MK2, and it would be $1032 with shipping included. This subwoofer would give you +3db at 16Hz compared to the one you have been thinking about, and 3db at that frequency would be noticeable. It does that by slightly increasing the cabinet volume and lowering the tuning point. Here is the subwoofer:

http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-15hmk2.html

I like SVS subwoofers very much. In fact, I am a long-time SVS subwoofer owner and currently have four of them in my HT. But, in my opinion, there is no comparison between either of the HSU's you may now be considering and the PB2000. It isn't a build quality issue. All of the SVS subs are very well constructed. It's strictly an output issue. The larger, stronger 15" driver in the HSU is capable of generating much more SPL at all frequencies than the PB2000. And, I think that you will also get very good service from HSU.

I believe that there are a lot of good subwoofer companies, and individual sub models, in the marketplace today. It's pretty hard to go wrong with any of them. But, I sincerely believe that subwoofer buyers are better served by buying the most sub that they can afford, because for most HT owners, subwoofer upgrades are a routine exercise. Starting out with as much output as you can get for your money is the best way I know to future-proof your system. Then, as you and several others have observed, you can add a second, similar sub, when it is feasible to do so.

I hope this helps!

Regards,
Mike
Falconsfan71 likes this.

GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
Speaker placements & Room treatments; HT calibration & Room EQ; Room gain; Bass
Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.
mthomas47 is offline  
post #44 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 08:13 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
sk373's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,514
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 804 Post(s)
Liked: 1143
Quote:
Originally Posted by Falconsfan71 View Post
I really want to hear the SB-16 Ultra. I’ve never listened to a sealed sub. I know an equivalent ported gives more headroom and lower extension. I wonder though how the SB16 compares to the VTF3.5. I listen to a lot of music and have heard sealed is the way to go. But, I can’t justify the $2,000 price tag over what I have now.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
You can run your VTF3-MK5 in sealed mode.

My humble main system:
Vizio M75-E1; Oppo 203 universal UHD player; Denon 4300H AVR, Dual PSA S1801's; Monitor Audio Silver RX-6 mains, RX center, and RX surrounds; one pair NHT mini Atmos speakers; Home-built HTPC (Xeon E1230, 16gb RAM, Crucial M500 480gb SSD, GeForce 980Ti, Corsair CX600, CoolerMaster mini-ITX case); Roku Premiere+; Amazon 4K Fire TV
sk373 is online now  
post #45 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 08:30 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Jack D Ripper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Burpelson Air Force Base
Posts: 1,445
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 168 Post(s)
Liked: 543
Quote:
Originally Posted by confinoj View Post
The cylinder subs are mostly unique to SVS. I’m a fan as well. The few spots I have available for subs are limited by floor space and the SVS cyclinders really gave me good options in my living room. They are tall but only take up 16.6” (diameter) of floor space. Performance between the box and cylinder version of their subs is very similar. The PC-2000 compared to the PB-2000 is a little backwards from the other lines. As noted above the pc-2000 extends 1hz lower. How much that is noteicable not sure. For their higher lines, 12 plus and 4000, the box versions have a little better extension and output due to slightly larger volumes of the boxes but still overall very similar. I went from PB-1000 to PC-2000 to PC12+ to dual PC12+s. Now contemplating dual PC-4000s but not sure how to ask permission from my wife yet again. I’m telling you good bass is addictive.
Regarding the performance of cylinder versus box, it really is a question of what size SVS decides to make each one. They can make a cylinder go deeper, or a box, depending on which one they decide to make bigger. And lately, most of the time, SVS decides to make the boxes bigger, in most of their lines. But they always make them comparable. And the advantages for the cylinder are weighing less and taking up less floor space, due to the shape allowing for thinner cabinet and less bracing (so less weight) and the floor space due to having the cylinder standing up, with the circle not that big, but with them relatively tall. Because of the thinner cabinet and less internal bracing, the overall external volume is smaller with the cylinder than with a box if they have the same internal volume. I like them weighing less and taking up less floor space; for my home theater, I have a pair of the SVS CS-Ultra subwoofers. Some people, though, just want a box. But I am not alone in liking them having less weight and being easy to move and taking up less floor space:

There is a lot to like about the PC-2000. Its two greatest distinctions are the light weight and the very clean and linear performance. I would bet that with respect to deep bass in the 16 to 30 Hz range, the PC-2000 might be the market champion in a performance vs. weight and footprint ratio. You might think to yourself that weight is not a big deal in a sub, and that it is something too seldom dealt with to be a serious advantage since subs are mostly just plopped down in a corner and left alone. However, allow me to make a case for the usefulness of light weight in a subwoofer. Yes, many times the subwoofer is simply plopped into the corner and left alone, but a reason why it is not often moved afterward is because of the weight: it is a daunting task to move around a 70+ lbs object, so we will tend to find reasons not to. The PC2000 is different, because moving it around is a cinch. It is very easy to pick up and its small footprint allows it to be placed in many more spots than most subs. The relative mobility of the PC2000 holds a real set of advantages: it is easier to find the optimal location for the sub, it is easier to adjust the low frequency response for specific listening positions since it’s so easy to move the sub and thus change the response, and its portability makes it a simple matter when moving homes, selling, or just bringing it over to a friend’s place to demo.
https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofe...fer/conclusion


I think it is unfortunate that SVS no longer makes unpowered subwoofers, and does not make a cylinder version of their new Ultra model. But they do not need to worry too much about me, because I am satisfied with my old CS-Ultra subwoofers and do not feel the need to upgrade. But if I ever did want to upgrade, I think I would ask them about the possibility of them making some unpowered Ultra cylinders.

Hsu used to make cylinder subwoofers, that were highly regarded at the time, but stopped making cylinder subwoofers some years ago. I do not know why they stopped making them. I wish more companies made them, but, then again, they do not need to concern themselves with my tastes, as I am satisfied with what I have and do not plan on ever upgrading. Sure, there are better subwoofers available now, but the performance of mine does not change because new ones are better. They are still the great subwoofers they always were, no matter how much better anything now or in the future is or will be.

God willing, we will prevail in peace and freedom from fear and in true health through the purity and essence of our natural fluids. God bless you all.
Jack D Ripper is offline  
post #46 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 08:52 AM
Advanced Member
 
d-rail34's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Longville, LA.
Posts: 860
Mentioned: 17 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 450 Post(s)
Liked: 859
Quote:
Originally Posted by blake18 View Post
I'd go with Pb-2000's or Outlaw Ultra X-12 on sale. Also, check outlet stores or consider buying used and checking the classifieds on this forum.
I concur with this.

I was able to pick up my PB12 Plus for only $800 through the AVS Classifieds. It was barely used and in prestine condition. I actually finished breaking it in. Definitely a fantastic find, so don't be deterred from considering buying used gear.

"Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken." - Tyler Durden

Living Room - Denon AVR-X2400H/MiniDSP 2X4HD/Hsu Research HB-1 Bookshelfs (4)/HC-1 Center/SVS PB12 Plus (1)/Samsung UN65H7150/Sony UBP-X800/PC Built by D-Rail/XBox One S
d-rail34 is offline  
post #47 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 09:25 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Jack D Ripper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Burpelson Air Force Base
Posts: 1,445
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 168 Post(s)
Liked: 543
Regarding the advice some are giving about switching to Hsu, you can read a couple of things with measurements:

SVS PC-2000:

https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofe...r/measurements

(The measurements are at that page, but the article starts at: https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofe...2000-subwoofer )


Hsu VTF-15H MK2 and Hsu VTF-3 MK5:

https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofe...-hp-subwoofers

The more expensive Hsu subwoofers can play louder at all frequencies than the less expensive SVS PC-2000, and the more expensive Hsu VTF-15H MK2 can play louder than the less expensive Hsu VTF-3 MK5.

I recommend reading both articles in their entirety, as well as looking at other reviews of the subwoofers in question.

Both SVS and Hsu are highly regarded companies that have been in business a long time. I don't think you can go too far wrong with either brand. So it is more a question of how much you want to spend, what level of performance you require, and what size/weight you are okay with having. Of course, you can also look at more expensive SVS models, though you would be going over the proposed budget of $1k.


As for going with used, if you lived in Georgia, I would be suggesting a pair of SVS CS-Ultra subwoofers that someone is selling, with a power amp and EQ, for $900. They are even better subwoofers than what you are considering (judging by a comparison with the measurements at https://hometheaterhifi.com/volume_9...02-part-2.html ), and you would be getting two of them for that price. But it would be a long drive from Ohio. (I am not the person selling the CS-Ultra subwoofers in Georgia, nor do I know the person. So I do not vouch for the claims made by the seller.) If I were looking at subwoofers now at that price, I would be wondering if I wanted to make a road trip. I love my CS-Ultra subwoofers.

God willing, we will prevail in peace and freedom from fear and in true health through the purity and essence of our natural fluids. God bless you all.
Jack D Ripper is offline  
post #48 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 11:13 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 80
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 93 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack D Ripper View Post
Regarding the advice some are giving about switching to Hsu, you can read a couple of things with measurements:

SVS PC-2000:

https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofe...r/measurements

(The measurements are at that page, but the article starts at: https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofe...2000-subwoofer )


Hsu VTF-15H MK2 and Hsu VTF-3 MK5:

https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofe...-hp-subwoofers

The more expensive Hsu subwoofers can play louder at all frequencies than the less expensive SVS PC-2000, and the more expensive Hsu VTF-15H MK2 can play louder than the less expensive Hsu VTF-3 MK5.

I recommend reading both articles in their entirety, as well as looking at other reviews of the subwoofers in question.

Both SVS and Hsu are highly regarded companies that have been in business a long time. I don't think you can go too far wrong with either brand. So it is more a question of how much you want to spend, what level of performance you require, and what size/weight you are okay with having. Of course, you can also look at more expensive SVS models, though you would be going over the proposed budget of $1k.


As for going with used, if you lived in Georgia, I would be suggesting a pair of SVS CS-Ultra subwoofers that someone is selling, with a power amp and EQ, for $900. They are even better subwoofers than what you are considering (judging by a comparison with the measurements at https://hometheaterhifi.com/volume_9...02-part-2.html ), and you would be getting two of them for that price. But it would be a long drive from Ohio. (I am not the person selling the CS-Ultra subwoofers in Georgia, nor do I know the person. So I do not vouch for the claims made by the seller.) If I were looking at subwoofers now at that price, I would be wondering if I wanted to make a road trip. I love my CS-Ultra subwoofers.
Yeah that would be a long drive from Ohio to Georgia - I won’t be looking at the VTF15H MK2 because it weighs 110lbs. That unfortunately makes it a dealbreaker

Thank you for sharing those links. Reviews are helpful, some of the technical data is a bit beyond my level of experience and understanding. But it definitely helps

For budget and for specs, maybe the VTF MK5 is the way to go. Plus I will be able to actually carry it by myself.
Brad Sobolewski is offline  
post #49 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 11:38 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
confinoj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Shaker Heights, OH
Posts: 2,020
Mentioned: 24 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1248 Post(s)
Liked: 1069
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad Sobolewski View Post
Yeah that would be a long drive from Ohio to Georgia - I won’t be looking at the VTF15H MK2 because it weighs 110lbs. That unfortunately makes it a dealbreaker

Thank you for sharing those links. Reviews are helpful, some of the technical data is a bit beyond my level of experience and understanding. But it definitely helps

For budget and for specs, maybe the VTF MK5 is the way to go. Plus I will be able to actually carry it by myself.
Just curious where in Ohio are you?

LG OLED65C7P (Chad B Calibrated) | Denon X4300H | HDHomeRun Quatro | Nvidia Shield | ATV 4K | Oppo UDP-203 | 40TB Plex server
5.2.4 | Front Klipsch RP-160M x2 | Center Klipsch RP-450C | Surrounds Klipsch RP-150M x2 | Atmos Klipsch RP-140SA x 4 | Subs SVS PC-4000 x 2
confinoj is online now  
post #50 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 12:15 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
bear123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: PA
Posts: 6,450
Mentioned: 78 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2658 Post(s)
Liked: 4152
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad Sobolewski View Post
Yeah that would be a long drive from Ohio to Georgia - I won’t be looking at the VTF15H MK2 because it weighs 110lbs. That unfortunately makes it a dealbreaker

Thank you for sharing those links. Reviews are helpful, some of the technical data is a bit beyond my level of experience and understanding. But it definitely helps

For budget and for specs, maybe the VTF MK5 is the way to go. Plus I will be able to actually carry it by myself.
If you are leaning towards the VTF3.5, I think you would be making an excellent choice. Once you have a well designed sub.....it mostly boils down to output and extension. The VTF3.5 will give you A LOT more of both compared to any sub $1000 and under.

I would not let the weight of the VTF15.2 dissuade you from purchasing it..imo that would be the worst reason possible. Once you take these subs out of the box, they aren't that hard to lift especially using the port as a hand hold. If needed, use a dolly and a blanket. Imagine if we never bought a couch because it weighed too much to lift by ourselves for example. If its the right sub, buy it

I do think the 15.2 is a worthwhile upgrade over the 3.5 due to the added output down low...the costliest and hardest to produce output, and it has close to 50% more than the 3.5? Not that you probably wouldn't be very happy with the 3.5. I just see the benefit of the 15.2 brushed off too often on these forums. $150 extra dollars is nothing when it comes to a sub you could potentially enjoy for the next ten years(if its in budget).

Regardless, a 3.5 now and another down the road someday will make for a VERY capable sub system that you may never have to upgrade. I mean, anything is possible. I know at least one forum member who has had the same subs for about 3 years. @basshead81 .

P.S. Also, short of a disability, if any grown man here cannot lift something that weighs 100 lbs, I would suggest looking up a basic strength training program like starting strength or stronglifts 5x5. Acquiring a moderate base level of strength is very helpful in every day life and can help you live a longer, more independent life!
Falconsfan71 likes this.
bear123 is offline  
post #51 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 12:47 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 80
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 93 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
If you are leaning towards the VTF3.5, I think you would be making an excellent choice. Once you have a well designed sub.....it mostly boils down to output and extension. The VTF3.5 will give you A LOT more of both compared to any sub $1000 and under.

I would not let the weight of the VTF15.2 dissuade you from purchasing it..imo that would be the worst reason possible. Once you take these subs out of the box, they aren't that hard to lift especially using the port as a hand hold. If needed, use a dolly and a blanket. Imagine if we never bought a couch because it weighed too much to lift by ourselves for example. If its the right sub, buy it

I do think the 15.2 is a worthwhile upgrade over the 3.5 due to the added output down low...the costliest and hardest to produce output, and it has close to 50% more than the 3.5? Not that you probably wouldn't be very happy with the 3.5. I just see the benefit of the 15.2 brushed off too often on these forums. $150 extra dollars is nothing when it comes to a sub you could potentially enjoy for the next ten years(if its in budget).

Regardless, a 3.5 now and another down the road someday will make for a VERY capable sub system that you may never have to upgrade. I mean, anything is possible. I know at least one forum member who has had the same subs for about 3 years. @basshead81 .

P.S. Also, short of a disability, if any grown man here cannot lift something that weighs 100 lbs, I would suggest looking up a basic strength training program like starting strength or stronglifts 5x5. Acquiring a moderate base level of strength is very helpful in every day life and can help you live a longer, more independent life!
It’s not the lifting. It is the ridiculousness of a 110 pound subwoofer that my wife in no way will support purchasing in all honesty. :-(
Brad Sobolewski is offline  
post #52 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 12:50 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
MIX_MASTER_ICE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 5,065
Mentioned: 45 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2669 Post(s)
Liked: 2477
If I had a 1K budget and decided to go with just one sub, I would opt for the $1032 (current sale price) VTF-15H mk2 over the $895 VTF-3 MK5 HP. More output down low, which is a key reason these subs cost what they do, plus more port area for less chance of port noise. VTF-3 has been known to have some port noise issues.
MIX_MASTER_ICE is offline  
post #53 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 01:04 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
jjackkrash's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 5,276
Mentioned: 40 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2223 Post(s)
Liked: 2331
Quote:
Originally Posted by bear123 View Post
P.S. Also, short of a disability, if any grown man here cannot lift something that weighs 100 lbs, I would suggest looking up a basic strength training program like starting strength or stronglifts 5x5. Acquiring a moderate base level of strength is very helpful in every day life and can help you live a longer, more independent life!
Dude, Jim Wendler's 5-3-1.
jjackkrash is offline  
post #54 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 01:24 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 80
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 93 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by MIX_MASTER_ICE View Post
If I had a 1K budget and decided to go with just one sub, I would opt for the $1032 (current sale price) VTF-15H mk2 over the $895 VTF-3 MK5 HP. More output down low, which is a key reason these subs cost what they do, plus more port area for less chance of port noise. VTF-3 has been known to have some port noise issues.
Why did my budget start at 500 and now balloon to greater than $1000? :-)

Is there a rule of thumb as to what percentage of your speaker system cost should go towards subwoofers?
Brad Sobolewski is offline  
post #55 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 01:31 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
MIX_MASTER_ICE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 5,065
Mentioned: 45 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2669 Post(s)
Liked: 2477
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad Sobolewski View Post
Why did my budget start at 500 and now balloon to greater than $1000? :-)

Is there a rule of thumb as to what percentage of your speaker system cost should go towards subwoofers?
Welcome to the rabbit hole, Alice.
MIX_MASTER_ICE is offline  
post #56 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 01:38 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 80
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 93 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by MIX_MASTER_ICE View Post
Welcome to the rabbit hole, Alice.
AVS Forum = Cheshire Cat?
d-rail34 and drh3b like this.
Brad Sobolewski is offline  
post #57 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 01:52 PM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 11
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad Sobolewski View Post
Narrowed things down - thanks to help on the forum (you all rock) and discussions with folks at SVS. It helps that I live in Ohio and want to support them. I have read (too much honestly) about Hsu, PSA, Outlaw etc,. I honestly can't tell much of a difference and I know that any way I go I will get great equipment. I want to get something that will sound good, and I don't have to worry about upgrading. Warranty and customer service are very important to me.

Main question is Dual PB-1000 versus single PB-2000

Budget <$1000 US

Set-up
  • 7.1 or 2.4 Dolby Atmos
  • Center MartinLogan Motion 30
  • FR/FL Martin Logan Motion 20 towers
  • Surrounds x4 Martin Logan Motion 4i
  • Ceiling Atmos x4 RSL C34E
  • AVR Denon AVRX6400 - love the Audyssey calibration

Room is 16 x 16 w/ 9 foot ceilings - ceiling has a bump out for ductwork making the square footage roughly 2300sq ft. Room is Drywall, floor is carpeted. It is below our kitchen.

Listening/viewing habits
40% Movies/Streaming content - AppleTV
40% Games -PS4 Pro and Switch
20% DirecTV/live sports

I have 3 young kids and don't plan on rattling the walls - I don't need loud bass, plan to play at low-moderate levels. I want "clarity" if there's such a thing rather than loud kick in the chest which will anger my wife. Size and placement in the room are not a factor.

Thank you in advance - this forum has helped me purchase most/if not all of the stuff for my new home theater so far. Lots of knowledge and expertise here!
Ive seen dealers run the JL E110 for right at a grand. That would be my recommendation. Hands down the best sub under $2000.
AVAUSTIN is offline  
post #58 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 02:03 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 80
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 93 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVAUSTIN View Post
Ive seen dealers run the JL E110 for right at a grand. That would be my recommendation. Hands down the best sub under $2000.
If that is a 10 inch sub what makes it better than a 15 inch Hsu? Build quality?
Brad Sobolewski is offline  
post #59 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 02:45 PM
Newbie
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 11
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad Sobolewski View Post
If that is a 10 inch sub what makes it better than a 15 inch Hsu? Build quality?
Better basket, driver, amp and crossover. The accuracy and clarity are the best I've seen by any sub at that price point. Look at the reviews by any hifi audio reviewer. JL subs are always on the top of the list.
AVAUSTIN is offline  
post #60 of 115 Old 03-04-2018, 02:51 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
jjackkrash's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 5,276
Mentioned: 40 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2223 Post(s)
Liked: 2331
JL Audio builds excellent compact sealed subs (with excellent component parts). But JL also charges a huge premium for the small form factor and for squeezing every ounce out of a smaller box. I run mostly JL Audio in my cars and boats because space, weight and power consumption are at a premium. In a home-theater setting I personally don't see the need to pay the JL premium unless you are also space limited or just want to pay for the JL aesthetic.

Here are the links for a comparison between the JL and the HSU 15" VTF-15H on data bass:

https://data-bass.com/data?page=system&id=103&mset=115

https://www.data-bass.com/data?page=system&id=100

Last edited by jjackkrash; 03-04-2018 at 02:59 PM.
jjackkrash is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Subwoofers, Bass, and Transducers

Tags
dual subwoofers , single subwoofer , Svs

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off