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post #13321 of 14537 Old 04-29-2020, 07:45 PM
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Originally Posted by zeus33 View Post
The main part of that intro that people like are the last 2 tones (15hz and 10hz). Your PB-12s won't play those notes with any kind of authority. All it's going to do is overwork your limiters.

And as Pio mentioned, the intro is VERY hot and you said you like to listen loud. That's a recipe for disaster. At a minimum, start about 15 dB less MV than usual and creep up on it.
Oddly the person who recommended this movie has Deftech subs, as in the ones built into his front channels.

I shall play that over and over again slowly increasing the sonic pain and if SVS's limiters don't light and smoke starts coming out of the subwoofers well it will make for one of those great audio tales.

Interestingly I have the Vudu version in 4k with DV/Atmos so I don't suppose anyone has reported on that?

-The single digits are where the magic lies.....they deliver a 'touch of god' sensation that sometimes makes the hairs on one's arms stand up. It's hard to describe but it feels like you are there in the recording studio with the artist and "feeling" them move as they are playing the instrument. You can't see them, but you can feel them as movements are happening on the floor below you. - trhought
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post #13322 of 14537 Old 04-29-2020, 07:46 PM
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So is Imax Enhanced a dirty word in these parts?

-The single digits are where the magic lies.....they deliver a 'touch of god' sensation that sometimes makes the hairs on one's arms stand up. It's hard to describe but it feels like you are there in the recording studio with the artist and "feeling" them move as they are playing the instrument. You can't see them, but you can feel them as movements are happening on the floor below you. - trhought
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post #13323 of 14537 Old 04-29-2020, 07:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by meles View Post
So is Imax Enhanced a dirty word in these parts?
Only for those using an ATMOUSE soundbar instead of an AVR (since it can't do DTS:X)
....and you're most likely the only one in this thread doing that.

I prefer all titles BEQ-Enhanced over this list:

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post #13324 of 14537 Old 04-29-2020, 08:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meles
Interestingly I have the Vudu version in 4k with DV/Atmos so I don't suppose anyone has reported on that?
You probably will do it anyways, but I'd strongly advise against trying BEQ with a different audio source than the one originally provided here. Especially with EoT. I'd wait until Aaron or someone does one for the ATMOS version.

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post #13325 of 14537 Old 04-29-2020, 08:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by meles View Post
Oddly the person who recommended this movie has Deftech subs, as in the ones built into his front channels.

I shall play that over and over again slowly increasing the sonic pain and if SVS's limiters don't light and smoke starts coming out of the subwoofers well it will make for one of those great audio tales.

Interestingly I have the Vudu version in 4k with DV/Atmos so I don't suppose anyone has reported on that?
We don't really care about 4K or Dolby Vision video specs, or even ATMOS when it comes to audio.

When Aron extracts the audio from the source he only uses the core 5.1/7.1 audio track
Then all channels are downmixed to mono in the BEQ-Designer app before establishing the BEQ filters.
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post #13326 of 14537 Old 04-29-2020, 08:15 PM
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Originally Posted by PioManiac View Post
Only for those using an ATMOUSE soundbar instead of an AVR (since it can't do DTS:X)
....and you're most likely the only one in this thread doing that.
haha now hold on here. I heard that Imax Enhanced is no good because it bypasses your receivers bass management. I'm just parroting AVrant really:

-The single digits are where the magic lies.....they deliver a 'touch of god' sensation that sometimes makes the hairs on one's arms stand up. It's hard to describe but it feels like you are there in the recording studio with the artist and "feeling" them move as they are playing the instrument. You can't see them, but you can feel them as movements are happening on the floor below you. - trhought
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post #13327 of 14537 Old 04-29-2020, 08:24 PM
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Originally Posted by PioManiac View Post
We don't really care about 4K or Dolby Vision video specs, or even ATMOS when it comes to audio.

When Aron extracts the audio from the source he only uses the core 5.1/7.1 audio track
Then all channels are downmixed to mono in the BEQ-Designer app before establishing the BEQ filters.
Yes and really is the LFE track ever that different between Atmos and DTS HD MA? I'm far from experienced, but I've noticed that to hold in the few I've looked at.

Well I think an ear cleaning may be in order if you don't think Atmos affects bass perception. Yes I see and agree that Atmos has 0.0 impact on doing the BEQ filters with the fine methodology established. I must say everything I've tried does seem to be expertly tuned.

By the measurements I expect DD+ version fully capable of smoking my pitiful PB12 Nasties hehe, and if I blow up my subwoofers maybe you guys will be rid of me for a while.

-The single digits are where the magic lies.....they deliver a 'touch of god' sensation that sometimes makes the hairs on one's arms stand up. It's hard to describe but it feels like you are there in the recording studio with the artist and "feeling" them move as they are playing the instrument. You can't see them, but you can feel them as movements are happening on the floor below you. - trhought
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post #13328 of 14537 Old 04-29-2020, 08:50 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meles View Post
Yes and really is the LFE track ever that different between Atmos and DTS HD MA?
Did you read the FAQ on page 1? (specifically item 4)

Oblivion 4K ATMOS/TrueHD BEQ: ( +18.5 at 22Hz )



Oblivion Bluray DTS-HD MA track is substantially hotter and the BEQ only needed +4.5 at 20Hz.



Difference in the Heat Maps
(right half is the native audio map before BEQ)

ATMOS


DTS-HD MA


If you applied the BEQ settings to your miniDSP that were designed for the ATMOS/TrueHD track
BUT played the Bluray with DTS-HD MA instead, at reference levels you may be in for a world of Hurt. (+14dB)

Keep in mind, this is only one Example of how mis-matching audio BEQ settings/formats can be risky.
The truth is you will never know for sure unless Aron runs all options through the BEQ'D app.


Star Wars: The Rise of Skywalker BEQ filters are almost identical for 4 different formats:
(Disc based 4K/UHD ATMOS, Bluray DTS-HD MA 7.1, Streaming (Disney+) DD+ ATMOS and Streaming Amazon Prime Video DD+)

Look for yourself here: https://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-s...l#post59421590



FWIW,

I've played the Edge of Tomorrow intro (Bluray) and it was a fun ride, but when it showed up on one of the cable TV HD movie networks,
...My Twin 18" Funk Audio sealed subs (Capable down to single digit Hz with 4800 watts of power) barely moved at all.
Heavily Fil-turd by the network to avoid damage complaints no doubt. So any streamed sources might be similar.
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post #13329 of 14537 Old 04-29-2020, 09:53 PM
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Originally Posted by AmerCa View Post
You probably will do it anyways, but I'd strongly advise against trying BEQ with a different audio source than the one originally provided here. Especially with EoT. I'd wait until Aaron or someone does one for the ATMOS version.

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Well you already know me. I just did it very cautiuously watching one of the subwoofers lights and no problem, but then I watched the other subwoofer. Re limiter light was definitily engaging at full power and not just for a blip. So I dropped the left sub that was not in the corner by 3 db and increased the corner sub by 3 db. Now both equally engage the limiter lights with the BEQ. The left sub appears to have survived its abuse fairly well. At other portions of the movie the limiter light will engage some (opening beach battle scene right near the end will cause a brief flash.) I'd been looking for a way to properly load balance these subs.

I would encourage fans of this film to use the Vudu service for playback, not only does that get you 4K and HDR/Dolby Vision, but the Atmos track sounds great and seems to push out a similar subwoofer melting amount of bass. Shame this is not out on disc with TrueHD Atmos as that would really be a treat.

oops @PioManiac read your post above after reading this. Not sure if this is retest worthy since its only on Vudu this way and Itunes is HDR/dd51. Movies Anywhere is Vision/Atmos, but again only US based service. Oh and have you tried that Vertex (I know the Vertex 2 will do it) to try get Dolby Vision out of your Oppo to your projector? I don't really know those subs of yours, but must be nice. I must figure out room treatment plan before I mess with any further sub upgrades and really its much more complex than that.

-The single digits are where the magic lies.....they deliver a 'touch of god' sensation that sometimes makes the hairs on one's arms stand up. It's hard to describe but it feels like you are there in the recording studio with the artist and "feeling" them move as they are playing the instrument. You can't see them, but you can feel them as movements are happening on the floor below you. - trhought

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post #13330 of 14537 Old 04-29-2020, 10:02 PM
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^°^°^°^
Hahaha. You're crazy, but at least you're enjoying the ride. If you want more subwoofage fun, try Aquaman, in case you haven't. And the BD of The Cloverfield Paradox is with checking out for audio and video. I'm not sure if you'll enjoy the movie itself, but the audio is top notch.

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post #13331 of 14537 Old 04-29-2020, 10:13 PM
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Originally Posted by jcwhammie View Post
I also haven't seen it since having a capable system. Did you watch it on disc or streaming (likely Disney+). I believe that movie was the first to hit theaters using Atmos sound.
I watched Brave on the 4k disc. I rarely ever stream. One thing i noticed this time around that i found hilarious is how much boobage they put in this movie lol. Yup....boobage lol. You wouldn't expect it in a movie like this but they made it a point. At first i thought it was just me but it happens throughout the movie reaching its peak towards the end. Watch it again and you'll understand lol.
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post #13332 of 14537 Old 04-29-2020, 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted by AmerCa View Post
^°^°^°^
Hahaha. You're crazy, but at least you're enjoying the ride. If you want more subwoofage fun, try Aquaman, in case you haven't. And the BD of The Cloverfield Paradox is with checking out for audio and video. I'm not sure if you'll enjoy the movie itself, but the audio is top notch.

Enviado desde mi XT1032 mediante Tapatalk
I have confidence in SVS and their five year warranty. Kudos for Paradox recommendation and its on my shopping list. I love the sound and HDR of Suspiria 1973 (Atmos), but I don't see BEQ for it.

Has anyone had any real luck with some methodical BEQ tuning on the fly? Would such a crude approach have any hope. I frankly don't understand the process for developing BEQ settings.

-The single digits are where the magic lies.....they deliver a 'touch of god' sensation that sometimes makes the hairs on one's arms stand up. It's hard to describe but it feels like you are there in the recording studio with the artist and "feeling" them move as they are playing the instrument. You can't see them, but you can feel them as movements are happening on the floor below you. - trhought
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post #13333 of 14537 Old 04-29-2020, 11:49 PM
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Has anyone given Dreamworks' Turbo (BD) a spin? They gave it a 5 (which is the max) on both Audio and Video.

It's $5 on amazon with shipping right now so im curious.
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post #13334 of 14537 Old 04-29-2020, 11:53 PM
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Has anyone given Dreamworks' Turbo (BD) a spin? They gave it a 5 (which is the max) on both Audio and Video.

It's $5 on amazon with shipping right now so im curious.
I have. I liked the movie, and from what I can remember, the audio was solid, although I didn't find it particularly remarkable, but that's us being picky. For 5 bucks is a good deal. I watched it a few times. Just my two cents.

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post #13335 of 14537 Old 04-29-2020, 11:58 PM
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Originally Posted by meles View Post
haha now hold on here. I heard that Imax Enhanced is no good because it bypasses your receivers bass management. I'm just parroting AVrant really:
That's why you do your bass management with a miniDSP and not in the AVR.
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Originally Posted by DesertDog View Post
That's why you do your bass management with a miniDSP and not in the AVR.


It will be interesting to see if this best practice changes as Dirac Live Bass Management matures. For now, I will kick back and enjoy my optimized bass and BEQ filters.

Mark


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post #13338 of 14537 Old 04-30-2020, 08:25 AM
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Originally Posted by mitchlampert View Post
Probably not given the inputs and outputs. You want minidsp HD. Minidsp HD can be upgraded to Dirac 2.0:
https://www.minidsp.com/products/dir...4hd-to-ddrc-24

I don't know if Dirac on HD unit would cause an issue for BEQ and its tools. If you need more channels often the recommendation is two minidsp HD. I'm no expert on whether the 4x10 and 10x10 HD is an option, but generally for many applications two minidsp HD favored over those and cheaper.
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-The single digits are where the magic lies.....they deliver a 'touch of god' sensation that sometimes makes the hairs on one's arms stand up. It's hard to describe but it feels like you are there in the recording studio with the artist and "feeling" them move as they are playing the instrument. You can't see them, but you can feel them as movements are happening on the floor below you. - trhought
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post #13339 of 14537 Old 04-30-2020, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by meles View Post
Probably not given the inputs and outputs. You want minidsp HD. Minidsp HD can be upgraded to Dirac 2.0:
https://www.minidsp.com/products/dir...4hd-to-ddrc-24

I don't know if Dirac on HD unit would cause an issue for BEQ and its tools. If you need more channels often the recommendation is two minidsp HD. I'm no expert on whether the 4x10 and 10x10 HD is an option, but generally for many applications two minidsp HD favored over those and cheaper.
It looks like it has balanced in and balanced out. My system is balanced so it should just plug right into the sub path. The miniDSP HD that I already own emits RF noise that causes my RF remote not to work unless I unplug the miniDSP. I'm hoping this higher end product will eliminate that.
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post #13340 of 14537 Old 04-30-2020, 08:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by mitchlampert View Post
I just flipped through the manual -> https://www.minidsp.com/images/docum...r%20Manual.pdf

I scrolled down to the Plugin User Interface, page 56-80, and looks identical to the miniDSP 2x4HD's HD1 software
...So I'm guessing Yes, it should work for BEQ and importing XLM files from the repo.






Maybe @3ll3d00d can confirm,

If you want to use the BEQ-Designer app for merging XLM files with your own EQ/House Curve,
You would likely select the 2x4HD option since the software appears to work the same.
...or perhaps the SHD Studio could be added to the device list? (along with the 2x4, 2x4HD and 10x10HD)

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post #13341 of 14537 Old 04-30-2020, 09:17 AM
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Originally Posted by mitchlampert View Post
It looks like it has balanced in and balanced out. My system is balanced so it should just plug right into the sub path. The miniDSP HD that I already own emits RF noise that causes my RF remote not to work unless I unplug the miniDSP. I'm hoping this higher end product will eliminate that.
Perhaps time for Harmony Hub or the like? I'm in the middle of setting up the tool, but you are going to want the convenience features:
"Then load the entire 800+ movie list (in XML file format) from the GitHub repository (aka Repo) to your computer, for a single click to load any title.
GitHub link complete with ReadMe instructions: https://github.com/bmiller/miniDSPBEQ (thanks to DesertDog )

The Next Level is to create your own House Curve and/or individual Sub EQ (using the miniDSP output channels)
and merge your Config.xml file with the Repo list using the BEQ'Designer App for a more refined personal experience to match your systems capabilities.
Most users have found this to be the Ultimate setup for integrating multiple subs and tactile devices to work in harmony with BEQ."

So you are shooting yourself in the foot not doing the Next Level setup. Surely with minidsp HD in hand you can reposition it or shield it to stop the interference? Your balanced stuff should have single ended connections. I love balanced, but perhaps you should use the minidsp HD you have at first before and learn everything before trying to go off the beaten path. If your cable runs are short the benefit of balanced for subwoofer is smaller or even inaudible.

I'll also say you probably will want multiple subs and that unit only stereo. The other terrible thing in my mind with the proposed unit:
Inputs: Stereo digital channels (USB Audio/AES-EBU/SPDIF/Optical)

Good luck getting 24 bit bass out of any of those inputs. HDMI is pretty sticky and not even my Oppo will get the full bass signal via digital output. You may end up with dd5.1 bass for everything. I've even asked HD Fury about this (so I don't need an oppo to output analog bass) and they can't get you the full bass signal and say its impossible.

-The single digits are where the magic lies.....they deliver a 'touch of god' sensation that sometimes makes the hairs on one's arms stand up. It's hard to describe but it feels like you are there in the recording studio with the artist and "feeling" them move as they are playing the instrument. You can't see them, but you can feel them as movements are happening on the floor below you. - trhought
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post #13342 of 14537 Old 04-30-2020, 09:33 AM
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@aron7awol - any chance of some BEQ love for "The A-Team"?
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post #13343 of 14537 Old 04-30-2020, 09:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meles View Post
Perhaps time for Harmony Hub or the like? I'm in the middle of setting up the tool, but you are going to want the convenience features:
"Then load the entire 800+ movie list (in XML file format) from the GitHub repository (aka Repo) to your computer, for a single click to load any title.
GitHub link complete with ReadMe instructions: https://github.com/bmiller/miniDSPBEQ (thanks to DesertDog )

The Next Level is to create your own House Curve and/or individual Sub EQ (using the miniDSP output channels)
and merge your Config.xml file with the Repo list using the BEQ'Designer App for a more refined personal experience to match your systems capabilities.
Most users have found this to be the Ultimate setup for integrating multiple subs and tactile devices to work in harmony with BEQ."

So you are shooting yourself in the foot not doing the Next Level setup. Surely with minidsp HD in hand you can reposition it or shield it to stop the interference? Your balanced stuff should have single ended connections. I love balanced, but perhaps you should use the minidsp HD you have at first before and learn everything before trying to go off the beaten path. If your cable runs are short the benefit of balanced for subwoofer is smaller or even inaudible.

I'll also say you probably will want multiple subs and that unit only stereo. The other terrible thing in my mind with the proposed unit:
Inputs: Stereo digital channels (USB Audio/AES-EBU/SPDIF/Optical)

Good luck getting 24 bit bass out of any of those inputs. HDMI is pretty sticky and not even my Oppo will get the full bass signal via digital output. You may end up with dd5.1 bass for everything. I've even asked HD Fury about this (so I don't need an oppo to output analog bass) and they can't get you the full bass signal and say its impossible.

So I'm going to try to be nice here. I have been using the miniDSP 2x4HD for quite some time and already use BEQ Designer to merge my house curve.

I'm not really familiar with Harmony Hub but surely my Universal Devices MSC-400 base unit and MX-990 remote are well up to the task. With my remote setup, I can control my theater system completely plus control lighting and HVAC along with many house related functions, all from the comfort of my chair.

As far as multiple subs, I do have two Rhythmik FV25HP but I run them in mono since they are equidistant from my listening position so I only need a single channel to run them.

As far as your input comment, since I'm not an audio engineer, I'll just leave the description of the input here for you to read:
Digital Audio Inputs

Quote:
Digital Audio Inputs

Digital audio source selectable from IR remote or Front panel, up to 216 kHz sample rate:

AES/EBU on Neutrik 3pin female XLR / Isolated with digital audio transformer
Sorry to rant but I asked a simple question which was answered very succinctly by PioManiac. I didn't ask for a complete inaccurate analysis of my system.
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post #13344 of 14537 Old 04-30-2020, 10:02 AM
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Originally Posted by steelman1991 View Post
@aron7awol - any chance of some BEQ love for "The A-Team"?
Ooooo, now I get to say it...

Please see @MOberhardt 's Github Repository:

https://github.com/Mobe1969/miniDSPBEQ
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post #13345 of 14537 Old 04-30-2020, 10:10 AM
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Originally Posted by SuperFist View Post
Ooooo, now I get to say it...

Please see @MOberhardt 's Github Repository:

https://github.com/Mobe1969/miniDSPBEQ

and I get to say - thanks
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post #13346 of 14537 Old 04-30-2020, 10:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PioManiac View Post
If you want to use the BEQ-Designer app for merging XLM files with your own EQ/House Curve,
You would likely select the 2x4HD option since the software appears to work the same.
...or perhaps the SHD Studio could be added to the device list? (along with the 2x4, 2x4HD and 10x10HD)
if someone posts an example of the config file for that minidsp then we can compare and see if it's the same, my guess is the peq format might be the same but the overall file structure will have differences
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post #13347 of 14537 Old 04-30-2020, 10:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PioManiac View Post
I just flipped through the manual -> https://www.minidsp.com/images/docum...r%20Manual.pdf

I scrolled down to the Plugin User Interface, page 56-80, and looks identical to the miniDSP 2x4HD's HD1 software
...So I'm guessing Yes, it should work for BEQ and importing XLM files from the repo.

Maybe @3ll3d00d can confirm,

If you want to use the BEQ-Designer app for merging XLM files with your own EQ/House Curve,
You would likely select the 2x4HD option since the software appears to work the same.
...or perhaps the SHD Studio could be added to the device list? (along with the 2x4, 2x4HD and 10x10HD)
@mitchlampert
A quick glance at the specs it looks like we could add support for it. It might work out of the box with the 2x4HD setting in BEQd but we'd need to verify the save file format to make sure it's the same.

We might need to switch up how BEQ is used though in it. I'm not sure if Dirac is going to be a problem since we're doing the BEQ on the input side and it's being applied after it. For those units we'd maybe had to put the BEQ on the outputs instead. I'm not 100% sure. It'll probably depend on how much DEQ it does.

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post #13348 of 14537 Old 04-30-2020, 11:05 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mitchlampert View Post
As far as your input comment, since I'm not an audio engineer, I'll just leave the description of the input here for you to read:
Digital Audio Inputs
on closer investigation,meles may be onto a possible signal path issue.

All sub signals from your processor are analog
.. and the SHD Studio list all the inputs/outputs as Digital only. (may not accept analog?)

The miniDSP 2x4 models list a 24 bit ADC/DAC (Analog to Digital and Digital to Analog Converter)



In the 2x4 models,

The incoming analog signal is first converted to Digital to be processed in the DSP engine
(the ADSP12489 Digital Sound Processing engine appears to be the same in both models)
...That's where the BEQ magic happens.

Then the signal is converted back to analog (with the DAC) to your subs.

I can't confirm that the SHD Studio is able to accept an analog input via XLR and convert it to digital based on the supplied information.
(No ADC or DAC is listed in the spec) and even the flow chart diagrams indicate an external DAC (Digital to Analog Converter) is needed to output to speakers/subs.






You may want to contact miniDSP with your inquiry before purchasing
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post #13349 of 14537 Old 04-30-2020, 11:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mitchlampert View Post
So I'm going to try to be nice here. I have been using the miniDSP 2x4HD for quite some time and already use BEQ Designer to merge my house curve.

I'm not really familiar with Harmony Hub but surely my Universal Devices MSC-400 base unit and MX-990 remote are well up to the task. With my remote setup, I can control my theater system completely plus control lighting and HVAC along with many house related functions, all from the comfort of my chair.

As far as multiple subs, I do have two Rhythmik FV25HP but I run them in mono since they are equidistant from my listening position so I only need a single channel to run them.

As far as your input comment, since I'm not an audio engineer, I'll just leave the description of the input here for you to read:
Digital Audio Inputs



Sorry to rant but I asked a simple question which was answered very succinctly by PioManiac. I didn't ask for a complete inaccurate analysis of my system.
Sorry for taking you as a newbie to BEQ.

I see $900 being spent here when perhaps shielding might still offer a solution. I'm also surprised you are not using minidsp to tune those subwoofer individually, but again I must be misreading.

I'm not an engineer either and those digital XLR inputs have me confused.

-The single digits are where the magic lies.....they deliver a 'touch of god' sensation that sometimes makes the hairs on one's arms stand up. It's hard to describe but it feels like you are there in the recording studio with the artist and "feeling" them move as they are playing the instrument. You can't see them, but you can feel them as movements are happening on the floor below you. - trhought
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post #13350 of 14537 Old 04-30-2020, 11:21 AM
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So does Monolith meet BEQ bang for the buck bass standards?

The single 15 ported unit is on sale by monoprice on ebay right now and I'm thinking about going crazy and buying one. Right now I have PB12-NSD in corner and this would replace my other PB12-NSD which is midwall. My thinking is the PB12 in the corner has a 6 db advantage so that gets it up within maybe 3 db of the much larger Monolith. The Monolith midwall about on a 25 foot wall would still get room support for the lowest bass. I believe with minidsp HD one could aggressively shape the Monolith to do all of that subsonic bass on its own. (My PB12 is 3db down at 21 hz ). If I wanted to beyond this I'm thinking buttkicker, boss, etc to vibrate the seat might all I can muster down the road. Or since I have just enough output with current subs try to do buttkickers with bass 3db down at 21 hz? NEED SOME BEQ subsonic advice as my finger is itchy to buy.

-The single digits are where the magic lies.....they deliver a 'touch of god' sensation that sometimes makes the hairs on one's arms stand up. It's hard to describe but it feels like you are there in the recording studio with the artist and "feeling" them move as they are playing the instrument. You can't see them, but you can feel them as movements are happening on the floor below you. - trhought
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