Velodyne DLS-4000R vs. BIC America F-12 - straight trade - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 10 Old 02-17-2019, 12:42 AM - Thread Starter
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Velodyne DLS-4000R vs. BIC America F-12 - straight trade

Hey you awesome geniuses...

Just upgraded some speakers. I've got a nice to me 5.1 with Energy speakers - Connoisseur series towers for R/L and there larger center. I'm currently running a Bic America F-12. Works pretty well I think but I have the option of doing a straight across swap with a Velodyne DLS-4000R. I get to keep 1 of the 2 subs.

They both seem like pretty decent subs. I know Velo has a long pedigree. Room is mid sized. ~14'x18'. 9 ft ceilings.

For movies. Does anyone have any thoughts here?

BIC F12

Price (MSRP): $449/Each
Design: Front-firing 12" 475-watt peak powered subwoofer
Frequency Response: 25Hz - 200Hz
Sensitivity: 90dB
Drivers: 12" Injection molded woofer with heavy duty surround
Magnetic Shielding: YES
Gold-Plated Terminals:YES
Recommended Power: Built-in Amplifier Power: 475 watts Dynamic Peak, 150 watts RMS continuous
Impedance: 8 ohms


Velodyne DLS-4000R

Price: $560
Configuration Extended Excursion Slot-Loaded Bass-Reflex
Driver 12" forward firing (9-7/8" piston diameter) with vented pole piece
Frequency Response 25-120 Hz +/-3 dB
Phase 0, 90, 180, 270 degrees
Presets Movies; R&B-Rock; Jazz-Classical; Games
Magnet 2.5 lbs
Voice Coil 2" 4-layer copper
Power Requirements: 117V, 60 Hz
Continuous Power: 200 watts
Dynamic Power: 400 watts
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post #2 of 10 Old 02-17-2019, 01:31 AM
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The Velodyne DLS-4000R is an ancient model by electronics standards. My $0.02 is that performance seems to be pretty comparable but with a much older amp possibly nearing the end of its life.
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post #3 of 10 Old 02-17-2019, 05:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saitac View Post
Hey you awesome geniuses...

Just upgraded some speakers. I've got a nice to me 5.1 with Energy speakers - Connoisseur series towers for R/L and there larger center. I'm currently running a Bic America F-12. Works pretty well I think but I have the option of doing a straight across swap with a Velodyne DLS-4000R. I get to keep 1 of the 2 subs.

They both seem like pretty decent subs. I know Velo has a long pedigree. Room is mid sized. ~14'x18'. 9 ft ceilings.

For movies. Does anyone have any thoughts here?

BIC F12

Price (MSRP): $449/Each
Design: Front-firing 12" 475-watt peak powered subwoofer
Frequency Response: 25Hz - 200Hz
Sensitivity: 90dB
Drivers: 12" Injection molded woofer with heavy duty surround
Magnetic Shielding: YES
Gold-Plated Terminals:YES
Recommended Power: Built-in Amplifier Power: 475 watts Dynamic Peak, 150 watts RMS continuous
Impedance: 8 ohms


Velodyne DLS-4000R

Price: $560
Configuration Extended Excursion Slot-Loaded Bass-Reflex
Driver 12" forward firing (9-7/8" piston diameter) with vented pole piece
Frequency Response 25-120 Hz +/-3 dB
Phase 0, 90, 180, 270 degrees
Presets Movies; R&B-Rock; Jazz-Classical; Games
Magnet 2.5 lbs
Voice Coil 2" 4-layer copper
Power Requirements: 117V, 60 Hz
Continuous Power: 200 watts
Dynamic Power: 400 watts
I would keep what you have and just save up for a better performing sub if you're wanting a change.
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post #4 of 10 Old 02-19-2019, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by B3ntwooki3 View Post
The Velodyne DLS-4000R is an ancient model by electronics standards. My $0.02 is that performance seems to be pretty comparable but with a much older amp possibly nearing the end of its life.
I have an Onkyo 809 with Klipsch LCRs and Surrounds, and I've been reading through the Speaker and Receiver forums trying to decide what to do in order to upgrade to Atmos. I've moved speaker positions, re-run Audyssey calibration using new techniques, and have improved the sound overall without having spent any money (except for banana plugs, mounts, etc). I've been trying to save my budget for a new Atmos Onkyo, because I'm generally pleased with the speakers I have. Some have recommended a higher model center for my setup, but no one has said anything to make me worry about upgrading anything besides my AVR at this point.

Until now! I have a Velo DLS-4000R sub that I received in 2011. It may be old technology, but I really enjoy it. Now that I have it calibrated better, it really does add life to both music and movies. I really was looking forward to upgrading my AVR and hearing Atmos. But NOW that you have told me that the Velo is old technology, I will need to upgrade! Since you said it on the Internet, it has to be true, right? Ugh. Now it's time to start finding new excuses to feed to my wife as to why I need to upgrade more than one big ticket item in the HT...
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post #5 of 10 Old 02-19-2019, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Photokid1970 View Post
I have an Onkyo 809 with Klipsch LCRs and Surrounds, and I've been reading through the Speaker and Receiver forums trying to decide what to do in order to upgrade to Atmos. I've moved speaker positions, re-run Audyssey calibration using new techniques, and have improved the sound overall without having spent any money (except for banana plugs, mounts, etc). I've been trying to save my budget for a new Atmos Onkyo, because I'm generally pleased with the speakers I have. Some have recommended a higher model center for my setup, but no one has said anything to make me worry about upgrading anything besides my AVR at this point.

Until now! I have a Velo DLS-4000R sub that I received in 2011. It may be old technology, but I really enjoy it. Now that I have it calibrated better, it really does add life to both music and movies. I really was looking forward to upgrading my AVR and hearing Atmos. But NOW that you have told me that the Velo is old technology, I will need to upgrade! Since you said it on the Internet, it has to be true, right? Ugh. Now it's time to start finding new excuses to feed to my wife as to why I need to upgrade more than one big ticket item in the HT...
Did you even bother reading the OP's question to establish context before injecting your sarcasm into a friendly thread?

I never implied that the Velo was a bad sub. The OP asked he he should do a straight trade with a presumably new BIC F12 for an older Velo DLS-4000R.
The statement that the Velo was "ancient" was a reference to how electronics don't improve with age like a fine wine. The Velo has no CEA-2010 specs therefore it is impossible to know exactly how it compares with the F12 but the specs infer that they are comparable with the Velo having the disadvantage of having aged electronic components.

As far as your whatever your wife has to say about anything or whatever you choose to upgrade or not upgrade is none of my business and I really don't care as I was not replying to you or your situation.

Edit:

I also never made a single reference to how the Velo was old technology even though it just might be as it is struggling to keep up with a budget under $200 subwoofer such as a BIC F12. I only mentioned that the electronics had some mileage on it.
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Last edited by B3ntwooki3; 02-19-2019 at 01:31 PM.
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post #6 of 10 Old 02-19-2019, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by B3ntwooki3 View Post
Did you even bother reading the OP's question to establish context before injecting your sarcasm into a friendly thread?
Yes I did... I did not mean to offend - my apologies. He's looking to see if he should trade or not, and I wasn't trying to encourage or discourage that at all. I am just making the point that I thought the Velo was pretty good, and now it seems that it may be old technology, and perhaps I should add something new to my shopping list! I find that to be a bit exciting, as I haven't been sub shopping in a while.

Again, I apologize if my sarcasm caused your fur to raise. Not my intent.
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post #7 of 10 Old 02-19-2019, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Photokid1970 View Post
But NOW that you have told me that the Velo is old technology, I will need to upgrade! Since you said it on the Internet, it has to be true, right? Ugh.
Perhaps my social skills our out of touch with today's internet speak but the statements like you made which is quoted above would absolutely solicit a response in my opinion. Response has been given and I am moving on.
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post #8 of 10 Old 02-19-2019, 01:43 PM
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Perhaps my social skills our out of touch with today's internet speak but the statements like you made which is quoted above would absolutely solicit a response in my opinion. Response has been given and I am moving on.
Understood. I meant no disrespect. Again my apologies if I came across as rude.

In regards to the OP, I can tell you I am very pleased with my sub. Good luck to whatever choice you make!
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post #9 of 10 Old 03-06-2019, 01:26 PM
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Very civil of you gents, good to see not everyone will drag down the thread with back-and-forth bickering.


I've had the Velodyne DLS-4000R for close to a decade now, as an audio novice it has performed well for my needs.

I do have a bass drop in my main seating area where the room opens up but that's primarily a layout issue.


I'm no expert so I'm not sure what new subs bring to the table but unless you're noticing a major audio issue it is probably best to wait it out.
No harm in asking for a trial if you can swing it.
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post #10 of 10 Old 03-08-2019, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saitac View Post
Hey you awesome geniuses...

Just upgraded some speakers. I've got a nice to me 5.1 with Energy speakers - Connoisseur series towers for R/L and there larger center. I'm currently running a Bic America F-12. Works pretty well I think but I have the option of doing a straight across swap with a Velodyne DLS-4000R. I get to keep 1 of the 2 subs.

They both seem like pretty decent subs. I know Velo has a long pedigree. Room is mid sized. ~14'x18'. 9 ft ceilings.

For movies. Does anyone have any thoughts here?

BIC F12

Price (MSRP): $449/Each
Design: Front-firing 12" 475-watt peak powered subwoofer
Frequency Response: 25Hz - 200Hz
Sensitivity: 90dB
Drivers: 12" Injection molded woofer with heavy duty surround
Magnetic Shielding: YES
Gold-Plated Terminals:YES
Recommended Power: Built-in Amplifier Power: 475 watts Dynamic Peak, 150 watts RMS continuous
Impedance: 8 ohms


Velodyne DLS-4000R

Price: $560
Configuration Extended Excursion Slot-Loaded Bass-Reflex
Driver 12" forward firing (9-7/8" piston diameter) with vented pole piece
Frequency Response 25-120 Hz +/-3 dB
Phase 0, 90, 180, 270 degrees
Presets Movies; R&B-Rock; Jazz-Classical; Games
Magnet 2.5 lbs
Voice Coil 2" 4-layer copper
Power Requirements: 117V, 60 Hz
Continuous Power: 200 watts
Dynamic Power: 400 watts

If I were you I would save up a little more money and go bigger because the F12 might have a little bit more bass but it will not be as clear as the DLS-4000R sub.
Just my 2cents

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Receiver: Emotiva Fusion 8100 / Amps: Emotiva XPA-3, UPA-700
Polk Signature Series - S60 Towers for L/R, S35 Center, S15 Surrounds
Subwoofer PSA 2xV1801
Roku 4, Nvidia Shield, Xiaomi Mi Box S, Darbee Darblet 5000
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