RBH i-12 vs SVS PB-2000: worthwhile upgrade? - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 13 Old 08-22-2019, 05:48 PM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
BlueWRXPride's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Syracuse, NY
Posts: 321
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 132 Post(s)
Liked: 49
RBH i-12 vs SVS PB-2000: worthwhile upgrade?

Like it says in the title, I have a RBH i-12, and have the opportunity to replace it with a SVS PB-2000. Based on the specs it looks like an upgrade as it has more power and lower extension. Should I expect to see a night and day difference between these two? Or would it be more of an incremental improvement?

Home Theater: Marantz SR6012, Fronts: Paradigm Titans, Sides: Paradigm Atoms, Surrounds: Paradigm ADP-170, Sub: RBH I-12
BlueWRXPride is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 13 Old 08-22-2019, 06:01 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: United States
Posts: 2,580
Mentioned: 51 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1292 Post(s)
Liked: 2089
That is what they call a "lateral upgrade",

You would get a slight improvement--maybe, if you hold your mouth right etc.

I am assuming you have ONE subwoofer? If so, if you expect/demand an improvement--I'd pick up a second RBH to match your first one.

This way you'll gain at least 3dB of output (or more) and you'll get a more even bass response around your room. The natural peaks/nulls that happen in smaller rooms will be "filled in" by the other sub if you do proper setup. The reason for this is a single sub will have peaks/nulls and so will the second sub--but they will be at different frequencies so the nulls will be "filled in" by the other sub. They do if you don't stack them on top of each other, read up on proper setup of dual subs to assist your setup. You can't EQ out a null but you can a peak so a combination of EQ'ing the peaks and "filling in" the nulls with the second sub is how it works.

Then of course, if you want more--you will get introduced to the "rabbit hole". Three subs will give even better response (Look up Earl Geddes and 3 sub setup) or 4 subs might fit your room better (corner load all of them to gain more "free" output.

Chasing better with one 12 inch sub might get you a little bit--but 2 of the same subs will give you better bass sound quality and a bit more SPL. If it was me, I'd go with a second RBH for a known improvment. Now if you can only have one sub for whatever reason--and it must be a certain size then you have to deal with that issue. At that point, if I could have only one (one sub to rule them all!) I'd go with the highest performance with a sub in the largest size I could handle. We all have to deal with reality at some point--reality sucks.

Good luck in your quest, let us know if you can do 2 subs (or more) the maximum size you can deal with and how much SPL you wish to have, what frequency range that you desire and all that jazz. Hope my babble helped more than it hurt--enjoy!

Last edited by 18Hurts; 08-22-2019 at 06:05 PM.
18Hurts is offline  
post #3 of 13 Old 08-22-2019, 06:08 PM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
BlueWRXPride's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Syracuse, NY
Posts: 321
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 132 Post(s)
Liked: 49
I do have 2 sub hookups in my room, but their tied to the same single sub output at the receiver. So if I got 2 subs, i wouldn't be able to have them tuned individually by the receiver. Even if it's a lateral upgrade, it's not going to have much of a delta cost, so maybe it's worth it. If I did want to add another sub in the future, it's probably a lot easier to find another PB-2000 than another i-12.

But then again, that i-12 is a really beautiful sub...but how often am I looking at it, it's a dedicated room so 98% of the time I'm in there with the lights off.

Home Theater: Marantz SR6012, Fronts: Paradigm Titans, Sides: Paradigm Atoms, Surrounds: Paradigm ADP-170, Sub: RBH I-12
BlueWRXPride is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 13 Old 08-23-2019, 01:00 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
jamiebosco's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,200
Mentioned: 19 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 728 Post(s)
Liked: 1763
Is it the RBH I-12 or the I-12/E ?

If it's the I-12 then (IMHO) the PB-2000 would be a fairly significant upgrade performance wise (definite downgrade in appearance though). The I-12 has a higher port tune and less powerful amp. At a guess,you would probably be looking at 3-10dB more output in the 20-30Hz range and maybe 2dB more above that by going with the PB-2000. It would be a huge(!) difference around 20Hz (and under)

If it's the more powerful and more expensive I-12/E and used in 2-port mode then it's probably a less notable upgrade except at 20Hz

PB-2000 CEA 2010 Results (2 meter RMS)
•20Hz 103.8 dB
•25Hz 107.6 dB
•31.5Hz 109.6 dB
•40Hz 110.1 dB
•50Hz 110.5 dB
•63Hz 111.5 dB


RBH I-12/E 2 Ports mode (2 meter RMS)

20 Hz ---100.3 dB
25 Hz ---107.0 dB
31.5 Hz -107.1 dB
40 Hz----109.3 dB
50 Hz ---109.9 dB
63 Hz ---109.5 dB

. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
TV: Panasonic P65ST60 AVR: Denon 4311ci Speakers: PSA MTM-210C (Centre), PSA MTM-210 (Left & Right), PSA MT-110 (Surrounds) Subwoofers: Dual Seaton SubMersives

Last edited by jamiebosco; 08-23-2019 at 03:46 AM.
jamiebosco is online now  
post #5 of 13 Old 08-23-2019, 05:21 AM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
BlueWRXPride's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Syracuse, NY
Posts: 321
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 132 Post(s)
Liked: 49
It is the I-12, not the E version. I was able to do a side by side test of the subs in my theater, and honestly I wasn't able to see a dramatic difference between the two. I agree that on paper it should be more noticeable, but it wasn't for me. Maybe I don't have it placed well to fully utilize, or maybe I would need to do some tuning to have it shine better. But I'm leaning towards sticking with the RBH.

Home Theater: Marantz SR6012, Fronts: Paradigm Titans, Sides: Paradigm Atoms, Surrounds: Paradigm ADP-170, Sub: RBH I-12
BlueWRXPride is offline  
post #6 of 13 Old 08-23-2019, 06:50 AM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: NB, Canada
Posts: 948
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 507 Post(s)
Liked: 272
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueWRXPride View Post
It is the I-12, not the E version. I was able to do a side by side test of the subs in my theater, and honestly I wasn't able to see a dramatic difference between the two. I agree that on paper it should be more noticeable, but it wasn't for me. Maybe I don't have it placed well to fully utilize, or maybe I would need to do some tuning to have it shine better. But I'm leaning towards sticking with the RBH.
for the similar price of the PB2000 i would step up to a 15" like the HSU VTF-3 MK5. This would be a significant upgrade

or better yet wait for some used I-12's to show up and go Quad I-12's

FYI you should look at MiniDSP(to setup your duals+)

Speakers: KEF Q100 / Q300 / Q750 / Q650C, Fluance Signature Series Bookshelf / SX6 / XL5F, Mirage M-190 Subwoofers: Outlaw Ultra X12 (x2), BIC H100-II Receiver: Denon AVR-X4500H, Denon AVR-X1400H Integrated Amplifier: Yamaha A-S501, Fosi Audio TPA3116 mini amp Extras: MiniDSP Umik-1 Headphones: Philips SPH9500s, Audio Tech. ATH-M40x, Takstar Pro 82.
macgallant is offline  
post #7 of 13 Old 08-23-2019, 06:52 AM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
BlueWRXPride's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Syracuse, NY
Posts: 321
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 132 Post(s)
Liked: 49
Does it change your opinion if i can get the PB2000 for $400?

Home Theater: Marantz SR6012, Fronts: Paradigm Titans, Sides: Paradigm Atoms, Surrounds: Paradigm ADP-170, Sub: RBH I-12
BlueWRXPride is offline  
post #8 of 13 Old 08-23-2019, 06:57 AM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: NB, Canada
Posts: 948
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 507 Post(s)
Liked: 272
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueWRXPride View Post
Does it change your opinion if i can get the PB2000 for $400?
That's a killer Deal but since they have different port tunes it would be hard to integrate with your I-12's


would you be willing to sell your I-12's to grab a second PB-2000?


also what is the size of your room(including any open adjacent area's)


you wouldn't notice much compared to your I-12's if your not pushing your volume, but what you will notice is the deeper LFE in movies that have some

Speakers: KEF Q100 / Q300 / Q750 / Q650C, Fluance Signature Series Bookshelf / SX6 / XL5F, Mirage M-190 Subwoofers: Outlaw Ultra X12 (x2), BIC H100-II Receiver: Denon AVR-X4500H, Denon AVR-X1400H Integrated Amplifier: Yamaha A-S501, Fosi Audio TPA3116 mini amp Extras: MiniDSP Umik-1 Headphones: Philips SPH9500s, Audio Tech. ATH-M40x, Takstar Pro 82.
macgallant is offline  
post #9 of 13 Old 08-23-2019, 06:59 AM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
BlueWRXPride's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Syracuse, NY
Posts: 321
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 132 Post(s)
Liked: 49
Yeah i wouldn't try to use them both, i'd sell the I-12.

I wish the SVS was as beautiful as the RBH is!

Home Theater: Marantz SR6012, Fronts: Paradigm Titans, Sides: Paradigm Atoms, Surrounds: Paradigm ADP-170, Sub: RBH I-12
BlueWRXPride is offline  
post #10 of 13 Old 08-23-2019, 07:00 AM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: NB, Canada
Posts: 948
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 507 Post(s)
Liked: 272
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueWRXPride View Post
Yeah i wouldn't try to use them both, i'd sell the I-12.

I wish the SVS was as beautiful as the RBH is!
go take a peak at funk audio

Speakers: KEF Q100 / Q300 / Q750 / Q650C, Fluance Signature Series Bookshelf / SX6 / XL5F, Mirage M-190 Subwoofers: Outlaw Ultra X12 (x2), BIC H100-II Receiver: Denon AVR-X4500H, Denon AVR-X1400H Integrated Amplifier: Yamaha A-S501, Fosi Audio TPA3116 mini amp Extras: MiniDSP Umik-1 Headphones: Philips SPH9500s, Audio Tech. ATH-M40x, Takstar Pro 82.
macgallant is offline  
post #11 of 13 Old 08-23-2019, 07:05 AM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: NB, Canada
Posts: 948
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 507 Post(s)
Liked: 272
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueWRXPride View Post
Yeah i wouldn't try to use them both, i'd sell the I-12.

I wish the SVS was as beautiful as the RBH is!
do you have the place to eventually have 4 PB2000's ?

Speakers: KEF Q100 / Q300 / Q750 / Q650C, Fluance Signature Series Bookshelf / SX6 / XL5F, Mirage M-190 Subwoofers: Outlaw Ultra X12 (x2), BIC H100-II Receiver: Denon AVR-X4500H, Denon AVR-X1400H Integrated Amplifier: Yamaha A-S501, Fosi Audio TPA3116 mini amp Extras: MiniDSP Umik-1 Headphones: Philips SPH9500s, Audio Tech. ATH-M40x, Takstar Pro 82.
macgallant is offline  
post #12 of 13 Old 08-23-2019, 07:32 AM - Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
BlueWRXPride's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Syracuse, NY
Posts: 321
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 132 Post(s)
Liked: 49
Quote:
Originally Posted by macgallant View Post
do you have the place to eventually have 4 PB2000's ?
Haha no i think at most i'd do 2 subs, whatever they are.

And yeah those funk audio speakers sure are beautiful, if you can afford it!

Home Theater: Marantz SR6012, Fronts: Paradigm Titans, Sides: Paradigm Atoms, Surrounds: Paradigm ADP-170, Sub: RBH I-12
BlueWRXPride is offline  
post #13 of 13 Old 08-23-2019, 07:38 AM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: NB, Canada
Posts: 948
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 507 Post(s)
Liked: 272
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueWRXPride View Post
Haha no i think at most i'd do 2 subs, whatever they are.

And yeah those funk audio speakers sure are beautiful, if you can afford it!
pb2000's improvement will be noticeable from 16-25hz. If it was me i would hold out for 15's or even 18's since you'll never go with 4x setup.

Speakers: KEF Q100 / Q300 / Q750 / Q650C, Fluance Signature Series Bookshelf / SX6 / XL5F, Mirage M-190 Subwoofers: Outlaw Ultra X12 (x2), BIC H100-II Receiver: Denon AVR-X4500H, Denon AVR-X1400H Integrated Amplifier: Yamaha A-S501, Fosi Audio TPA3116 mini amp Extras: MiniDSP Umik-1 Headphones: Philips SPH9500s, Audio Tech. ATH-M40x, Takstar Pro 82.
macgallant is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Subwoofers, Bass, and Transducers

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off