SB-16 Ultra or SB-4000 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 13 Old 10-21-2019, 09:28 AM - Thread Starter
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SB-16 Ultra or SB-4000

So this weekend I demo'd the PB-4000 and was quite surprised to my findings:
1. Holy crap it's way bigger in my living room. Now that being said, it could work (if I loved it).
2. I watched a ton of different material in all three SVS modes (sealed, standard, and extended). And in the end the little woman and I always thought the sub sounded best in sealed mode.

The SB-4000 and the SB-16 ultra are just about the same size, however the SB 16 ultra does run a party penny more. Has anyone had or demo's these two? What are your thoughts? My local shop doesn't have either in stock to demo, they only carry the PB line.

Should I consider dual SB-3000?

Thanks for your help

Last edited by Cbi1000; 10-21-2019 at 09:37 AM.
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post #2 of 13 Old 10-21-2019, 04:07 PM
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I currently have both subs but the 4000 sold and ships tomorrow. I am now running a JTR S1 with the SB16. The SB16 is actually quite a bit larger than the 4000 in cabinet size. They are excellent subs, and the App control is very nice and saves a lot of up and down to adjust the sub settings.

The SB16 unsurprisingly has much higher output and will go a bit lower. But, the 4000 is a fine sub in its own right, best for up to medium sized rooms in my opinion.

Where are you located?
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post #3 of 13 Old 10-21-2019, 05:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brmott View Post
I currently have both subs but the 4000 sold and ships tomorrow. I am now running a JTR S1 with the SB16. The SB16 is actually quite a bit larger than the 4000 in cabinet size. They are excellent subs, and the App control is very nice and saves a lot of up and down to adjust the sub settings.

The SB16 unsurprisingly has much higher output and will go a bit lower. But, the 4000 is a fine sub in its own right, best for up to medium sized rooms in my opinion.

Where are you located?
I'm up in the Portland Or. area.

SVS has the two sub sizes listed as:
The SB 4000 is 18.3 x 17.8 x 20.9
The SB 16 U is 20 x 19.5 x 20.1

So not crazy big, nothing like the PB4000.

Did you find one better than the other, if so, in what areas?

thanks.

Last edited by Cbi1000; 10-22-2019 at 01:59 PM.
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post #4 of 13 Old 10-21-2019, 06:01 PM
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Back when i had my pair of S-1's i remember having conversations with other members,,,,, the SB16 had approx 2.5 DB's more output than the SB13-U that i had (which is pretty much the new SB4000's output equal.) i was considering the SB16 until i saw the how much more output the S-1's put out. Also the SB16 does dig a bit deeper noticeably than the 4000.

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post #5 of 13 Old 10-22-2019, 01:04 PM
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The SB16-Ultra has about 50-60% higher dynamic output than the SB-4000 over most of the common bass bandwidth. They both have very similar frequency response curves and both use the app. So really the major difference is dynamic output.

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post #6 of 13 Old 10-22-2019, 01:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cbi1000 View Post
So this weekend I demo'd the PB-4000 and was quite surprised to my findings:
1. Holy crap it's way bigger in my living room. Now that being said, it could work (if I loved it).
2. I watched a ton of different material in all three SVS modes (sealed, standard, and extended). And in the end the little woman and I always thought the sub sounded best in sealed mode.

The SB-4000 and the SB-16 ultra are just about the same size, however the SB 16 ultra does run a party penny more. Has anyone had or demo's these two? What are your thoughts? My local shop doesn't have either in stock to demo, they only carry the PB line.

Should I consider dual SB-3000?

Thanks for your help
What is your room size? If you have two subwoofers could you place them on opposite sides of the room or would they both have to be up front? How loud do you listen? Do you calibrate using Audyssey or similar?

If your room is small (or even just small in certain directions) you might have a lot of room gain down low causing the ported mode to sound boomy down low, versus the sealed might knock down that peak because it naturally rolls off sooner. That might be what is going on there. You could of course do some EQ and they'd probably sound similar and the ported might allow you to dig deeper louder.
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post #7 of 13 Old 10-22-2019, 02:35 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by anjunadeep View Post
What is your room size? If you have two subwoofers could you place them on opposite sides of the room or would they both have to be up front? How loud do you listen? Do you calibrate using Audyssey or similar?

If your room is small (or even just small in certain directions) you might have a lot of room gain down low causing the ported mode to sound boomy down low, versus the sealed might knock down that peak because it naturally rolls off sooner. That might be what is going on there. You could of course do some EQ and they'd probably sound similar and the ported might allow you to dig deeper louder.
My room is a bit odd shaped. Not very wide, but longer, and opens up to the dining room and kitchen on one side. I have attached the layout. The only really good spot for the sub is listed in the attachment. I could possibly place one in the back of the room to the left side.

I am not sure what you mean by room gain? Is that "levels" listed in the AV receiver, like + - db? I have looked in there and my center is +2, my ceiling speakers are also +2. Rears, fronts, and sub are all set to 0.

I have the Marantz 8012, most of the time I have the volume set at 55 and for some movies I go to 65-70. I have no clue what those numbers equate to.

When I purchased the sub I have now (GoldenEar SuperSub XXL) they came out and dialed everything in via some computer and laser measure deal. They didn't run the Audyssey. I have owned this sub for a couple months and I'm not super happy with it. It plays loud, and it does hit hard, but it's kind of harsh. I don't feel like it gets the low growl or rumble. Hard to explain. I tried the SVS PB4000 and it sounded better than my GE, but I liked much better with all the ports plugged and in sealed mode. The size of the PB4000 is also way too big in my room. This has me now thinking about the sb4000 or the sb16 ultra.

Thanks for your help.
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post #8 of 13 Old 10-22-2019, 07:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cbi1000 View Post
My room is a bit odd shaped. Not very wide, but longer, and opens up to the dining room and kitchen on one side. I have attached the layout. The only really good spot for the sub is listed in the attachment. I could possibly place one in the back of the room to the left side.

I am not sure what you mean by room gain? Is that "levels" listed in the AV receiver, like + - db? I have looked in there and my center is +2, my ceiling speakers are also +2. Rears, fronts, and sub are all set to 0.
I was more speaking size, but that gives me an idea based on your couch size drawn in. Not sure how your volume equates either, you would need to calibrate your system for me to be able to have a frame of reference. If you like it very loud, I'd get the SB16 Ultra and place it in your proposed position, centered on that wall, which tends to be a reasonable location when doing single sub. I would not do dual subwoofers in your space, because you don't have the ability to place them properly to get the most benefit out of them (generally one will end up on the opposite wall someplace). If you listen at moderate volumes, the SB4000 should be plenty. With subwoofers, it's generally good to go a little overkill for the extra couple hundred bucks. They have a tough job. Now if you listen at moderate easy listening levels, no sense in getting a bigger subwoofer than you'll ever use. Comparing the Ultra and 4000 is more about output than quality, they are otherwise very similar.

Room gain is a boost in low frequencies that naturally occurs when sound is reinforced by the boundaries of a room.
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post #9 of 13 Old 10-22-2019, 09:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by anjunadeep View Post
I was more speaking size, but that gives me an idea based on your couch size drawn in. Not sure how your volume equates either, you would need to calibrate your system for me to be able to have a frame of reference. If you like it very loud, I'd get the SB16 Ultra and place it in your proposed position, centered on that wall, which tends to be a reasonable location when doing single sub. I would not do dual subwoofers in your space, because you don't have the ability to place them properly to get the most benefit out of them (generally one will end up on the opposite wall someplace). If you listen at moderate volumes, the SB4000 should be plenty. With subwoofers, it's generally good to go a little overkill for the extra couple hundred bucks. They have a tough job. Now if you listen at moderate easy listening levels, no sense in getting a bigger subwoofer than you'll ever use. Comparing the Ultra and 4000 is more about output than quality, they are otherwise very similar.

Room gain is a boost in low frequencies that naturally occurs when sound is reinforced by the boundaries of a room.
Thanks. I am leaning towards the SB 16 ultra. I have to keep the sub to the right of the tv area due to the built ins the tv sits in.
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post #10 of 13 Old 10-23-2019, 10:18 AM
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I recently had a similar choice to make. I originally was going with the PB 4000 but felt that it was too large for the room. I demoed both the SB 4000 and 16 ultra. They are similar in size so I chose the 16 Ultra. I couldn’t be happier with my decision. The sub rocks! Good luck.

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post #11 of 13 Old 10-23-2019, 11:21 AM - Thread Starter
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I recently had a similar choice to make. I originally was going with the PB 4000 but felt that it was too large for the room. I demoed both the SB 4000 and 16 ultra. They are similar in size so I chose the 16 Ultra. I couldn’t be happier with my decision. The sub rocks! Good luck.
Does it dig super deep? What sub did you have before.
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post #12 of 13 Old 10-23-2019, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Cbi1000 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryIII View Post
I recently had a similar choice to make. I originally was going with the PB 4000 but felt that it was too large for the room. I demoed both the SB 4000 and 16 ultra. They are similar in size so I chose the 16 Ultra. I couldn’️t be happier with my decision. The sub rocks! Good luck.
Does it dig super deep? What sub did you have before.

I previously had an older SVS 20-39 CS + and 20-39 CS ultra cylinders powered by a Samson S1000. They were in a different room so it is hard to make a straight comparison. That being said, the SB 16 Ultra is one of the most violent subs I have heard. It blends so well with my mains for music and it will punch you in the face with movies. Mine is in a 3000cuft room that is then open to a very large kitchen. kitchen.

Edit: I listen to all types of music and have yet to reach anywhere near the limits of this sub even at ear splitting levels. I also auditioned the SB 4000 and it was very good. If you already budgeted for the PB 4000 then I think that the SB 16 ultra is a no brainer at the same price. For movies it is flat out visceral. I have never had a speaker scare me like this one did when I first turned it on before calibration. Yikes! Everyone that has heard it is amazed.

I will be happy to answer any questions you may have. Mine is in a 3000 cuft room that is open to a very large kitchen.

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Last edited by JerryIII; 10-23-2019 at 02:35 PM.
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post #13 of 13 Old 10-27-2019, 11:26 AM
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So I’m looking to replace my two 12 inch subs and having a hard time deciding between two PB 4000 or two sb ultra 16s. I don’t play movies at reference level so I’m wondering if the 16s can still hit 13hz with enough oomph where I wouldnt need the ported version

Pioneer SC-95, Axiom M80, VP180, Dual SVS PB-4000 subs, ISCO III, RS540 + Stewart Cima Neve 133
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