Do you need a subwoofer for listening to music? - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 7Likes
  • 2 Post By The_Nephilim1
  • 1 Post By Polyrythm1k
  • 1 Post By The_Nephilim1
  • 2 Post By charmerci
  • 1 Post By pjp
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 15 Old 12-02-2019, 06:49 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 78
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 55 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Do you need a subwoofer for listening to music?

Well respected audiophile Steve Guttenberg says no. My time is running out to make a Cyber Monday purchase on the SVS SB12-NSD. I've never owned a SW for not sure what I'm missing.

https://www.cnet.com/news/the-case-a...ers-for-music/
happycamper820 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 15 Old 12-02-2019, 06:53 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 233
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 141 Post(s)
Liked: 154
NEED? Probably not. But what kind of music do you mostly listen to? What are your mains? How big is the room? Etc. IMO, yes. Music benefits from a sub, BUT with good enough mains, this can be questionable.
Polyrythm1k is offline  
post #3 of 15 Old 12-02-2019, 06:54 PM
Advanced Member
 
The_Nephilim1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: New Jersey USA
Posts: 966
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 138 Post(s)
Liked: 35
Well unless you have a really awesome pair of Full Range speakers maybe not but I would strongly disaggre with this guy.. a Sub is definitely needed ffor music..

I would get one even if it iwas just a 2.1 system without a doubt..
ss nimrod and darthray like this.

My Humble HT: Integra 40.3 Audyssey Calibrated / Denon 1930Ci SACD/DVD-A Player / Sony 3600 3D blu Ray / Behringer iNuke 3000DSP / Mach 5 IXL 18.4 Subwoofer / Optoma HD142x 3D REady 1080P DLP Projector / 92" 16:9 Manual screen / miniDSP HD2x4
The_Nephilim1 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 15 Old 12-02-2019, 07:05 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 78
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 55 Post(s)
Liked: 11
I've got a pair of bookshelf speakers with only 5.25" midrange which I believe only go down to 55hz so it's probably even less than that that I can hear. I was actually thinking of buying a new pair of speakers with a 6.5" midrange that goes to 45hz or so and that might improve the lower end enough to be noticeable. I have spare bedroom as my listening room so only about 11x12.
happycamper820 is offline  
post #5 of 15 Old 12-02-2019, 07:07 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 233
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 141 Post(s)
Liked: 154
So what kind of music are you listening to?
Polyrythm1k is offline  
post #6 of 15 Old 12-02-2019, 07:12 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 78
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 55 Post(s)
Liked: 11
I listen to all kinds of stuff...pop, classical, big band, rock, anything except for rap. Right now I'm listening to mostly Christmas music.
happycamper820 is offline  
post #7 of 15 Old 12-02-2019, 07:15 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 233
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 141 Post(s)
Liked: 154
Yes. Just get it. If you have the dough, and you’ve never had one, might as well scratch that itch. You’ll never go back...
darthray likes this.
Polyrythm1k is offline  
post #8 of 15 Old 12-02-2019, 07:17 PM
Advanced Member
 
The_Nephilim1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: New Jersey USA
Posts: 966
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 138 Post(s)
Liked: 35
Well even though speakers can go low but in reality you shouldn't because the strain it puts on the amplifiers in the receiver it is best too have a sub do the lower Hz..

Usually you would want to set your speakers at a crossover of 80hz and set the sub crossover at 120Hz and let the sub play the lower stuff.

Worst case scenario if you dont like the sub you could get a company with a good return policy.. some of the ID sub companies like HSU or SVS proablly still have good return policies..
darthray likes this.

My Humble HT: Integra 40.3 Audyssey Calibrated / Denon 1930Ci SACD/DVD-A Player / Sony 3600 3D blu Ray / Behringer iNuke 3000DSP / Mach 5 IXL 18.4 Subwoofer / Optoma HD142x 3D REady 1080P DLP Projector / 92" 16:9 Manual screen / miniDSP HD2x4
The_Nephilim1 is offline  
post #9 of 15 Old 12-02-2019, 07:18 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 78
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 55 Post(s)
Liked: 11
The only thing that concerns me is I don't want to have to manage the SW all the time. I want the volume to be linear and once you set it I want to forget it and not always be worrying is the sub too loud or not loud enough.
happycamper820 is offline  
post #10 of 15 Old 12-02-2019, 07:21 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 78
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 55 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Nephilim1 View Post
Well even though speakers can go low but in reality you shouldn't because the strain it puts on the amplifiers in the receiver it is best too have a sub do the lower Hz..

Usually you would want to set your speakers at a crossover of 80hz and set the sub crossover at 120Hz and let the sub play the lower stuff.

Worst case scenario if you dont like the sub you could get a company with a good return policy.. some of the ID sub companies like HSU or SVS proablly still have good return policies..
I have no way to manage crossover as the amp is not an AV amp. I only have a pre-out to send signal to a sub and use the crossover on the sub so the amp will still be sending full range signal to the midranges.
happycamper820 is offline  
post #11 of 15 Old 12-02-2019, 07:31 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
charmerci's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 1,338
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 453 Post(s)
Liked: 321
Quote:
Originally Posted by happycamper820 View Post
The only thing that concerns me is I don't want to have to manage the SW all the time. I want the volume to be linear and once you set it I want to forget it and not always be worrying is the sub too loud or not loud enough.
First, if you like bass and you even occasionally like to crank it up go for it. Don't worry about it. A well tuned sub will bring out the bass like it should be done.

If it's just one tune or album, they'll be a volume switch on the sub. Just remember where it is and turn it down a bit and then turn it back to the proper setting. Most likely, you'll never do it. Or just keep it slightly lower than recommended.
ss nimrod and darthray like this.
charmerci is offline  
post #12 of 15 Old 12-02-2019, 07:31 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2018
Posts: 233
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 141 Post(s)
Liked: 154
Quote:
Originally Posted by happycamper820 View Post
I have no way to manage crossover as the amp is not an AV amp. I only have a pre-out to send signal to a sub and use the crossover on the sub so the amp will still be sending full range signal to the midranges.


That should be fine. Just use the XO(LPF) on the subwoofer to blend.
Polyrythm1k is offline  
post #13 of 15 Old 12-02-2019, 07:33 PM
pjp
AVS Forum Special Member
 
pjp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: NJ/NY
Posts: 1,630
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 798 Post(s)
Liked: 457
Quote:
Originally Posted by happycamper820 View Post
Well respected audiophile Steve Guttenberg says no. My time is running out to make a Cyber Monday purchase on the SVS SB12-NSD. I've never owned a SW for not sure what I'm missing.

https://www.cnet.com/news/the-case-a...ers-for-music/
The first question is: What mains do you have?

I think Steve is taking serious drugs on this one. Done right, subs will always add a lot if you tune them right. Once you have them dialed in, you don't need to fiddle with them ever. You only end up with "too much bass" if you don't tune them right. Honestly, I think it is insanity to suggest that a speaker with a 5 1/2" woofer won't benefit from a sub. The difference is massive.

The above said, it is possible for a sub not to sound good with music. I've lived that. My experience is that a sub will always help music, even if you have large mains, if the following are done:

1. Sealed sub is better than ported for music

2. No DSP built into the sub (for pure analog where the left/right mains have no DSP) (I tried forever to get DSP sub EQ to sound good with my 2-channel system, it sounded muddy and imprecise always until I removed DSP and used the basic built-in sub gain and crossover controls)

3. Drive the sub with the speaker level inputs rather than line-level (the sub will act more like an extension of the mains because both the sub and mains are driven by the exact same signal).
darthray likes this.
pjp is offline  
post #14 of 15 Old 12-02-2019, 07:41 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Posts: 78
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 55 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by pjp View Post
The first question is: What mains do you have?

I think Steve is taking serious drugs on this one. Done right, subs will always add a lot if you tune them right. Once you have them dialed in, you don't need to fiddle with them ever. You only end up with "too much bass" if you don't tune them right. Honestly, I think it is insanity to suggest that a speaker with a 5 1/2" woofer won't benefit from a sub. The difference is massive.

The above said, it is possible for a sub not to sound good with music. I've lived that. My experience is that a sub will always help music, even if you have large mains, if the following are done:

1. Sealed sub is better than ported for music

2. No DSP built into the sub (for pure analog where the left/right mains have no DSP) (I tried forever to get DSP sub EQ to sound good with my 2-channel system, it sounded muddy and imprecise always until I removed DSP and used the basic built-in sub gain and crossover controls)

3. Drive the sub with the speaker level inputs rather than line-level (the sub will act more like an extension of the mains because both the sub and mains are driven by the exact same signal).
There aren't very many mid-priced subs with speaker level inputs. Bic has the F12 with speaker inputs but most under $500 only have line level or LFE input.
happycamper820 is offline  
post #15 of 15 Old 12-02-2019, 07:48 PM
pjp
AVS Forum Special Member
 
pjp's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: NJ/NY
Posts: 1,630
Mentioned: 8 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 798 Post(s)
Liked: 457
Quote:
Originally Posted by happycamper820 View Post
There aren't very many mid-priced subs with speaker level inputs. Bic has the F12 with speaker inputs but most under $500 only have line level or LFE input.

Most subs (across a wide range of prices) do have speaker level inputs, unfortunately the SVS sub you mentioned does not. Some have a "pass-through" speakers connections (where you connect the amp speaker outputs to the sub "speaker in" and the speakers to sub "speaker out") and some only have speaker-level inputs (in which case you wire the sub speaker-level inputs in parallel with the mains).
pjp is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Subwoofers, Bass, and Transducers

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off