Dual PB-2000 Pros vs dual PB-3000s.....decisions... - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 35 Old 02-14-2020, 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
Hi,

Although, you have already gotten a fair bit of advice on this thread, it may be worth exploring your options a little bit more. If you are looking to upgrade to another SVS sub, from your single PB2000, I would recommend a PB3000 over a 2000 Pro, and I would probably recommend a PB4000 (or a PC4000), over a PB3000. As you move-up the SVS food chain, you gain some things that you may want. Here are some things to consider, as you also consider what you are able to afford, or are willing to spend.

Your room size is about 2300^3. That's not a really large room, so you will be getting some room gain that will help to augment the frequencies under about 25Hz. That's a plus! You don't mention whether or not you are on concrete or on a suspended wood floor. If you are on a suspended wood floor, that will be another plus with respect to very low-frequencies.

A suspended wood floor will resonate sympathetically with very low-frequencies, creating low-bass tactile sensations which correspond to the special effects in movies. Concrete will not resonate that way, and consequently, most people need more <20Hz SPL when they are on concrete floors. (Carpet or wood flooring, on top of concrete, doesn't increase low-frequency resonance.)

Bringing this back to the subwoofer options, moving-up to a PB3000 will offer you a lot more SPL at every frequency, compared to a PB2000, where a Pro would be a much more modest increase. And, the sound quality should be a bit better as well. The PB3000 may be SVS's best value for the money. I think you would notice that upgrade much more than you would if you went to the 2000 Pro.

But, and this can be an important but for some people, the PB3000 is still not a low-tuned subwoofer. Quantifying the difference between a subwoofer which is tuned to about 19Hz, and one that is tuned to about 15 or 16Hz can be a little difficult. You can look at outdoor measurements for the two different subwoofers and see what the max SPL numbers are below 20Hz. But, if you haven't actually heard a lower-tuned sub, those numbers may not be very meaningful to you. Here are some test results that you can compare:

https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofe...000/conclusion

https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofe...0/measurements

You will notice that the PB3000 holds its own very well with the PB4000 down to 20Hz. But, at 16Hz, there is a difference in max output of about 11dB between the PB3000, and the PB4000 in Extended mode. To put that into context, a single PB4000 would produce approximately as much SPL, into the middle teens, as four PB3000's could produce. (The disparity would be just slightly greater with PB2000's. The PB3000 doesn't really go much lower than the PB2000 does.)

The way I arrive at that comparison is as follows. A doubling of subwoofers nets an increase of +6dB. Doubling that pair of subwoofers nets another +6dB. So, four PB3000's would produce 12dB more max volume, at 16Hz, than a single PB3000 would. An 11 or 12dB difference at those low-bass frequencies is enormous!

The first question I think you need to ask yourself is what are you really looking for? Are you looking for more of what you have now, combined with slightly better sound quality and more features, or are you specifically looking for more <20Hz performance? The reason that subwoofers become larger and more expensive, as they play lower-frequencies at higher volume levels, is because those lower-frequencies are harder to reproduce. They require larger cabinet volumes, lower port tunes, (perhaps stronger drivers with more amplifier power), and more DSP directing the amp power into the lowest frequencies.

If you are on a suspended wood floor, in a room that size, you may already be getting pretty satisfactory low-frequency SPL and TR (tactile response) from a subwoofer which is tuned to about 19Hz. But, if you are on a concrete floor, or if you feel that you want to explore lower-frequencies, then you will need a lower-tuned ported subwoofer in order to do it.

That's why I used the example of it requiring about four PB3000's (or PB2000's) to equal a single PB4000 at 16Hz. You can't just add multiple ported subs and expect to get significantly more low-frequency SPL. Each individual sub will still roll-off wherever it is designed to roll-off.

In an early post @Basshead recommended that you jump all the way to a PB4000, but he didn't really explain why it might be worth your while to do that. And, neither did the subsequent posts. Unfortunately, no one else can put himself in your exact position concerning what you are really looking for with an upgrade, or with respect to subwoofer costs.

But, I thought it might be helpful for you to understand some of the advantages involved, as you move-up the SVS ported subwoofer food chain. Good luck with whatever you decide!

Regards,
Mike
Mike,



I doubt you know me on AVS but I see and read your posting frequently.
Especially on Subwoofers ............

I really enjoyed your post I just now read above ^^^

I'm getting ready if all works-out to replace my now 20 year old 4 Mirage BPS400 subs.

My choice after extensive research is to get 4 SVS PB-3000 Subs with the, (SVS - SoundPath Subwoofer Isolation System - Black) feet/pads.

I had not a clue what it meant as you added additional subs and now I do know from your Excellent post above ^^^.

I wish I could find more information like you have posted above on having 4 subwoofers versus 1 sub.
Especially if the information was relating to the SVS PB-3000 subs.

Thanks again your the Man,
Terry

Up-Date guys,
Below video is "Awesome" and tells me what I have been hoping to see or hear.




4 SVS PB-3000 subs are it ...........

.
mthomas47 and Matt Fowler like this.

Last edited by tigerhonaker; 02-14-2020 at 04:02 PM. Reason: Found exactly what I have been looking for so added the Video to post !!!
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post #32 of 35 Old 02-14-2020, 04:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tigerhonaker View Post
Mike,



I doubt you know me on AVS but I see and read your posting frequently.
Especially on Subwoofers ............

I really enjoyed your post I just now read above ^^^

I'm getting ready if all works-out to replace my now 20 year old 4 Mirage BPS400 subs.

My choice after extensive research is to get 4 SVS PB-3000 Subs with the, (SVS - SoundPath Subwoofer Isolation System - Black) feet/pads.

I had not a clue what it meant as you added additional subs and now I do know from your Excellent post above ^^^.

I wish I could find more information like you have posted above on having 4 subwoofers versus 1 sub.
Especially if the information was relating to the SVS PB-3000 subs.

Thanks again your the Man,
Terry

Up-Date guys,
Below video is "Awesome" and tells me what I have been hoping to see or hear.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezXH...ature=emb_logo


4 SVS PB-3000 subs are it ...........

.

Hi Terry,

Thank you very much for the nice post, and congratulations on your new subs! Four PB3000's should be terrific!

I actually do recognize your user name, and have read some of your posts here and there. I'm really glad that my post was helpful to you!

Regards,
Mike
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GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
Speaker placements & Room treatments; HT calibration & Room EQ; Room gain; Bass
Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.
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post #33 of 35 Old 02-14-2020, 07:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
Hi Terry,

Thank you very much for the nice post, and congratulations on your new subs! Four PB3000's should be terrific!

I actually do recognize your user name, and have read some of your posts here and there.
I'm really glad that my post was helpful to you!

Regards,
Mike
Hey Mike,

I don't have the SVS PB-3000 4 Subs yet buddy.
But, I have made the decision and my wife of plus 35-years also likes the PB-3000 Subs as we watched a few videos last night on them.

I will make that move in the near future as I want them here before my guys from come to do the 6 in-ceiling Atmos system.

Post ... I have now made my Final choice on the Atmos System, January 17th 2020 ...

https://www.avsforum.com/forum/15-ge...l#post59114246

As the wife (Cathy) and I discussed things she said you need to get those SVS PB-3000 4-Subs before they come to do the Atmos install.
That way they can do both and not have to come back ...........

Sometimes our wives can and do Surprise us. LOL !!!

Your post was most helpful as I was reading it and then you explained about having dual Subs and then if you had Quad (4) Subs what they added.
And comparing them to the SVS PB-4000 Subwoofer for output.

I was also researching the PB-4000 and doing 4 of them.
But, the more I read and viewed (Videos) on the PB-3000 Subs made a lot more sense to me.

Terry
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post #34 of 35 Old 02-15-2020, 11:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Mike and everyone thanks so much for opinions and options I appreciate your time.

Gave me plenty to think aboot. The room is in the basement. Carpet, padding, osb and dmx underlay.

Going lower in frequency wasn't a huge priority...a bit louder at deep frequencies would be nicer but mostly it's the natural bass...kick drums, doors, thuds, stuff like that makes me smile. Duals is for the sake of achieving a more even experience from the other seats.

Oh boy so then we're now at dual 3000s (why no cylinders there again??) or a single 4000.

I couldn't have done an Alberta run as I'm in Ontario, though I have done road trips to acquire speakers before also!

I'll keep an eye on canuckaudiomart for sure. Though I'm wary and would prefer a good length of warranty.
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post #35 of 35 Old 02-16-2020, 09:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samcro1100 View Post
Mike and everyone thanks so much for opinions and options I appreciate your time.

Gave me plenty to think aboot. The room is in the basement. Carpet, padding, osb and dmx underlay.

Going lower in frequency wasn't a huge priority...a bit louder at deep frequencies would be nicer but mostly it's the natural bass...kick drums, doors, thuds, stuff like that makes me smile.

Duals is for the sake of achieving a more even experience from the other seats.

Oh boy so then we're now at dual 3000s (why no cylinders there again??) or a single 4000.

I couldn't have done an Alberta run as I'm in Ontario, though I have done road trips to acquire speakers before also!

I'll keep an eye on canuckaudiomart for sure.

Though I'm wary and would prefer a good length of warranty.


samcro1100,

Quote:
Duals is for the sake of achieving a more even experience from the other seats.

Going lower in frequency wasn't a huge priority...a bit louder at deep frequencies would be nicer but mostly it's the natural bass...kick drums, doors, thuds, stuff like that makes me smile.

Though I'm wary and would prefer a good length of warranty.
Just my (Opinions) ..............

Go Duals if you can ...........
I have been doing this for over 30-years now.
I've had singles, doubles and now Quad (4) Subs.
Duals make an instant noticeable difference to what you like.
Also, always-always go for the "Warranty" buddy !!!

Good-Luck with your final choice.
Terry
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