Originally Posted by squadz
Heh I know, but this sub is still great and perfect for my uses.
I just need to learn how to push it one step further from -5. If I understood Mike's post correctly, I think he means I would go back to the subwoofer knob on the back to up it now, but that seems against what I've read.
Originally Posted by Polyrythm1k
I would go into the speaker settings as D bone said and adjust the trim there. I always find mikes advice very useful and excellent. I didn’t see where he said use the subs knob, unless he meant because audyssey was against its limit.
Originally Posted by jima4a
Mike can come and clarify but as far as I read it, DO NOT increase trims above -5 in the AVR but use the volume (gain) on the sub itself to boost sub level if desired.
Edit: I can see potential confusion in Mike’s post where he prefers to adjust “to taste” in the AV processor but I believe he is far enough negative so the net stays below -5.
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My second post on this was primarily intended to clarify some terms for @squadz
and to indicate that the gain control on the subwoofer itself is labelled "Volume". But, the Guide, and my original post to him, are very clear and unambiguous. This is what I wrote:
"Then, post-calibration, owners could add several decibels of sub boost with the AVR remote, up to about -5. Additional boosts above about -5 in trim level, would be made with the subwoofer gain rather than the AVR remote.
And, unless you are specifically measuring your frequency response, you are just adding bass to your personal taste, so it won't hurt anything to add boost with the subwoofer gain control."
The "measuring" part of that statement was simply for the people who want to know exactly how much bass SPL they have added, and how that affects their overall frequency response or house curve.
There is always going to be conflicting advice on subjects like this. That's why the Guide was started, and that's why I posted last night. I wanted to state what I believe to be the best way for most of us to use our sub gains and our trim levels. This method will do no harm, and it may really help in some cases, including for the OP.
Think of the process this way. When you try to get to about -11 in trim level, during calibration, you are already using your subwoofer amplifier to the maximum extent that you can. If you turn your gain up any higher, you may exceed the Denon/Marantz trim levels of -12, and you will have no idea what your subwoofer settings should really be. Are they just -12, or would they really be -14 or -16, or even higher, if the trim levels went that low?
Then from that initial setting of about -11, you can add trim with your AVR remote, and you are still mostly using the subwoofer amplifier, because you deliberately turned the subwoofer gain, up above where Audyssey wanted you to, during the calibration process. But, once you hit about -5 in trim, that is about as far as you should usually go in order to stay with the best-practice method that I am recommending. If you still want more bass from that -5 trim setting, and many people do, you just go back to using the subwoofer gain control again to get it.
This way, you are using the gain control during the Audyssey calibration, and if you need to, you are using it again after the Audyssey calibration.
Section II-C of the Guide uses the analogy of depositing subwoofer amplifier power in the bank, when you get to an AVR trim setting of about -11.
But after calibration, as you increase your AVR trim up to about -5, you have used up that initial bank deposit of subwoofer amplifier power, and now you need to make another deposit of sub amplifier voltage with your gain control. Perhaps, repeating that analogy here will help to make the process of using the subwoofer amplifier easier to understand.