Official SVS Owners/Support Thread. - Page 794 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 44631Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #23791 of 31618 Old 05-04-2016, 07:58 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
aaranddeeman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Lover's State
Posts: 4,079
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1874 Post(s)
Liked: 676
My theater room is 18'x12'x8' approx.
I currently have ED A2-300 placed on the side of the couch.
I am wondering if I replace Ed with 2x SB-1000 and place them in front just besides the mains, would they be able to provide the bass at least at par (of not more) that my current A2-300.
Why SB-1000 only? I can only have sub with max height 14" in front due to the screen viewable bottom is at that height from ground.
Appreciate your input on this or any other alternative that you may have.
aaranddeeman is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #23792 of 31618 Old 05-04-2016, 09:41 PM
Member
 
SodomySquirrel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 92
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 42 Post(s)
Liked: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bond 007 View Post
Sub placement is critical for good bass.
Placement for me is unfortunately somewhat constrained. Tiny living room.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cchunter View Post
After running audyssey what is the sub volume at on the Denon? I have my Ultra volume at -15 and after audyssey my Denon set it to -9. It wasn't loud enough for me so I went to -3 so running 6db's hot.
Having a hard time finding where I could see the settings...


Quote:
Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
Hi,

I haven't found a lot of correlation in my room, with my subs, between the SVS recommended gain setting and the actual one. Both position in the room, and distance from the MLP, can be factors in the amount of gain required. What sub are you using, and did you do a sub crawl to try to find the best location for your sub?

As noted, you may be sitting in a null. But it's also entirely possible that you just need to add trim post-Audyssey. People typically find that they need to add 3 to 6db of trim to their sub(s) after running an Audyssey calibration, and some add even more. What was your post-calibration trim setting in your sub, and have you tried increasing it?

The answer to the questions in both paragraphs will help to resolve things.

Regards,
Mike
Due to the very small size of my living room, doing the sub crawl wouldn't matter as the number of places for the sub are VERY limited. Trying to get it to work best with what I got until I move out in the next 2 years...

By adding "trim" do you mean adjusting the vol on the actual sub? HT Detail is in my sig.

Thank you all for the help.

Living Room: Front: B&W CM10 S2 w/ AQ Rocket 44 \\ Rear: B&W CM6 S2 w/ AQ X2
Center: B&W CM Centre 2 S2 w/ Canare 4S11 \\ Sub: SVS SB16-Ultra w/ AQ Black Lab (REL T9 retired, SVS SB13 retired)
AVR: Denon X6200W // TV: 65JS9500 (64F8500 65ZT60 52Z5100 retired)
Bedroom: TV: Sony 55X850D \\ Front: Sonos PlayBar \\ Rear: Sonos Play:1s \\ Sub: Sonos Sub
SodomySquirrel is offline  
post #23793 of 31618 Old 05-04-2016, 11:44 PM
Advanced Member
 
rolldog's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 868
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 602 Post(s)
Liked: 204
Quote:
Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
Hi,

Outstanding! Out of a sense of fairness, I was one of the people advising you to look at other subs before deciding, but I'm glad that you went with the PB-13. Looks matter to me too, and I think that the Ultra in piano black, with the metal grille, is a winner. And I definitely do think it will give you the deep bass that you can both hear and feel.

That's the good news. The bad news is that you should probably just get rid of the Klipsch subs, original boxes or not. Perhaps you can find someone in your community who wants them (Craigslist, maybe) and avoid shipping. If not, there are places where you can get large boxes.

If you combine the weaker subs with your much more powerful Ultra, you will either hold back the Ultra, or risk distorting/damaging the Klipsch subs, or both. Audyssey, for instance, will only set filters to the F3 point of the lesser sub, and then will EQ the subs as one, even with XT-32 and two sub inputs. So, if the Ultra has an in-room F3 of 10 or 11Hz, which is very possible with one port plugged, and the Klipsch subs have an in-room F3 of about 25Hz, then there will be a large gap of more than an octave where you have no EQ at all. And then when you try to crank up your subs, particularly with something like DEQ engaged, you will risk distorting the sound, or damaging the Klipsch subs, as they are unable to keep up. People do use lesser subs in conjunction with more powerful ones, but it takes some effort (with measurements and something like a miniDSP) to make it work well.

I would just enjoy the Ultra, and depending on how things work out, look forward to the time when I could add a second one.

Regards,
Mike
Yes, thank you very much for the advice. I guess I could always use these subs in other rooms, where they would add some deeper bass that having no subs at all. I still have 3 older receivers sitting in a closet, so, maybe I could gradually piece together a system that would at least be better than using TV speakers. I'm planning a fairly large remodel sometime over the next 6 months, so I might even be able to incorporate them into a whole home audio system. I'll think of something.

My sub will be here on Wednesday of next week, along with my new TV, which was supposed to be delivered this past Saturday, but apparently demand has been higher than expected because Best Buy couldn't even get my TV within 2 weeks of me buying it. So, I'm really looking forward to next week, new PB-13 Ultra and a new Vizio P75. I went ahead and bought the PB-13 Ultra, even after everyone had to put in their 2 cents on why I should go with a different brand and model. I looked at a couple of other options, but I decided to move forward with the SVS, otherwise, I could picture myself a month from now still researching different brands and models, which I call paralysis through analysis. Again, thanks for the advice. Now, I think I'm finally going to be able to fill the void and add the bass that my system has been lacking.

Sent from my Pixel C using Tapatalk
mthomas47 likes this.

JVC RS4500K, Paladin DCR, Lumagen Radiance Pro, LG OLED W7, OLED E7, OLED C6, Sony A1E, Samsung QLED Q9F, QLED Q7F, Vizio P75c1, Marantz AV8805, Emotiva XPA-7 Gen 3, Integra DRC-R1, Anthem MRX 720, Oppo 203, Sunfire TGA-7401, Outlaw 5000, Triad Silver 7.1.4 Atmos setup, SVS PB16 Ultra, PSA 3601,SVS PB-13 Ultra, 31 Sonance VP88R, 6x6 Control4 4K HDR AV matrix, Control4 8 Zone AMP, Control4 EA-5, Control4 EA-1, QNAP TVS-882 & TS-451+
rolldog is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #23794 of 31618 Old 05-05-2016, 07:01 AM
AVS ***** Member
 
mthomas47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 8,269
Mentioned: 346 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5482 Post(s)
Liked: 10465
Quote:
Originally Posted by rolldog View Post
Yes, thank you very much for the advice. I guess I could always use these subs in other rooms, where they would add some deeper bass that having no subs at all. I still have 3 older receivers sitting in a closet, so, maybe I could gradually piece together a system that would at least be better than using TV speakers. I'm planning a fairly large remodel sometime over the next 6 months, so I might even be able to incorporate them into a whole home audio system. I'll think of something.

My sub will be here on Wednesday of next week, along with my new TV, which was supposed to be delivered this past Saturday, but apparently demand has been higher than expected because Best Buy couldn't even get my TV within 2 weeks of me buying it. So, I'm really looking forward to next week, new PB-13 Ultra and a new Vizio P75. I went ahead and bought the PB-13 Ultra, even after everyone had to put in their 2 cents on why I should go with a different brand and model. I looked at a couple of other options, but I decided to move forward with the SVS, otherwise, I could picture myself a month from now still researching different brands and models, which I call paralysis through analysis. Again, thanks for the advice. Now, I think I'm finally going to be able to fill the void and add the bass that my system has been lacking.

Sent from my Pixel C using Tapatalk

You are very welcome! I look forward to hearing your impressions of the Ultra. It's also fun to experience the excitement of new displays and subs vicariously.
pacman9270 likes this.

GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
Speaker placements & Room treatments; HT calibration & Room EQ; Room gain; Bass
Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.
mthomas47 is online now  
post #23795 of 31618 Old 05-05-2016, 07:08 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Cal68's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Maryland
Posts: 1,179
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 356 Post(s)
Liked: 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by rolldog View Post
I went ahead and bought the PB-13 Ultra, even after everyone had to put in their 2 cents on why I should go with a different brand and model. I looked at a couple of other options, but I decided to move forward with the SVS, otherwise, I could picture myself a month from now still researching different brands and models, which I call paralysis through analysis. Again, thanks for the advice. Now, I think I'm finally going to be able to fill the void and add the bass that my system has been lacking.

Sent from my Pixel C using Tapatalk
I am pretty sure that you will be very happy with the PB13 Ultra. I know that there are other subs out there that get rave reviews on AVS, but I do not recall hearing any negative opinions about PB-13 Ultra's when one looks at them by themselves for what they are. Enjoy your new sub and let us know how your new Visio turns out to be as well!

Cal68
Cal68 is offline  
post #23796 of 31618 Old 05-05-2016, 07:12 AM
AVS ***** Member
 
mthomas47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 8,269
Mentioned: 346 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5482 Post(s)
Liked: 10465
Quote:
Originally Posted by SodomySquirrel View Post
Having a hard time finding where I could see the settings...


Due to the very small size of my living room, doing the sub crawl wouldn't matter as the number of places for the sub are VERY limited. Trying to get it to work best with what I got until I move out in the next 2 years...

By adding "trim" do you mean adjusting the vol on the actual sub? HT Detail is in my sig.

Thank you all for the help.

You are very welcome! It takes a little while to get used to a new AVR, but you should be able to look at your various receiver settings on-screen. You may need to scroll through your menu a few times to familiarize yourself with your setting options. I have to do that whenever I get a new AVR.

As a general rule, it is best to adjust your sub level either in your Audio Menu or in your Speaker Menu, rather than making adjustments to the sub itself. That makes it easier to keep track of things, and lets you use your remote for convenience. If Audyssey sets your trim level at -9, and you adjust your sub trim in your AVR to about -3, that would be considered pretty typical.

Just experiment a little and if you are unsure of something, there will always be someone willing to help. That's one of the things I really like about AVS, because we all need assistance at times.

GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
Speaker placements & Room treatments; HT calibration & Room EQ; Room gain; Bass
Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.
mthomas47 is online now  
post #23797 of 31618 Old 05-05-2016, 08:40 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
BuGsArEtAsTy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: AVS Forum
Posts: 8,292
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 715 Post(s)
Liked: 348
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuGsArEtAsTy View Post
I think what I'll do is wait for pricing and then either get the amp fixed (if even possible) or else get a new amp.
The replacement Sledge STA-1000D amp to replace my dead BASH for my PB13-Ultra is reasonably priced (Canada). So, I'm going to get a new amp. The nice warranty seals the deal.

Now I just need my speaker mounts to arrive to complete my 5.1.2 Atmos setup. I'm almost feeling a little bit of withdrawl with "just" a 5.0 setup at the moment. Looking forward to watching Mad Max: Fury Road (Atmos) on Blu-ray soon.
mthomas47 likes this.
BuGsArEtAsTy is offline  
post #23798 of 31618 Old 05-05-2016, 02:08 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
AllenA07's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 1,637
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 704 Post(s)
Liked: 579
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaranddeeman View Post
My theater room is 18'x12'x8' approx.
I currently have ED A2-300 placed on the side of the couch.
I am wondering if I replace Ed with 2x SB-1000 and place them in front just besides the mains, would they be able to provide the bass at least at par (of not more) that my current A2-300.
Why SB-1000 only? I can only have sub with max height 14" in front due to the screen viewable bottom is at that height from ground.
Appreciate your input on this or any other alternative that you may have.
My theater is roughly the same size. I'm using a PC-12 Plus and a PC-13 Ultra, which I'll admit might be a small amount of overkill (don't tell my wife!). I would suggest that you look at the SVS cylinder subs. One of the advantages is that they can be laid on their side. My Plus is standing upright behind my couch, but my Ultra is laying on it's side under the screen. The flexibility of being able to lay the sub on its side is a huge reason that I ended up going with SVS, otherwise I'm not sure I would have had the room for large subs.

My Theater: The Ugly Theater
AllenA07 is offline  
post #23799 of 31618 Old 05-05-2016, 02:47 PM
AVS ***** Member
 
mthomas47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 8,269
Mentioned: 346 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5482 Post(s)
Liked: 10465
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaranddeeman View Post
My theater room is 18'x12'x8' approx.
I currently have ED A2-300 placed on the side of the couch.
I am wondering if I replace Ed with 2x SB-1000 and place them in front just besides the mains, would they be able to provide the bass at least at par (of not more) that my current A2-300.
Why SB-1000 only? I can only have sub with max height 14" in front due to the screen viewable bottom is at that height from ground.
Appreciate your input on this or any other alternative that you may have.

Hi,

I tried to find some verified specs, or bench tests of the A2-300 for comparison purposes, but no luck. One website claimed 18Hz to 100Hz +/- 3db. With only 200 watts, though, I am more than a little bit skeptical. Allen's advice to consider cylinders (16.5" diameter) which could be laid on their sides might be a good idea. That would give you a number of power/price choices.

Two sealed subs might be okay for your room alright, but the SB-1000 is only a 10" sub with a 300 watt amp. My guess is that two of them would probably give you at least equivalent performance, considering that your A2-300 was nearfield, but I don't know how much of an upgrade in output it would be. It should be an upgrade in frequency response, though, in any event.

One of the nice things about SVS is that you can order a pair of subs risk free. I might try a pair of SB-1000's, listen hard for a couple of weeks, and if I weren't satisfied, try a couple of cylinders laid on their sides.

Regards,
Mike

Edit: I just re-read my post and it doesn't really make very good sense. If the 14.5" height of an SB-2000 is too high, then the 16.5" height of a cylinder laid on its side won't work very well either. No chance that you could raise your screen another inch from the floor if the SB-1000's aren't quite enough?

GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
Speaker placements & Room treatments; HT calibration & Room EQ; Room gain; Bass
Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.

Last edited by mthomas47; 05-05-2016 at 02:54 PM.
mthomas47 is online now  
post #23800 of 31618 Old 05-05-2016, 03:05 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
Kini62's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Hawaii
Posts: 8,045
Mentioned: 43 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2724 Post(s)
Liked: 2537
Quote:
Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
Hi,

I tried to find some verified specs, or bench tests of the A2-300 for comparison purposes, but no luck. One website claimed 18Hz to 100Hz +/- 3db. With only 200 watts, though, I am more than a little bit skeptical. Allen's advice to consider cylinders (16.5" diameter) which could be laid on their sides might be a good idea. That would give you a number of power/price choices.

Two sealed subs might be okay for your room alright, but the SB-1000 is only a 10" sub with a 300 watt amp. My guess is that two of them would probably give you at least equivalent performance, considering that your A2-300 was nearfield, but I don't know how much of an upgrade in output it would be. It should be an upgrade in frequency response, though, in any event.

One of the nice things about SVS is that you can order a pair of subs risk free. I might try a pair of SB-1000's, listen hard for a couple of weeks, and if I weren't satisfied, try a couple of cylinders laid on their sides.

Regards,
Mike

Edit: I just re-read my post and it doesn't really make very good sense. If the 14.5" height of an SB-2000 is too high, then the 16.5" height of a cylinder laid on its side won't work very well either. No chance that you could raise your screen another inch from the floor if the SB-1000's aren't quite enough?
The SB1000 actually has a 12" driver.
mthomas47 likes this.

Klipsch RF-62II, RC-500, RS-400, SVS PC12+,
Def Tech SC8000
Onkyo RZ820
Roku Ultra, Apple TV, Sharp 70" Quattron
Kini62 is offline  
post #23801 of 31618 Old 05-05-2016, 03:09 PM
AVS ***** Member
 
mthomas47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 8,269
Mentioned: 346 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5482 Post(s)
Liked: 10465
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kini62 View Post
The SB1000 actually has a 12" driver.

I had better quit while I'm behind.

GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
Speaker placements & Room treatments; HT calibration & Room EQ; Room gain; Bass
Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.
mthomas47 is online now  
post #23802 of 31618 Old 05-05-2016, 03:16 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 32
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 22 Post(s)
Liked: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
Hi,

I tried to find some verified specs, or bench tests of the A2-300 for comparison purposes, but no luck. One website claimed 18Hz to 100Hz +/- 3db. With only 200 watts, though, I am more than a little bit skeptical. Allen's advice to consider cylinders (16.5" diameter) which could be laid on their sides might be a good idea. That would give you a number of power/price choices.

Two sealed subs might be okay for your room alright, but the SB-1000 is only a 10" sub with a 300 watt amp. My guess is that two of them would probably give you at least equivalent performance, considering that your A2-300 was nearfield, but I don't know how much of an upgrade in output it would be. It should be an upgrade in frequency response, though, in any event.

One of the nice things about SVS is that you can order a pair of subs risk free. I might try a pair of SB-1000's, listen hard for a couple of weeks, and if I weren't satisfied, try a couple of cylinders laid on their sides.

Regards,
Mike

Edit: I just re-read my post and it doesn't really make very good sense. If the 14.5" height of an SB-2000 is too high, then the 16.5" height of a cylinder laid on its side won't work very well either.No chance that you could raise your screen another inch from the floor if the SB-1000's aren't quite enough?
PC on it's side could definitely work. It won't be 16.5" high flush to the wall...it will taper down approaching the wall since it's a cylinder and not a box. Depending on your seating height, distance to the screen and sub distance from wall (on its side), the angles may work well. Take some measurements and see if it's an option. I have dual PC-2000 subs and absolutely love them.

Sent from my SM-G925V using Tapatalk

Yamaha Aventage RX-A3060 | (3) DefTech UIW RLS II (LCR) | (4) DefTech RSS II (Side and Back Surrounds) | (4) DefTech Di8r in-ceilings for Atmos/DTS:X | (2) SVS PB-3000 Subs, 7.2.4
Seymour 119" 2.37:1 AT Neo Enlightor with 16:9 AT Masking Panels | JVC DLA-X790R projector
mmmmmmbacon is offline  
post #23803 of 31618 Old 05-05-2016, 04:01 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
aaranddeeman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Lover's State
Posts: 4,079
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1874 Post(s)
Liked: 676
Quote:
Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
Hi,

I tried to find some verified specs, or bench tests of the A2-300 for comparison purposes, but no luck. One website claimed 18Hz to 100Hz +/- 3db. With only 200 watts, though, I am more than a little bit skeptical. Allen's advice to consider cylinders (16.5" diameter) which could be laid on their sides might be a good idea. That would give you a number of power/price choices.

Two sealed subs might be okay for your room alright, but the SB-1000 is only a 10" sub with a 300 watt amp. My guess is that two of them would probably give you at least equivalent performance, considering that your A2-300 was nearfield, but I don't know how much of an upgrade in output it would be. It should be an upgrade in frequency response, though, in any event.

One of the nice things about SVS is that you can order a pair of subs risk free. I might try a pair of SB-1000's, listen hard for a couple of weeks, and if I weren't satisfied, try a couple of cylinders laid on their sides.

Regards,
Mike

Edit: I just re-read my post and it doesn't really make very good sense. If the 14.5" height of an SB-2000 is too high, then the 16.5" height of a cylinder laid on its side won't work very well either. No chance that you could raise your screen another inch from the floor if the SB-1000's aren't quite enough?
You do have good points. I can go for the cylinders as well, as a matter of fact I would prefer them over the small cube.
Though I can not place them upfront (laid down), I amy be able to place them forward of mains (within mains and MLP) or may be behind the couch.
And BTW, SB 1000 is 12" and not 10" (I guess it's the PB 1000 that is 10").
aaranddeeman is offline  
post #23804 of 31618 Old 05-05-2016, 04:04 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
aaranddeeman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Lover's State
Posts: 4,079
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1874 Post(s)
Liked: 676
Quote:
Originally Posted by AllenA07 View Post
My theater is roughly the same size. I'm using a PC-12 Plus and a PC-13 Ultra, which I'll admit might be a small amount of overkill (don't tell my wife!). I would suggest that you look at the SVS cylinder subs. One of the advantages is that they can be laid on their side. My Plus is standing upright behind my couch, but my Ultra is laying on it's side under the screen. The flexibility of being able to lay the sub on its side is a huge reason that I ended up going with SVS, otherwise I'm not sure I would have had the room for large subs.
Thanks.
I don't mind cylinder(s). But then I will have to place them at different location(s), which is not a big issue. As a matter of fact I would jump on the PC-12NSD deal if it pops again.
This was may second thought to go with the cubes and set them upfront instead.
aaranddeeman is offline  
post #23805 of 31618 Old 05-05-2016, 04:32 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
AllenA07's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 1,637
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 704 Post(s)
Liked: 579
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaranddeeman View Post
Thanks.
I don't mind cylinder(s). But then I will have to place them at different location(s), which is not a big issue. As a matter of fact I would jump on the PC-12NSD deal if it pops again.
This was may second thought to go with the cubes and set them upfront instead.
If you're going with dual subs you would likely be better off with them at different locations anyway.

My Theater: The Ugly Theater
AllenA07 is offline  
post #23806 of 31618 Old 05-05-2016, 07:52 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
aaranddeeman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Lover's State
Posts: 4,079
Mentioned: 11 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1874 Post(s)
Liked: 676
Quote:
Originally Posted by AllenA07 View Post
If you're going with dual subs you would likely be better off with them at different locations anyway.
There is a very tempting sale of JBL 560p. But am not sure how it stacks up with SVS SB-1000 (or 2000) or for that matter PC-xx
aaranddeeman is offline  
post #23807 of 31618 Old 05-05-2016, 08:01 PM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
baron2's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,398
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 124 Post(s)
Liked: 147
What should I be looking for in a sub that will be just used for a music setup?
Any recommendations under 1k

Ive got some stuff
baron2 is offline  
post #23808 of 31618 Old 05-06-2016, 05:20 AM
Advanced Member
 
tang7969's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Tonawanda NY
Posts: 773
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 309 Post(s)
Liked: 212
Quote:
Originally Posted by baron2 View Post
What should I be looking for in a sub that will be just used for a music setup?

Any recommendations under 1k


Didn't you buy a PB12 Plus?

SONY XBR-65X900F - Sony UDP X800- PSA 210T L/R -PHANTOM CENTER -ENERGY RC-10 SURROUNDS -PSA S3000i - MARANTZ SR6013 - APPLE TV -DIRECTV HR44 -HARMONY ELITE

BASEMENT SETUP- SAMSUNG UN466500- ENERGY RC50'S L/R-ENERGY RC LCR- DENON-AVR-3311CI- PS3 -APPLETV- MINI GENIE
tang7969 is offline  
post #23809 of 31618 Old 05-06-2016, 05:44 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
AllenA07's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 1,637
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 704 Post(s)
Liked: 579
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaranddeeman View Post
There is a very tempting sale of JBL 560p. But am not sure how it stacks up with SVS SB-1000 (or 2000) or for that matter PC-xx
I would stick with the SVS over the JBL, I would be willing to bet that is a battle that SVS is going to win every time. Out of curiosity, why not look at some of the ported options? You get more output with a ported sub and there is very little evidence to suggest that a sealed sub is any cleaner then ported, as long as you're not pushing the sub so hard to generate chuffing.

My Theater: The Ugly Theater
AllenA07 is offline  
post #23810 of 31618 Old 05-06-2016, 07:22 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
baron2's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,398
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 124 Post(s)
Liked: 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by tang7969 View Post
Didn't you buy a PB12 Plus?
Yes I have dual PB12 Plus's that will arrive on Monday for my theatre room . I have a separate music setup that's why I was
asking.

Ive got some stuff
baron2 is offline  
post #23811 of 31618 Old 05-06-2016, 07:24 AM
Member
 
Jben04's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Beaufort ,SC
Posts: 143
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 56 Post(s)
Liked: 21
Loving my PB-1000,, just a small question,, the Volume control how low or soft its set at ( stronger / weaker bass),that just do to a persons preference right?,,

TCL 55P605 4k HDR - LG 47LW5600 (3D) - Energy take classic 5.0 - SVS PB-1000 - Panasonic BDT220 (3D) - Sony BD S350 - Sony BDP-S1700 (Region Free) -
Denon AVR X2100W - Harmony One Remote - Harmony Ultimate One.
Jben04 is offline  
post #23812 of 31618 Old 05-06-2016, 07:46 AM
AVS ***** Member
 
mthomas47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 8,269
Mentioned: 346 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5482 Post(s)
Liked: 10465
Quote:
Originally Posted by aaranddeeman View Post
There is a very tempting sale of JBL 560p. But am not sure how it stacks up with SVS SB-1000 (or 2000) or for that matter PC-xx

It is hard to find specs on JBL subs. Data-Bass lists specs for the 4445c, which had an 18" driver, and which only did 95.9db at 20Hz, and showed nothing at all below that, so it must have dropped like a rock. That makes me a little skeptical of JBL's claim of 22Hz with the 560p, particularly with an amp that peaks at only 500 watts. But giving the JBL every benefit of the doubt, it might be the equal of an SB-1000. But no more than that, and certainly not the equal of a ported 12" SVS sub.

To fully enjoy the LFE in modern movies, most people think it is important to be able to get under 20Hz at fairly significant volumes. If I could find a way to acquire two cylinders, I think that would be a better way to go.

GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
Speaker placements & Room treatments; HT calibration & Room EQ; Room gain; Bass
Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.
mthomas47 is online now  
post #23813 of 31618 Old 05-06-2016, 08:02 AM
AVS ***** Member
 
mthomas47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 8,269
Mentioned: 346 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5482 Post(s)
Liked: 10465
Quote:
Originally Posted by baron2 View Post
Yes I have dual PB12 Plus's that will arrive on Monday for my theatre room . I have a separate music setup that's why I was
asking.

Hi,

I can't remember, but didn't you have an older sub that might be re-purposed for your separate music room? The requirements for a music sub are a little different, IMO, simply because SPL down to and below 20Hz is not important in a music system. People sometimes use the example of a pipe organ piece that can go down to 16Hz, but unless you are really into pipe organs, not much music content goes below about 30Hz, and most of it is higher than that. Just the opposite of some LFE content in action movies.

So, for a music sub in a separate room, I would be looking for a sub that is stronger at about 40Hz and above. Typically, that will be a sealed sub. An SB-2000 would be a good choice if you wanted to stay with SVS, or a Rythmik sub, maybe an F8 or F12 series. Velodyne always had a popular reputation for music, but I think they are pricey. Really any sub that can play accurately down to about 30 or 35Hz would work pretty well for music. So, testing something you already have, including one of your new PB-12 Pluses, might help to give you an idea.

Regards,
Mike

GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
Speaker placements & Room treatments; HT calibration & Room EQ; Room gain; Bass
Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.
mthomas47 is online now  
post #23814 of 31618 Old 05-06-2016, 08:13 AM
Senior Member
 
prerich's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 311
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 124 Post(s)
Liked: 80
Quote:
Originally Posted by pclausen View Post
Hi guys,

I'm thinking about picking up a PB13-Ultra to replace my old Klipsch KSW-15, which doesn't really do much of anything.

My room layout is challenging so say the least. Here's the layout of the 1st floor:



The red is the LCD screen, the green are the speakers and the orange represent the current sub.

So the room is 24' long by 13' wide. Ceilings are 9'. The challenges are:

Windows and glass door covers 2 walls completely
Large 10' x 7' opening in center of 3rd wall into large 24' x 20' living room

View from behind main listening position. Note that I have acoustic blocks in the corners and on the wall above the LCD.



View towards back of room: (yes I know it's a mess. Got 3 and 5 year old girls...)



View from main living room into sunroom/theater room. Here you can also see the current placement of the KLW-15 sub. My plan was to locate the PB13-Ultra in the same spot.



TV is LG 4k 84"
AVR is Denon X3000
Mains are Klipsch KLF30s
Center is Klipsch KSB-C6
Surrounds are Klipsch KSB 3.1

I know the location of the surround speakers are pretty terrible for a 7.1 layout, but I don't really have many options.

I thinking about upgrading the Denon X3000 to a X6200W and do a 7.1.4 setup with 4 in ceiling speakers, but I'm not sure how that will play out with the current surrounds already being located at the top of the walls instead of at ear level. Just don't know if I can change that given the room layout.

Was also looking at the SVS Ultra Towers, Center and surrounds, but again, the room layout leaves a lot to be desired, so maybe I should not worry about that for now.

So will a single PB13 be enough? Should I look at other options?

Is the current location on the middle of the window wall decent, or should I look at other options?

This will mainly be for watching movies as opposed to listening to music.

My main theater is in the basement, and have a pair of TC Sound 18" drivers in DIY cabinets and about 4000W driving them. I really miss the LFE on the upstairs system, so I'm trying to figure out the best way to add at least a taste of that there.
Your sub seems like it's at the midway point in your room. That's not a good place for it. Move your sub to the front 1/3 of your room and tell us if it sounds better.
prerich is offline  
post #23815 of 31618 Old 05-06-2016, 08:19 AM
AVS Forum Special Member
 
baron2's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,398
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 124 Post(s)
Liked: 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
Hi,

I can't remember, but didn't you have an older sub that might be re-purposed for your separate music room? The requirements for a music sub are a little different, IMO, simply because SPL down to and below 20Hz is not important in a music system. People sometimes use the example of a pipe organ piece that can go down to 16Hz, but unless you are really into pipe organs, not much music content goes below about 30Hz, and most of it is higher than that. Just the opposite of some LFE content in action movies.

So, for a music sub in a separate room, I would be looking for a sub that is stronger at about 40Hz and above. Typically, that will be a sealed sub. An SB-2000 would be a good choice if you wanted to stay with SVS, or a Rythmik sub, maybe an F8 or F12 series. Velodyne always had a popular reputation for music, but I think they are pricey. Really any sub that can play accurately down to about 30 or 35Hz would work pretty well for music. So, testing something you already have, including one of your new PB-12 Pluses, might help to give you an idea.

Regards,
Mike
Thanks Mike. Yes I do have a couple of options with subs I already have. Here are the options I have now and also what I would like for a comparison from SVS. I have Dual Energy S12.3 or I can use my Three Energy Veritas VSW-10 subs My other option I was wondering how it might compare to my 2 options I have now would be one SB13 Ultra.

I have read about people using duals for a music setup only but what about my option of using my Three VSW-10 subs?
True, if I found I only needed one of the PB12 Plus's in theatre room I could use one in my music setup. I will more than likely end up using both for the theatre setup though.

You mentioned a SB-2000 which could be a good choice on its own. With that said one SB-2000 may not be be better than what options I have in the house now.

Ive got some stuff

Last edited by baron2; 05-06-2016 at 08:34 AM.
baron2 is offline  
post #23816 of 31618 Old 05-06-2016, 08:34 AM
AVS ***** Member
 
mthomas47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 8,269
Mentioned: 346 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5482 Post(s)
Liked: 10465
Quote:
Originally Posted by baron2 View Post
Thanks Mike. Yes I do have a couple of options with subs I already have. Here are the options I have now and also what I would like for a comparison from SVS. I have Dual Energy S12.3 or I can use my Three Energy Veritas VSW-10 subs My other option I was wondering how it might compare to my 2 options I have now would be one SB13 Ultra.

I have read about people using duals for a music setup only but what about my option of using my Three VSW-10 subs?
True, if I found I only needed one of the PB12 Plus's in theatre room I could use one in my music setup. I will more than likely end up using both for the theatre setup though.

You are welcome! I think that your three 10" subs might work great for music as long as they are accurate, as most music simply won't put the same low frequency demands on them that modern movies will. The advantage of using multiple subs for music is similar to movies, although output is generally less of an issue. But from a frequency response standpoint, multiple bass sources are nearly always preferable.

Incidentally, I wasn't suggesting that you put one of your Pluses in your music room permanently--just that you test it in there against your older subs as a way to find out what you are looking for. I don't often say this for fear that mobs will form with torches and pitchforks, but I don't use my subs at all for music. I have multiple full range speakers which serve me very well. Then for movies, I add in my center and my subs, bass manage everything, and I'm good to go. And I run my subs very hot for movies. So, for me at least, I can draw a clear distinction between how much bass I need for music, versus how much I need for movies. I know that that's a minority viewpoint, but I mention it in the context of giving your three 10" subs a fair try. They might work well for music.
baron2 likes this.

GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
Speaker placements & Room treatments; HT calibration & Room EQ; Room gain; Bass
Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.
mthomas47 is online now  
post #23817 of 31618 Old 05-06-2016, 09:30 AM
Member
 
Sam Schulz's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 168
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 103 Post(s)
Liked: 30
Would dual pb 2000s be an upgrade or a lateral move from dual vtf 2 mk4s?
Sam Schulz is offline  
post #23818 of 31618 Old 05-06-2016, 09:36 AM
Senior Member
 
discone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 483
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 207 Post(s)
Liked: 210
Well the deed is done! I'll soon be the proud owner of a new PC13-Ultra next week.

I mentioned a couple of week's ago joking to my friend if he wanted to buy my PB-2000. He gave me a good faith deposit for it on Monday. I've been doing a lot of reading trying to decide between the PC12 + and the Ultra. Even SVS was great about answering all my questions. My open floor plan townhouse comes out to around 5500cf and the PB did great for the movie's I'm just hoping for a little more impact or maybe a lot more.

My neighbor has been great knowing we watch movies after work and has never complained about my sub. I hoping this new sub does not change things.
discone is offline  
post #23819 of 31618 Old 05-06-2016, 09:53 AM
AVS ***** Member
 
mthomas47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 8,269
Mentioned: 346 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5482 Post(s)
Liked: 10465
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam Schulz View Post
Would dual pb 2000s be an upgrade or a lateral move from dual vtf 2 mk4s?

Hi Sam,

Data-bass doesn't have tests on the PB-2000, but extrapolating from the older model, I would say that the move would be pretty lateral. I think that the PB-2000 would have slightly more output under about 30Hz , and the VTF (with one port plugged) would definitely have more output above about 30Hz. I could be wrong about this, but I think to get a significant upgrade, you would probably have to move up to PB-12 Pluses.

http://www.data-bass.com/systems

Regards,
Mike
Sam Schulz likes this.

GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
Speaker placements & Room treatments; HT calibration & Room EQ; Room gain; Bass
Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.
mthomas47 is online now  
post #23820 of 31618 Old 05-06-2016, 12:32 PM
AVS ***** Member
 
mthomas47's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 8,269
Mentioned: 346 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5482 Post(s)
Liked: 10465
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jben04 View Post
Loving my PB-1000,, just a small question,, the Volume control how low or soft its set at ( stronger / weaker bass),that just do to a persons preference right?,,

Hi,

I definitely think that is a personal preference thing. Most people seem to like adding at least 3db post-Audyssey, and 6db, or more, is possible sometimes. Just make sure when you do an Audyssey calibration that your gain control on your sub is turned up high enough to give you a nice negative number on your sub trim: -8 or more would be good. Then you can add 3db or even 6db of sub trim (volume) in your Denon while still staying in negative numbers. Staying in negative numbers is particularly important to prevent distortion as you turn your master volume up with DEQ engaged.

It sounds complicated, but you just don't want to push your sub too hard, so sub volume, master volume, and DEQ (which also boosts your sub) are all interrelated. As long as you stay at about -3 on the sub trim, though, and don't go crazy on something like "Edge of Tomorrow" you should be fine.

Regards,
Mike
Jben04 likes this.

GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
Speaker placements & Room treatments; HT calibration & Room EQ; Room gain; Bass
Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.
mthomas47 is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Subwoofers, Bass, and Transducers

Tags
Speaker Systems , Svs , svs pb-2000 , Svs Pb1000 10 Inch 300 Watt Powered Subwoofer , Svs Pb12 Nsd Black Vinyl 12 Inch Powered Subwoofer , svs pb12 plus , Svs Pb13 Ultra , svs pc-4000 , Svs Pc12 Nsd 12 Inch 400 Watt Powered Cylinder Subwoofer , Svs Pc12 Ultra , Svs Sb1000 12 Inch 300 Watt Powered Subwoofer , Svs Sb12 Nsd Charcoal Black Vinyl 12 Inch 400 Watt Powered Subwoofer , Svs Sb13 Ultra Piano Gloss 13 Inch 1000 Watt Powered Subwoofer , Svs Sb2000

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off