Official SVS Owners/Support Thread. - Page 944 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #28291 of 31356 Old 05-26-2018, 01:44 PM
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Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
That's sort of like being all dressed up with nowhere to go!

I think that you are really going to like your new PB16, but as for what mode you will prefer to use it in, that's something that you will need to experiment with to determine. If you don't use any of the port plugs, and you keep it in Standard mode, you will get a little more SPL above 20Hz. Whether you would actually notice the difference is a YMMV sort of thing.

If you plug one port (any port) and set the DSP to Extended mode, you will get more SPL below 20Hz. With the right content, most people are likely to notice that. <20Hz frequencies are where you will hear/feel the deepest bass effects. Most professional recommendations I have seen for the various Ultras have recommended using the Extended mode, and that is certainly what I prefer. But, that's just something for you to decide for yourself.

If you plug all of the ports and set the DSP to Sealed mode, you will have converted your great big ported sub into an SB16. So, that is not a mode that most people use, although again it's a YMMV issue. I hope that this brief discussion of modes helps!

Regards,
Mike
Yep, been all dressed up for it a couple days now, but least everything's ready and in place for its arrival.

And awesome, thanks for that. Sounds like plugging one port is exactly what I'm looking to do. Doubt I'll ever want to plug them all unless I'm just playing around with music, but this will mainly be used for movies and I'm ready for Blade Runner to kick me in the chest.
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post #28292 of 31356 Old 05-26-2018, 01:52 PM
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Originally Posted by GOOCHY View Post
I just wanted to follow up in this thread to let folks know that the amp in my SB-4000 did fail and SVS had a new amp to me within two days. I put the new amp in last night and everything is back up and rolling. They provided me a return ship label so the failed amp will go back to SVS. Brad in customer service was awesome. One phone call, a couple follow-up emails post-troubleshooting, and they had an amp out the door early the next morning. That's customer service. Thanks SVS!
so you had to tear into a 1500 dollar sub yourself, and replace the amp?
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post #28293 of 31356 Old 05-26-2018, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by nodoubt View Post
so you had to tear into a 1500 dollar sub yourself, and replace the amp?
I did, but it wasn't any big deal. There are ten or so screws holding the amp on, and two easily removed cables - one going to the display, and one going to the woofer - to remove. I can see how plenty of people would not be on board to do that.
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post #28294 of 31356 Old 05-27-2018, 01:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Rengozu View Post
Yep, been all dressed up for it a couple days now, but least everything's ready and in place for its arrival.

And awesome, thanks for that. Sounds like plugging one port is exactly what I'm looking to do. Doubt I'll ever want to plug them all unless I'm just playing around with music, but this will mainly be used for movies and I'm ready for Blade Runner to kick me in the chest.
I'm running dual PB-16's in Extended mode, and Blade Runner 2049 is one of my favorite movies Not running my subs anywhere close to their limit, as I wish them to last for a good number of years.

Please do let us know your thoughts once you're up and running!
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post #28295 of 31356 Old 05-27-2018, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
Hi,


You are very welcome! Yes, you can absolutely just trade AVR trim for subwoofer gain without rerunning Audyssey. It may be a little difficult to determine exactly where you are in subwoofer volume, but honestly, that is not something I would worry about. If I were you, I would just set my AVR trim at about -5 or -6, and then turn up the gain controls on my subwoofers symmetrically to the volume that sounds appropriate to you. You could be playing some bass-heavy content at your normal -15 MV while you make the adjustment, and just adjust the sub gains symmetrically until you are satisfied with the balanced bass.

I would probably make a note of what your original sub gains were, just for future reference, but in my opinion, it's not really critical information anyway. Wherever your gain settings are, after calibration, you are just going to add bass until you have what you want. If you start with an AVR trim setting of about -6, that will give you a little room to adjust upward and downward in a listening session, with the remote and without ever leaving your chair. For more substantial increases than a decibel or two, I would continue to make any further increases after this with the gain controls.

Regards,
Mike
Thanks Mike I printed this to show how much gain/trim in the AVR to a sub my friend is setting up his first AVR and 5.1 system. After he read what you posted here he understood.

I ran across this bech test on a PB 13 Ultra, wow there is a lot of info here plus your articles. This is a lot to take in but I am going to do the test to see when you need to back off the gain when the dB does NOT go up. I purchased the CM-130 SPL meter Ed at SVS likes to use to help read the signal. My old Rat Shack is really close on C FAST, surprised after 28 years. REW and the mic and read more. Ed set mine up for me so I can swap sub cables from my AVR and plug in my NAD analog system and not have to touch the DSP.

https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofe...3-measurements
Thanks again Mike for all the time you spent on this.
Louis
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post #28296 of 31356 Old 05-27-2018, 04:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Louis Bartay View Post
Thanks Mike I printed this to show how much gain/trim in the AVR to a sub my friend is setting up his first AVR and 5.1 system. After he read what you posted here he understood.

I ran across this bech test on a PB 13 Ultra, wow there is a lot of info here plus your articles. This is a lot to take in but I am going to do the test to see when you need to back off the gain when the dB does NOT go up. I purchased the CM-130 SPL meter Ed at SVS likes to use to help read the signal. My old Rat Shack is really close on C FAST, surprised after 28 years. REW and the mic and read more. Ed set mine up for me so I can swap sub cables from my AVR and plug in my NAD analog system and not have to touch the DSP.

https://www.audioholics.com/subwoofe...3-measurements
Thanks again Mike for all the time you spent on this.
Louis

You are very welcome, Louis! I'm glad if the Guide has helped. Those Data-Bass and Audioholics tests and articles are terrific aren't they?

Believe it or not, I think I have benefited from the Guide more than anyone. The research, writing, editing, and updating have taught me a lot. And, every time I learn something new, or develop a little better understanding of something, I put it in the Guide so that everyone (including myself) can refer to it whenever we need to.

Regards,
Mike

GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
Speaker placements & Room treatments; HT calibration & Room EQ; Room gain; Bass
Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.
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post #28297 of 31356 Old 05-28-2018, 05:36 AM
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Thanks Mike. I get so much help from everyone on this forum. It's cost me a lot in the process but at least when I buy new gear I know it will work out great in the end. Have a great holiday.

Mike
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post #28298 of 31356 Old 05-28-2018, 06:42 AM
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Anybody know of a good AV guy in the DC area who can install and optimize a subwoofer for me? Will probably need a new center channel speaker as well, but will hold off after seeing how the system sounds after a new sub. Also could use some calibration/setting optimization for another room as well. Would be an extra perk if s/he can also calibrate a new jvc rs540 projector. PM is fine. Thanks.
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post #28299 of 31356 Old 05-30-2018, 02:50 AM
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Originally Posted by zeak View Post
Anybody know of a good AV guy in the DC area who can install and optimize a subwoofer for me? Will probably need a new center channel speaker as well, but will hold off after seeing how the system sounds after a new sub. Also could use some calibration/setting optimization for another room as well. Would be an extra perk if s/he can also calibrate a new jvc rs540 projector. PM is fine. Thanks.
I too live in the DC area and know of a few AV guys who can do installations for less than what the big store guys charge. But they are not calibrators and all they will do for you is run Audyssey (or its equivalent) which you can do for yourself for free. If you do need a name of someone who can do wiring and install the sub for you, let me know and I'll PM you his details. If you find the name of someone who does calibrations (especially REW which I would very much like to learn to use), please let me know since I need some help too. Thanks.

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post #28300 of 31356 Old 05-30-2018, 06:50 AM
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Originally Posted by GOOCHY View Post
I did, but it wasn't any big deal. There are ten or so screws holding the amp on, and two easily removed cables - one going to the display, and one going to the woofer - to remove. I can see how plenty of people would not be on board to do that.
Who would not be onboard to do it themselves? I got my amp swapped out and it was was better an experience than shipping it or bringing it somewhere and waiting 2 weeks for something that took me less than 30 minutes to do and SVS gives you the only tool you need for the job.

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post #28301 of 31356 Old 05-30-2018, 07:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Jim Kiler View Post
Who would not be onboard to do it themselves? I got my amp swapped out and it was was better an experience than shipping it or bringing it somewhere and waiting 2 weeks for something that took me less than 30 minutes to do and SVS gives you the only tool you need for the job.
You can't understand how a potentially non-technical person would not want to tear into their brand new $1500 subwoofer after just a month of ownership?
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post #28302 of 31356 Old 05-30-2018, 09:53 AM
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Hi folks! I'm new to SVS ownership, having purchased a used PC12-Plus a few weeks ago. So far, I'm blown away by this sub (layers of extremely accurate and tight bass...IMO) and the famous SVS customer service. I made a small riser using SVS Soundpath feet and some MLV (mass loaded vinyl) I had laying around - seems to work well. Overall - I'm super pleased, but feel foolish for waiting so long to get a real sub!
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post #28303 of 31356 Old 05-30-2018, 09:55 AM
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Who would not be onboard to do it themselves? I got my amp swapped out and it was was better an experience than shipping it or bringing it somewhere and waiting 2 weeks for something that took me less than 30 minutes to do and SVS gives you the only tool you need for the job.
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Originally Posted by GOOCHY View Post
You can't understand how a potentially non-technical person would not want to tear into their brand new $1500 subwoofer after just a month of ownership?
You both make valid points. I would guess the majority of people (myself included) who frequent these threads have no problem or issue replacing a sub amp. However, there are some who admittedly don’t care to or are not adept at performing such tasks.
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post #28304 of 31356 Old 05-30-2018, 12:11 PM
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It's a matter of choice. You can send whole subwoofer, but then you will have to wait longer.
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post #28305 of 31356 Old 05-30-2018, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Kevog View Post
Hi folks! I'm new to SVS ownership, having purchased a used PC12-Plus a few weeks ago. So far, I'm blown away by this sub (layers of extremely accurate and tight bass...IMO) and the famous SVS customer service. I made a small riser using SVS Soundpath feet and some MLV (mass loaded vinyl) I had laying around - seems to work well. Overall - I'm super pleased, but feel foolish for waiting so long to get a real sub!
Congrats on the sub. But you could've just removed the base plate and put the soundpath isolation feet right on the sub. Might have been easier.

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post #28306 of 31356 Old 05-30-2018, 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Kevog View Post
Hi folks! I'm new to SVS ownership, having purchased a used PC12-Plus a few weeks ago. So far, I'm blown away by this sub (layers of extremely accurate and tight bass...IMO) and the famous SVS customer service. I made a small riser using SVS Soundpath feet and some MLV (mass loaded vinyl) I had laying around - seems to work well. Overall - I'm super pleased, but feel foolish for waiting so long to get a real sub!
Nice. I wonder if that was mine. I recently traded up dual pc12+ for dual pc-4000. I put the soundpath feet right on the base plate. Enjoy- it’s an excellent sub.

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post #28307 of 31356 Old 05-30-2018, 06:02 PM
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Oh man, barely out of the box with almost factory settings and this thing is so much fun! Exactly what I was missing in this room, and don't even get me started on Blade Runner 2049. . . might even need to check for foundation damage on the house after all that boom!




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post #28308 of 31356 Old 05-30-2018, 06:36 PM
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My Ultra BS was on the FedEx truck for delivery at 3:59 this morning... so, no further away than 10 miles and showing delivery by the end of the day...

At the end of the day the website shows "No scheduled delivery date available at this time."

All day waiting... (Not the first issue I've had with them.)

Of course that means another all day wait whenever they figure out what they're doing.

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post #28309 of 31356 Old 05-30-2018, 06:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Matt2026 View Post
My Ultra BS was on the FedEx truck for delivery at 3:59 this morning... so, no further away than 10 miles and showing delivery by the end of the day...

At the end of the day the website shows "No scheduled delivery date available at this time."

All day waiting... (Not the first issue I've had with them.)

Of course that means another all day wait whenever they figure out what they're doing.
That is Ultra BS!
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post #28310 of 31356 Old 05-30-2018, 06:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Matt2026 View Post
My Ultra BS was on the FedEx truck for delivery at 3:59 this morning... so, no further away than 10 miles and showing delivery by the end of the day...

At the end of the day the website shows "No scheduled delivery date available at this time."

All day waiting... (Not the first issue I've had with them.)

Of course that means another all day wait whenever they figure out what they're doing.
That is frustrating, specially if you cannot work from home.

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post #28311 of 31356 Old 05-30-2018, 06:41 PM
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That is Ultra BS!
You must have read my mind because I was thinking the same thing as I wrote up my post
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post #28312 of 31356 Old 05-30-2018, 07:04 PM
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That is frustrating, specially if you cannot work from home.
Thanks for commiserating with me Jim, but fear not, I'll survive it

Actually, I turned in my resignation letter in March of 1997. Ended up doing some part time contract work for ~7 years, averaging 4 to 5 hours a week the last 3 years and then pulled the plug. So, no work since ~2004 It was a great way to leave the job behind as I went from 60 hours a week, winding down to 4-5 hours some weeks at the end with some 1 to 2 month periods of no work tossed into the mix.

There was zero shock at the end compared to some folks who are going full speed one day and then zero the next Also I realized along my life's journey, that amongst other things, I was not my job. It was something I had

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post #28313 of 31356 Old 05-30-2018, 07:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Matt2026 View Post
My Ultra BS was on the FedEx truck for delivery at 3:59 this morning... so, no further away than 10 miles and showing delivery by the end of the day...

At the end of the day the website shows "No scheduled delivery date available at this time."

All day waiting... (Not the first issue I've had with them.)

Of course that means another all day wait whenever they figure out what they're doing.
Now that sucks. For whatever reason they used a Semi-truck specialty service to deliver mine and not the typical UPS/Fed-Ex types. Well hopefully someone can be there to sign for it tomorrow.

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post #28314 of 31356 Old 05-30-2018, 07:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Matt2026 View Post
My Ultra BS was on the FedEx truck for delivery at 3:59 this morning... so, no further away than 10 miles and showing delivery by the end of the day...

At the end of the day the website shows "No scheduled delivery date available at this time."

All day waiting... (Not the first issue I've had with them.)

Of course that means another all day wait whenever they figure out what they're doing.
FedEx just dropped off my speaker Driver said that because of the holiday he had more packages to deliver until he's caught up

Time to open it up and see what condition its in...

[Edit] Looks brand new

Connected in place of my front right to check it out.

The Guess Who (Quadrophonic recording) Road Food sounds great

Regards, Ken (Retired)
9.1.) Denon 4520CI; Samsung 55H8000; OPPO 203; 6x SVS Ultra BS,
Ultra Center; FH 2xPolk; Rythmik F12; CyberPower CP1500PFCLCD (x2)
2.1 Ch.) Nak RE-1, CR7A, BD F7500, Aircom T-8, Denon 300F/Ortofon 2M Bronze;
ADS L1290(x2); PINNACLE BABYBOOMER SUB, PANAMAX MR4300

Last edited by Matt2026; 05-30-2018 at 07:48 PM.
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post #28315 of 31356 Old 05-31-2018, 05:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Kini62 View Post
Congrats on the sub. But you could've just removed the base plate and put the soundpath isolation feet right on the sub. Might have been easier.

I thought about that - but I wanted to raise the sub and get a few layers of that MLV going....
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post #28316 of 31356 Old 05-31-2018, 03:41 PM
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Its here! Its here!


Got the new PB-16 Ultra sub in today, drug it upstairs, re-ran Audyssey etc and got all set in to listen to music and watch stuff blow up...




And my first impression? meh...


It definately does lower than my 10yr old 15" Velodyne that it just replaced, but the volume just isn't there. Super 8 train crash had more depth but signifiantly less force. So much so that I drug the old one back in and plugged it in just to be sure Audyssey didn't mess with something. Even at 60% volume on my Velodyone DLR-5000R (15" 1000W RMS, 23Hz from ~2007) it has significantly more thump (>3dB based on my iphone free SPL meter app) than the PB-16 Ultra does set at 0dB. That's without changing any of the AVR settings, just moving the cord from one sub to the other and replaying the same track...




Do these things take awhile to loosen up perhaps?? What am I missing?? I set the EQ to extended and plugged the center port, but haven't messed with any other setting it arrived with.
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post #28317 of 31356 Old 05-31-2018, 04:02 PM
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Originally Posted by rx7gslse View Post
Its here! Its here!


Got the new PB-16 Ultra sub in today, drug it upstairs, re-ran Audyssey etc and got all set in to listen to music and watch stuff blow up...




And my first impression? meh...


It definately does lower than my 10yr old 15" Velodyne that it just replaced, but the volume just isn't there. Super 8 train crash had more depth but signifiantly less force. So much so that I drug the old one back in and plugged it in just to be sure Audyssey didn't mess with something. Even at 60% volume on my Velodyone DLR-5000R (15" 1000W RMS, 23Hz from ~2007) it has significantly more thump (>3dB based on my iphone free SPL meter app) than the PB-16 Ultra does set at 0dB. That's without changing any of the AVR settings, just moving the cord from one sub to the other and replaying the same track...




Do these things take awhile to loosen up perhaps?? What am I missing?? I set the EQ to extended and plugged the center port, but haven't messed with any other setting it arrived with.

my pb4000 took a few weeks to loosen up, as well as all other svs subs ive had.
that pb16 you have should still mop the floor with that vd , even out of the box.
i would def run the standard setting to break it in, all ports open
it has more overall output
are you getting good excursion with the woofer ?
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Last edited by nodoubt; 05-31-2018 at 04:08 PM.
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post #28318 of 31356 Old 05-31-2018, 04:56 PM
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Originally Posted by rx7gslse View Post
Its here! Its here!

Got the new PB-16 Ultra sub in today, drug it upstairs, re-ran Audyssey etc and got all set in to listen to music and watch stuff blow up...

And my first impression? meh...


It definately does lower than my 10yr old 15" Velodyne that it just replaced, but the volume just isn't there. Super 8 train crash had more depth but signifiantly less force. So much so that I drug the old one back in and plugged it in just to be sure Audyssey didn't mess with something. Even at 60% volume on my Velodyone DLR-5000R (15" 1000W RMS, 23Hz from ~2007) it has significantly more thump (>3dB based on my iphone free SPL meter app) than the PB-16 Ultra does set at 0dB. That's without changing any of the AVR settings, just moving the cord from one sub to the other and replaying the same track...

Do these things take awhile to loosen up perhaps?? What am I missing?? I set the EQ to extended and plugged the center port, but haven't messed with any other setting it arrived with.
Hi,

I have never been quite sure about subwoofer break-in. It did seem to me that a new PB4000 got louder after a few spirited listening sessions, but who knows? I am sure, though, that running Audyssey, and then just switching back-and-forth between the two subs doesn't prove anything. The room EQ would be entirely different for those two subwoofers. Audyssey might have deliberately done something based on the PB16's interaction with the room, that allowed the Velodyne to exhibit a louder peak at a particular frequency.

Did I understand you to say that you turned the PB16 up to the max setting on the subwoofer, and you still weren't getting enough volume? If so, it is also possible that you are accustomed to hearing more mid-bass than the PB16 produces, and that you may like mid-bass more than low-bass. (Note: your phone app won't even be able to measure the low-bass SPL. It doesn't go low enough to do that.)

If it does turn out that you really prefer mid-bass to low-bass as some people certainly do, then break-in period or not, the PB16 may not be the best subwoofer for you. I would definitely give myself some time to see if the low-bass capabilities of the PB16 grow on you. But, if they don't grow on you, and you believe that you just want more mid-bass than it can produce, then I would investigate a PSA V3601. That subwoofer deliberately emphasizes mid-bass frequencies relative to low-bass frequencies, where the PB16 does the exact opposite. It's entirely a YMMV issue!

Regards,
Mike
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GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
Speaker placements & Room treatments; HT calibration & Room EQ; Room gain; Bass
Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.
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post #28319 of 31356 Old 05-31-2018, 05:42 PM
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Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
Hi,

I have never been quite sure about subwoofer break-in. It did seem to me that a new PB4000 got louder after a few spirited listening sessions, but who knows? I am sure, though, that running Audyssey, and then just switching back-and-forth between the two subs doesn't prove anything. The room EQ would be entirely different for those two subwoofers. Audyssey might have deliberately done something based on the PB16's interaction with the room, that allowed the Velodyne to exhibit a louder peak at a particular frequency.

Did I understand you to say that you turned the PB16 up to the max setting on the subwoofer, and you still weren't getting enough volume? If so, it is also possible that you are accustomed to hearing more mid-bass than the PB16 produces, and that you may like mid-bass more than low-bass. (Note: your phone app won't even be able to measure the low-bass SPL. It doesn't go low enough to do that.)

If it does turn out that you really prefer mid-bass to low-bass as some people certainly do, then break-in period or not, the PB16 may not be the best subwoofer for you. I would definitely give myself some time to see if the low-bass capabilities of the PB16 grow on you. But, if they don't grow on you, and you believe that you just want more mid-bass than it can produce, then I would investigate a PSA V3601. That subwoofer deliberately emphasizes mid-bass frequencies relative to low-bass frequencies, where the PB16 does the exact opposite. It's entirely a YMMV issue!

Regards,
Mike
I dunno about mid-bass vs low base, but even at 0db this doesn’t have very much room rattle, movies or music... I’ve done the crawl and it’s in the 1/4 wall front position where it seemed. I keep flipping back and forth and it just seems like something on this isn’t working right. I can see the woofer move, and I get a fair amount of sound, it’s just not very impactful?

I remember just being able to feel the one I demoed at the store... this one I don’t get that. Wondering if this one is messed up or something?

My brother in law got his sb-16 delivered today as well, so may have to do some comparisons this weekend... but for the size/power/weight of this it doesn’t seem to hold up to my old one... not what I expected at all.
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post #28320 of 31356 Old 05-31-2018, 05:49 PM
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Originally Posted by rx7gslse View Post
I dunno about mid-bass vs low base, but even at 0db this doesn’t have very much room rattle, movies or music... I’ve done the crawl and it’s in the 1/4 wall front position where it seemed. I keep flipping back and forth and it just seems like something on this isn’t working right. I can see the woofer move, and I get a fair amount of sound, it’s just not very impactful?

I remember just being able to feel the one I demoed at the store... this one I don’t get that. Wondering if this one is messed up or something?

My brother in law got his sb-16 delivered today as well, so may have to do some comparisons this weekend... but for the size/power/weight of this it doesn’t seem to hold up to my old one... not what I expected at all.

Sound like you have a placement problem, or maybe the setting on your sub or AVR.


Not sure if you read this thread, while long to read, a lot of good information can be found;
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/113-su...eferences.html


The answer to your problem, is more likely in there.


Ray
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