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post #29521 of 31781 Old 11-10-2018, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
Hi,

I can visualize what you are saying alright, so a diagram wouldn't really change my response. In theory, you can put a sub anywhere, and it can be hard to know in advance where it will or won't sound good. Ideally, you would do a sub crawl, and if you couldn't put the subwoofer in the best location, you would at least rule-out any really bad locations.

I don't see where facing the driver toward the wall will be a problem. And, I'm not sure that having a doorway just beyond the subwoofer will be a problem. If that is the "back" wall of the room you are talking about, however, I might be a little bit concerned about bass localization, since most of the action (or music) will typically be coming from the front wall where your display and front speakers are located. But, this is just something that you will have to experiment with to determine.
Regards,
Mike
Thanks, Mike! That was a great explanation and very helpful.
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post #29522 of 31781 Old 11-10-2018, 05:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Prophizee View Post
Yup that's exactly what there doing there tech made me do some testing and concluded definitely the amp. They are shipping new one out on Monday should have it by Wednesday. Thanks guys for all the help

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk

sorry to hear .
mine went out after about a month, its very depressing for sure to have to deal with it.
just be careful when you pop the amp out, it will seriously POP out.
all at once.
mine has been flawless since replacement.
i told them to please check out the new amp b4 they sent it, and run the crap out of it !
hate to see its still a problem, but the new amps seem to be better.
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post #29523 of 31781 Old 11-10-2018, 05:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Ferrari_1996 View Post
Spotify Premium is 320kbps OGG Vorbis, which apparently is a better codec than MP3, so the quality should be a little better than 320kbps MP3s. I don't think I would notice a big difference stepping up to CDs? Not to mention the convenience of streaming and the fact that Spotify allows me to discover new music.

I urge anyone to chime in, because I'd like to know if there would be a substantial enough quality difference over Spotify Premium to justify the increased cost of purchasing CDs.
My turn table and reel to reel sounds better then my CD or streaming format but at a cost, and a hassle to play and store.Retired have time to clean and play a LP and enjoy the warm analog sound that most CD do not reproduce. But it takes near TOTL equipment and someone that knows how to set up a TT cartridge with "Protractor" VTA,VTF etc. So I can see how some like to stream music but when you get use to listening to a MFSL Original Recorded LP from the Master Tapes WOW the same CD has a "Edgie" sound to it. YMMV on some LP VS CD as I have many of the same and I do a blind test with friends that come over. . Most of the time everyone picks the LP to their liking.
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post #29524 of 31781 Old 11-10-2018, 07:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Louis Bartay View Post
My turn table and reel to reel sounds better then my CD or streaming format but at a cost, and a hassle to play and store.Retired have time to clean and play a LP and enjoy the warm analog sound that most CD do not reproduce. But it takes near TOTL equipment and someone that knows how to set up a TT cartridge with "Protractor" VTA,VTF etc. So I can see how some like to stream music but when you get use to listening to a MFSL Original Recorded LP from the Master Tapes WOW the same CD has a "Edgie" sound to it. YMMV on some LP VS CD as I have many of the same and I do a blind test with friends that come over. . Most of the time everyone picks the LP to their liking.

A true fact, my friend

While a LP have more distortion than a CD recording. It sound better to our hearing system, because they distort it the second order (could have been even distortion frequencies). And digital recording, distort in the first order (could have been, odd). It sound better to us human, since the second order/even distortions, is more pleasant to our hearing system/brain. Cannot remember all the details now, since I remember this lesson, but was over 30 years ago.
If I find a link, I will post-it later.

Found one;
https://electronics.howstuffworks.co...ds-or-dvds.htm

It also show on the first graph, why is my preference for an AVP over an AVR, for better DAC (Digital Analog Converter).
All those steps are from a DAC, the better ones have more of those steps, mostly found on an AVP, the difference between DAC, and do cost more. The reason AVP cost more, more quality parts, not including transistor, resistor and many other small parts, for been either 0.1-1% instead of 10% tolerance.


Ray

Last edited by darthray; 11-11-2018 at 06:39 PM.
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post #29525 of 31781 Old 11-11-2018, 06:44 PM
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Originally Posted by darthray View Post
A true fact, my friend

While a LP have more distortion than a CD recording. It sound better to our hearing system, because they distort it the second order (could have been even distortion frequencies). And digital recording, distort in the first order (could have been, odd). It sound better to us human, since the second order/even distortions, is more pleasant to our hearing system/brain. Cannot remember all the details now, since I remember this lesson, but was over 30 years ago.
If I find a link, I will post-it later.

Found one;
https://electronics.howstuffworks.co...ds-or-dvds.htm

It also show on the first graph, why is my preference for an AVP over an AVR, for better DAC (Digital Analog Converter).
All those steps are from a DAC, the better ones have more of those steps, mostly found on an AVP, the difference between DAC, and do cost more. The reason AVP cost more, more quality parts, not including transistor, resistor and many other small parts, for been either 0.1-1% instead of 10% tolerance.


Ray
Quote:
Originally Posted by Louis Bartay View Post
My turn table and reel to reel sounds better then my CD or streaming format but at a cost, and a hassle to play and store.Retired have time to clean and play a LP and enjoy the warm analog sound that most CD do not reproduce. But it takes near TOTL equipment and someone that knows how to set up a TT cartridge with "Protractor" VTA,VTF etc. So I can see how some like to stream music but when you get use to listening to a MFSL Original Recorded LP from the Master Tapes WOW the same CD has a "Edgie" sound to it. YMMV on some LP VS CD as I have many of the same and I do a blind test with friends that come over. . Most of the time everyone picks the LP to their liking.

Forgot to mention in my previous post, this is the reason that Vinyl LP, that were dead, came back with a vengeance


Ray
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post #29526 of 31781 Old 11-12-2018, 06:42 AM
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Everyday I love my PB16 more and more. Yesterday my eight year old and I watched Incredibles 2. The low end in that movie is amazing. Ever action seen with low end resulted in a smile on his face from ear to ear that was only matched by mine. He even said “daddy I feel like I’m in the movie. I feel every thing.”

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post #29527 of 31781 Old 11-12-2018, 08:21 PM
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[QUOTE=ANSEK;57095676]Everyday I love my PB16 more and more. Yesterday my eight year old and I watched Incredibles 2. The low end in that movie is amazing. Ever action seen with low end resulted in a smile on his face from ear to ear that was only matched by mine. He even said “daddy I feel like I’m in the movie. I feel every thing.”[/QUOTE]


Congrats on your PB16.
You will enjoy-it

And thanks for the heads-up about this movie, and my Wife got-it for me yesterday
Ralph, finally got his copy, and posted his review;
https://www.avsforum.com/forum/187-o...ay-review.html
Look very promising

The first Incredibles, was also very good in the bass department, and it was years ago since I saw this one


Ray
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post #29528 of 31781 Old 11-12-2018, 09:46 PM
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Originally Posted by ANSEK View Post
Everyday I love my PB16 more and more.
My congrats as well and enjoy! It's very easy to love the good, clean, accurate bass of an SVS sub...and the PB16 provides that extra measure of extension! Do experiment with the various port configs to see what you prefer in your room with your favorite content.

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Originally Posted by ANSEK View Post
Yesterday my eight year old and I watched Incredibles 2. The low end in that movie is amazing.
It's been quite a while since my 3 kids were eight! I also have Incredibles 2 but haven't watched it yet...waiting for movie night with the grandchildren. Don't know if you're aware or have had the opportunity but visiting the bass threads here in the forum will provide you with a variety of bass content...i.e. List of Bass in Movies, downloadable bass demos, etc.

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Originally Posted by ANSEK View Post
Ever action seen with low end resulted in a smile on his face from ear to ear that was only matched by mine. He even said “daddy I feel like I’m in the movie. I feel every thing.”
Your son definitely appears to be a burgeoning "basshead" and future AVS'er! Although all my kids love bass, in my case, one of my daughters matches my passion for bass!
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post #29529 of 31781 Old 11-12-2018, 10:11 PM
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Originally Posted by gene4ht View Post
my congrats as well and enjoy! it's very easy to love the good, clean, accurate bass of an svs sub...and the pb16 provides that extra measure of extension! Do experiment with the various port configs to see what you prefer in your room with your favorite content.


it's been quite a while since my 3 kids were eight! i also have incredibles 2 but haven't watched it yet...waiting for movie night with the grandchildren. don't know if you're aware or have had the opportunity but visiting the bass threads here in the forum will provide you with a variety of bass content...i.e. List of bass in movies, downloadable bass demos, etc.


your son definitely appears to be a burgeoning "basshead" and future avs'er! although all my kids love bass, in my case, one of my daughters matches my passion for bass!
LOL, about the kids, since mine are also grown-up, except for my Cats, that are my new kids now

Great to see/hear about your daughters
In this day of age, too many peoples do not care about audio sound
But there is hope, since Vinyl LP are back, as you know, and hope some of the newer generations, take over, from us. For what this great hobby is, not the ease of use.

Once a new user with clean bass, and got use to-it, many miss the extra boost in the mid bass frequencies.
There is no turning back, and this option as you already know trying this, is always available;
III-C: Cascading Crossovers:


Ray

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post #29530 of 31781 Old 11-13-2018, 04:49 PM
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Cascading Crossover

Hi Guys,

Just wanted to check if I'm doing this right. Mike has mentioned it lots of time as well as I few others so I was reading about it and this is my understanding. Firstly set all speaker crossover in AVR to 80hz or 90hz. Then lower the the low frequency in AVR from default 120hz to match the selected speaker crossover. Third set the LPF in the sub menu to the same setting as the first step. I guessing this is right. Just one other thing should I disable any other PEQs that I might be using in the presets and also does any extra db boost post Audysessy have any effect.
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post #29531 of 31781 Old 11-13-2018, 05:32 PM
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Originally Posted by bigzee3 View Post
Hi Guys,

Just wanted to check if I'm doing this right. Mike has mentioned it lots of time as well as I few others so I was reading about it and this is my understanding. Firstly set all speaker crossover in AVR to 80hz or 90hz. Then lower the the low frequency in AVR from default 120hz to match the selected speaker crossover. Third set the LPF in the sub menu to the same setting as the first step. I guessing this is right. Just one other thing should I disable any other PEQs that I might be using in the presets and also does any extra db boost post Audysessy have any effect.

Hi,

That all sounds correct. One other thing I would do is to set the slope in your subs to 24db per octave. That will help them to roll-off even a little faster above, lets say, 80Hz. When you do all of that, you will be concentrating more SPL below 80Hz, and that should make the bass both a little clearer and a little more impactful.

I don't want to call this a night-and-day difference. In fact, I think it's probably fairly subtle for most people. But, extra clarity is always welcome, for its own sake, and I especially notice the difference for dialogue.

I would probably try this without the 63Hz boost, at first, just to get used to it on its own. And then, I would add it back if I wanted to--just seasoning the sound to your individual taste. The subwoofer boosts that you have added post-Audyssey will, if anything, be a little stronger now, because they will be a little more concentrated below 80Hz. That's not night-and-day either, but dropping your LPF of LFE (in the AVR) from the default 120Hz, to ~80Hz, will make your subwoofer boosts more impactful for the LFE channel.

Regards,
Mike
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GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
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Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.
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post #29532 of 31781 Old 11-13-2018, 05:53 PM
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Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
Hi,

That all sounds correct. One other thing I would do is to set the slope in your subs to 24db per octave. That will help them to roll-off even a little faster above, lets say, 80Hz. When you do all of that, you will be concentrating more SPL below 80Hz, and that should make the bass both a little clearer and a little more impactful.

I don't want to call this a night-and-day difference. In fact, I think it's probably fairly subtle for most people. But, extra clarity is always welcome, for its own sake, and I especially notice the difference for dialogue.

I would probably try this without the 63Hz boost, at first, just to get used to it on its own. And then, I would add it back if I wanted to--just seasoning the sound to your individual taste. The subwoofer boosts that you have added post-Audyssey will, if anything, be a little stronger now, because they will be a little more concentrated below 80Hz. That's not night-and-day either, but dropping your LPF of LFE (in the AVR) from the default 120Hz, to ~80Hz, will make your subwoofer boosts more impactful for the LFE channel.

Regards,
Mike

As you already know, it did wonder for me in my room

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigzee3 View Post
Hi Guys,

Just wanted to check if I'm doing this right. Mike has mentioned it lots of time as well as I few others so I was reading about it and this is my understanding. Firstly set all speaker crossover in AVR to 80hz or 90hz. Then lower the the low frequency in AVR from default 120hz to match the selected speaker crossover. Third set the LPF in the sub menu to the same setting as the first step. I guessing this is right. Just one other thing should I disable any other PEQs that I might be using in the presets and also does any extra db boost post Audysessy have any effect.

The way I did mine, was the following;
- After doing the Audyssey calibration, I set all my speakers to 80Hz, most were 40-60Hz.
- Then I change the frequency cut off, to 80Hz on the subs (physically on the sub, not from an AVP/AVR).
- Then LFE on my AVP, to 80Hz from the default value of 120Hz.
- turn Off DEQ, a preference thing and my room situation, many prefer this one On.
- And finally added 2 dB, for my subs value from the calibration, on my AVP.

While I use an AVP (Audio Video processor), the same can be apply to an AVR.
My boost was only 2 dB for my room and preference. But it is not uncomment to raise higher than that, as many do.
It is all about personal preference, some like more bass than the other. There is no right or wrong way, for boosting your sub after calibration.

Unless pushing the sub/s too hard, and getting it/them into the dangerous zone of the sub/s amp, to get into clipping, meaning the amp, is out of juice and no longer control the sub driver to come back, after going out. This how bottoming out a sub, happen. Sound like a big POK, and those can destroy any drivers, on any subs, unless built with a protection system, that will not allow the sub to play that loud. While this last paragraph was more, for your personal information's. The same can be apply to Tweeters, mid drivers and bass drivers, for speakers. The reason it is better to have an AVR or amp, with too much power than not enough, to avoid the clipping zone.


Ray
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post #29533 of 31781 Old 11-13-2018, 06:48 PM
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Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
Hi,

That all sounds correct. One other thing I would do is to set the slope in your subs to 24db per octave. That will help them to roll-off even a little faster above, lets say, 80Hz. When you do all of that, you will be concentrating more SPL below 80Hz, and that should make the bass both a little clearer and a little more impactful.

I don't want to call this a night-and-day difference. In fact, I think it's probably fairly subtle for most people. But, extra clarity is always welcome, for its own sake, and I especially notice the difference for dialogue.

I would probably try this without the 63Hz boost, at first, just to get used to it on its own. And then, I would add it back if I wanted to--just seasoning the sound to your individual taste. The subwoofer boosts that you have added post-Audyssey will, if anything, be a little stronger now, because they will be a little more concentrated below 80Hz. That's not night-and-day either, but dropping your LPF of LFE (in the AVR) from the default 120Hz, to ~80Hz, will make your subwoofer boosts more impactful for the LFE channel.

Regards,
Mike
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post #29534 of 31781 Old 11-13-2018, 06:53 PM
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Originally Posted by darthray View Post
As you already know, it did wonder for me in my room




The way I did mine, was the following;
- After doing the Audyssey calibration, I set all my speakers to 80Hz, most were 40-60Hz.
- Then I change the frequency cut off, to 80Hz on the subs (physically on the sub, not from an AVP/AVR).
- Then LFE on my AVP, to 80Hz from the default value of 120Hz.
- turn Off DEQ, a preference thing and my room situation, many prefer this one On.
- And finally added 2 dB, for my subs value from the calibration, on my AVP.

While I use an AVP (Audio Video processor), the same can be apply to an AVR.
My boost was only 2 dB for my room and preference. But it is not uncomment to raise higher than that, as many do.
It is all about personal preference, some like more bass than the other. There is no right or wrong way, for boosting your sub after calibration.



Unless pushing the sub/s too hard, and getting it/them into the dangerous zone of the sub/s amp, to get into clipping, meaning the amp, is out of juice and no longer control the sub driver to come back, after going out. This how bottoming out a sub, happen. Sound like a big POK, and those can destroy any drivers, on any subs, unless built with a protection system, that will not allow the sub to play that loud. While this last paragraph was more, for your personal information's. The same can be apply to Tweeters, mid drivers and bass drivers, for speakers. The reason it is better to have an AVR or amp, with too much power than not enough, to avoid the clipping zone.


Ray
All sounds good Ray,

Hope my surrounds dropping from 120hz to 80hz isn't an issue.
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post #29535 of 31781 Old 11-13-2018, 07:03 PM
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Originally Posted by bigzee3 View Post
All sounds good Ray,

Hope my surrounds dropping from 120hz to 80hz isn't an issue.

That was for my speakers
Nothing wrong if yours require 120 Hz.
What matter, is your sub setting, since all speakers differ from various system.


Ray
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post #29536 of 31781 Old 11-13-2018, 10:09 PM
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Hi guys. Quick update. Received my 2 PB 4000's today. One of the boxes had a huge hole in it, but after opening the box it doesn't look like it took any damage. I am a little concerned about one thing. I know SVS is a legit company and their Bill of rights is an awesome perk.

That being said, one of the woofers had the power cord unwrapped and not in it's clear plastic. It also looks smaller in width then the other woofer power cable. The lettering and numbers is the same though. Just kind of odd as if these are indeed brand new woofers, I would think they would be all brand new in original packaging as when they were made and packed at the factory.

More concerning and a bigger issue is that I think I may have an issue with one of the woofers. It powers on but I am not getting any sound to the woofer. I am using outlaw audio's wirless modules hooked up to my Denon 7200 WA and the first woofer connects and work perfectly but the second one I am not getting any sound at all.

The outlaw receiver has a solid green and blue light showing that the woofer is connected to the Denon but no sound is coming through. I am a little more then disappointed. Other then swapping cables and checking connections to the AVR sub, I don't know what else it could be. Makes me go back to my first thought that maybe one of the subs was not brand new? Pretty bummed out at the moment and of course SVS is closed. Going to call first thing in the morning. Any of you gurus have any ideas as to what may be going on?

UPDATE#2-Well, I think I have a bad sub or more then likely amp. I hooked up my old subwoofer and immediately have sound from the right sub position. Disconnecting from the old sub and hooking back up to the new PB4000, I have no sound at all. I don't know if it's placebo, but if I put my hand on the woofer I think I can feel a little vibration but it may just be from the other PB 4000.

I can connect to it using the app, and the front display works fine. I wonder if the amp is bad? I thought SVS q&A'd their products before they packaged them for selling? The box even has an "Inspected by" sticker. WTF?! I heard their woofers were being made in China now. I am very upset and seriously disappointed.

I'm sure they will want me to replace the amp rather then shipping me a new sub. They better overnight me the amp at this point. I would assume the amp is pretty easy to swap out. Oh well, not really real world problems as I am lucky enough to be able to buy these new toys. Anyways, good night all and i'll update once I get things sorted
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post #29537 of 31781 Old 11-14-2018, 03:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Islandborn View Post
Hi guys. Quick update. Received my 2 PB 4000's today. One of the boxes had a huge hole in it, but after opening the box it doesn't look like it took any damage. I am a little concerned about one thing. I know SVS is a legit company and their Bill of rights is an awesome perk.

That being said, one of the woofers had the power cord unwrapped and not in it's clear plastic. It also looks smaller in width then the other woofer power cable. The lettering and numbers is the same though. Just kind of odd as if these are indeed brand new woofers, I would think they would be all brand new in original packaging as when they were made and packed at the factory.

More concerning and a bigger issue is that I think I may have an issue with one of the woofers. It powers on but I am not getting any sound to the woofer. I am using outlaw audio's wirless modules hooked up to my Denon 7200 WA and the first woofer connects and work perfectly but the second one I am not getting any sound at all.

The outlaw receiver has a solid green and blue light showing that the woofer is connected to the Denon but no sound is coming through. I am a little more then disappointed. Other then swapping cables and checking connections to the AVR sub, I don't know what else it could be. Makes me go back to my first thought that maybe one of the subs was not brand new? Pretty bummed out at the moment and of course SVS is closed. Going to call first thing in the morning. Any of you gurus have any ideas as to what may be going on?

UPDATE#2-Well, I think I have a bad sub or more then likely amp. I hooked up my old subwoofer and immediately have sound from the right sub position. Disconnecting from the old sub and hooking back up to the new PB4000, I have no sound at all. I don't know if it's placebo, but if I put my hand on the woofer I think I can feel a little vibration but it may just be from the other PB 4000.

I can connect to it using the app, and the front display works fine. I wonder if the amp is bad? I thought SVS q&A'd their products before they packaged them for selling? The box even has an "Inspected by" sticker. WTF?! I heard their woofers were being made in China now. I am very upset and seriously disappointed.

I'm sure they will want me to replace the amp rather then shipping me a new sub. They better overnight me the amp at this point. I would assume the amp is pretty easy to swap out. Oh well, not really real world problems as I am lucky enough to be able to buy these new toys. Anyways, good night all and i'll update once I get things sorted
Woah! Honestly don't remember if I've heard of any D.O.A. subs before, but I don't think so. I would be seriously upset too if that had happened to me!

Hope it goes well for you, please keep us posted!

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post #29538 of 31781 Old 11-14-2018, 05:31 AM
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Any word on the new PC3000??

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post #29539 of 31781 Old 11-14-2018, 05:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigzee3 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthray View Post
As you already know, it did wonder for me in my room[IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gif[/IMG]




The way I did mine, was the following;
- After doing the Audyssey calibration, I set all my speakers to 80Hz, most were 40-60Hz.
- Then I change the frequency cut off, to 80Hz on the subs (physically on the sub, not from an AVP/AVR).
- Then LFE on my AVP, to 80Hz from the default value of 120Hz.
- turn Off DEQ, a preference thing and my room situation, many prefer this one On.
- And finally added 2 dB, for my subs value from the calibration, on my AVP.

While I use an AVP (Audio Video processor), the same can be apply to an AVR.
My boost was only 2 dB for my room and preference. But it is not uncomment to raise higher than that, as many do.
It is all about personal preference, some like more bass than the other. There is no right or wrong way, for boosting your sub after calibration.



Unless pushing the sub/s too hard, and getting it/them into the dangerous zone of the sub/s amp, to get into clipping, meaning the amp, is out of juice and no longer control the sub driver to come back, after going out. This how bottoming out a sub, happen. Sound like a big POK, and those can destroy any drivers, on any subs, unless built with a protection system, that will not allow the sub to play that loud. While this last paragraph was more, for your personal information's. The same can be apply to Tweeters, mid drivers and bass drivers, for speakers. The reason it is better to have an AVR or amp, with too much power than not enough, to avoid the clipping zone.


Ray
All sounds good Ray,

Hope my surrounds dropping from 120hz to 80hz isn't an issue.[IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif[/IMG]
I wonder if the SUB/bass boost can be done after a DIRAC calibration? Most have said that as good as DIRAC is, it kills the low end-even on subs like SVS...

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post #29540 of 31781 Old 11-14-2018, 06:34 AM
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I wonder if the SUB/bass boost can be done after a DIRAC calibration? Most have said that as good as DIRAC is, it kills the low end-even on subs like SVS...

Hi,

Yes, you can boost your sub(s) after a Dirac calibration, or after any other calibration!

Despite reference sources like the Guide, linked below, I think that the whole issue of adding subwoofer boosts is frequently misunderstood. All calibrations, by whatever kind of automated routine (Audyssey, Dirac, YPAO, MCACC, or whatever) has two components. One, is the component of level-matching all of the speaker channels, including the subwoofer(s), so that they all play the same volume at the MLP. Some systems do that in a different way than others do, and some do it better. But, they all try to do do that.

The second component is the creation of filters to EQ all, or part of, the frequency response. Again, some do that differently and more effectively than others. But, it is an entirely separate thing to EQ peaks and dips in the FR than it is to make all of the speakers play the same overall volume at the MLP. (The test tone used to set volume levels for the speakers/subs is not usually even a full-range test tone, where the test tones used to EQ are broader in coverage--they typically go much higher and lower in frequency.)

So, since the two components of calibration are different mechanisms, with different purposes, we can change the volume level of any speaker or subwoofer, without affecting the EQ component. If you want your center channel to play a little louder after a calibration, you can increase the volume. If the surround channels sound too loud for some network programs (CBS used to be really bad about that) you can turn them down. If you want more bass, you can boost your subwoofers, or reduce the bass when you want to. Doing any of those things has no effect on the room EQ (flattening-out peaks and dips) that was performed during a calibration.

Changing the volume of a speaker only affects how loudly that particular speaker plays. So, it is sort of like adding seasoning to our food to make it taste better. It is strictly a YMMV thing. We can make the explanation more complicated by talking about house curves, but this is the simple answer. You can add or subtract volume from any channel you like, if it makes things sound better to you, without interfering with the room EQ.

That especially includes subwoofers, because we don't hear bass frequencies as well as those in our normal hearing range. So, nearly all of us have to increase the volume of our subwoofers, once they have been level-matched with our other speakers which play higher frequencies. I hope that this more detailed explanation helps!

Regards,
Mike
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GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
Speaker placements & Room treatments; HT calibration & Room EQ; Room gain; Bass
Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.
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post #29541 of 31781 Old 11-14-2018, 06:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chirosamsung View Post
I wonder if the SUB/bass boost can be done after a DIRAC calibration? Most have said that as good as DIRAC is, it kills the low end-even on subs like SVS...

Hi,

Yes, you can boost your sub(s) after a Dirac calibration, or after any other calibration!

Despite reference sources like the Guide, linked below, I think that the whole issue of adding subwoofer boosts is frequently misunderstood. All calibrations, by whatever kind of automated routine (Audyssey, Dirac, YPAO, MCACC, or whatever) has two components. One, is the component of level-matching all of the speaker channels, including the subwoofer(s), so that they all play the same volume at the MLP. Some systems do that in a different way than others do, and some do it better. But, they all try to do do that.

The second component is the creation of filters to EQ all, or part of, the frequency response. Again, some do that differently and more effectively than others. But, it is an entirely separate thing to EQ peaks and dips in the FR than it is to make all of the speakers play the same overall volume at the MLP. (The test tone used to set volume levels for the speakers/subs is not usually even a full-range test tone, where the test tones used to EQ are broader in coverage--they typically go much higher and lower in frequency.)

So, since the two components of calibration are different mechanisms, with different purposes, we can change the volume level of any speaker or subwoofer, without affecting the EQ component. If you want your center channel to play a little louder after a calibration, you can increase the volume. If the surround channels sound too loud for some network programs (CBS used to be really bad about that) you can turn them down. If you want more bass, you can boost your subwoofers, or reduce the bass when you want to. Doing any of those things has no effect on the room EQ (flattening-out peaks and dips) that was performed during a calibration.

Changing the volume of a speaker only affects how loudly that particular speaker plays. So, it is sort of like adding seasoning to our food to make it taste better. It is strictly a YMMV thing. We can make the explanation more complicated by talking about house curves, but this is the simple answer. You can add or subtract volume from any channel you like, if it makes things sound better to you, without interfering with the room EQ.

That especially includes subwoofers, because we don't hear bass frequencies as well as those in our normal hearing range. So, nearly all of us have to increase the volume of our subwoofers, once they have been level-matched with our other speakers which play higher frequencies. I hope that this more detailed explanation helps! [IMG class=inlineimg]/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif[/IMG]

Regards,
Mike
Thanks for that great explanation Mike
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post #29542 of 31781 Old 11-14-2018, 07:43 AM
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Thanks for that great explanation Mike

In deed it is a great post, mine would have very short
See my comment to Mike, in the quote below yours.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
Hi,

Yes, you can boost your sub(s) after a Dirac calibration, or after any other calibration!

Despite reference sources like the Guide, linked below, I think that the whole issue of adding subwoofer boosts is frequently misunderstood. All calibrations, by whatever kind of automated routine (Audyssey, Dirac, YPAO, MCACC, or whatever) has two components. One, is the component of level-matching all of the speaker channels, including the subwoofer(s), so that they all play the same volume at the MLP. Some systems do that in a different way than others do, and some do it better. But, they all try to do do that.

The second component is the creation of filters to EQ all, or part of, the frequency response. Again, some do that differently and more effectively than others. But, it is an entirely separate thing to EQ peaks and dips in the FR than it is to make all of the speakers play the same overall volume at the MLP. (The test tone used to set volume levels for the speakers/subs is not usually even a full-range test tone, where the test tones used to EQ are broader in coverage--they typically go much higher and lower in frequency.)

So, since the two components of calibration are different mechanisms, with different purposes, we can change the volume level of any speaker or subwoofer, without affecting the EQ component. If you want your center channel to play a little louder after a calibration, you can increase the volume. If the surround channels sound too loud for some network programs (CBS used to be really bad about that) you can turn them down. If you want more bass, you can boost your subwoofers, or reduce the bass when you want to. Doing any of those things has no effect on the room EQ (flattening-out peaks and dips) that was performed during a calibration.

Changing the volume of a speaker only affects how loudly that particular speaker plays. So, it is sort of like adding seasoning to our food to make it taste better. It is strictly a YMMV thing. We can make the explanation more complicated by talking about house curves, but this is the simple answer. You can add or subtract volume from any channel you like, if it makes things sound better to you, without interfering with the room EQ.

That especially includes subwoofers, because we don't hear bass frequencies as well as those in our normal hearing range. So, nearly all of us have to increase the volume of our subwoofers, once they have been level-matched with our other speakers which play higher frequencies. I hope that this more detailed explanation helps!

Regards,
Mike
Mike, again you surpass yourself, for giving a very detail explanation. Also a good thing, You beat me for a reply
Mine would have been much shorter. Something like "no matter the calibration system you use, you can add bass boost for your personal preference".


Darth
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post #29543 of 31781 Old 11-14-2018, 08:15 AM
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Looks like they are coming out with the 3000s. Video was posted on their site.
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post #29544 of 31781 Old 11-14-2018, 08:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Chirosamsung View Post
Thanks for that great explanation Mike
Quote:
Originally Posted by darthray View Post
In deed it is a great post, mine would have very short
See my comment to Mike, in the quote below yours.

Mike, again you surpass yourself, for giving a very detail explanation.
Mine would have been much shorter. Something like "no matter the calibration system you use



Thanks guys! My more detailed explanations tend to work along the lines of the old Chinese proverb: "Give a man a fish and he can eat for a day. Teach a man to fish and he can feed himself for a lifetime." The Guide sort of grew out of that kind of approach.

Not everyone really cares how things work. But, there are always people silently reading along, on these threads, who couldn't ask clarification questions, even if they wanted to. (The ratio of non-members to AVS members on these forums ranges from about 5/1, to as much as about 15/1.) So, I usually try to answer questions the way I would like to read the answers, if I were the one reading along.

Regards,
Mike
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GUIDE TO SUBWOOFER CALIBRATION AND BASS PREFERENCES

* The Guide linked above is a comprehensive guide to Audio & HT systems, including:
Speaker placements & Room treatments; HT calibration & Room EQ; Room gain; Bass
Preferences; Subwoofer Buyer's Guide: Sealed/ported; ID subs; Subwoofer placement.

Last edited by mthomas47; 11-14-2018 at 10:10 AM. Reason: Typo
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Morning fellas. So Just got off the phone with SVS. Like I thought, they think it's a bad amp and the easiest fix would be to ship me out a replacement amp. Pretty pissed off that I have to go through all of this crap. I spent almost 4K on brand new sub woofers and I have to fix it myself now. I was going to just go with a replacement but seeing how I have to wait for shipping again and next week being Thanksgiving, it seems easier and faster to go with the amp swap. Pretty disappointed in SVS products to be honest. One of the things I learned in my weeks of research was finding a lot of people reporting problems with the sledge amplifiers. Oh well, the amp should be here on Friday, so hopefully i'll get it swapped out and all will be fixed.
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post #29546 of 31781 Old 11-14-2018, 09:08 AM
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https://www.svsound.com/pages/3000-series

SB-3000
https://www.svsound.com/collections/...oducts/sb-3000


PB-3000
https://www.svsound.com/collections/...oducts/pb-3000
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post #29547 of 31781 Old 11-14-2018, 09:21 AM
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No PC3000??
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post #29548 of 31781 Old 11-14-2018, 12:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
Thanks guys! My more detailed explanations tend to work along the lines of the old Chinese proverb: "Give a man a fish and he can eat for a day. Teach a man to fish and he can feed himself for a lifetime." The Guide sort of grew out of that kind of approach.

Not everyone really cares how things work. But, there are always people silently reading along, on these threads, who couldn't ask clarification questions, even if they wanted to. (The ratio of non-members to AVS members on these forums ranges from about 5/1, to as much as about 15/1.) So, I usually try to answer questions the way I would like to read the answers, if I were the one reading along.

Regards,
Mike
You got me thinking now what movie I recently heard that Chinese proverb in.
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post #29549 of 31781 Old 11-14-2018, 12:57 PM
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Hmm... I wonder if it would be worthwhile upgrading to an SB3000 from the SB2000?

I do think the price point is on the high side. And based on the photos, it looks like they're using the same cheap plastic feet from the SB2000.

In my case, it's only a worthwhile consideration because the size is only slightly larger than my SB2000, and SVS have a number of Canadian dealers which I could order from. I can't make room for anything bigger in my current space (otherwise, I'd probably go for ID 15" sealed subs).

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post #29550 of 31781 Old 11-14-2018, 01:10 PM
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Interesting that they went with 2 ports for the 3k series, whereas the previous Plus line had three ports. Have to see how it shakes out, but that would appear to be a step backwards as far as tuning flexibility goes.

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